Time to boycott. Even if just all the Slashdotters boycotted, it'd be something to see.
Or perhaps organize a drone-enabled protest outside..;)
These jobs used to be filled not just by school kids and retirees, but by anyone looking to get by or pick up a little extra cash. Today there're more and more people clinging to these jobs as their last hope. Things have changed. On 'our' side, its gotten worse. On management's side? Well, let's just say that if the minimum wage had kept pace with the cost of living from 1978 on, $15/hr would look like a sweet deal to them.
I'd gladly pay 2 bits more for a burger knowing it was going to a real flesh and blood person rather than to grease and pneumatics upgrades.
Anybody feelin' the Bern?;)
"At what point will we start seeing legislation forbidding the automation of certain industries?"?
We won't. The decision on automation will be put squarely in the greedy, greasy palms of business owners and administrative bean-counters, who will see only the bottom line, while leaving the rest of us to fend for ourselves, widening even further the gap between the very rich and the very poor.
Politics, being increasingly money-driven, will do what it does now, ie listening to the money and allowing those "who know their industries" to write the legislation, rubber-stamping it as "good for the country" and blaming whatever wash-out echelon it creates for any inconvenient issues... such as the customer base able to purchase whatever product it happens to be. Prices will drop, since automation will do it better/faster/cheaper, still leaving truckloads of profit for the big-wigs while the rest of us collect bottles and cans from the side of the highway for a living.
Of course, before too long, THAT will become a crime too.
Now that I've spread a little joy, time to move along.;)
Have you done a whois on governmentattic.org?
Interesting. Not a word about it. Like it has never existed. Interesting mix of alphabet soup... NSA, NIA, CIA, FBI, FISA, PRISM, POTUS, and who knows what-all else. Curse you, Al Gore, for inventing this thing in the first place.;-)
Screw 'em. I fought the same fight for 18 years. Finally I would simply back up the necessary data myself and lecture them without mercy each time (about every 5 weeks on average) they opened a script-containing email or virus loading website. Then I would take my own sweet time cleaning the machine(s) and restoring the required data... Not that I'd dog it, of course, I just wouldn't kill myself to make sure the a-hole boss could check weather.com to see if he'd need an umbrella on the golf course... so he and/or his dribbling idiot sons (He only bought the place so that they wouldn't have jobs requiring paper hats and extensive use of the phrase "Would you like fries with that?") would have plenty of time to complain about people not following the rules (it was ALWAYS someone else's fault, ya know).
Hard to believe I've been looking for a job for 3 years now, huh? [chuckle]
Or make the computers send a death threat to each member of the congress and executive office (including the candidates)...
I've got to admit that this appeals to me. Just don't sign it "Osama" or mention WMDs... It seems there are some things they're just not interested in finding. [g]
> But the real reason for building a scope is the reason for building a > computer - it's fun and you learn stuff - not to save money.
This is true, but let's face it... money IS a concern for most of us.
Since I've started this project, I've learned a lot of stuff that I never thought about before. That is truly a great thing, but being able to say "This sucker only cost me [fill in the blank] bucks" comes second only to saying "I built this sucker myself".
It probably hasn't been mentioned because it's not really true anymore. Used to be, but now you can pick up a 10 inch dob with good optics for 450 bucks.
True, but a 10" dob isn't quite the epitome of amateur telescope making anymore.
A 10" mirror is still a good piece of equipment, but hardly deserving of the type of observatory we're talking about here.
While it's true that many of the discoveries that we consider important (Galileo, Cassini, etc.)
were made with telescopes with smaller mirrors smaller than what's available today, they didn't have to contend with sodium street lamps and huge cities that throw stray photons about like they were free.
Add to that the fact that what manufacturers call "good" optics are merely marginal by most standards, and it becomes worthwhile for someone interested in the process to make their own.
AND I'll bet you that I could build a 10" dob for less than half that cost.
Clear skies, Joe Mirando http://scope.joemirando.net
I'm a bit surprised that no one has mentioned this, but you can build your own telescope for less money than you can buy one!!
This includes grinding the mirror yourself, by the way. With a bit of care and patience, you can grind and polish a mirror that is accurate to within 1/10th of a wavelength of light.... that's quite a bit better than what you usually end up with when buying one from a store.
I'm in the process of polishing a 16" mirror at the moment.... my first! The 16" blank, along with an 8" blank for a smaller scope and all the grinding/polishing materials cost me around $300. That doesn't include the optical tube assembly or aluminizing the mirror, but the mirror itself is usually the most expensive part anyway.
There are also those who add their own "go to" drives and such, but that seems like a bit much for me... at least with THIS scope.
My guess is that you can find an astronomy club near by with several members who can help.
More info for those interested can be found at The ATM Site (not my site).
Slashdot Mirror
Time to boycott. Even if just all the Slashdotters boycotted, it'd be something to see. Or perhaps organize a drone-enabled protest outside.. ;)
These jobs used to be filled not just by school kids and retirees, but by anyone looking to get by or pick up a little extra cash. Today there're more and more people clinging to these jobs as their last hope. Things have changed. On 'our' side, its gotten worse. On management's side? Well, let's just say that if the minimum wage had kept pace with the cost of living from 1978 on, $15/hr would look like a sweet deal to them.
