I find it entirely plausible that women, when averaged across a reasonably sized population, do less work for employers than men. Don't you think it's reasonable to conclude that women, in general, take more time to care for children?
Of course you can't map the kanji for water to an ascii lookalike. You also can't use it to spoof paypal.com. This is a separate issue from IDN in general. Even if we do implement them, only one of similar characters should be permitted.
The goal isn't to stop *all* fishing, but simply to stop certain specific forms of it which similar characters cause. Speed limits don't stop traffic accidents, but they do stop some of them.
It's not stupid to have no ASCII version of a page. A chinese community does not need any ASCII. Their domain does not need any ASCII, either. If you want to access it from the hotel computer in Kansas and anticipate traveling there and doing so, log on to del.icio.us and click on your link, put in your flash drive and use your bookmarks, use google and search for it, etc. There's a chance that it will work. So yeah, you can prepare for that eventuality, JUST like you can prepare for a different power supply. The power adaptor analogy flies:P
Again we come back to the original point. IDN negates the purpose of DNS completely. If we're going to have to depend on USB keys (which may not be allowed in the Kansas netcafe) or social bookmark sites, we may as well just use IP addresses.
Further, you're "power adaptors" necessarily exclude economically disadvantaged people. A Chinese dissident fleeing execution isn't going to have time to back up all his bookmarks, and may not have the means to acquire their own system when seeking asylum.
It isn't about *enforcing* universal access, but *allowing* it. We can't do anything about a website doing silly things like not having an ascii only version, but we can at least make sure people can enter the domain name.
It doesn't matter what the accented characters mean. I'm just suggesting that we map them, entirely silently, to their lookalikes. A user could type göögle.de, have göögle.de packed in the DNS request and displayed in their browser. Only on the server side would göögle.de become google.de. Uneducated users would only encounter an issue if they tried to register a name with an accented character which has a non-accented equivalent. That's an *extremely* minor infringement for a very major reduction in phishing potential.
I'll bring up the hotel in Kansas example again, because you haven't satisfactorily dealt with it. You cannot, in general, make any modifications to netcafe computers, so the power adaptor analogy doesn't fly. You have to accept it's capabilities as they are, and that means ascii only. Maybe they won't be able to read a page anyway, but at least they have a chance. Further, it provides guidance to the people registering the domain that they should have an ascii only version available.
When I suggested silently mapping accent characters to their lookalikes. I meant for someone who requested mélangerie.com would in fact get melangerie.com. The clueless user still gets to type what the word sounds like to them, but we aren't obligated to handle dangerous characters that can be abused by phishers.
If we want to use them in a universally usable system, every machine *does* need to be able to use all characters in play. I'm not suggesting that we ban unicode and universally apply ascii to everything, just that we do so on critical, low level infrastructure. Again, it comes down to preference. You favour the aesthetic use of local scripts over universal access.
There's no money in installing Arabic interface methods in a Kansas hotel net cafe. You can't depend on the market for that sort of thing, it'll always leave some people out in the cold.
I prioritize the ability to access all of the internet by everyone, everywhere, and you prioritize the ability to use local scripts everywhere.
The mapping strategy takes some of the bite out of IDN, but it doesn't help our stereotypical windings using grandma. She'll just look at you blankly if you tell her she has to do that, where as if you map accented characters to their non-accented ascii lookalike, everything works automagically for her.
Given time, probably less than a generation, people will adapt to ascii-only domain names. I don't think you can say the same for language support in every hotel netcafe in the world. There are just too many different scripts for them all to be supported everywhere.
I don't really see a problem with google.de and göögle.de colliding. The later is almost certain to be some sort of scam site if it's allowed to exist in any event.
How the ascii-special character mappings work? Administrators aren't my primary concern, I'm more worried about, say, a (possibly unilingual) Cantonese speaker trying to use a net cafe in Vancouver.
Wingdings isn't in nnicode, AFAIK, it's just a font.
