How hard would it be to use the same exact system for mail servers? Sim City mail servers or something like it for tracking usage stats, could reduce a lot of time for sysadmins, and aid in the fight against spam. Maybe I'm reaching... but it didn't seem that far away when I wrote the first comment on the subject.
If a picture says a thousand words, a city of pictures will help inform sysadmins/webmasters rapidly of infinite variables, by adding the 3d location of all data, relative to the position of information on the server. I wonder if this could be used somehow to stop spam, by "jailing" naughty virtual-citizens? Please, nobody quote Jurassic Park about this... oh hell, Lex: "It's a UNIX system! I know this!"
> I guess you completely ignored the bit about Flash and PHP OpenGL being completely different, huh?
What's the point of rehashing this? I've already explained my view on the subject. To me, this PHP/OpenGL project brings the marketing people closer to a solution that will force bandwidth-intensive marketing down our throats. Even if the current state of PHP doesn't make it easy, the push for getting OpenGL to work using PHP brings it one step closer.
PHP is a web scripting language, so it's only a matter of time before someone figures out how to take this project and transform it.
I totally agree. There isn't much room for lateral changes to the global variance of accounting. Even though accounting changes to adapt new law, the system itself will never change; it's a matter of governments acquiring more and more money from corporations, and citizens. The laws don't have that much room to deform. Whereas technology has infinite room to deform, over time.
> The article mentioned that after a few years most college graduates have already achieved sysadmin status, but after that, where do you go from there?
I think the only way to go when you reach the ceiling, in any profession, is to design a smart startup company and own it. So it would be a switch from sysadmin to CEO. You could then sell off that company for big bucks, and then lather, rinse, repeat.
Where sysadmins will always thrive is in the ability to connect people who simply don't have time for all the details involved. It's not The Oldest Profession, but it's going to be the longest running profession someday, methinks.
> Yet another example of you not having a clue about what PHP is or does.
Inept. Totally inept statement. You missed my whole point, so I'll just skip it because I don't have time for people who don't understand simple logic.
This process is still young, but the eventual direction this will take is 3d apps over PHP and the web. It's bound to go that way. How could you deny that? You sound like Bill Gates when he said that computers will never need that much memory.
> It can't be used "over the net".
Currently, no, but that is bound to change when Gamespy figures out how to exploit this into Flash-like popup ads that can't be disabled, at all. Development money only comes from greed or enlightenment, and there is plenty of greed to go around these days.
> Conceivably somebody could write a plug-in that allows people to run PHP in a webbrowser, as well as some bindings to the necessary OpenGL libraries, but that is possible for any language.
Not exactly what I was saying, but close enough I guess. I think it's extremely viable for a plugin to be designed that will use this, and many will adopt it for websites as a result. Why the hell wouldn't they? It's not a totally bad idea, just one that scares me somewhat, if it's used maliciously.
> No, it could not.
There are systemic misuses and outright exploits. I am sure that any new system has both. You would have to agree, no? Or have you been sleeping in class?
> He didn't create a "system for content delivery". He just wrote an app that uses OpenGL.
> I call bullshit. If you've lectured this stuff, I pity your students.
Pity yourself.
> This is an extension to PHP that renders scenes on the machine it is running on.
And Flash differs how? And who controls how this is used over the net? You appear to place far too much trust in programmers today. This is going to be misused, imho.
> There is simply no facility for transmitting the OpenGL calls over the Internet to where they will somehow be rendered by the client.
Wherever they come from, be it the client or the server, they could still be malicious and misused. It would be ignorant to think otherwise.
> Either you have no clue about PHP, or you didn't read the article and jumped to some stupid conclusions. Which is it?
Why does it have to be one or the other? Couldn't I just have read the article and made informed conclusions about it, in that this appears to be innocent now, but could be misused by bad people / bad companies? Why are you defending it? Did you code it?
This statement is meaningless: You can't wave away the fact that your whining is completely irrelevent by saying "give it time" as the fundamental mechanisms are all wrong to do what you are complaining about.
> This project doesn't attempt to do any of that.
That's the crux of my arguement: yes, this project appears harmless, but it could be manipulated maliciously. It's still to early to tell how far it could go, but it's bad practice to create systems for content delivery that impose intense graphical CPU/GPU usage, without any standards of conformity, or checks and balances.
> The laughing just makes you look childish and embarrassed btw.
Maybe, but laughter is hard to control when I read statements like yours.
> The guy did it for the hell of it. No one is proposing that we start using php for graphics coding. Just proving that we could if we wanted to.
