You have the "right" (actually I disapprove of the whole notion of "rights", but that's another rant) to pass on your WORK PRODUCT AND ANY PROFITS ALREADY MADE to your kids.
You DO NOT have any reasonable expectation that society should pay your kids ONE THIN DIME for that product - either if they don't like it any more because the culture has progressed past your works or because the ideas embodied in those works are now in the minds of millions of others that are producing works based on your work.
A business owner has the "right" to pass on his BUSINESS to his kids - NOT HIS CUSTOMERS! His customers will decide for themselves whether they want to do business with his kids based on the current value of the business TO THOSE CUSTOMERS.
No business has any right to a SALE! They have a right to make an OFFER! Which is why most businesses eventually go OUT of business as a normal part of the business cycle.
Like most people, you want the state to hold a knife to everyone else's throat and force them to deal for your benefit. You just don't like it when someone else wins that privilege because they can bribe the state better than you can...
I read the book years ago - it is practically a how-to on how to be a check forger and con man (at least, as was possible thirty or forty years ago - the technigues now probably would not work - but the PRINCIPLES of why they worked probably still do work).
Anybody remember the scene from "Manhunter" (the original "Red Dragon" movie with Brian Cox as Hannibal Lector) where Hannibal "social-engineers' the address of FBI agent Will Graham out of the temp sitting in for the secretary of Graham's forensic psychologist by posing as the psychologist's publisher wanting to send a copy of a book to the agent? Great scene! Lector even does a little "phone phreaking" with the telephone!
And in it, Mitnick complains that the Feds used rumors and false charges against him...
HAH! Welcome to the Federal system of "criminal justice"!
Join the hundreds of thousands of "drug dealers" in prison because a REAL drug dealer informed on his family and friends to get a lesser sentence...
I sympathize with Mitnick, but not much, because he should have expected as much...
This is how the DOJ DOES BUSINESS EVERY SINGLE DAY OF THE WEEK!
I was in a holding cell in the San Francisco Federal Building when another defendant came in laughing. He was in court awaiting his case's turn for arraignment or bail or something. The Magistrate was hearing evidence presented by a DEA agent and expressing his doubts about it. The US Attorney said, "But, Your Honor, this is a DEA agent and he wouldn't lie!" The Magistrate LAUGHED in the attorney's face and said, "Don't tell me that a DEA agent wouldn't come into my courtroom and lie!"
That's how much common knowledge it is that Federal agents ROUTINELY LIE UNDER OATH.
HAH! You've obviously never browsed the book catalog of a large city public library like San Francisco, have you?
They have five copies of everything, at least. Here is how the entries read:
Copy 1: Damaged. Copy 2: Borrowed, not returned. Copy 3: Missing. Copy 4: On Loan (i.e., shortly to be changed to the same as Copy 2 or Copy 3). Copy 5: Restricted to Reference Desk.
Have fun finding Mitnick's book at ANY library - it will be stolen by script kiddies in twenty minutes after it's put in the stacks...
I would point out to you that Lee Felsenstein's project (reported on here at Slashdot recently) indicated that the teenagers in the villages involved were "100% literate".
These assumptions being made on Slashdot that everyone outside the US is illerate is mind-boggling. The literacy rate in the US is such that a significant percentage of high school grads cannot read signs or find Canada on a map...
Wake up! The educational establishment in the US has dumbed this country down to BELOW third-world levels, IMO.
You know WHY they don't sue Phillips - who makes stereo equipment that COPIES CDs? Because Phillips as a corporation has revenue greater than the ENTIRE MUSIC AND MOVIE INDUSTRIES COMBINED!
Not to mention that without CD and DVD players, the music and movie industries would go broke...
Power and economic clout are what matter - as long as it is executed by a small enough group of people. Spread Phillips billions over the people who pay for their products and you have no clout...
Jeez.... How many times do I hafta tell ya it don't happen like that in the Feds! (Unless you're a pretty boy/. geek (which is an oxymoron - although the moron part does fit most/.'ers...)
Go here for info on what files and how and where to put Real codecs on a Windows machine - presumably Xine docs can tell you where to put them for Xine...