As for änderungsaufträge, the most sensible thing to do would be to map ä to a silently. Allowing ä is just asking for phishing problems (ie, citibänk.com).
People wouldn't be using locked down kiosks if there was another option.
Alternative scripts should be *optionally* supported as widely as is at all feasible, but they should never be mandatory, especially not in something as crucial as DNS. That still allows native scripts to be used the vast majority of the time.
Your solution locks people out of certain segments of the net based on the hardware they have access to. There's something very wrong with you if you see that as anything but completely unacceptable.
Complaining to the manufacturer of a kiosk in a foreign country isn't going to help you check your email. If you can even figure out who the manufacturer is.
I'd much rather a world where you have to use a few ASCII characters (which aren't really foreign anywhere on this planet), than one in which the internet is segregated by country. That's what you're advocating.
About the only thing you can depend on is support for ASCII. This isn't an issue of language. It doesn't matter you can or cannot speak if the machine in your using doesn't support your character set.
Do you really want a world where people can only check their email if they bring their own laptop?
Not everyone will have access to system configuration on the machines they use (especially in net cafes), nor will all systems be guaranteed to be so configurable in any event (especially mobile/embedded devices).
Unless I'm mistaken, all keyboards can do the basic ASCII characters. From a standardization point of view, it makes sense to limit something as crucial as DNS to characters available to everyone.
Really, is there a pressing need for änderungsaufträge.de to be distinct from anderungsauftrage.de?
Slashdot Mirror
I find it entirely plausible that women, when averaged across a reasonably sized population, do less work for employers than men. Don't you think it's reasonable to conclude that women, in general, take more time to care for children?
Unless their running groups available only to their customers, their just passing along everyone else's posts.
They'll be suing Claude Shannon.
Yes I know he's dead. That's not stopped them in the past.
The term you're looking for is "tragedy of the commons". Fortunately, Google can update it's bots to clear out the overgrazers from time to time.
99.999% of small businesses are 100% irrelevant. That they don't show up easily on Google means it's working.
You know what does make your small business show up easily on Google, even if you're totally fucking useless? Buying a goddamn advertisement!
Problem fucking solved.
Of course you can't map the kanji for water to an ascii lookalike. You also can't use it to spoof paypal.com. This is a separate issue from IDN in general. Even if we do implement them, only one of similar characters should be permitted.
:P
The goal isn't to stop *all* fishing, but simply to stop certain specific forms of it which similar characters cause. Speed limits don't stop traffic accidents, but they do stop some of them.
It's not stupid to have no ASCII version of a page. A chinese community does not need any ASCII. Their domain does not need any ASCII, either. If you want to access it from the hotel computer in Kansas and anticipate traveling there and doing so, log on to del.icio.us and click on your link, put in your flash drive and use your bookmarks, use google and search for it, etc. There's a chance that it will work. So yeah, you can prepare for that eventuality, JUST like you can prepare for a different power supply. The power adaptor analogy flies
Again we come back to the original point. IDN negates the purpose of DNS completely. If we're going to have to depend on USB keys (which may not be allowed in the Kansas netcafe) or social bookmark sites, we may as well just use IP addresses.
Further, you're "power adaptors" necessarily exclude economically disadvantaged people. A Chinese dissident fleeing execution isn't going to have time to back up all his bookmarks, and may not have the means to acquire their own system when seeking asylum.
Just ask the People Eating Tasty Animals.
It isn't about *enforcing* universal access, but *allowing* it. We can't do anything about a website doing silly things like not having an ascii only version, but we can at least make sure people can enter the domain name.
It doesn't matter what the accented characters mean. I'm just suggesting that we map them, entirely silently, to their lookalikes. A user could type göögle.de, have göögle.de packed in the DNS request and displayed in their browser. Only on the server side would göögle.de become google.de. Uneducated users would only encounter an issue if they tried to register a name with an accented character which has a non-accented equivalent. That's an *extremely* minor infringement for a very major reduction in phishing potential.
