GNOME vs KDE (not flamebait!)
on
Gnome 2.14 Review
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· Score: 4, Insightful
Is it just me or has anyone else noticed this trend.
Within my local LUG over the last year or two opinions on GNOME vs KDE have become increasingly polarised. Personally I love GNOME and I think it's getting better every release. I have nothing bad to say about KDE but it just doesn't interest me.
Some of the KDE fans among us though seem to be starting to dislike GNOME more and more.
I don't know what it is but perhaps it's a good thing? A few years back it was my perception that both desktops were aiming for the same thing. Now though I think there is a clear and emerging idealogical difference between the two. While seen as bad by some (the desktops should be converging!), it at least presents more of a choice.
Anyone else noticed this or am I just going (even more) mad?
OSS began with no support from big business and would have carried on fine without it. It's growth and adoption has no doubt been helped by big business support, but to say it needs big business is just not true.
Previously you might say OSS needed big business because a significant part of the business market would not use OSS without that support, but they are slowly comong to realise that they can use OSS perfectly well without it.
Oracle are merely aligning themselves a bit more with OSS now in preparation for the death of their existing business model.
It's not that OSS Needs Big Business, it's that Big Business needs OSS.
Every company tries to crush its competition in the name of profits. That's what corporations do. It is against the law to do the things microsoft did to their competition if you are a monopoly.
Prices have been driven down. Software has never been cheaper. That does not mean it has reached the free market level it would if MS did not have monopolies.
Who are you to say where money "should have been". I'm no authority, but my opinion is as valid as anyone elses.
Every person who has paid for Microsoft software, had the option of either not buying it, or spending it on another product. I tried for months to find a laptop that suited my needs that I could buy without windows installed. I failed and ended up buying one with windows (which obviously I was paying for) and then installing linux over it.
At no point in time has any piece of Microsoft software *ever* been the only option for a given task. If the task is "edit this word document a customer has sent me and send it back to him so he can update it" then there is no reliable alternative. Not because MS software is better, but because they won't release the formats. This is why they are in trouble in the EU and about to recieve huge fines if they don't do something about it. They are breaking EU anti trust laws.
I'm extremely disappointed to see the slashdot crowd almost entirely bashing Gates becuase they don't care for microsofts software.
It's not neccesarily because they don't care for microsofts software.
Perhaps it is because microsoft is a convicted monopolist and Bill Gates is the worst of the bunch. They have been found guilty in court of illegally crushing their competition in the name of profits. Had they not done that, there would have been more competition and prices would have been driven down. Gates and microsoft would not be so rich in the first place and the money would instead distributed in the rest of society where it should have been in the first place.
Gates gestures are nothing IMO compared to the harm he and others have caused society with their monopolistic practices.
This is nothing to do with software, and everything to do with a bunch of over powerful, greedy, damaging people who will stop at nothing to "stay ahead" in their industry.
Forgive me for not falling at their feet when they give a few percent of their immorally gained wealth back to society in some way.
The web is used (rightly or wrongly) to deliver two distinct things.
1) Content.
2) Applications.
For (1) ajax _does_ suck most of the time for all the reasons stated, but for (2) is makes sense because it makes the app behave more like a desktop app. "back" and "bookmarks" stop making sense anyway. You wouldn't expect to have those features in your desktop apps, so why in an app delivered over the web.
The great shame is that these two opposing requirements have not forked into the data-web and the application-web. Things went wrong IMO the day someone thought of putting forms in html.
Free software products work like species. Their environment is the users and developers and they mutate to gain favour of the users. Their "random" mutation is the development cycle, including possibly many branches and forks with cross pollenation of both ideas and code. This is just the same as evolution in real species. Without enough variation and competition, species stagnate. Closed source software is mostly the same except the oppurtunity for random mutation is massively decreased.
Consider the web browser as an example. After Microsoft illegally crushed all the competition with IE, the browser stagnated for years while competition recovered. Once other had caught up, suddenly they start developmemt again. No cross pollenation of code because of incompatible licenses. (the offspring would be a mule) but ideas have spread. (tabbed browsing etc)
We need multiple competing desktops. That we have two that can (to some degree at least) cross pollenate code as well as ideas is part of what puts us at a potential advantage against commercial offerings. If we had only one, no code cross pollenation could occur and in that sense we would be on a more level playing field in terms of future potential.
This is a bullshit argument that generally presumes a substandard optimization by the binary compiler.
No it assumes that the compiler cannot know the most common runtime code paths (which is true). A JIT engine can of course.
Even with compilers that read seperately collected profiler data (such as recent gcc which can take gprof output) can only work on that one profiler measurement. Lots of software is highly dependent on usage patterns and so different paths will be run depending on how the user uses the software. Only runtime optimisation can take this into account.
Sometimes it does matter to know the different. It is not always possible to know what is meant unless you know the difference.
Example:
"Here is a list of changes I want made. Please make sure you don't affect these changes." "Here is a list of changes I want made. Please make sure you don't effect these changes."
The above two sentences mean very different things.
The first suggests "I want these changes made. Don't interfere when anyone makes them." The second is more like "I want these changes made, but I don't want you to make them."
