Yeah, I believe it. It's a fairly solid strategy for radicalizing people. It works because several of the people in the pipeline either don't know or don't care that they're part of it.
Yes, some punk kids will watch PDP and pick up on his mild racism. It'll resonate with them and they'll go looking for more. Like I said, they'll find Shapiro and Sargon, who will lead them to Southern and down the chain to rallies where thinly disguised Nazi flags are flow and finally to open white supremacy and Nazism.
Nobody wakes up on day and says "Boy, I sure would like to be a Nazi!". It's a process. PDP is part of that process. He should be called out on it, as should every cog in that machine.
the report didn't conclude anything, positive or negative, in regards to collusion. For any other president that would be the end of it.
Trump's supporters seem willing to excuse anything in exchange for what he gives them. I don't think it's going to turn out to be worth it, but to be blunt a lot of the folks voting for him are older and, well, they'll be dead before the problems he's causing come home to roost. Doesn't help that the right wing of the Democratic party has pretty much abandoned working class America.
Long run I'm hoping this turns out to be a good thing. The right wing Dems were counting on this to shut Trump down so they could put Biden or Beto in office. The effect would have been the same as Trump without the pointless trade wars. It'll be harder to do that now. Hopefully that means we get a populist like Bernie or Warren who will make actual, positive changes.
It's going to be interesting if we get another 4 years of Trump. He'll invade Venezuela once he's not worried about reelection. Also he'll overturn Roe v. Wade for the same reason. Both of those are things the extreme right want but 70% of Americans don't (could be 90% for invading Venezuela, the Trumpers I know want to spend that money securing the borders here). Still, they got away with it with Iraq. Bush jr has a positive approval rating...
it's more like there's a couple hundred different posts. There's emoluments. There's campaign finance. There's tax evasion (lots and lots of that).
The reason nobody ever thought Trump would run for real is that he's been breaking the law his entire life and getting away with it because we don't punish the very wealthy. As it stands we're not going to punish Trump unless the American people at large change their minds. Right now he could shoot a man dead in Time Square and get away with it. Hell, some of his supporters want him to take over and become a dictator.
Will that change? Who knows. I know either way the rule of law has been significantly eroded by his presidency. Do his supporters love him enough to overlook that? Probably.
I'm disappointed but not surprised. In order for anything to be pinned on Trump he'd actually have to have done something. I don't mean something criminal, I mean anything at all.
He doesn't seem to be involved at all in day to day governing let alone campaigning. He's a figurehead. It becomes obvious when he has to interact with world leaders. In that case he can't just hand it off to folks really in charge since it's expected to be him. The most telling example was that phone call with Turkey where he got talked into pulling out of Syria. He backed down on the pledge as soon as his handlers got ahold of him again.
He's still openly flaunting the emoluments clause. And that bit with Deutsche bank where they loaned him $2 billion but there's an email chain showing he likely couldn't pay it back stinks to high heaven. That said it looks like nobody cares enough to bother with those. A few attorney generals will sue but I don't think anything'll come of it. Ultimately, we here don't spill the blood of kings.
it's job. There's too kinds of Alt-righter. First, there's the leadership, who's just taking advantage of the rank and file to make money.
Then there's the rank and file. They're almost entirely made up of young dudes (usually white) who lost factory and blue collar jobs to outsourcing and don't really have a place in society anymore.
It's why the left is pushing the "Green New Deal". It's a jobs program to neuter the right wing's main source of power (disaffected working age men). The "Green" part is mostly incidental. It's there to steal votes from the Green Party so they can't be used by the right wing to spoil elections.
With very few exceptions give a man a job and a woman and he'll settle the fuck down. Mix in an education and he won't fall for demagogues. There will be exceptions (Osama Bin Laden comes to mind) but they won't have enough followers to get anything done before they get caught.
dedicated to making the members of the right wing feel as though they're under attack. That's because once you convince somebody that they're under attack and really drive home the fear of it you can get them to do damn near anything.
to reign in the worst elements of their community. By all accounts 8Chan bills itself as a haven for those sorts.