1) Anyone who invests a lot of time and energy into ONE THING will be influenced by that ONE THING. That's how the brain works - whatever is repetitive and emotionally stimulating is assumed to have some connection to the organism's survival and is therefore recorded more firmly than "lesser important" things.
2) If you let a kid "play violence" CONSTANTLY, their behavior may well be influenced. If you let them play with DOLLS CONSTANTLY (male or female), their behavior may well be influenced.
3) NO child can be HARMED by INCONSISTENT EXPOSURE to ANYTHING - porn, violence, whatever.
4) Especially if they are being influenced by an adult as to the (adult's perceived) social and philosophical context of the material.
5) Which means if you ain't training your kid, someone else will.
6) Which means any attempt to regulate ANY content of ANY nature is coercive interference both in the free market AND in parenting.
7) Anybody who does not understand these points is a moron. We Transhumanists will deal with you later.
Investigators said Serebryany took copies of many of the documents to his family's home in Los Angeles and from his home computer sent more than 800 megabytes worth of electronic copies to at least three Web site operators.
The operator of one Web site,
"It was mostly like snippets of internal meetings, technical meetings, about the new access card and such," the site's operator who identified himself as J. Gray of Nanaimo, British Columbia said in a telephone interview. "It gave people a start on where to start looking, the technical specifications."
LOOK AT THIS PART! Zwillinger, the lawyer for DirecTV, was formerly an expert on the law for the Justice Department and prosecuted the nation's first case under the law.
AND LOOK AT THIS PART! The internal DirecTV documents were under court seal as part of a lawsuit between the company and rival NDS Group PLC, a unit of News Corp., over an agreement for NDS to provide access cards for DirecTV subscribers. In a series of lawsuits and countersuits, NDS had alleged that DirecTV itself was responsible for leaking the internal documents onto the Internet.
Depends on the size of the firm. I would expect DirecTV to be using a sizeable firm, but perhaps not. I know I worked as a temp for Brobeck Phleger and Harrison at one point, and they have a considerable IT department (running IBM System/38's in the San Francisco office in the late '80's).
There are IT magazines oriented strictly to law firms.
If this guy as a temp had access to computers with sensitive client trade secret info on them, or he had access to documents with same in them, the law firm screwed up. There's probably due diligence rules somewhere that the Bar could bring against them. One would hope so...
I did eight years in the Federal joint. It is NOT like you see in the movies! Nobody even suggested to me that they'd like to screw me... (Beat my ass, maybe, but not screw it...)
OTOH, I wasn't a good-looking young kid...
Still, I NEVER in EIGHT YEARS saw or heard ANY verifiable case of someone being raped in the Federal joint... Not to say it never happens, because I am absolutely sure it does, but it AIN'T as common as people imagine...
Now, if you want to say "STATE-pound-me-in-the-ass crime", I have no direct experience of the state joint and I have heard it is considerably more violent than the Federal joint, so feel free...
According to the Economic Espionage Act, if the breaking of the NDA leads to the disclosure of trade secrets, then it is a crime under that law. An NDA is considered part of a victim's attempt to "reasonably protect" a trade secret.
The question some people have is whether this (treating ANY business information as a trade secret AND treating the disclosure of trade secrets as a criminal act) should be the case, as it seems to tread on legal precedent concerning the protection of trade secrets vrs the protection of patents.
This law appears to seriously extend the government's (and by extension any corporation's) ability to bring criminal action against anyone who reveals practically anything about a business. Much like the DMCA...
I understand your point - unlike the rest of the idiots quoting the article at you...
The law firm clearly did not protect sensitive client product the way they should have. Even if they just gave him some documents to Xerox, it should not have included proprietary trade secrets
And if they let him access a computer with those documents on it, they really screwed up big time.
If he hacked in, OTOH, it would depend on how and whether their IT security was on the ball vis-a-vis the security flaw involved...
- hey should be sending him to a federal pound-me- - in-the-ass prison!
Never been in Federal prison, have you? I have - for eight years. It's not quite the way they portray prisons on TV...