Yes, but we shouldn't use it like that. It's going to be exploitive if it is. It may be useful in some aspects, but I expect it will be misused by marketers, spammers (think 3d pr0n ads) and much more. I think it's going to be hell for many people. It could be invaluable for 3d gaming online, but it could also be totally misused, and because it's built into PHP, the users will have no choice but to go along with it.
> Only if you haven't got a clue what you are talking about.
Hahahahahahahah... hahahahaha!!! I've taught PHP & MySQL at college level, and I'm a programmer who uses PHP & MySQL on a regular basis. So I happen to have some grounding in this subject matter. So, it's you who don't know what you're talking about, actually.
> This has nothing to do with the web.
Oh give it time.
> PHP is a general purpose scripting language, like Perl or Python. It has nothing to do with websites.
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!
Of course it's a scripting language. I just have to laugh because you're pretending it was developed for 3d design. That's ridiculous. PHP was designed for the web, unlike Perl. It's a product of the Apache Software Foundation.
From the php.net site: PHP is a widely-used general-purpose scripting language that is especially suited for Web development and can be embedded into HTML.
Nice troll, Troll. There is nothing elitist about what I have said in regards to PHP and openGL. I think the combination is an abomination! I know you may have a problem with my unwashed masses comment, but in regards to the misuse of Flash, anyone with half a clue would completely understand the comment and perhaps applaud it. You are obviously part of the unwashed masses who would disagree and I bet you have a Flash-driven Geocities page to prove it.
Neat, Yet Misused
on
OpenGL in PHP
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· Score: 0, Redundant
I'm sorry but I have to reject the idea of running openGL with PHP. The concept makes about as much sense as using Flash intros.
However I will add that there is a neato factor to all this, but it only goes so far. It's just silly to allow the unwashed masses access to this kind of technology because it's going to end up like Flash anims, and further plague our internet with CRAP.
> The amount of corruption and waste that was left behind by the NDP was grotesque, the Tories were just cleaning that up.
This is a totally uninformed viewpoint. The Tories cut education until there was no meat left, only bone and gristle. The NDP tried desperately to fufuil promises when they were elected, and they did for the most part. The NDP has a better track record than the Tories or the Liberals.
> Cutting the budget forces the corruption to shrink so it doesn't get discovered.
Again, you are completely in the dark. The less money that is available, the greater the corruption and crime, in any organization. The more money that is available to educators, the better the morale and effectiveness of teachers!
I think this move is the most enlightened move the Ministry of Ed has made since inception. Sadly it's only motivated by the shoddy budget for education, and not a move in ideology, necessarily. The backstory to the Ontario Ministry of Education using Star Office has to do mostly with politics. Even with $2bil increase to spending on education in the 2004 budget, this is still a lot less than years prior, due to Tory cuts to education. It's really a sad state of affairs for children today, in Ontario.
I totally agree with you. What we need to watch out for is that other, non-criminal websites are not blocked. It's okay to block websites that have *criminal* content, but I would have to draw the line at that. The UK has to protect their citizens, and if it means blocking access to child porn, that is fine by me. Imagine you have a teenage boy who fills up your PC with lolita images, and *you* get arrested.
> They are quite up-front and honest about policies on plagarism and cheating.
Yes but the methods in which administrations conduct their day-to-day demonstrate a far cry from customer service and best practice. Look at the horrid lineups for everything, look at the facial expressions on everyone working in administration, and examine the public need for status-driven education. All these archetypes lead many students away from an honest education toward a philosophy closer resembling the administrations that serve them.
In other words, the entire system needs to go back to formula because it breeds dishonesty. Students who don't measure up will always resort to cheating, in any system. But what if cheating was somehow impossible? There could be a system designed where cheating had less of an impact, even if it was happening. Plagiarists everywhere reap direct rewards if they don't get caught, and big penalties if they do. So they get better at it, and by creating super-plagiarists, universities are contributing to a poisoning of society, because a plagiarist in school is a plagiarist in their career.
And plagiarism on the world stage is rewarded heavily. Look at all the knock-offs in the world. Japan revitalized its whole economy after WW2 because of plagiarism, by copying the western technology and making it better. That still is a form of plagiarism, IMHO, and yet it saved a whole country from the brink of disaster.
I mean it's easy to say that plagiarists are all bad people, but when you look at the big picture, it's not so cut and dry. Personally, I've graded every plagiarist in my courses with an F, and reported them. But after doing so I have always felt like I'm doing something wrong. Maybe plagiarists need harder exams or something?
