I agree that there are many unwashed out there, but you missed the important part of what he said...
...in my work I am the one responsible for protecting our offices, and cleaning up if something were to get through...
He needs to either step up to that responsibility or else relinquish it to someone who will. I was simply trying to make that clearer for him. That's what I meant when I said "by choice or by force".
The article he cites would be an interesting read. He should link it instead of being vague.
The company that got hit is going to have a hard time blaming anyone beyond their own admins. MS did the same thing they do to mitigate any other risk plus did some extra public-awareness work. Anybody who didn't see this coming and at least follow the advisory's recommendations to firewall the appropriate ports... well, they weren't too concerned about their systems. I mean, c'mon, NetBIOS ports open to untrusted networks? What system that critical should be allowing that? I don't allow NetBIOS to my son's gaming machine!
These worms that make us find and patch these holes, without wiping our systems out, are costly, yes, and annoying yes, but they are also protecting us from the really malicious ones, by making us all more aware, and ensuring that steps are taken to prevent. I am not just talking about the cleanup worm, but also MSblaster. It doesn't destroy anything, but it makes us protect ourselves, makes us develop an immune system.
I am not saying I like them, and in my work I am the one responsible for protecting our offices, and cleaning up if something were to get through but I would rather be protecting from MSBlaster, than something really nasty.
First, the worms shouldn't be making you find and patch the holes... you should've already known. Second, you better not just be defending against these lame automated attacks. They are the least of your worries. The dedicated, thinking intruder is much more skillful, and C|Net won't be warning you about his modus operandi in the same kind of detail. And there's no patch system for him. You're gonna get schooled one way or another... either by choice or by force.
Actually, the lazy admins are the $HIT. If the Critical Update plus a high-profile warning from no less than the US Govt (reprinted in media everywhere) isn't enough to make you consider reading the advisory, testing the patch and deploying, maybe you were an ostrich in a previous life. I get really amused when MS gets blasted for this but the GNU FTP server exploit which possibly tainted months worth of code updates only has the crowd screaming for the perpetrator's head. Truth is, in both scenarios, the admins are at fault.
Well, considering that you can have no confidence in a system that is known to have had unauthorised remote commands executed on it, I'd have to say that might not be a bad idea.
Right, and it has been made clear previously that NUMA, RCU were designed outside of UNIX and then implemented there, just like they were other places. So SCO has rights to those features on SCO UNIX, but that is the extent of it. Sequent (and hence IBM) retains the right to implement same wherever they see fit. If the implementation is similar, well, duhhh, LINUX is supposed to support a lot of UNIX-like stuff.
BTW -- at some Teradata training this week, I laughed my ass off to hear the instructor talk about some older versions of their software running on AT&T SVR4 that had an implementation of a JFS type file system supplied by Veritas! The dates he gave pretty much give SCO a run for their money on originating (much less owning) a JFS on UNIX, especially considering they still distribute that file system royalty free and with no agreement with anyone to do so and have for years.
Damn, my bad. It's so thick with zeal and ignorance in here, it's getting hard to tell the trolls from the folks who don't know any better. I was confused, to be sure; I was sure I had seen you post cogently before about OSS in general and Linux in particular. I'm so used to the repugnant anonymous trolls, it never crossed my mind that someone might do it with identity. I guess I'll cross reference earlier posts the next time I wonder if it's a troll or memorex.
You might have noticed that a lot of the positively moderated comments for this story are lamenting FSF's policies on backups and patches, and urging them to get on the fucking stick instead of being apologetics.
You might've noticed that the replies to all of these are modded redundant as we point out for the mozillionth time that they did make backups, but there's not enough evidence that the backup tools themselves were not compromised.
...and not just because it points out the disparity in tolerance for MS holes vs. others, but because it points out the emotional difference. Either way, the LINUX zealot is grabbing his torch. But in the MS case it's their fault. In this case, it's for the perp.
