Well, they could just keep their stuff and throw in the trash. Even if it doesn't cost them anything besides shipping, it's still nice to donate that stuff if it's useful to the NetBSD team.
This would indeed be interesting. What still impresses me is that one was able to format a floppy (for those among us still able to eat solid food: This was a common task back then and not a marveled rarity as it is today) under OS/2 without the system missing a beat. You could forget about that completely under Win 3.x, under 95 the mouse was jerking around and even NT didn't get it right. OS/2 for me was a combination of stunningly brilliant engineering and sheer stupidity (e.g. the single command queue thing for the GUI which bit me in the behind regularly or their variety of registry which totally fucked up the system for me all 4-6 months meaning a re-install). But overall I loved OS/2 until the lack of apps drove me away finally.
Where have you been the last 10 years ? You are right, OS/2's multitasking was awesome back in the day, but today even Macs do preemptive multitasking.
Because I need work to get done and prefer to do this with a closed source stable and feature-rich software instead of someones 0.00001Beta17 pipedream on sf.net ?
So you say because Microsoft does structured QA Linux should not do it ? Hm. You know, I recently heard MS doesn't like it if their developers jump out of the window, so... don't worry, it's just four floors down.
Hm. You could try wget or ncftp, depending on the protocol you need. I got pretty good results with recovering aborted downloads with both of them, better than with most other download managers. Both should be part of most Linux distros but are AFAIK also available as part of cygwin for win32 and with fink for OSX.
Why the heck don't you just download it from the official site at Sun like everybody else ? Like at http://www.sun.com/software/solaris/get.jsp. Sun's whole Web site is plastered with "Get Solaris 10 now" banners and links. So where's your problem ? Don't have a Web browser or what ?
This is the same as when I configured my kmail to scan all emails with spam assassin and all three virus scanners kmail supports out of the box and seeing the machine come to a grinding halt everytime a mail arrived for up to 10 s/mail. Sure this means kmail is totally ununable because you need to have four filters slowing down the machine for reading your mail ? Or was I just an idiot for setting it up that way against better knowledge ?
VB6 came out when ? A long long time ago in any case, far far back at the end of the 90s, if I'm not completely wrong. Compare to that what kind of APIs and toolkits in the Linux world have come and gone and mightily evolved in that time. Who is still using KDE 2.x or Gnome 1 to build their software against ?
Regarding b): I think you are overly optimistic regarding the uniqueness of the US and its abilities. Just recently I read an article about the huge problems European companies are having in China: They want to do business there because it's obviously a huge market, but their Chinese "partners" almost immediately copy all the sophisticated machines they sell there to the last screw and start churning them out themselves - at adequate quality and with service and all, but much much cheaper the dump European could ever dream of building them. And this are really complex high-tech manufacturing machines, not cheap TV sets or sewing machines.
Another example of how fast a country can lose its edge is the rise of Japan: At first the US and Europe laughed at them: "Haha, look at those dumb Japanese imitating our shitty cheap TV sets. Ha ! Now they try to do photo cameras ! Cars ! What a laug- Um. HEY ! Where is our automobile industry ? Where are the high-end manufacturers of optical gear ? What about VCRs ?"
Never underestimate an adversary. And having a country full of doctors and biologists is fine. Look at Russia to get an idea what happens if you have a society where excellent academians are a dime a dozens because there is a lot of knowledge but no adequate work.
But tinkering is what got us a lot of excellent open source projects in the first place. Some Finnish dude wanted to tinker with his spanking new 386, oops, we got Linux from it. Some other dudes wanted a real desktop environment for their machines - KDE got born. Etc.pp. If you do design by committee you get train wrecks like the Hurd and the current Debian situation - lots of politics, but noone gets anything done.
... simply because they could not afford the experimental apparatus necessary for chemistry, physics or molecular biology.
