Nope, then you've got to maintain presence (which means monthly or more frequent dives into water with two inch visibility, freezing temperatures, and, in some parts, currents strong enough to rip your arms off your body if you move wrong.) and you've got to otherwise show "good faith" attempts to salvage. You also need to make sure that nobody else already has rights to that ship. That can take you to Lloyd's, admiralty courts of a dozen nations, etc. Oh, by the way, you've also got to prove which wreck it is. Not so easy to do under those circumstances.
It may be *possible* to get and hold rights to wreck but it's by no means easy.
Rustin
And, yes, I am currently on the edge of a team with a pending effort to retrieve a wreck in the Hudson.
I'm a helios man myself. Once they get those puppies finalized, you'll see small towns able to cover footprints larger then most states. Specifically, this will be much more practical in mountainous areas or simply those with lots of deep ravines.
In Montana they've had trouble because people tend to build in narrow valleys (more water, less wind, etc.) and thereby are choosing the areas with the *worst* possible radio wave accessability. The higher you go, the less that matters.
Rustin
Hey there, the perfessor here.
I sent that info in for exactly the reasons that I said and analog_line explained. They were a part of the old school legacy and I'm sad to see them go. Personally, even though I, as it happens, am the owner of a 5300 that only just flaked this year, yeah, I think that they were overprices and rude. But, then again, where else could you find Radius monitors and Apple ][ add-ons as of last year without completely gambling on reliability? Other than one of their famed 99-dollar 7200 mobos, I haven't bought from them in *years* but I truly will miss dropping by and looking at the silly goodies.
Okay, so enough sentiment. Y'all are bitchin' too much about lack of places to get goods. You want a frickin' ad? Here's a frickin' ad!
Perfessor Multigeek's Guide to Mac Stuff Sites
(incomplete 'cause otherwise you'll never drop by my site when I put up my new Mac links next month)
Guide to Mac CPUsThis is Apple's own site for detailed specs on all their machines ever. I'm starting you off on the page for older machines to remind you that a well-configured 1996 Mac w/ a USB/Firewire card can run OSX just fine, thank you very much.
Mac of All TradesGetcher used macs here! Pretty visuals, delicious prices, detailed info. Selection could be better and there's no old stuff at all but I can deal with that. Have I bought from them yet? Nope. Am I likely to in the future? Yep.
MacResqThe best place I've found overall to pick up gear. Even the guys in that article figured that out.
Focus of Mac Hardware good workaday resource for doing mods. No cool toys. Considerable good data.
Missoula Mac User Group, Yeah, I know that you haven't heard of them; neither has anybody else outside of Montana AFAIK. Best place for overall newbie resources.
Powermax Cheesy setup, improving selection, good prices.
ResExcellence In the old days I would have suggested MacFixit, but these guys have taken their place. If you've been in the Mac world for a while you'll recognize them as the old-time source extraordinaire of ResEdit hacks.
Small Dog Shrinking selection, great quality, excellent service, annoying interface. Bottom line, these are the guys to turn to for premium service, support, and savvy. Been around quite a while and, hey, they enclose coupons for Ben and Jerry's.
applefritter. They've built Macs into everything from 1930's radios to LEGO people to ziplock bags. You can't buy anything there, but still much fun.
Think Secret Nice little rumor site. Some cool moments.
Of course, for those of us in the New York City area, there's always TekServe, an Apple and media gear mecca. You want to know what Lou Reed, Jam Master Jay, or Oliver Pratt are using? Ask them. You want toys? They got 'em. Ten cent cokes, vintage radios, serious testing gear, and a massive knowledge base. Hell, I once even applied for a job there when it would have meant giving up a far-better paying sysadmin gig. If they're good enough for Steve J., then they're worth a look.
Oh, by the way, the last time that I posted this list I included Shreve. What did I say? ShreveExpensive, distracting, but the best place to get weird low-end stuff like Mac Plus manuals and Daystar cards.
There. You all feeling better now?
Rustin
You sir, are correct. My bad. Most embarrassing.
How could I screw up one last chance to recall the best low-bandwidth bus ever made? After all, how could we ever forget a bus that performed *above* spec for almost fifteen years? *
I blame too much caffeine and not enough sleep; after all, it couldn't be the fault of my sloppiness, could it?