If you don't like the standards at your workplace you should find a new job.
That seems a bit extreme. I am in a small minority at our company who use linux on their desktops. (I have personally for a few years now)
I just explained why it would make me more productive in what I do and then installed it. If they had complained and shouted, then I would have uninstalled linux and got another job. As it turned out the company was reasonable about it.
When you drink yourself to death, then the person you are harming is yourself.
Agreed.
When you speed, you could harm others.
I have been speeding every time I drive without fail for 15 years. I have never harmed others.
While your statement is true, it is also true that I could harm others when I don't speed.
You are assuming that speeding causes accidents. I have never seen any credible evidence that shows this to be true. I haven't even seen any evidence of any kind that it is. Even the police don't claim it is true. They usually say something vague like "speed is a factor in accidents" which is conveniently difficult to disagree with whilst not actually meaning anything.
In order to install the software you have to make a copy of it (either copy from the cd to hard drive, or copy from internet page to hard drive) but before you can copy you need a copyright license. What gives you that license if not the EULA?
"the ability to sense the power status of the PC" "it can inform users when their mouse battery is low" "the mouse can sense when the PC has gone into sleep mode or is shut down. The mouse powers down accordingly." "ability to sense if there is wireless interference from other devices"
All of these features are workarounds for the fact that the mouse lacks a cable. What the hell is wrong with a good optical mouse with a cable?
Honestly, I can't understand ths obsession with wireless stuff. Of course wifi and bluetooth are convenient, but wireless keyboards and mice add nothing for most users. Most desktop users are better off with wired versions because lots of hassle goes away.
Slashdot Mirror
Is it just me or has anyone else noticed this trend.
Within my local LUG over the last year or two opinions on GNOME vs KDE have become increasingly polarised. Personally I love GNOME and I think it's getting better every release. I have nothing bad to say about KDE but it just doesn't interest me.
Some of the KDE fans among us though seem to be starting to dislike GNOME more and more.
I don't know what it is but perhaps it's a good thing? A few years back it was my perception that both desktops were aiming for the same thing. Now though I think there is a clear and emerging idealogical difference between the two. While seen as bad by some (the desktops should be converging!), it at least presents more of a choice.
Anyone else noticed this or am I just going (even more) mad?
No. Because Christianity is faith.
Faith involves believing something which cannot be proved.
Science involves disbelieving everything which cannot be proved.
No kind of belief can be held by one person for both faith reasons and science reasons.
OSS began with no support from big business and would have carried on fine without it. It's growth and adoption has no doubt been helped by big business support, but to say it needs big business is just not true.
Previously you might say OSS needed big business because a significant part of the business market would not use OSS without that support, but they are slowly comong to realise that they can use OSS perfectly well without it.
Oracle are merely aligning themselves a bit more with OSS now in preparation for the death of their existing business model.
It's not that OSS Needs Big Business, it's that Big Business needs OSS.
--
Martin.
It's just so much easier to unquestioningly accept anything at face value.
:)
I don't believe you. Prove it.
I have been buying CDs and ripping them to play on my iRiver. I may as well just download them instead of buying in future if its just as illegal.
16k ZX Spectrum. -- learned basic here.
48k ZX Spectrum.
128k Spectrum +3 -- learned assembly here. (z80)
Amiga 500 -- had to re-learn assembly (68000)
Amiga 4000
PII/400 (linux)
AthlonXP 1600 (linux)
Athlon64 3000 (linux)
Completely ms windows free so far. Woohoo!
an annual fee of $49.99 per year.
Oh, an annual fee per year, as opposed to all the other kinds of annual fee.
It always annoys me when people use duplicate unnecessary redundant superfluous words in their sentences.
Just like anyone who has read Harry Potter is no longer allowed to write stories about wizards.
Does anyone know anything that _does_ pass that test?
Every company tries to crush its competition in the name of profits. That's what corporations do.
It is against the law to do the things microsoft did to their competition if you are a monopoly.
Prices have been driven down. Software has never been cheaper.
That does not mean it has reached the free market level it would if MS did not have monopolies.
Who are you to say where money "should have been".
I'm no authority, but my opinion is as valid as anyone elses.
Every person who has paid for Microsoft software, had the option of either not buying it, or spending it on another product.
I tried for months to find a laptop that suited my needs that I could buy without windows installed. I failed and ended up buying one with windows (which obviously I was paying for) and then installing linux over it.
At no point in time has any piece of Microsoft software *ever* been the only option for a given task.
If the task is "edit this word document a customer has sent me and send it back to him so he can update it" then there is no reliable alternative. Not because MS software is better, but because they won't release the formats. This is why they are in trouble in the EU and about to recieve huge fines if they don't do something about it. They are breaking EU anti trust laws.
I'm extremely disappointed to see the slashdot crowd almost entirely bashing Gates becuase they don't care for microsofts software.
It's not neccesarily because they don't care for microsofts software.
Perhaps it is because microsoft is a convicted monopolist and Bill Gates is the worst of the bunch. They have been found guilty in court of illegally crushing their competition in the name of profits. Had they not done that, there would have been more competition and prices would have been driven down. Gates and microsoft would not be so rich in the first place and the money would instead distributed in the rest of society where it should have been in the first place.