I think only the BSD proponents have it right and so what... it's not snobbery if you're right. Off that topic tho... the problem is... what about all the GNU software installs that have gone down since March? If you buy the GNU line here, it's all suspect. And let's be clear here that this includes GNU software for any platform, including Win32! Imagine if a library used in a cross platforn GNU-distributed product has "malcode" inserted! If I stretch my imagination, I can believe that a sizeable percentage of the *X/BSD crowd will know to get fresh everything that might be suspect... but Joe Windows who wanted to try GIMP, oOo or something to avaoid paying for the commercial offerings?* Forget it, he'll never know the diff... and besides, he's r00+3d six ways from sunday anyway already. But now if someone in the know ever hips him to the fact, he'll probably blame the GNU installs.
I'm a Windows user a lot of the time, but there's no denying that the mean value of intelligence of users on the platform is far below that of most others.
*(note -- I'm leaving out the other great GNU software that runs on Windows like Apache, MySQL, just to name a few because the caliber of moron we're talking about here has no need for a web server or DB engine, etc. then again, MS would install it by default until recently...)
That's just it... it's not technically true. Even if firewalled, the machines are still vulnerable to the right vector if they are not patched or improperly patched and they continue to broadcast the crap and screw up the network for those of us with a clean bill of health.
AMEN to this. I had a remote user get slammer. My T-1 provider phoned at 2:00 AM to inform me that my network was broadcasting the nasty. I assured him I was not, but a quick packet capture at the gateway hinted I was wrong. When I revoked his dialin privileges, he was on the phone at 2:30 AM asking why he couldn't get in. I told him I was sleeping and he was infected to call me back when he had reformatted, reinstalled, patched and scanned. When he called back again, I told him I wasn't done sleeping I'd call him back later. This was the incident that finally got me to deploy SNORT at a few choice spots on my network.
OCG: Incorrect. Windows Update and Auto Update are shoddy excuses for patch management, especially taken alone. Ordering and chaining of patches is horrendous, and the mechanism that "validates" patch installation is worse. HFNetChkPro is a far superior product, especially when combined with Software Update Services and the aforementioned practice of testing on non-critical servers (or, optionally, reasonable replicas of your operating environment). Any admin on any platform that doesn't rigorously regression-test a patch before deploying, while still not as villainous as the lazy slob who doesn't patch until the worm is spotted, still needs to be ousted from duty and have his home DSL line snipped permanently as well. That goes for Windows, LINUX, BSD, C-64 or whatever else. If it (your platform of choice/force) has the capacity to pollute the environment and there is a fix available but you turn out to be the ultra inertially-challenged and you turn a blind eye until the inevitable happens, you need to either commit suicide for the sake of us all, or, ignoring that, run for President. Hell, you can say you invented patches.
I don't run auto update anywhere on my network, but all my servers and workstations are patched. Snort is detecting the bugger outside the walls, and the din is getting higher. Anyone going to wager if it gets farther than Nimda?
You're the wulf-kind for certain. Weren't you the one who told us two comments ago how long you'd been "out of the gate"... you can deny your true self only so long before your own language will give you away.
It is so entertaining how you can flip from asinine vulgarity to holier-than-thou in an instant. I guess you have to be inventive if you are the only one who will listen. Are you sure you're not also a latent appliance fetishist? That would limit you to underage robot dogs...
I don't know about you, but when I call to a pet, I do it with a very clear and authoritative voice, not unlike the one I use with other lower life forms like you. If you use guttural or distorted voices when speaking to the animals, it probably says something about you. It also probably scares the hell out of the animals. All the better. If they knew what's good for them, they started running as soon as they saw you.
You do owe the dog-kind apologies, but you know the real reason why. You are not only fixated on the pre-pubescent, you are an animal fetishist as well. You have combined the two and will only mate with underage dogs. Ah well, your mum's been of age for almost two years and she's fair game since your dad, I mean older brother moved out, but she's a special case.
BTW my recording card is a Delta 44, my gaming card is a SBL Platinum 5.1. Not the latest, but does what I need. Would probably do well for those pre-pubescent gay.RMs you like to "stream" to as well.
Alphasys has no credited works. But the guy who posts using that moniker surely does. I have recounted before that I have shared the stage with Col. Bruce Hampton (Ret.)... here's another clue for you... the Allmans' offspring is on one of the songs on one of the last albums I did.
What is vicarious about prevarication? Not that I am lying, but what makes that vicarious?