I'll bring up the hotel in Kansas example again, because you haven't satisfactorily dealt with it. You cannot, in general, make any modifications to netcafe computers, so the power adaptor analogy doesn't fly. You have to accept it's capabilities as they are, and that means ascii only. Maybe they won't be able to read a page anyway, but at least they have a chance. Further, it provides guidance to the people registering the domain that they should have an ascii only version available.
When I suggested silently mapping accent characters to their lookalikes. I meant for someone who requested mélangerie.com would in fact get melangerie.com. The clueless user still gets to type what the word sounds like to them, but we aren't obligated to handle dangerous characters that can be abused by phishers.
If we want to use them in a universally usable system, every machine *does* need to be able to use all characters in play. I'm not suggesting that we ban unicode and universally apply ascii to everything, just that we do so on critical, low level infrastructure. Again, it comes down to preference. You favour the aesthetic use of local scripts over universal access.
There's no money in installing Arabic interface methods in a Kansas hotel net cafe. You can't depend on the market for that sort of thing, it'll always leave some people out in the cold.
I prioritize the ability to access all of the internet by everyone, everywhere, and you prioritize the ability to use local scripts everywhere.
The mapping strategy takes some of the bite out of IDN, but it doesn't help our stereotypical windings using grandma. She'll just look at you blankly if you tell her she has to do that, where as if you map accented characters to their non-accented ascii lookalike, everything works automagically for her.
Given time, probably less than a generation, people will adapt to ascii-only domain names. I don't think you can say the same for language support in every hotel netcafe in the world. There are just too many different scripts for them all to be supported everywhere.
I don't really see a problem with google.de and göögle.de colliding. The later is almost certain to be some sort of scam site if it's allowed to exist in any event.
First you get the sugar, then you get the power, then you get the women.
How the ascii-special character mappings work? Administrators aren't my primary concern, I'm more worried about, say, a (possibly unilingual) Cantonese speaker trying to use a net cafe in Vancouver.
Wingdings isn't in nnicode, AFAIK, it's just a font.
As for änderungsaufträge, the most sensible thing to do would be to map ä to a silently. Allowing ä is just asking for phishing problems (ie, citibänk.com).
People wouldn't be using locked down kiosks if there was another option.
Alternative scripts should be *optionally* supported as widely as is at all feasible, but they should never be mandatory, especially not in something as crucial as DNS. That still allows native scripts to be used the vast majority of the time.
Your solution locks people out of certain segments of the net based on the hardware they have access to. There's something very wrong with you if you see that as anything but completely unacceptable.
Complaining to the manufacturer of a kiosk in a foreign country isn't going to help you check your email. If you can even figure out who the manufacturer is.
I'd much rather a world where you have to use a few ASCII characters (which aren't really foreign anywhere on this planet), than one in which the internet is segregated by country. That's what you're advocating.
How do you change the keyboard layout on a kiosk with no configuration available to the user?
About the only thing you can depend on is support for ASCII. This isn't an issue of language. It doesn't matter you can or cannot speak if the machine in your using doesn't support your character set.
Do you really want a world where people can only check their email if they bring their own laptop?
Not everyone will have access to system configuration on the machines they use (especially in net cafes), nor will all systems be guaranteed to be so configurable in any event (especially mobile/embedded devices).
How are you going to enter these URLs on a standard keyboard from a different region? What about Blackberry/Treo style devices?
Unless I'm mistaken, all keyboards can do the basic ASCII characters. From a standardization point of view, it makes sense to limit something as crucial as DNS to characters available to everyone.
Really, is there a pressing need for änderungsaufträge.de to be distinct from anderungsauftrage.de?
In the ancestor post, I pointed out that this nullifies the point of DNS. So yes, they may as well be using IP addresses.
On any keyboard, so it makes sense to limit URLs to that.
In almost all cases, they'll simply be unable to do so.
I"m supporting a standard which can be easily implemented on all available hardware.
In a net cafe on the other side of the world?
Their characters are not available to me. By using them in the DNS system, a part of the net is effectively being segregated.
And besides, links can use IP addresses just as easily.