There are arguments to be made that 8chan shouldn't be considered a terrorist recruitment site. For example, that it's not their intended purpose and that any recruitment taking place is a side effect of their laissez faire approach to moderation. But it's not a fair argument to make that because a terrorist recruiter can post to Facebook that means 8chan's automatically off the hook. Facebook would very quickly ban the individual if there was even a whiff of potential violence. 8chan wouldn't take down a post unless there was a very, very clear violation of law (and there's accusations that even then they'll turn a blind eye).
Also, I think we're conflating up "Should be considered a recruitment tool" vs "is actively recruiting terrorists". There's a big difference. For the former it means the FBI keeps a closer eye on what goes on. For the latter it means the FBI/CIA/Military/local police (depending on the country) raids the place.
For those that don't wanna bother with a long video, the article is about what the author calls "stochastic terrorism". Bruce Sterling touched on it in his novel "Distraction".
It works like a sales pipeline. You start out with PewDiePie spouting white supremacy "full the lulz" and for cheap publicity. A subset of his viewers "graduate" to harder stuff like Ben Shapiro and Sargon of Arkad, then on to Laura Southern and finally to stuff like the Unite the Right rally.
The New Zealand shooter ending his video with "subscribe to PewDiePie " because he's trying to put kids into that pipeline. Put a few hundred million in and eventually terrorists come out.
You'll be blocked for certain comments. Certain common troll posts won't be allowed. I've tried to do a few parody troll posts where I'm calling out to old trolls and gotten blocked until I modified the post substantially and added a bit more content than just a call out to the old post.
I'm not sure, but I'm guessing they did it to prevent folks from wasting all their Mod Points on modding down trolls.
Fascism is when all public institutions are brought under a single, centralized control. That's not just the economy. It's the Economy, Gov't, Religion, Schools, Hospitals, etc, etc.
I'm not going to pretend I can explain it terribly well, so see here and also here. Look up Shaun on YouTube while you're at it.
the only reason anyone can read your post but you is that/. is censoring the "Natalie Portman Hot Grits / Greased up Yoda Doll / GNAA" trolls. I can't be the only one old enough to remember the time before when/. was rendered useless by trolling efforts.
regular folk. Get a room full of 100 random people and I'd be surprised you could find one who's heard of 8chan before the shootings. If you did, it was probably because of that stunt THQ Nordic pulled with them (no such thing as bad advertising...).
And if I may, censorship has it's up side, especially when it's not done by the government. It makes content creators work harder to get their message out because they can't just rely on shock value. It discourages writers from relying on sex and violence and bigger and bigger explosions. The 70s and 80s were pretty well censored and they were a golden age for films (Star Wars, the Mel Brooks films, The God Father).
Take all the breaks off and you don't get a "free marketplace of ideas", you get a bevy of trolls and their shit posts. And as the discourse gets more and more toxic you get this.
for the last one. So I don't think they need to care. There won't be any bad PR because it's all pretty much the same corporate owned media whether it's Fox, MSNBC or CNN. There's a few lefty outlets talking about it (and Bernie and Warren, both of which have been bitching about it years, Bernie for decades) but you'd really have to go looking to find those.
because Stalin and Mao weren't socialists, they were fascists.
You do understand that people can misrepresent themselves, right? If not, I've got a Nigerian prince I can introduce you too. I'll just need a finders fee of a few dozen bit coins to an unregistered wallet...
TI just says you can't use your phone because you might cheat. They also spend a bunch of time/money training the teachers. You can use a $50 Casio but if you get stuck and don't know how to access a feature you need then unless your teacher kicks more ass than Mr T you're SOL. And if all else fails they buy off the schoolboards.
the entire economy is prepping for recession. It sucks. We all know it's coming and nobody's doing a damn thing to stop it. Instead companies are slashing staff so they can use the money for buy backs to boost their stock when it hits so the CEOs don't take a pay cut.
We could stop this easily. End buy backs. Increase regulatory oversight so that companies can't gamble on the economy and then hold us all hostage for a bail out. Start spending on Demand Side economics. Do the Green New Deal, not for the "Green" part but for the "New Deal" part. Do single payer healthcare so employees can switch jobs for better pay w/o fear of losing insurance for a few months.