Telling the students is just silly. I think maybe the better path would be individual assignment loads based on merit. The greater your grades, the less work you get assigned. In our current information age, it would not be that difficult to design dynamic courses that could adapt to each student. Plagiarists could be assigned a mountain of work that could not be plagiarised for punishment. Like 20,000 multiple choice questions or something hideous like that. Even if they cheat on it, it won't matter because it would be like a study session, and they would learn from it.
I'm sure after a few semesters of that, you'd find a sharp rise in original work!:-)
> Is it a coincidence that the school was making money off him and they have a motive for waiting until his senior year to can him? I think not.
I agree with this statement, and it touches on the administrative dishonesty that needs to be corrected. Students learn from example, and the administrations everywhere need to have tough policy, but back it up by following their own policies on a per-case basis. Clearly this university has failed their entire student body by being evil.
This argument doesn't fly with me at all. In fact it's the kind of thing I'd expect a university to claim. And it's that kind of dishonesty that has people cheating, because they had role-models. The schools need to practice an honesty-first method of administration, or they can expect that many students will cheat the system. I would think that there is an equation in there somewhere...
My point is that any claim can be made by administration about how degrees have zero value, but if you consider the worth of these advancements, and there is a tangible value.
Don't get me wrong, I dislike plagiarists immensely. For the amount of time it takes to write a good essay, you'd think people would figure out that it is totally easy to spot a fraud. I taught courses at college and caught someone plagiarizing; I noticed something in their report that stood out as far too advanced for the course and I googled it. F!!:-)
You sound like you know exactly what you're talking about, but you clearly are missing the point by a long-shot. XHTML is written cleaner and it parses well. It must be "well formed", and that is reason enough to use it. I'm a programmer first, and then a web developer second, and XHTML makes much more sense to me than HTML.
And why shouldn't Google move their base of operations out of the US? I strongly dislike judicial or political interference in the quality of service offered. Maybe the premise of fearing abuse of privacy is accurate, but as a programmer, I am offended whenever the government tells me how I can and can not code. It should be up to experienced systems designers and coders to decide how these systems are designed, not issue-pushing baby-kissers.
Slashdot Mirror
How hard would it be to use the same exact system for mail servers? Sim City mail servers or something like it for tracking usage stats, could reduce a lot of time for sysadmins, and aid in the fight against spam. Maybe I'm reaching... but it didn't seem that far away when I wrote the first comment on the subject.
If a picture says a thousand words, a city of pictures will help inform sysadmins/webmasters rapidly of infinite variables, by adding the 3d location of all data, relative to the position of information on the server. I wonder if this could be used somehow to stop spam, by "jailing" naughty virtual-citizens? Please, nobody quote Jurassic Park about this... oh hell, Lex: "It's a UNIX system! I know this!"
> I lather, rinse, repeat right now. That's why they gave me my own office with a door.
Yeah but if you don't shower at all, you'll get an office faster!
> I guess you completely ignored the bit about Flash and PHP OpenGL being completely different, huh?
What's the point of rehashing this? I've already explained my view on the subject. To me, this PHP/OpenGL project brings the marketing people closer to a solution that will force bandwidth-intensive marketing down our throats. Even if the current state of PHP doesn't make it easy, the push for getting OpenGL to work using PHP brings it one step closer.
PHP is a web scripting language, so it's only a matter of time before someone figures out how to take this project and transform it.
> If you like stability, try accounting.
I totally agree. There isn't much room for lateral changes to the global variance of accounting. Even though accounting changes to adapt new law, the system itself will never change; it's a matter of governments acquiring more and more money from corporations, and citizens. The laws don't have that much room to deform. Whereas technology has infinite room to deform, over time.
> The article mentioned that after a few years most college graduates have already achieved sysadmin status, but after that, where do you go from there?
I think the only way to go when you reach the ceiling, in any profession, is to design a smart startup company and own it. So it would be a switch from sysadmin to CEO. You could then sell off that company for big bucks, and then lather, rinse, repeat.
> Is it also hard to control your fingers typing it out?
Sometimes.
> Give me a single example that makes sense. A single example of misuse.
For more information on that, go here.
Where sysadmins will always thrive is in the ability to connect people who simply don't have time for all the details involved. It's not The Oldest Profession, but it's going to be the longest running profession someday, methinks.
> Yet another example of you not having a clue about what PHP is or does.
Inept. Totally inept statement. You missed my whole point, so I'll just skip it because I don't have time for people who don't understand simple logic.
> In pretty much every way.
This process is still young, but the eventual direction this will take is 3d apps over PHP and the web. It's bound to go that way. How could you deny that? You sound like Bill Gates when he said that computers will never need that much memory.
> It can't be used "over the net".