This is not entirely correct. Russia also has lots of very talented chemicists, biologists and physicists (if not, noone would be worried of them hired away by rogue states or terrorist groups to build WMDs). There are also some even if small excellent chemical and molecular biological companies which are basically spin-offs of the Soviet Union's old science cities. But they are also only a few. So the situation in all natural sciences there seems to be like in mathmatics and computer sciences: Excellently trained and experienced people, few work for them.
Oh, that's nothing. I have a really impressing resume with work experience at four different biotech companies - just that they always were one and the same that kept changing names for some stupid reasons. So it's not just open source.
As far as I understood back then, the car had only one wheel, no engine and broken windows. Apparently the possible alternatives back then were no real alternatives as they would (at least from Linus' point of view) not have been any better than his old and severely broken development process or even considerably worse.
"Did you ever consider that he might have got a similar productivity boost by switching to a Free source control system instead of BitKeeper? "
This was re-hashed in numerous flamefest regarding BitKeeper usage over the last couple of years. Apparently Linus had a look back then at most if not all available free source control systems, and according to him they all sucked for his usage. Enter BitKeeper.
I'm reading this over and over again in this thread. But if they were able to match BitKeeper what were they waiting for ? There are more than enough large open source and other projects out there waiting for a good distributed source management solution. Perhaps it's not that easy ?
I find the limitation to V2 quite reasonable from Linus' point of view.
Look at it like that: There is no GPL V3 at the moment, at no one definetely knows what will finally be in there. By putting your software under a license (among others) that just does not exist at the moment you give a blank cheque to the one creating the new version of the license. Ok, the FFS seems to be quite trustworthy at the moment, but many organizations have totally changed over the years and many good intentions didn't turn out good results but goddamned disasters. So I think Linus' decision to limit Linux to the known to be functional GPL V2 seems to me quite sane.
Basically it does (the Pizza guy does the same for me:-) ), but there are two major issues holding it back:
* Even if you have been able to get caller ID support even for analog lines for at least a couple of years (I'm not sure, but I think it's even free now) a lot of people with old phone installations really don't bother (like my parents *sigh*). I don't know if the emergency services can get a caller ID in any case, but I don't think so.
* The other point until recently were privacy issues. It was not legal until last year to offer products in Germany that allow for a search caller ID->owner (nobody prevented you to do a respective search for your own private or business address data, hence the pizza guy still worked once he got my data, but I assume that the law required some kind of personal or business relationship to be legally able to do so). It is still much contended that e.g. the police emergency line would now be able to identify someone calling anonymously but having forgotten to turn of his/her caller ID.
That's Germany for you. You can die miserably in your home because you aren't able any more to utter your name, but at least you do so in perfect privacy.:-)
There often is much more to a database then just the data itself, you know ? Moving the data is the easy part. Let's see you move the logic you have implemented inside your database in form of triggers, stored procs, constraints etc in that way.
I run back inside and dial 911. Guess what? The girl didn't know my address. She fumbled for a few minutes and finally I gave it to her.
Just an honest question from a dumb foreigner: Can your emergency services usually really tell your address automatically when you are calling ? And if yes, how do they do this ? Or did I just get the wrong idea from the sentence above ?
Here in Germany which usually has a really state-of-the-art digital phone system you are still required and also trained to do so to tell the emergency service in any case where you are located besides other stuff.
What I am really missing here is what you want to do no matter if you use WTS or some Unix-based thing. Usually you don't have a terminal service just for the sake of it but for accessing some kind of application or the other.
If this application is a Windows-only app then the answer is: No, you cannot replace the server by something Unixy, but certainly you can use Linux or something else as a (thin) client as many in this thread have suggested.
If the app also runs on *ix or has appropriate replacements there then run it there and use one of the suggestions above (X11, NX, VNC,... depending on your network infrastructure).
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Well, they could just keep their stuff and throw in the trash. Even if it doesn't cost them anything besides shipping, it's still nice to donate that stuff if it's useful to the NetBSD team.