Yes, this SlashID is a facade. You think I would tell you who I really am? Then I'd have to kill you. The truth is in here. It is you who are out there.
I most surely have links.
Who said anything about an unarmed fight? I'd blow your ass away on sight.
I'm not the one who won't even post using a SlashID
Thank you for admitting that the link references you. Isn't that what self-referential means?
No, the more you speak, the more ridiculous you look.
Certainly I have credits out there for both studio work and live shows. Some of it downloadable (but not on MP3.com). Both my own playing and my production work can be reviewed -- if you know who I am. But seeing how rabidly you accost my anonymous facade here on/., I am not nearly stupid enough to refer you to a single link. You think I want to bother with the kind of red tape it would take to get you out of my real life? And my collaboators would never forgive me. Honestly, is anyone that dim? Since I would go to jail for giving you the ass-whipping you deserve and I don't have that kind of time, I guess I can never reveal my true identity here on/. -- but I can reveal yours -- I found some news about you today.
Again, you just don't know when to shut up. You'd do alot better challenging my knowledge of BSD or something. I've run much of the major editing S/W for PCs for years, I've set up an interface between an AMEK Einstein with SuperTrue automation pack and regular PCs, ProTools rigs, networked studios, set up their disk systems, etc., etc. I also have produced my own tunes, played on other musicians projects and albums, toured, even supported myself entirely doing these things for years at a time when I didn't feel like doing anything else. Of course, there's not alot of material I can point you to for verification, but that's what makes it fun. I don't at all claim to have used the finest that either analog or digital has to offer, but I've seen my share of nice gear. I know enough to get by, lets just leave it at that. But yes, these days, I use very commodity-grade gear and don't get around like I used to. Having a family calms ya down. You may never know if that is true or not if you don't lay off the goatse.
Yeah, the big problem with the SBL is the lower samples -- haven't checked out Audigy as I can only afford upgrades about every 2 major revs. As for supporting something like the Yamaha, I don't know how all that works, but I do know that back in '98 it was supported by SoundForge, Cakewalk, most anything else doing ASIO.
What about the Yamaha SW1000XG and DSP Factory system?
(from the link)
24 Bit Resolution Effect Processors
Up to 7 independent effects blocks, each with many effect programs and tons of program-dependent parameters. 12 types of Reverb, 14 Chorus, 70 Variation, 43 Insertion 1, 43 Insertion 2 effects, 5-Band Total EQ and 4 types of vocal harmony effect (when upgraded with PLG100-VH) can be used simultaneously for the wavetable synthesizer and the digiital audio.
These have been around for half a decade and are quite good at taking DSP effects load off the CPU. Who says the DSP hardware has to be proprietary?
Slashdot Mirror
I agree that there are many unwashed out there, but you missed the important part of what he said...
He needs to either step up to that responsibility or else relinquish it to someone who will. I was simply trying to make that clearer for him. That's what I meant when I said "by choice or by force".
The article he cites would be an interesting read. He should link it instead of being vague.
The company that got hit is going to have a hard time blaming anyone beyond their own admins. MS did the same thing they do to mitigate any other risk plus did some extra public-awareness work. Anybody who didn't see this coming and at least follow the advisory's recommendations to firewall the appropriate ports... well, they weren't too concerned about their systems. I mean, c'mon, NetBIOS ports open to untrusted networks? What system that critical should be allowing that? I don't allow NetBIOS to my son's gaming machine!
First, the worms shouldn't be making you find and patch the holes... you should've already known. Second, you better not just be defending against these lame automated attacks. They are the least of your worries. The dedicated, thinking intruder is much more skillful, and C|Net won't be warning you about his modus operandi in the same kind of detail. And there's no patch system for him. You're gonna get schooled one way or another... either by choice or by force.
Your carefree attitude about who patches the systems implies YANASA, either.
Actually, the lazy admins are the $HIT. If the Critical Update plus a high-profile warning from no less than the US Govt (reprinted in media everywhere) isn't enough to make you consider reading the advisory, testing the patch and deploying, maybe you were an ostrich in a previous life. I get really amused when MS gets blasted for this but the GNU FTP server exploit which possibly tainted months worth of code updates only has the crowd screaming for the perpetrator's head. Truth is, in both scenarios, the admins are at fault.