Currently, no, but that is bound to change when Gamespy figures out how to exploit this into Flash-like popup ads that can't be disabled, at all. Development money only comes from greed or enlightenment, and there is plenty of greed to go around these days.
> Conceivably somebody could write a plug-in that allows people to run PHP in a webbrowser, as well as some bindings to the necessary OpenGL libraries, but that is possible for any language.
Not exactly what I was saying, but close enough I guess. I think it's extremely viable for a plugin to be designed that will use this, and many will adopt it for websites as a result. Why the hell wouldn't they? It's not a totally bad idea, just one that scares me somewhat, if it's used maliciously.
> No, it could not.
There are systemic misuses and outright exploits. I am sure that any new system has both. You would have to agree, no? Or have you been sleeping in class?
> He didn't create a "system for content delivery". He just wrote an app that uses OpenGL.
I'm saying he has triggered the inevitability.
> mfh:
you are a fucking moron.
Maybe, but I'm a happy one. Can you say the same?
> I call bullshit. If you've lectured this stuff, I pity your students.
Pity yourself.
> This is an extension to PHP that renders scenes on the machine it is running on.
And Flash differs how? And who controls how this is used over the net? You appear to place far too much trust in programmers today. This is going to be misused, imho.
> There is simply no facility for transmitting the OpenGL calls over the Internet to where they will somehow be rendered by the client.
Wherever they come from, be it the client or the server, they could still be malicious and misused. It would be ignorant to think otherwise.
> Either you have no clue about PHP, or you didn't read the article and jumped to some stupid conclusions. Which is it?
Why does it have to be one or the other? Couldn't I just have read the article and made informed conclusions about it, in that this appears to be innocent now, but could be misused by bad people / bad companies? Why are you defending it? Did you code it?
This statement is meaningless: You can't wave away the fact that your whining is completely irrelevent by saying "give it time" as the fundamental mechanisms are all wrong to do what you are complaining about.
> This project doesn't attempt to do any of that.
That's the crux of my arguement: yes, this project appears harmless, but it could be manipulated maliciously. It's still to early to tell how far it could go, but it's bad practice to create systems for content delivery that impose intense graphical CPU/GPU usage, without any standards of conformity, or checks and balances.
> The laughing just makes you look childish and embarrassed btw.
Maybe, but laughter is hard to control when I read statements like yours.
> The guy did it for the hell of it. No one is proposing that we start using php for graphics coding. Just proving that we could if we wanted to.
Yes, but we shouldn't use it like that. It's going to be exploitive if it is. It may be useful in some aspects, but I expect it will be misused by marketers, spammers (think 3d pr0n ads) and much more. I think it's going to be hell for many people. It could be invaluable for 3d gaming online, but it could also be totally misused, and because it's built into PHP, the users will have no choice but to go along with it.
> Only if you haven't got a clue what you are talking about.
Hahahahahahahah... hahahahaha!!! I've taught PHP & MySQL at college level, and I'm a programmer who uses PHP & MySQL on a regular basis. So I happen to have some grounding in this subject matter. So, it's you who don't know what you're talking about, actually.
> This has nothing to do with the web.
Oh give it time.
> PHP is a general purpose scripting language, like Perl or Python. It has nothing to do with websites.
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!
Of course it's a scripting language. I just have to laugh because you're pretending it was developed for 3d design. That's ridiculous. PHP was designed for the web, unlike Perl. It's a product of the Apache Software Foundation.
From the php.net site: PHP is a widely-used general-purpose scripting language that is especially suited for Web development and can be embedded into HTML.
Nice troll, Troll. There is nothing elitist about what I have said in regards to PHP and openGL. I think the combination is an abomination! I know you may have a problem with my unwashed masses comment, but in regards to the misuse of Flash, anyone with half a clue would completely understand the comment and perhaps applaud it. You are obviously part of the unwashed masses who would disagree and I bet you have a Flash-driven Geocities page to prove it.
I'm sorry but I have to reject the idea of running openGL with PHP. The concept makes about as much sense as using Flash intros.
However I will add that there is a neato factor to all this, but it only goes so far. It's just silly to allow the unwashed masses access to this kind of technology because it's going to end up like Flash anims, and further plague our internet with CRAP.
> The amount of corruption and waste that was left behind by the NDP was grotesque, the Tories were just cleaning that up.
This is a totally uninformed viewpoint. The Tories cut education until there was no meat left, only bone and gristle. The NDP tried desperately to fufuil promises when they were elected, and they did for the most part. The NDP has a better track record than the Tories or the Liberals.
> Cutting the budget forces the corruption to shrink so it doesn't get discovered.