I'd gladly pay 2 bits more for a burger knowing it was going to a real flesh and blood person rather than to grease and pneumatics upgrades.
Anybody feelin' the Bern? ;)
"At what point will we start seeing legislation forbidding the automation of certain industries?"? We won't. The decision on automation will be put squarely in the greedy, greasy palms of business owners and administrative bean-counters, who will see only the bottom line, while leaving the rest of us to fend for ourselves, widening even further the gap between the very rich and the very poor. Politics, being increasingly money-driven, will do what it does now, ie listening to the money and allowing those "who know their industries" to write the legislation, rubber-stamping it as "good for the country" and blaming whatever wash-out echelon it creates for any inconvenient issues... such as the customer base able to purchase whatever product it happens to be. Prices will drop, since automation will do it better/faster/cheaper, still leaving truckloads of profit for the big-wigs while the rest of us collect bottles and cans from the side of the highway for a living. Of course, before too long, THAT will become a crime too. Now that I've spread a little joy, time to move along. ;)
Have you done a whois on governmentattic.org? Interesting. Not a word about it. Like it has never existed. Interesting mix of alphabet soup... NSA, NIA, CIA, FBI, FISA, PRISM, POTUS, and who knows what-all else. Curse you, Al Gore, for inventing this thing in the first place. ;-)
Can we PLEASE dispense with the silly encryption bullshit? If I wanted something that was impossible to read, I'd go to FOXNEWS
You beat me to it! I WAS going to say that they must be accounting for inflation and creating five 6.9 million dollar men.
Screw 'em. I fought the same fight for 18 years. Finally I would simply back up the necessary data myself and lecture them without mercy each time (about every 5 weeks on average) they opened a script-containing email or virus loading website. Then I would take my own sweet time cleaning the machine(s) and restoring the required data... Not that I'd dog it, of course, I just wouldn't kill myself to make sure the a-hole boss could check weather.com to see if he'd need an umbrella on the golf course... so he and/or his dribbling idiot sons (He only bought the place so that they wouldn't have jobs requiring paper hats and extensive use of the phrase "Would you like fries with that?") would have plenty of time to complain about people not following the rules (it was ALWAYS someone else's fault, ya know). Hard to believe I've been looking for a job for 3 years now, huh? [chuckle]
Or make the computers send a death threat to each member of the congress and executive office (including the candidates)...
I've got to admit that this appeals to me. Just don't sign it "Osama" or mention WMDs... It seems there are some things they're just not interested in finding. [g]
Strom,
All I can say is:
Hookt on Fonicks Werkt Four Mee!
Joe Mirando
I haven't heard anything about this anywhere else... Has anyone confirmed this?
> computer - it's fun and you learn stuff - not to save money.
This is true, but let's face it... money IS a concern for most of us.
Since I've started this project, I've learned a lot of stuff that I never thought about before. That is truly a great thing, but being able to say "This sucker only cost me [fill in the blank] bucks" comes second only to saying "I built this sucker myself".
Let's see...
Mirror kit: $100.00
Diagonal: $ 30.00
Focuser: $ 30.00
Building mat'l: $ 40.00
Sono-Tube: $ 10.00
Eyepiece: $ 40.00
The joy of knowing you beat a big company
out of a getting your hard-earned money by doing it yourself: PRICELESS
For some things, it doesn't matter much whether you're right or wrong.
For everything else, there's SlashDot
chuckle chuckle
Joe Mirando
really true anymore. Used to be, but now you can pick
up a 10 inch dob with good optics for 450 bucks.
True, but a 10" dob isn't quite the epitome of amateur telescope making anymore.
A 10" mirror is still a good piece of equipment, but hardly deserving of the type of observatory we're talking about here.
While it's true that many of the discoveries that we consider important (Galileo, Cassini, etc.) were made with telescopes with smaller mirrors smaller than what's available today, they didn't have to contend with sodium street lamps and huge cities that throw stray photons about like they were free.
Add to that the fact that what manufacturers call "good" optics are merely marginal by most standards, and it becomes worthwhile for someone interested in the process to make their own.
AND I'll bet you that I could build a 10" dob for less than half that cost.
Clear skies,
Joe Mirando
http://scope.joemirando.net
This includes grinding the mirror yourself, by the way. With a bit of care and patience, you can grind and polish a mirror that is accurate to within 1/10th of a wavelength of light.... that's quite a bit better than what you usually end up with when buying one from a store. I'm in the process of polishing a 16" mirror at the moment.... my first! The 16" blank, along with an 8" blank for a smaller scope and all the grinding/polishing materials cost me around $300. That doesn't include the optical tube assembly or aluminizing the mirror, but the mirror itself is usually the most expensive part anyway.
There are also those who add their own "go to" drives and such, but that seems like a bit much for me... at least with THIS scope.
My guess is that you can find an astronomy club near by with several members who can help.
More info for those interested can be found at The ATM Site (not my site).
Clear Skies,
Joe Mirando