Gates gestures are nothing IMO compared to the harm he and others have caused society with their monopolistic practices.
This is nothing to do with software, and everything to do with a bunch of over powerful, greedy, damaging people who will stop at nothing to "stay ahead" in their industry.
Forgive me for not falling at their feet when they give a few percent of their immorally gained wealth back to society in some way.
No. The polish were fighting communist authoritarianism and the ./ crowd are fighting capitalist authoritarianism.
It is over powerful authorities that are being fought in both cases. Political ideology doesn't enter into it.
The correct name for the SI unit I think you are referring to is "degree Celcius" not "Degree Centigrade"
Furthermore, kelvin does not have an uppercase "K"
The web is used (rightly or wrongly) to deliver two distinct things.
1) Content.
2) Applications.
For (1) ajax _does_ suck most of the time for all the reasons stated, but for (2) is makes sense because it makes the app behave more like a desktop app. "back" and "bookmarks" stop making sense anyway. You wouldn't expect to have those features in your desktop apps, so why in an app delivered over the web.
The great shame is that these two opposing requirements have not forked into the data-web and the application-web. Things went wrong IMO the day someone thought of putting forms in html.
Free software products work like species. Their environment is the users and developers and they mutate to gain favour of the users. Their "random" mutation is the development cycle, including possibly many branches and forks with cross pollenation of both ideas and code. This is just the same as evolution in real species. Without enough variation and competition, species stagnate. Closed source software is mostly the same except the oppurtunity for random mutation is massively decreased.
Consider the web browser as an example. After Microsoft illegally crushed all the competition with IE, the browser stagnated for years while competition recovered. Once other had caught up, suddenly they start developmemt again. No cross pollenation of code because of incompatible licenses. (the offspring would be a mule) but ideas have spread. (tabbed browsing etc)
We need multiple competing desktops. That we have two that can (to some degree at least) cross pollenate code as well as ideas is part of what puts us at a potential advantage against commercial offerings. If we had only one, no code cross pollenation could occur and in that sense we would be on a more level playing field in terms of future potential.
This is a bullshit argument that generally presumes a substandard optimization by the binary compiler.
No it assumes that the compiler cannot know the most common runtime code paths (which is true). A JIT engine can of course.
Even with compilers that read seperately collected profiler data (such as recent gcc which can take gprof output) can only work on that one profiler measurement. Lots of software is highly dependent on usage patterns and so different paths will be run depending on how the user uses the software. Only runtime optimisation can take this into account.
Sometimes it does matter to know the different. It is not always possible to know what is meant unless you know the difference.
Example:
"Here is a list of changes I want made. Please make sure you don't affect these changes."
"Here is a list of changes I want made. Please make sure you don't effect these changes."
The above two sentences mean very different things.
The first suggests "I want these changes made. Don't interfere when anyone makes them."
The second is more like "I want these changes made, but I don't want you to make them."
I use netcat.
If you don't like the standards at your workplace you should find a new job.
That seems a bit extreme. I am in a small minority at our company who use linux on their desktops. (I have personally for a few years now)
I just explained why it would make me more productive in what I do and then installed it. If they had complained and shouted, then I would have uninstalled linux and got another job. As it turned out the company was reasonable about it.
When you drink yourself to death, then the person you are harming is yourself.
Agreed.
When you speed, you could harm others.
I have been speeding every time I drive without fail for 15 years. I have never harmed others.
While your statement is true, it is also true that I could harm others when I don't speed.
You are assuming that speeding causes accidents. I have never seen any credible evidence that shows this to be true. I haven't even seen any evidence of any kind that it is. Even the police don't claim it is true. They usually say something vague like "speed is a factor in accidents" which is conveniently difficult to disagree with whilst not actually meaning anything.
I think I agree, but how do you answer this:
In order to install the software you have to make a copy of it (either copy from the cd to hard drive, or copy from internet page to hard drive) but before you can copy you need a copyright license. What gives you that license if not the EULA?
Maybe I have just been lucky with the types of desk I have had, but I have never had that problem.
Perhaps it also depends on the type of cord? e.g. bendy or stiff.
CONGRATULATIONS!
You are the millionth person this month to make a "this isn't april 1st" joke on slashdot.
You win.....
nothing.
(PS. sorry dude - no offence. I just got sick of "not april 1st" jokes)
From TFA:
"the ability to sense the power status of the PC"
"it can inform users when their mouse battery is low"
"the mouse can sense when the PC has gone into sleep mode or is shut down. The mouse powers down accordingly."
"ability to sense if there is wireless interference from other devices"
All of these features are workarounds for the fact that the mouse lacks a cable. What the hell is wrong with a good optical mouse with a cable?
Honestly, I can't understand ths obsession with wireless stuff. Of course wifi and bluetooth are convenient, but wireless keyboards and mice add nothing for most users. Most desktop users are better off with wired versions because lots of hassle goes away.
I photocopy mine to 900% size and tape them up in all my windows.
People say I am a looney, but I don't know. Who is to say anyone will even look at my windows anyway?