Again, you are completely in the dark. The less money that is available, the greater the corruption and crime, in any organization. The more money that is available to educators, the better the morale and effectiveness of teachers!
I think this move is the most enlightened move the Ministry of Ed has made since inception. Sadly it's only motivated by the shoddy budget for education, and not a move in ideology, necessarily. The backstory to the Ontario Ministry of Education using Star Office has to do mostly with politics. Even with $2bil increase to spending on education in the 2004 budget, this is still a lot less than years prior, due to Tory cuts to education. It's really a sad state of affairs for children today, in Ontario.
> Microsoft never innovated BEFORE they had money.
You hit it right on the head.
Is Microsoft Money Crushing Microsoft?
No, it's crushing me and everyone else who wants innovation, artistry and quality.
I totally agree with you. What we need to watch out for is that other, non-criminal websites are not blocked. It's okay to block websites that have *criminal* content, but I would have to draw the line at that. The UK has to protect their citizens, and if it means blocking access to child porn, that is fine by me. Imagine you have a teenage boy who fills up your PC with lolita images, and *you* get arrested.
> They are quite up-front and honest about policies on plagarism and cheating.
:-)
Yes but the methods in which administrations conduct their day-to-day demonstrate a far cry from customer service and best practice. Look at the horrid lineups for everything, look at the facial expressions on everyone working in administration, and examine the public need for status-driven education. All these archetypes lead many students away from an honest education toward a philosophy closer resembling the administrations that serve them.
In other words, the entire system needs to go back to formula because it breeds dishonesty. Students who don't measure up will always resort to cheating, in any system. But what if cheating was somehow impossible? There could be a system designed where cheating had less of an impact, even if it was happening. Plagiarists everywhere reap direct rewards if they don't get caught, and big penalties if they do. So they get better at it, and by creating super-plagiarists, universities are contributing to a poisoning of society, because a plagiarist in school is a plagiarist in their career.
And plagiarism on the world stage is rewarded heavily. Look at all the knock-offs in the world. Japan revitalized its whole economy after WW2 because of plagiarism, by copying the western technology and making it better. That still is a form of plagiarism, IMHO, and yet it saved a whole country from the brink of disaster.
I mean it's easy to say that plagiarists are all bad people, but when you look at the big picture, it's not so cut and dry. Personally, I've graded every plagiarist in my courses with an F, and reported them. But after doing so I have always felt like I'm doing something wrong. Maybe plagiarists need harder exams or something?
Telling the students is just silly. I think maybe the better path would be individual assignment loads based on merit. The greater your grades, the less work you get assigned. In our current information age, it would not be that difficult to design dynamic courses that could adapt to each student. Plagiarists could be assigned a mountain of work that could not be plagiarised for punishment. Like 20,000 multiple choice questions or something hideous like that. Even if they cheat on it, it won't matter because it would be like a study session, and they would learn from it.
I'm sure after a few semesters of that, you'd find a sharp rise in original work!
> Is it a coincidence that the school was making money off him and they have a motive for waiting until his senior year to can him? I think not.
I agree with this statement, and it touches on the administrative dishonesty that needs to be corrected. Students learn from example, and the administrations everywhere need to have tough policy, but back it up by following their own policies on a per-case basis. Clearly this university has failed their entire student body by being evil.
> The money is NOT for grades or a degree.
:-)
This argument doesn't fly with me at all. In fact it's the kind of thing I'd expect a university to claim. And it's that kind of dishonesty that has people cheating, because they had role-models. The schools need to practice an honesty-first method of administration, or they can expect that many students will cheat the system. I would think that there is an equation in there somewhere...
My point is that any claim can be made by administration about how degrees have zero value, but if you consider the worth of these advancements, and there is a tangible value.
Don't get me wrong, I dislike plagiarists immensely. For the amount of time it takes to write a good essay, you'd think people would figure out that it is totally easy to spot a fraud. I taught courses at college and caught someone plagiarizing; I noticed something in their report that stood out as far too advanced for the course and I googled it. F!!
You sound like you know exactly what you're talking about, but you clearly are missing the point by a long-shot. XHTML is written cleaner and it parses well. It must be "well formed", and that is reason enough to use it. I'm a programmer first, and then a web developer second, and XHTML makes much more sense to me than HTML.
:-)
Are you a Microsoft proponent, per chance?
And why shouldn't Google move their base of operations out of the US? I strongly dislike judicial or political interference in the quality of service offered. Maybe the premise of fearing abuse of privacy is accurate, but as a programmer, I am offended whenever the government tells me how I can and can not code. It should be up to experienced systems designers and coders to decide how these systems are designed, not issue-pushing baby-kissers.