It's frustrating because we know exactly how to stop all this and we just don't do it. And the same folks who say we shouldn't pick winners and losers will be on TV telling us why we need to bail out the losers next time. And we will to. We've done it every 10 years since I started paying attention, and I bet if I looked we did it before then.
that Jared and Ivanka used an app known for it's end to end encryption an ability to maintain privacy and secrecy with the full intention of maintaining all records.
Also, I'm quite certain I'm Napoleon. Viva la France!
A few moments on google should be enough to depose yourself of that idea, this
Beto's been overwhelmingly right win in his votes. He's a "New" Democrat, aka a Clinton Democrat. Just like Biden he "reaches across the isle", which is to say he votes with the GOP 80% of the time.
If that's what you want find. But please do go to the polls thinking your voting for a lefty or even a centrist. Beto is very much right wing, and it's only the crazy shifts in the Overton window that make him appear to be anything else. If you want a left wing candidate your choices are Bernie or Warren.
that's why we're discussing this. It's too expensive to get internet out to the boonies. Just like it was too expensive to get electricity and phones there. We did it anyway because it was good for the country. A connected, modern and well educated rural population was much less likely to do boneheaded things at the polls.
And I mentioned this elsewhere but if you live in the city the average rural voter has 40 times the voting power you do thanks to how the Senate and Electoral college works, and that's before we factor in Gerrymandering.
because thanks to our Senate and Electoral College those mountain folk have over 40 times more voting power than you do.
It is in your best interests that they have as much access to information as possible. Otherwise somebody will be happy to tell them exactly how to think and how to vote, and not necessarily to your liking...
Slashdot Mirror
Yeah, I believe it. It's a fairly solid strategy for radicalizing people. It works because several of the people in the pipeline either don't know or don't care that they're part of it.
Yes, some punk kids will watch PDP and pick up on his mild racism. It'll resonate with them and they'll go looking for more. Like I said, they'll find Shapiro and Sargon, who will lead them to Southern and down the chain to rallies where thinly disguised Nazi flags are flow and finally to open white supremacy and Nazism.
Nobody wakes up on day and says "Boy, I sure would like to be a Nazi!". It's a process. PDP is part of that process. He should be called out on it, as should every cog in that machine.
If this were Fox News those two would be flipped. This is why the Republicans win. They successfully control the message.
the report didn't conclude anything, positive or negative, in regards to collusion. For any other president that would be the end of it.
Trump's supporters seem willing to excuse anything in exchange for what he gives them. I don't think it's going to turn out to be worth it, but to be blunt a lot of the folks voting for him are older and, well, they'll be dead before the problems he's causing come home to roost. Doesn't help that the right wing of the Democratic party has pretty much abandoned working class America.
Long run I'm hoping this turns out to be a good thing. The right wing Dems were counting on this to shut Trump down so they could put Biden or Beto in office. The effect would have been the same as Trump without the pointless trade wars. It'll be harder to do that now. Hopefully that means we get a populist like Bernie or Warren who will make actual, positive changes.
It's going to be interesting if we get another 4 years of Trump. He'll invade Venezuela once he's not worried about reelection. Also he'll overturn Roe v. Wade for the same reason. Both of those are things the extreme right want but 70% of Americans don't (could be 90% for invading Venezuela, the Trumpers I know want to spend that money securing the borders here). Still, they got away with it with Iraq. Bush jr has a positive approval rating...
it's more like there's a couple hundred different posts. There's emoluments. There's campaign finance. There's tax evasion (lots and lots of that).
The reason nobody ever thought Trump would run for real is that he's been breaking the law his entire life and getting away with it because we don't punish the very wealthy. As it stands we're not going to punish Trump unless the American people at large change their minds. Right now he could shoot a man dead in Time Square and get away with it. Hell, some of his supporters want him to take over and become a dictator.
Will that change? Who knows. I know either way the rule of law has been significantly eroded by his presidency. Do his supporters love him enough to overlook that? Probably.