OTOH, the kid is 19 and young guys are at more risk of sexual harassment than older guys. On the third hand, he may be a bodybuilder-type Russian and can handle himself...
Plus he can always go sit in The Hole for the duration...
- but a 19 year old part-time worker was able to - access electronic copies of a major client's - most proprietary technical information? Either - the firm's IT people are lax or someone on the - staff made a mistake that allowed the fellow - access.
THAT's a very good point - the law firm seriously screwed up here in protecting client product...
No surprise, tho... DirecTV would be wise to find a new firm with better IT security.
All in all, tho, I'd say the kid is the one in deep excrement - if he did what they say, it definitely sounds like industrial espionage - at least in the sense that proprietary trade secrets were obtained and distributed - whether that was for economic gain depends on whether hacking satellite service is an "economic gain" in the INDUSTRIAL ESPIONAGE sense...as opposed to some other legal sense.
And while I'm sure he cringes (or chuckles) when anybody mentions this, but he was also "Military Editor" of the Berkeley Barb in the '60's...
He has LONG supported the idea of cheap technology access for everyone. He was promoting the idea for years of a cheap PC ($100 or less) for everybody including Third World countries just to see what people would do with them.
I suppose he counts as "left wing" or "liberal" (he's definitely not a Libertarian) but he's not an idiot liberal.
The morons complaining here about the project don't have a clue (which is not to say I can afford to donate anything myself or even that I care about the project personally).
Slashdot Mirror
You have the "right" (actually I disapprove of the whole notion of "rights", but that's another rant) to pass on your WORK PRODUCT AND ANY PROFITS ALREADY MADE to your kids.
You DO NOT have any reasonable expectation that society should pay your kids ONE THIN DIME for that product - either if they don't like it any more because the culture has progressed past your works or because the ideas embodied in those works are now in the minds of millions of others that are producing works based on your work.
A business owner has the "right" to pass on his BUSINESS to his kids - NOT HIS CUSTOMERS! His customers will decide for themselves whether they want to do business with his kids based on the current value of the business TO THOSE CUSTOMERS.
No business has any right to a SALE! They have a right to make an OFFER! Which is why most businesses eventually go OUT of business as a normal part of the business cycle.
Like most people, you want the state to hold a knife to everyone else's throat and force them to deal for your benefit. You just don't like it when someone else wins that privilege because they can bribe the state better than you can...
I read the book years ago - it is practically a how-to on how to be a check forger and con man (at least, as was possible thirty or forty years ago - the technigues now probably would not work - but the PRINCIPLES of why they worked probably still do work).
Anybody remember the scene from "Manhunter" (the original "Red Dragon" movie with Brian Cox as Hannibal Lector) where Hannibal "social-engineers' the address of FBI agent Will Graham out of the temp sitting in for the secretary of Graham's forensic psychologist by posing as the psychologist's publisher wanting to send a copy of a book to the agent? Great scene! Lector even does a little "phone phreaking" with the telephone!
And in it, Mitnick complains that the Feds used rumors and false charges against him...
HAH! Welcome to the Federal system of "criminal justice"!
Join the hundreds of thousands of "drug dealers" in prison because a REAL drug dealer informed on his family and friends to get a lesser sentence...
I sympathize with Mitnick, but not much, because he should have expected as much...
This is how the DOJ DOES BUSINESS EVERY SINGLE DAY OF THE WEEK!
I was in a holding cell in the San Francisco Federal Building when another defendant came in laughing. He was in court awaiting his case's turn for arraignment or bail or something. The Magistrate was hearing evidence presented by a DEA agent and expressing his doubts about it. The US Attorney said, "But, Your Honor, this is a DEA agent and he wouldn't lie!" The Magistrate LAUGHED in the attorney's face and said, "Don't tell me that a DEA agent wouldn't come into my courtroom and lie!"
That's how much common knowledge it is that Federal agents ROUTINELY LIE UNDER OATH.
HAH! You've obviously never browsed the book catalog of a large city public library like San Francisco, have you?
They have five copies of everything, at least. Here is how the entries read:
Copy 1: Damaged.