Rustin
*the ABD spec was actually rather loose while the chip set used by Apple was extremely consistent. When the clones came out and worked merely to spec (for example, not complying with the rock-solid Apple ADB waveform) a number of ABD devices such as the late, lamented ABD I/O failed and had to be reworked to the new, less-rigorous hardware. Ah, I'll miss ya! -R
The editor I work with most frequently has recently been applying an old and worthy technique to my work.
When you finish your first draft, look at it and find the thing in it you love most. The obscure fact that you are sure everybody should know, the analysis that proves your brilliance once and for all, or, even more importantly, proves X public figure a fool/genius, the telling anecdote/fact. Take that thing out and kill it dead.
It's a great (though humbling) way to reduce bias. Now if only more of our journalists had such unforgiving editors.
Rustin
Thank you for the link.
The idea that the Transportation Safety folks now keep a list of people to subject to intense search bothers me not at all.
The idea that one can get on that list simply for being politically distasteful to the Bush Administration is appalling.
The idea that nobody is willing to admit how this list is compiled or how one disputes being on it is terrifying.
When government declares that it is no longer accountable to the people it governs, then it has lost the legitimacy of that office.
I would compare this to McCarthy but McCarthy and his cronies weren't anywhere near this effective.
Rustin
Cool! (heh, heh)
Actually my main thought is that this makes living comfortably off the grid even more viable.
All that compressor-based stuff? Fridges with motors and coils and water traps? Naw, they's just for thems as don't know any better.
Okay, so the only currently relevant conclusion they are reaching is that life on Mars (if there is any) would have evolved to bloom and spread at massive speeds, like an even more extreme version of our desert plants. I can *kinda* see that since if there's usually no life in most places there's also no competition for anything that gets there. Given the Martian wind levels and a presumption of heavy rains then fast propagation is possible.
Thass nice. So what?
Well, it seems to me that if we begin to terraform Mars, or in fact, even build a base there that heats the surrounding area and spreads some moisture just by mistake, then we may get some sorta Martian kudzu spreading everywhere. Sounds fine to me.
Rustin
Ahh, and thus/. brings joy to at least one geek's life.
Well, quasi-geek. I'm sorry, Wil, but anybody whose photo has been in Teen Beat has a limit to how purely geek they can be.
Rustin
Yup, you are correct. I was wrong and should have read more of the thread before posting. Oops. So now you have your proofe (heh, heh) of my slovenliness.
Slinks off (giggling) into the darkness . .
Rustin
Yep, that annoys me no end, and I live in NYC so don't even have to shop there. My question is: do they label the media as having been modified? Perhaps a special B rating for boring.
It has been my experience in the past that, in fact, there is no such labeling.
Of course, one funny (laughing to keep from crying) aspect of this is that the RIAA/MPAA's members are seeing their products sold in stripped down form because they don't have the unity to stand up to WalMart/DuaneReade/CVS/etc. Good to know that they're there for their members when quality and brand identity are on the line. Hmph.
btw, one interesting factoid: Southland Corporation (Seven-Eleven) has repeatedly stood up to pressure to moron-proof their stuff. One too many suits from the Wildmon crowd and 7/11 decided that backing free speech was a business matter for them. Cool. Makes me feel better about all those Slurpies I've paid for.
Rustin
Ah, the ignorance of the young. As it happens, I was named after Bayard Rustin, the guy who *really* organized the "ML King" March on Washington, along with many, many other things.
So now you know.
Rustin
I'm gonna take a not so wild guess and say that it wasn't on purpose. After all, he also misspelled "Wil".
Let's face it folks, the man is none too bright. Either that or he well and truly just doesn't care at all. Look at those answers. They're all done on autopilot. The closest thing to attention was his answer about regret and for a well-known actor, even that is just a prepared speech.
But at the end of day, does it really matter? Not to me. As long as I've got his face yelling "Khan!!!!!!!! I don't care if he can't even spell his *own* name.
Rustin
Read the article. This system uses seawater, not fresh. No loss of fresh water at all. In fact, if, as they claim, they would recover a bit of the sea salts, they would actually create a net *increase* in the overall supply of water.
I don't know about you folks, but I'm pretty bullish on this one. It looks like a good approach (other then nastying up coastal areas and creating surface turbulence) to me and I wish them the best.
Rustin
I love the concept, but have you ever visited the Seattle area? Unless they can *start out* with huge floods, nobody would notice. They'ld just button up their Patagonia jackets a little higher.