I'm disappointed but not surprised. In order for anything to be pinned on Trump he'd actually have to have done something. I don't mean something criminal, I mean anything at all.
He doesn't seem to be involved at all in day to day governing let alone campaigning. He's a figurehead. It becomes obvious when he has to interact with world leaders. In that case he can't just hand it off to folks really in charge since it's expected to be him. The most telling example was that phone call with Turkey where he got talked into pulling out of Syria. He backed down on the pledge as soon as his handlers got ahold of him again.
He's still openly flaunting the emoluments clause. And that bit with Deutsche bank where they loaned him $2 billion but there's an email chain showing he likely couldn't pay it back stinks to high heaven. That said it looks like nobody cares enough to bother with those. A few attorney generals will sue but I don't think anything'll come of it. Ultimately, we here don't spill the blood of kings.
it's job. There's too kinds of Alt-righter. First, there's the leadership, who's just taking advantage of the rank and file to make money.
Then there's the rank and file. They're almost entirely made up of young dudes (usually white) who lost factory and blue collar jobs to outsourcing and don't really have a place in society anymore.
It's why the left is pushing the "Green New Deal". It's a jobs program to neuter the right wing's main source of power (disaffected working age men). The "Green" part is mostly incidental. It's there to steal votes from the Green Party so they can't be used by the right wing to spoil elections.
With very few exceptions give a man a job and a woman and he'll settle the fuck down. Mix in an education and he won't fall for demagogues. There will be exceptions (Osama Bin Laden comes to mind) but they won't have enough followers to get anything done before they get caught.
dedicated to making the members of the right wing feel as though they're under attack. That's because once you convince somebody that they're under attack and really drive home the fear of it you can get them to do damn near anything.
Fox News is too big with the old folk, but Peterson's set him self up as a kind of father figure to a large number of disenfranchised young men.
I didn't like the guy when I first saw him but had a really, really hard time articulating why until I saw this and also this. This too.
to reign in the worst elements of their community. By all accounts 8Chan bills itself as a haven for those sorts.
There are arguments to be made that 8chan shouldn't be considered a terrorist recruitment site. For example, that it's not their intended purpose and that any recruitment taking place is a side effect of their laissez faire approach to moderation. But it's not a fair argument to make that because a terrorist recruiter can post to Facebook that means 8chan's automatically off the hook. Facebook would very quickly ban the individual if there was even a whiff of potential violence. 8chan wouldn't take down a post unless there was a very, very clear violation of law (and there's accusations that even then they'll turn a blind eye).
Also, I think we're conflating up "Should be considered a recruitment tool" vs "is actively recruiting terrorists". There's a big difference. For the former it means the FBI keeps a closer eye on what goes on. For the latter it means the FBI/CIA/Military/local police (depending on the country) raids the place.
See here.
For those that don't wanna bother with a long video, the article is about what the author calls "stochastic terrorism". Bruce Sterling touched on it in his novel "Distraction".
It works like a sales pipeline. You start out with PewDiePie spouting white supremacy "full the lulz" and for cheap publicity. A subset of his viewers "graduate" to harder stuff like Ben Shapiro and Sargon of Arkad, then on to Laura Southern and finally to stuff like the Unite the Right rally.
The New Zealand shooter ending his video with "subscribe to PewDiePie " because he's trying to put kids into that pipeline. Put a few hundred million in and eventually terrorists come out.
You'll be blocked for certain comments. Certain common troll posts won't be allowed. I've tried to do a few parody troll posts where I'm calling out to old trolls and gotten blocked until I modified the post substantially and added a bit more content than just a call out to the old post.
I'm not sure, but I'm guessing they did it to prevent folks from wasting all their Mod Points on modding down trolls.
you're not seeing them because the Mods shut them down before you do. Both the human ones and the automated ones.
so you're building up strawmen to attack me.
Fascism is when all public institutions are brought under a single, centralized control. That's not just the economy. It's the Economy, Gov't, Religion, Schools, Hospitals, etc, etc.