This would indeed be interesting. What still impresses me is that one was able to format a floppy (for those among us still able to eat solid food: This was a common task back then and not a marveled rarity as it is today) under OS/2 without the system missing a beat. You could forget about that completely under Win 3.x, under 95 the mouse was jerking around and even NT didn't get it right. OS/2 for me was a combination of stunningly brilliant engineering and sheer stupidity (e.g. the single command queue thing for the GUI which bit me in the behind regularly or their variety of registry which totally fucked up the system for me all 4-6 months meaning a re-install). But overall I loved OS/2 until the lack of apps drove me away finally.
Where have you been the last 10 years ? You are right, OS/2's multitasking was awesome back in the day, but today even Macs do preemptive multitasking.
Because I need work to get done and prefer to do this with a closed source stable and feature-rich software instead of someones 0.00001Beta17 pipedream on sf.net ?
So you say because Microsoft does structured QA Linux should not do it ? Hm. You know, I recently heard MS doesn't like it if their developers jump out of the window, so... don't worry, it's just four floors down.
Hm. You could try wget or ncftp, depending on the protocol you need. I got pretty good results with recovering aborted downloads with both of them, better than with most other download managers. Both should be part of most Linux distros but are AFAIK also available as part of cygwin for win32 and with fink for OSX.
Why the heck don't you just download it from the official site at Sun like everybody else ? Like at
http://www.sun.com/software/solaris/get.jsp. Sun's whole Web site is plastered with "Get Solaris 10 now" banners and links. So where's your problem ? Don't have a Web browser or what ?
Especially as there hasn't been up to now any product being able to have exactly that functionality.... VMWare anyone ? *rolls eyes*
This is the same as when I configured my kmail to scan all emails with spam assassin and all three virus scanners kmail supports out of the box and seeing the machine come to a grinding halt everytime a mail arrived for up to 10 s/mail. Sure this means kmail is totally ununable because you need to have four filters slowing down the machine for reading your mail ? Or was I just an idiot for setting it up that way against better knowledge ?
A Heineken ? In Munich ???? Heretic ! Burn him at the stake !
VB6 came out when ? A long long time ago in any case, far far back at the end of the 90s, if I'm not completely wrong. Compare to that what kind of APIs and toolkits in the Linux world have come and gone and mightily evolved in that time. Who is still using KDE 2.x or Gnome 1 to build their software against ?
Regarding b): I think you are overly optimistic regarding the uniqueness of the US and its abilities. Just recently I read an article about the huge problems European companies are having in China: They want to do business there because it's obviously a huge market, but their Chinese "partners" almost immediately copy all the sophisticated machines they sell there to the last screw and start churning them out themselves - at adequate quality and with service and all, but much much cheaper the dump European could ever dream of building them. And this are really complex high-tech manufacturing machines, not cheap TV sets or sewing machines.
Another example of how fast a country can lose its edge is the rise of Japan: At first the US and Europe laughed at them: "Haha, look at those dumb Japanese imitating our shitty cheap TV sets. Ha ! Now they try to do photo cameras ! Cars ! What a laug- Um. HEY ! Where is our automobile industry ? Where are the high-end manufacturers of optical gear ? What about VCRs ?"
Never underestimate an adversary. And having a country full of doctors and biologists is fine. Look at Russia to get an idea what happens if you have a society where excellent academians are a dime a dozens because there is a lot of knowledge but no adequate work.
But tinkering is what got us a lot of excellent open source projects in the first place. Some Finnish dude wanted to tinker with his spanking new 386, oops, we got Linux from it. Some other dudes wanted a real desktop environment for their machines - KDE got born. Etc.pp. If you do design by committee you get train wrecks like the Hurd and the current Debian situation - lots of politics, but noone gets anything done.
... simply because they could not afford the experimental apparatus necessary for chemistry, physics or molecular biology.