Copy 2: Borrowed, not returned.
Copy 3: Missing.
Copy 4: On Loan (i.e., shortly to be changed to the same as Copy 2 or Copy 3).
Copy 5: Restricted to Reference Desk.
Have fun finding Mitnick's book at ANY library - it will be stolen by script kiddies in twenty minutes after it's put in the stacks...
Yes, and there's nothing on it about this issue, which seems like more evidence that it is some sort of prank by somebody other than Gobbles.
I just sent an email message to the email address on the site suggesting they make a statement.
I would point out to you that Lee Felsenstein's project (reported on here at Slashdot recently) indicated that the teenagers in the villages involved were "100% literate".
These assumptions being made on Slashdot that everyone outside the US is illerate is mind-boggling. The literacy rate in the US is such that a significant percentage of high school grads cannot read signs or find Canada on a map...
Wake up! The educational establishment in the US has dumbed this country down to BELOW third-world levels, IMO.
Morons...
You know WHY they don't sue Phillips - who makes stereo equipment that COPIES CDs? Because Phillips as a corporation has revenue greater than the ENTIRE MUSIC AND MOVIE INDUSTRIES COMBINED!
Not to mention that without CD and DVD players, the music and movie industries would go broke...
Power and economic clout are what matter - as long as it is executed by a small enough group of people. Spread Phillips billions over the people who pay for their products and you have no clout...
He's a smart (if illiterate) 14 - he's figured out how the world works already...
In other words, if I live in Tonga and sell buttons with swastikas on them, I can do prison time in Germany?
Welcome to the One World Order...
No:
1. Bush invades Australia.
2. ????
3. Profit!
While reading a short sentence, you came - twice?
I'm glad I am NOT your girlfriend...
"Federal-pound-me-in-the-ass prison"!
/. geek (which is an oxymoron - although the moron part does fit most /.'ers...)
Say "STATE-pound-me-in-the-ass-prison"!
Jeez.... How many times do I hafta tell ya it don't happen like that in the Feds! (Unless you're a pretty boy
Go here for info on what files and how and where to put Real codecs on a Windows machine - presumably Xine docs can tell you where to put them for Xine...
In a few years, I can hack from my limo (babes in the back), using encrypted links, no one can find me, no one can stop me, I can get in anywhere...
BWHAHAHAHAHAHAH....
Oh, wait...
Sorry, thought I was posting to Phrack...
1. Sign deals with small companies (Seattle Computer Products, now Sendo)
2. ?????
3. Profit!
I'll explain it to you all again:
1) Anyone who invests a lot of time and energy into ONE THING will be influenced by that ONE THING. That's how the brain works - whatever is repetitive and emotionally stimulating is assumed to have some connection to the organism's survival and is therefore recorded more firmly than "lesser important" things.
2) If you let a kid "play violence" CONSTANTLY, their behavior may well be influenced. If you let them play with DOLLS CONSTANTLY (male or female), their behavior may well be influenced.
3) NO child can be HARMED by INCONSISTENT EXPOSURE to ANYTHING - porn, violence, whatever.
4) Especially if they are being influenced by an adult as to the (adult's perceived) social and philosophical context of the material.
5) Which means if you ain't training your kid, someone else will.
6) Which means any attempt to regulate ANY content of ANY nature is coercive interference both in the free market AND in parenting.
7) Anybody who does not understand these points is a moron. We Transhumanists will deal with you later.
Have a nice media day...
Read this from the ABC report on the matter:
Investigators said Serebryany took copies of many of the documents to his family's home in Los Angeles and from his home computer sent more than 800 megabytes worth of electronic copies to at least three Web site operators.
The operator of one Web site,
"It was mostly like snippets of internal meetings, technical meetings, about the new access card and such," the site's operator who identified himself as J. Gray of Nanaimo, British Columbia said in a telephone interview. "It gave people a start on where to start looking, the technical specifications."
LOOK AT THIS PART!
Zwillinger, the lawyer for DirecTV, was formerly an expert on the law for the Justice Department and prosecuted the nation's first case under the law.
AND LOOK AT THIS PART!