Well, considering that you can have no confidence in a system that is known to have had unauthorised remote commands executed on it, I'd have to say that might not be a bad idea.
Security hole discloses you!
Right, and it has been made clear previously that NUMA, RCU were designed outside of UNIX and then implemented there, just like they were other places. So SCO has rights to those features on SCO UNIX, but that is the extent of it. Sequent (and hence IBM) retains the right to implement same wherever they see fit. If the implementation is similar, well, duhhh, LINUX is supposed to support a lot of UNIX-like stuff.
BTW -- at some Teradata training this week, I laughed my ass off to hear the instructor talk about some older versions of their software running on AT&T SVR4 that had an implementation of a JFS type file system supplied by Veritas! The dates he gave pretty much give SCO a run for their money on originating (much less owning) a JFS on UNIX, especially considering they still distribute that file system royalty free and with no agreement with anyone to do so and have for years.
Damn, my bad. It's so thick with zeal and ignorance in here, it's getting hard to tell the trolls from the folks who don't know any better. I was confused, to be sure; I was sure I had seen you post cogently before about OSS in general and Linux in particular. I'm so used to the repugnant anonymous trolls, it never crossed my mind that someone might do it with identity. I guess I'll cross reference earlier posts the next time I wonder if it's a troll or memorex.
I imagine it is Windows 2000 that uses you.
...and not just because it points out the disparity in tolerance for MS holes vs. others, but because it points out the emotional difference. Either way, the LINUX zealot is grabbing his torch. But in the MS case it's their fault. In this case, it's for the perp.
I think only the BSD proponents have it right and so what... it's not snobbery if you're right.
Off that topic tho... the problem is... what about all the GNU software installs that have gone down since March? If you buy the GNU line here, it's all suspect. And let's be clear here that this includes GNU software for any platform, including Win32! Imagine if a library used in a cross platforn GNU-distributed product has "malcode" inserted! If I stretch my imagination, I can believe that a sizeable percentage of the *X/BSD crowd will know to get fresh everything that might be suspect... but Joe Windows who wanted to try GIMP, oOo or something to avaoid paying for the commercial offerings?* Forget it, he'll never know the diff... and besides, he's r00+3d six ways from sunday anyway already. But now if someone in the know ever hips him to the fact, he'll probably blame the GNU installs.
I'm a Windows user a lot of the time, but there's no denying that the mean value of intelligence of users on the platform is far below that of most others.
*(note -- I'm leaving out the other great GNU software that runs on Windows like Apache, MySQL, just to name a few because the caliber of moron we're talking about here has no need for a web server or DB engine, etc. then again, MS would install it by default until recently...)
That's just it... it's not technically true. Even if firewalled, the machines are still vulnerable to the right vector if they are not patched or improperly patched and they continue to broadcast the crap and screw up the network for those of us with a clean bill of health.
AMEN to this. I had a remote user get slammer. My T-1 provider phoned at 2:00 AM to inform me that my network was broadcasting the nasty. I assured him I was not, but a quick packet capture at the gateway hinted I was wrong. When I revoked his dialin privileges, he was on the phone at 2:30 AM asking why he couldn't get in. I told him I was sleeping and he was infected to call me back when he had reformatted, reinstalled, patched and scanned. When he called back again, I told him I wasn't done sleeping I'd call him back later.
This was the incident that finally got me to deploy SNORT at a few choice spots on my network.
OCG:
Incorrect. Windows Update and Auto Update are shoddy excuses for patch management, especially taken alone. Ordering and chaining of patches is horrendous, and the mechanism that "validates" patch installation is worse. HFNetChkPro is a far superior product, especially when combined with Software Update Services and the aforementioned practice of testing on non-critical servers (or, optionally, reasonable replicas of your operating environment). Any admin on any platform that doesn't rigorously regression-test a patch before deploying, while still not as villainous as the lazy slob who doesn't patch until the worm is spotted, still needs to be ousted from duty and have his home DSL line snipped permanently as well. That goes for Windows, LINUX, BSD, C-64 or whatever else. If it (your platform of choice/force) has the capacity to pollute the environment and there is a fix available but you turn out to be the ultra inertially-challenged and you turn a blind eye until the inevitable happens, you need to either commit suicide for the sake of us all, or, ignoring that, run for President. Hell, you can say you invented patches.