How about the new MS facility in India that they're so smug about? The one trying to get the Indian educational system locked into Windoze? I'm sure that any Indian LUG would be happy to provide the coordinates.
Now *that* would be nice.
Rustin
a responsible, efficient agricultural conglomerate like Archer-Daniels-Midland
You are kidding, right?
Are we talking about the same ADM that had multiple senior executives convicted of fraud and price fixing? You know, the one case where their behavior was so bad that they're serving jail time. The same one that is considered a willful and determined sabotager of the family farm? The company that pushed for and got mandatory government support of gasahol based on their crops that cost two to three times the cost of petroleum?
No, maybe you're talking about the ADM that has used massive political contributions to cripple the production, pricing and availability of sugar in the United States, thereby not only leavng us with food products made with high fructose corn syrup (purchased from them, of course) that makes our food taste worse here and sell worse overseas, but also provides a major source of income for hard-core right-wing Cuban emigres for them to use to fund Iran-Contra and Latin American death squads.
No, perhaps you were thinking about their key role in funding Bob Dole's crushing of John McCain's push for campaign finance reform.
Impossible. You were probably thinking of this ADM, the one that has spread consistent misinformation about genetically modified crops, thereby making it much harder for those who are honestly trying to use genetic engineering to help their fellows.
Unless, of course, you're talking about the company whose role in the use of bovine growth hormone puts them on the top of the list for reasons that many American teenagers are now on a constant course of drugs just from the stuff they absorb from eating at places like McDonald's.
Sure, perhaps the worst company in America this side of Waste Management and Microsoft for ubiquitious and culturally supported corruption. A place that considers undermining of efficient government and an honest media right up there with price fixing and destructive competition as daily goals. Definitely the people *I* want running a crucial new social function.
Better go back and take some of those M.B.A. classes again. Sounds like you missed a few bits here and there.
Rustin
Irrigation doesn't affect the weather?
It certainly does on this planet, boyo.
Irrigated areas create different wind profiles, put water into the atmosphere (after all, that's how plants get water, it gets pulled up through the roots into the body of the plant by the capillary force of the water that's *already* evaporating off the leaves), and usually correlate with changes in species distribution and surface temperature.
Are these changes necessarily bad? A messy question. But they certainly take place.
Facts, ol' son. Start by getting facts.
Rustin
"authorization"? oh, please. It's a hundred foot tall tower with no complex moving parts. Anybody with access to windy coastland and some cash will be able to do this.
I'm more curious as to how this will affect land prices and the political games it will create.
Anybody care to take bets on how long it will be before some Friend O' Bush who owns very dry land in, say, Texas, gets the government to pay to build these on the closest bit of coast?
Rustin
Cool. Let him blow through the money that, by all accounts (heh, heh) he got none too ethically in the first place, and in the process provide more jobs for techies. At the very least, this will encourage more kids to study space science and increase the odds of somebody else using a job there to get the scratch to write up their own, more productive approach.
I'll bet that ten years from now we'll be hearing of seriously radical space ventures founded by the veterans of all the low-cost-launcher/X Prize companies that will have tanked but paid the bills and created the relationships that will get the second gen. companies moving. Don't think of SpaceX as a sleazy guy pushing into an oversaturated market. Think of it as space science fellowships.
Rustin
I agree. You go out and get the money (No big deal these days. venture capital being so readily available), and I'll buy a ticket.
Sarcasm aside, I *would* buy a ticket for a space trip lottery (if the odds were, say a five dollar ticket for a one-in-a-million chance) and would love it if somebody did a thing like that. As you pointed out, it would even be good business and good for keeping Russian scientists doing good stuff.
But folks are a *wee bit* short of the ready these days. Maybe in ten years.
Rustin
Point taken. I misspoke. What I meant to say is that there seem to be a lot of pilots out there with solid experience who speak of seeing what appeared to them to be intelligently driven vehicles of a sort not possible with current known technology. I *really* don't want to say "flying saucers" and, yes, UFO is a meaningless term since, as you pointed out, these are, by definition unidentified, look to be flying, and look to be objects, even though those same criteria would apply to wads of bubble gum shot up with boomerangs from the local school.
BTW, what was the deal with all that talk recently about some hujungeous delta-shaped airship thingy that people were calling an alien craft but was actually some sort of U.S. military supply ship? I remember reading about it but don't remember where. Probably/. but I'm too lazy to do the search.