The internal DirecTV documents were under court seal as part of a lawsuit between the company and rival NDS Group PLC, a unit of News Corp., over an agreement for NDS to provide access cards for DirecTV subscribers. In a series of lawsuits and countersuits, NDS had alleged that DirecTV itself was responsible for leaking the internal documents onto the Internet.
READ THAT LAST SENTENCE!
Depends on the size of the firm. I would expect DirecTV to be using a sizeable firm, but perhaps not. I know I worked as a temp for Brobeck Phleger and Harrison at one point, and they have a considerable IT department (running IBM System/38's in the San Francisco office in the late '80's).
There are IT magazines oriented strictly to law firms.
If this guy as a temp had access to computers with sensitive client trade secret info on them, or he had access to documents with same in them, the law firm screwed up. There's probably due diligence rules somewhere that the Bar could bring against them. One would hope so...
"Federal-pound-me-in-the-ass crime"?
I did eight years in the Federal joint. It is NOT like you see in the movies! Nobody even suggested to me that they'd like to screw me... (Beat my ass, maybe, but not screw it...)
OTOH, I wasn't a good-looking young kid...
Still, I NEVER in EIGHT YEARS saw or heard ANY verifiable case of someone being raped in the Federal joint... Not to say it never happens, because I am absolutely sure it does, but it AIN'T as common as people imagine...
Now, if you want to say "STATE-pound-me-in-the-ass crime", I have no direct experience of the state joint and I have heard it is considerably more violent than the Federal joint, so feel free...
According to the Economic Espionage Act, if the breaking of the NDA leads to the disclosure of trade secrets, then it is a crime under that law. An NDA is considered part of a victim's attempt to "reasonably protect" a trade secret.
The question some people have is whether this (treating ANY business information as a trade secret AND treating the disclosure of trade secrets as a criminal act) should be the case, as it seems to tread on legal precedent concerning the protection of trade secrets vrs the protection of patents.
This law appears to seriously extend the government's (and by extension any corporation's) ability to bring criminal action against anyone who reveals practically anything about a business. Much like the DMCA...
I understand your point - unlike the rest of the idiots quoting the article at you...
The law firm clearly did not protect sensitive client product the way they should have. Even if they just gave him some documents to Xerox, it should not have included proprietary trade secrets
And if they let him access a computer with those documents on it, they really screwed up big time.
If he hacked in, OTOH, it would depend on how and whether their IT security was on the ball vis-a-vis the security flaw involved...
Hope he shows up on
- hey should be sending him to a federal pound-me-
- in-the-ass prison!
Never been in Federal prison, have you? I have - for eight years. It's not quite the way they portray prisons on TV...
OTOH, the kid is 19 and young guys are at more risk of sexual harassment than older guys. On the third hand, he may be a bodybuilder-type Russian and can handle himself...
Plus he can always go sit in The Hole for the duration...
- but a 19 year old part-time worker was able to
- access electronic copies of a major client's
- most proprietary technical information? Either
- the firm's IT people are lax or someone on the
- staff made a mistake that allowed the fellow
- access.
THAT's a very good point - the law firm seriously screwed up here in protecting client product...
No surprise, tho... DirecTV would be wise to find a new firm with better IT security.
All in all, tho, I'd say the kid is the one in deep excrement - if he did what they say, it definitely sounds like industrial espionage - at least in the sense that proprietary trade secrets were obtained and distributed - whether that was for economic gain depends on whether hacking satellite service is an "economic gain" in the INDUSTRIAL ESPIONAGE sense...as opposed to some other legal sense.
And while I'm sure he cringes (or chuckles) when anybody mentions this, but he was also "Military Editor" of the Berkeley Barb in the '60's...
He has LONG supported the idea of cheap technology access for everyone. He was promoting the idea for years of a cheap PC ($100 or less) for everybody including Third World countries just to see what people would do with them.
I suppose he counts as "left wing" or "liberal" (he's definitely not a Libertarian) but he's not an idiot liberal.
The morons complaining here about the project don't have a clue (which is not to say I can afford to donate anything myself or even that I care about the project personally).