I don't run auto update anywhere on my network, but all my servers and workstations are patched. Snort is detecting the bugger outside the walls, and the din is getting higher. Anyone going to wager if it gets farther than Nimda?
Doesn't GroupWise predate most others?
You're the wulf-kind for certain. Weren't you the one who told us two comments ago how long you'd been "out of the gate"... you can deny your true self only so long before your own language will give you away.
It is so entertaining how you can flip from asinine vulgarity to holier-than-thou in an instant. I guess you have to be inventive if you are the only one who will listen. Are you sure you're not also a latent appliance fetishist? That would limit you to underage robot dogs...
I don't know about you, but when I call to a pet, I do it with a very clear and authoritative voice, not unlike the one I use with other lower life forms like you. If you use guttural or distorted voices when speaking to the animals, it probably says something about you. It also probably scares the hell out of the animals. All the better. If they knew what's good for them, they started running as soon as they saw you.
You do owe the dog-kind apologies, but you know the real reason why. You are not only fixated on the pre-pubescent, you are an animal fetishist as well. You have combined the two and will only mate with underage dogs. Ah well, your mum's been of age for almost two years and she's fair game since your dad, I mean older brother moved out, but she's a special case.
BTW my recording card is a Delta 44, my gaming card is a SBL Platinum 5.1. Not the latest, but does what I need. Would probably do well for those pre-pubescent gay .RMs you like to "stream" to as well.
No, fuckwad, I have a family to support and alot of expenses your live-at-home-with-mama ass will never know.
Piece by piece:
The more you speak, the worse you smell
Alphasys has no credited works. But the guy who posts using that moniker surely does. I have recounted before that I have shared the stage with Col. Bruce Hampton (Ret.)... here's another clue for you... the Allmans' offspring is on one of the songs on one of the last albums I did.
What is vicarious about prevarication? Not that I am lying, but what makes that vicarious?
Yes, this SlashID is a facade. You think I would tell you who I really am? Then I'd have to kill you. The truth is in here. It is you who are out there.
I most surely have links.
Who said anything about an unarmed fight? I'd blow your ass away on sight.
I'm not the one who won't even post using a SlashID
Thank you for admitting that the link references you. Isn't that what self-referential means?
No, the more you speak, the more ridiculous you look.
/., I am not nearly stupid enough to refer you to a single link. You think I want to bother with the kind of red tape it would take to get you out of my real life? And my collaboators would never forgive me. Honestly, is anyone that dim? Since I would go to jail for giving you the ass-whipping you deserve and I don't have that kind of time, I guess I can never reveal my true identity here on /. -- but I can reveal yours -- I found some news about you today.
Certainly I have credits out there for both studio work and live shows. Some of it downloadable (but not on MP3.com). Both my own playing and my production work can be reviewed -- if you know who I am. But seeing how rabidly you accost my anonymous facade here on
Again, you just don't know when to shut up. You'd do alot better challenging my knowledge of BSD or something. I've run much of the major editing S/W for PCs for years, I've set up an interface between an AMEK Einstein with SuperTrue automation pack and regular PCs, ProTools rigs, networked studios, set up their disk systems, etc., etc. I also have produced my own tunes, played on other musicians projects and albums, toured, even supported myself entirely doing these things for years at a time when I didn't feel like doing anything else. Of course, there's not alot of material I can point you to for verification, but that's what makes it fun. I don't at all claim to have used the finest that either analog or digital has to offer, but I've seen my share of nice gear. I know enough to get by, lets just leave it at that. But yes, these days, I use very commodity-grade gear and don't get around like I used to. Having a family calms ya down. You may never know if that is true or not if you don't lay off the goatse.
Yeah, the big problem with the SBL is the lower samples -- haven't checked out Audigy as I can only afford upgrades about every 2 major revs. As for supporting something like the Yamaha, I don't know how all that works, but I do know that back in '98 it was supported by SoundForge, Cakewalk, most anything else doing ASIO.
(from the link)
These have been around for half a decade and are quite good at taking DSP effects load off the CPU. Who says the DSP hardware has to be proprietary?