I'm not going to pretend I can explain it terribly well, so see here and also here. Look up Shaun on YouTube while you're at it.
the only reason anyone can read your post but you is that /. is censoring the "Natalie Portman Hot Grits / Greased up Yoda Doll / GNAA" trolls. I can't be the only one old enough to remember the time before when /. was rendered useless by trolling efforts.
regular folk. Get a room full of 100 random people and I'd be surprised you could find one who's heard of 8chan before the shootings. If you did, it was probably because of that stunt THQ Nordic pulled with them (no such thing as bad advertising...).
And if I may, censorship has it's up side, especially when it's not done by the government. It makes content creators work harder to get their message out because they can't just rely on shock value. It discourages writers from relying on sex and violence and bigger and bigger explosions. The 70s and 80s were pretty well censored and they were a golden age for films (Star Wars, the Mel Brooks films, The God Father).
Take all the breaks off and you don't get a "free marketplace of ideas", you get a bevy of trolls and their shit posts. And as the discourse gets more and more toxic you get this.
which are doing very well for them, so they just fired a bunch of highly trained and useful people in a profitable product line.
for the last one. So I don't think they need to care. There won't be any bad PR because it's all pretty much the same corporate owned media whether it's Fox, MSNBC or CNN. There's a few lefty outlets talking about it (and Bernie and Warren, both of which have been bitching about it years, Bernie for decades) but you'd really have to go looking to find those.
it won't cause famine any more than the last New Deal did. The "Green" part is just there to keep the Green party from spoiling another race.
because Stalin and Mao weren't socialists, they were fascists.
You do understand that people can misrepresent themselves, right? If not, I've got a Nigerian prince I can introduce you too. I'll just need a finders fee of a few dozen bit coins to an unregistered wallet...
TI just says you can't use your phone because you might cheat. They also spend a bunch of time/money training the teachers. You can use a $50 Casio but if you get stuck and don't know how to access a feature you need then unless your teacher kicks more ass than Mr T you're SOL. And if all else fails they buy off the schoolboards.
the entire economy is prepping for recession. It sucks. We all know it's coming and nobody's doing a damn thing to stop it. Instead companies are slashing staff so they can use the money for buy backs to boost their stock when it hits so the CEOs don't take a pay cut.
We could stop this easily. End buy backs. Increase regulatory oversight so that companies can't gamble on the economy and then hold us all hostage for a bail out. Start spending on Demand Side economics. Do the Green New Deal, not for the "Green" part but for the "New Deal" part. Do single payer healthcare so employees can switch jobs for better pay w/o fear of losing insurance for a few months.
It's frustrating because we know exactly how to stop all this and we just don't do it. And the same folks who say we shouldn't pick winners and losers will be on TV telling us why we need to bail out the losers next time. And we will to. We've done it every 10 years since I started paying attention, and I bet if I looked we did it before then.
that Jared and Ivanka used an app known for it's end to end encryption an ability to maintain privacy and secrecy with the full intention of maintaining all records.
Also, I'm quite certain I'm Napoleon. Viva la France!
A few moments on google should be enough to depose yourself of that idea, this
Beto's been overwhelmingly right win in his votes. He's a "New" Democrat, aka a Clinton Democrat. Just like Biden he "reaches across the isle", which is to say he votes with the GOP 80% of the time.
If that's what you want find. But please do go to the polls thinking your voting for a lefty or even a centrist. Beto is very much right wing, and it's only the crazy shifts in the Overton window that make him appear to be anything else. If you want a left wing candidate your choices are Bernie or Warren.
that's why we're discussing this. It's too expensive to get internet out to the boonies. Just like it was too expensive to get electricity and phones there. We did it anyway because it was good for the country. A connected, modern and well educated rural population was much less likely to do boneheaded things at the polls.
And I mentioned this elsewhere but if you live in the city the average rural voter has 40 times the voting power you do thanks to how the Senate and Electoral college works, and that's before we factor in Gerrymandering.
because thanks to our Senate and Electoral College those mountain folk have over 40 times more voting power than you do.
It is in your best interests that they have as much access to information as possible. Otherwise somebody will be happy to tell them exactly how to think and how to vote, and not necessarily to your liking...