Rustin
Slashdot Mirror
Nope, then you've got to maintain presence (which means monthly or more frequent dives into water with two inch visibility, freezing temperatures, and, in some parts, currents strong enough to rip your arms off your body if you move wrong.) and you've got to otherwise show "good faith" attempts to salvage. You also need to make sure that nobody else already has rights to that ship. That can take you to Lloyd's, admiralty courts of a dozen nations, etc. Oh, by the way, you've also got to prove which wreck it is. Not so easy to do under those circumstances.
It may be *possible* to get and hold rights to wreck but it's by no means easy.
Rustin
And, yes, I am currently on the edge of a team with a pending effort to retrieve a wreck in the Hudson.
I'm a helios man myself. Once they get those puppies finalized, you'll see small towns able to cover footprints larger then most states. Specifically, this will be much more practical in mountainous areas or simply those with lots of deep ravines.
In Montana they've had trouble because people tend to build in narrow valleys (more water, less wind, etc.) and thereby are choosing the areas with the *worst* possible radio wave accessability. The higher you go, the less that matters.
Rustin
Okay, so enough sentiment. Y'all are bitchin' too much about lack of places to get goods. You want a frickin' ad? Here's a frickin' ad!
Perfessor Multigeek's Guide to Mac Stuff Sites
(incomplete 'cause otherwise you'll never drop by my site when I put up my new Mac links next month)
Guide to Mac CPUsThis is Apple's own site for detailed specs on all their machines ever. I'm starting you off on the page for older machines to remind you that a well-configured 1996 Mac w/ a USB/Firewire card can run OSX just fine, thank you very much.
Mac of All TradesGetcher used macs here! Pretty visuals, delicious prices, detailed info. Selection could be better and there's no old stuff at all but I can deal with that. Have I bought from them yet? Nope. Am I likely to in the future? Yep.
MacResqThe best place I've found overall to pick up gear. Even the guys in that article figured that out.
Focus of Mac Hardware good workaday resource for doing mods. No cool toys. Considerable good data.
Missoula Mac User Group, Yeah, I know that you haven't heard of them; neither has anybody else outside of Montana AFAIK. Best place for overall newbie resources.
Powermax Cheesy setup, improving selection, good prices.
ResExcellence In the old days I would have suggested MacFixit, but these guys have taken their place. If you've been in the Mac world for a while you'll recognize them as the old-time source extraordinaire of ResEdit hacks.
Small Dog Shrinking selection, great quality, excellent service, annoying interface. Bottom line, these are the guys to turn to for premium service, support, and savvy. Been around quite a while and, hey, they enclose coupons for Ben and Jerry's.
applefritter. They've built Macs into everything from 1930's radios to LEGO people to ziplock bags. You can't buy anything there, but still much fun.
Think Secret Nice little rumor site. Some cool moments.
Of course, for those of us in the New York City area, there's always TekServe, an Apple and media gear mecca. You want to know what Lou Reed, Jam Master Jay, or Oliver Pratt are using? Ask them. You want toys? They got 'em. Ten cent cokes, vintage radios, serious testing gear, and a massive knowledge base. Hell, I once even applied for a job there when it would have meant giving up a far-better paying sysadmin gig. If they're good enough for Steve J., then they're worth a look.
Oh, by the way, the last time that I posted this list I included Shreve. What did I say?
ShreveExpensive, distracting, but the best place to get weird low-end stuff like Mac Plus manuals and Daystar cards.
There. You all feeling better now?
Rustin
You sir, are correct. My bad. Most embarrassing.
How could I screw up one last chance to recall the best low-bandwidth bus ever made? After all, how could we ever forget a bus that performed *above* spec for almost fifteen years? *
I blame too much caffeine and not enough sleep; after all, it couldn't be the fault of my sloppiness, could it?
Rustin
*the ABD spec was actually rather loose while the chip set used by Apple was extremely consistent. When the clones came out and worked merely to spec (for example, not complying with the rock-solid Apple ADB waveform) a number of ABD devices such as the late, lamented ABD I/O failed and had to be reworked to the new, less-rigorous hardware. Ah, I'll miss ya! -R
The editor I work with most frequently has recently been applying an old and worthy technique to my work.