This is not entirely correct. Russia also has lots of very talented chemicists, biologists and physicists (if not, noone would be worried of them hired away by rogue states or terrorist groups to build WMDs). There are also some even if small excellent chemical and molecular biological companies which are basically spin-offs of the Soviet Union's old science cities. But they are also only a few. So the situation in all natural sciences there seems to be like in mathmatics and computer sciences: Excellently trained and experienced people, few work for them.
Oh, that's nothing. I have a really impressing resume with work experience at four different biotech companies - just that they always were one and the same that kept changing names for some stupid reasons. So it's not just open source.
As far as I understood back then, the car had only one wheel, no engine and broken windows. Apparently the possible alternatives back then were no real alternatives as they would (at least from Linus' point of view) not have been any better than his old and severely broken development process or even considerably worse.
"Did you ever consider that he might have got a similar productivity boost by switching to a Free source control system instead of BitKeeper? "
This was re-hashed in numerous flamefest regarding BitKeeper usage over the last couple of years. Apparently Linus had a look back then at most if not all available free source control systems, and according to him they all sucked for his usage. Enter BitKeeper.
I'm reading this over and over again in this thread. But if they were able to match BitKeeper what were they waiting for ? There are more than enough large open source and other projects out there waiting for a good distributed source management solution. Perhaps it's not that easy ?
They are also not too well financially (which country is these days ?), but I think you are thinking of Argentina.
I find the limitation to V2 quite reasonable from Linus' point of view.
Look at it like that: There is no GPL V3 at the moment, at no one definetely knows what will finally be in there. By putting your software under a license (among others) that just does not exist at the moment you give a blank cheque to the one creating the new version of the license. Ok, the FFS seems to be quite trustworthy at the moment, but many organizations have totally changed over the years and many good intentions didn't turn out good results but goddamned disasters. So I think Linus' decision to limit Linux to the known to be functional GPL V2 seems to me quite sane.
You mean the one with the "Nothing to see hear"'s and the for some time constant authentication problems ? There's a recommendation...
Basically it does (the Pizza guy does the same for me :-) ), but there are two major issues holding it back:
:-)
* Even if you have been able to get caller ID support even for analog lines for at least a couple of years (I'm not sure, but I think it's even free now) a lot of people with old phone installations really don't bother (like my parents *sigh*). I don't know if the emergency services can get a caller ID in any case, but I don't think so.
* The other point until recently were privacy issues. It was not legal until last year to offer products in Germany that allow for a search caller ID->owner (nobody prevented you to do a respective search for your own private or business address data, hence the pizza guy still worked once he got my data, but I assume that the law required some kind of personal or business relationship to be legally able to do so). It is still much contended that e.g. the police emergency line would now be able to identify someone calling anonymously but having forgotten to turn of his/her caller ID.
That's Germany for you. You can die miserably in your home because you aren't able any more to utter your name, but at least you do so in perfect privacy.
There often is much more to a database then just the data itself, you know ? Moving the data is the easy part. Let's see you move the logic you have implemented inside your database in form of triggers, stored procs, constraints etc in that way.
I run back inside and dial 911. Guess what? The girl didn't know my address. She fumbled for a few minutes and finally I gave it to her.
Just an honest question from a dumb foreigner: Can your emergency services usually really tell your address automatically when you are calling ? And if yes, how do they do this ? Or did I just get the wrong idea from the sentence above ?
Here in Germany which usually has a really state-of-the-art digital phone system you are still required and also trained to do so to tell the emergency service in any case where you are located besides other stuff.
What I am really missing here is what you want to do no matter if you use WTS or some Unix-based thing.
... depending on your network infrastructure).
Usually you don't have a terminal service just for the sake of it but for accessing some kind of application or the other.
If this application is a Windows-only app then the answer is: No, you cannot replace the server by something Unixy, but certainly you can use Linux or something else as a (thin) client as many in this thread have suggested.
If the app also runs on *ix or has appropriate replacements there then run it there and use one of the suggestions above (X11, NX, VNC,