When you finish your first draft, look at it and find the thing in it you love most. The obscure fact that you are sure everybody should know, the analysis that proves your brilliance once and for all, or, even more importantly, proves X public figure a fool/genius, the telling anecdote/fact. Take that thing out and kill it dead.
It's a great (though humbling) way to reduce bias. Now if only more of our journalists had such unforgiving editors.
Rustin
Thank you for the link.
The idea that the Transportation Safety folks now keep a list of people to subject to intense search bothers me not at all.
The idea that one can get on that list simply for being politically distasteful to the Bush Administration is appalling.
The idea that nobody is willing to admit how this list is compiled or how one disputes being on it is terrifying.
When government declares that it is no longer accountable to the people it governs, then it has lost the legitimacy of that office.
I would compare this to McCarthy but McCarthy and his cronies weren't anywhere near this effective.
Rustin
Cool! (heh, heh)
Actually my main thought is that this makes living comfortably off the grid even more viable.
All that compressor-based stuff? Fridges with motors and coils and water traps? Naw, they's just for thems as don't know any better.
I *love* living in the future!
Rustin
Okay, so the only currently relevant conclusion they are reaching is that life on Mars (if there is any) would have evolved to bloom and spread at massive speeds, like an even more extreme version of our desert plants. I can *kinda* see that since if there's usually no life in most places there's also no competition for anything that gets there. Given the Martian wind levels and a presumption of heavy rains then fast propagation is possible.
Thass nice. So what?
Well, it seems to me that if we begin to terraform Mars, or in fact, even build a base there that heats the surrounding area and spreads some moisture just by mistake, then we may get some sorta Martian kudzu spreading everywhere. Sounds fine to me.
Rustin
Ahh, and thus /. brings joy to at least one geek's life.
Well, quasi-geek. I'm sorry, Wil, but anybody whose photo has been in Teen Beat has a limit to how purely geek they can be.
Rustin
Shatner balls? Ewwwww!
Rustin
Yup, you are correct. I was wrong and should have read more of the thread before posting. Oops. So now you have your proofe (heh, heh) of my slovenliness.
Slinks off (giggling) into the darkness . .
Rustin
Clearly a matter for the Klingon Language Institute. The only bunch of linguists I know whose leather creaks at their meetings.
Rustin
Yep, that annoys me no end, and I live in NYC so don't even have to shop there. My question is: do they label the media as having been modified? Perhaps a special B rating for boring.
It has been my experience in the past that, in fact, there is no such labeling.
Of course, one funny (laughing to keep from crying) aspect of this is that the RIAA/MPAA's members are seeing their products sold in stripped down form because they don't have the unity to stand up to WalMart/DuaneReade/CVS/etc. Good to know that they're there for their members when quality and brand identity are on the line. Hmph.
btw, one interesting factoid: Southland Corporation (Seven-Eleven) has repeatedly stood up to pressure to moron-proof their stuff. One too many suits from the Wildmon crowd and 7/11 decided that backing free speech was a business matter for them. Cool. Makes me feel better about all those Slurpies I've paid for.
Rustin
Ah, the ignorance of the young. As it happens, I was named after Bayard Rustin, the guy who *really* organized the "ML King" March on Washington, along with many, many other things.
So now you know.
Rustin
I'm gonna take a not so wild guess and say that it wasn't on purpose. After all, he also misspelled "Wil".
Let's face it folks, the man is none too bright. Either that or he well and truly just doesn't care at all. Look at those answers. They're all done on autopilot. The closest thing to attention was his answer about regret and for a well-known actor, even that is just a prepared speech.
But at the end of day, does it really matter? Not to me. As long as I've got his face yelling "Khan!!!!!!!! I don't care if he can't even spell his *own* name.
Rustin
Read the article. This system uses seawater, not fresh. No loss of fresh water at all. In fact, if, as they claim, they would recover a bit of the sea salts, they would actually create a net *increase* in the overall supply of water.
I don't know about you folks, but I'm pretty bullish on this one. It looks like a good approach (other then nastying up coastal areas and creating surface turbulence) to me and I wish them the best.
Rustin
I love the concept, but have you ever visited the Seattle area? Unless they can *start out* with huge floods, nobody would notice. They'ld just button up their Patagonia jackets a little higher.
How about the new MS facility in India that they're so smug about? The one trying to get the Indian educational system locked into Windoze? I'm sure that any Indian LUG would be happy to provide the coordinates.
Now *that* would be nice.
Rustin
Thank you. Amen.
a responsible, efficient agricultural conglomerate like Archer-Daniels-Midland
You are kidding, right?
Are we talking about the same ADM that had multiple senior executives convicted of fraud and price fixing? You know, the one case where their behavior was so bad that they're serving jail time. The same one that is considered a willful and determined sabotager of the family farm? The company that pushed for and got mandatory government support of gasahol based on their crops that cost two to three times the cost of petroleum?
No, maybe you're talking about the ADM that has used massive political contributions to cripple the production, pricing and availability of sugar in the United States, thereby not only leavng us with food products made with high fructose corn syrup (purchased from them, of course) that makes our food taste worse here and sell worse overseas, but also provides a major source of income for hard-core right-wing Cuban emigres for them to use to fund Iran-Contra and Latin American death squads.
No, perhaps you were thinking about their key role in funding Bob Dole's crushing of John McCain's push for campaign finance reform.
Impossible. You were probably thinking of this ADM, the one that has spread consistent misinformation about genetically modified crops, thereby making it much harder for those who are honestly trying to use genetic engineering to help their fellows.
Unless, of course, you're talking about the company whose role in the use of bovine growth hormone puts them on the top of the list for reasons that many American teenagers are now on a constant course of drugs just from the stuff they absorb from eating at places like McDonald's.
Sure, perhaps the worst company in America this side of Waste Management and Microsoft for ubiquitious and culturally supported corruption. A place that considers undermining of efficient government and an honest media right up there with price fixing and destructive competition as daily goals. Definitely the people *I* want running a crucial new social function.
Better go back and take some of those M.B.A. classes again. Sounds like you missed a few bits here and there.
Rustin
Irrigation doesn't affect the weather?
It certainly does on this planet, boyo.
Irrigated areas create different wind profiles, put water into the atmosphere (after all, that's how plants get water, it gets pulled up through the roots into the body of the plant by the capillary force of the water that's *already* evaporating off the leaves), and usually correlate with changes in species distribution and surface temperature.
Are these changes necessarily bad? A messy question. But they certainly take place.
Facts, ol' son. Start by getting facts.
Rustin
"authorization"? oh, please. It's a hundred foot tall tower with no complex moving parts. Anybody with access to windy coastland and some cash will be able to do this.
I'm more curious as to how this will affect land prices and the political games it will create.
Anybody care to take bets on how long it will be before some Friend O' Bush who owns very dry land in, say, Texas, gets the government to pay to build these on the closest bit of coast?
Rustin
Cool. Let him blow through the money that, by all accounts (heh, heh) he got none too ethically in the first place, and in the process provide more jobs for techies. At the very least, this will encourage more kids to study space science and increase the odds of somebody else using a job there to get the scratch to write up their own, more productive approach.
I'll bet that ten years from now we'll be hearing of seriously radical space ventures founded by the veterans of all the low-cost-launcher/X Prize companies that will have tanked but paid the bills and created the relationships that will get the second gen. companies moving. Don't think of SpaceX as a sleazy guy pushing into an oversaturated market. Think of it as space science fellowships.
Rustin
I agree. You go out and get the money (No big deal these days. venture capital being so readily available), and I'll buy a ticket.
Sarcasm aside, I *would* buy a ticket for a space trip lottery (if the odds were, say a five dollar ticket for a one-in-a-million chance) and would love it if somebody did a thing like that. As you pointed out, it would even be good business and good for keeping Russian scientists doing good stuff. But folks are a *wee bit* short of the ready these days. Maybe in ten years.
Rustin
You keep a soul in Redmond? No wonder you're in trouble.
Point taken. I misspoke. What I meant to say is that there seem to be a lot of pilots out there with solid experience who speak of seeing what appeared to them to be intelligently driven vehicles of a sort not possible with current known technology. I *really* don't want to say "flying saucers" and, yes, UFO is a meaningless term since, as you pointed out, these are, by definition unidentified, look to be flying, and look to be objects, even though those same criteria would apply to wads of bubble gum shot up with boomerangs from the local school. /. but I'm too lazy to do the search.
BTW, what was the deal with all that talk recently about some hujungeous delta-shaped airship thingy that people were calling an alien craft but was actually some sort of U.S. military supply ship? I remember reading about it but don't remember where. Probably
Rustin