Of course you are right. I think it would be ideal for Apple to do something like use the Crusoe processor core [128 bit VLIW? need to double check] or work on a new unique CPU with AMD or Transmeta or something. Perhaps IBM would want to get in bed too.
If anything is known about new CPU details Apple is keeping the information in an air-tight container.
1) Apple needs to sell the total package to make money doing what they do. They do a really good job of it right now IMHO. If I could buy a PC clone and load OS X on it Apple only gets a *very* small portion of that total package. For Apple to make money doing this the cost of OS X would have to be more that even Microsoft Office!
2) Do you think Microsoft would sell Office for a new "competing" OS? I think they would drop support for OS X in a heartbeat if they did this.
I don't like to spread rumors of any kind about Apple but I think if they do choose a new CPU it *should* be derived from perhaps the IBM Power series. It has PPC compatibility and is 64bit. Existing software *should* be able to work on it and Apple users would have a lot to look forward to in next generation software.
The big issue is how much are those mothers gonna cost? In reality I know I don't *need* 64bits to get my work done and that CPU makers are really just cramming it down my throat because they feel the need to sell me something.
I bought a dual AMD MP 1600 system in the last 6 months and I tend to use my powerbook more often than that [which is only 667 Mhz G4]. I think that says a lot about what I need and what the industry wants me to want.
I can wait and so can 90% of the public wait for either faster G4's or 64bit Apples.
This seemed horrible at first... till I actually read the link. Seems like a decent service for 100 bucks a year. Especially if the support is any good.
100MB of iDisk space, more email space, 15MB email space, backup and antivirus software [probably worth the 100 bucks right there if they are any good], and hopefully good customer support [my ISP sometimes sucks a lot when it comes to storage space and email].
I will have to think it over for the 60 grace period before I make the jump.
My bad then... I should have been more explicit/specific about what the situation was... as you can see the entry was already long though.... I over edited myself.
It didn't work that way in 1.4... Go try it then come back and tell me how fucking easy it is... Seriously do it. There was no properties option. I walked through this step-by-step with a friend who also didn't believe me when I made this claim... He said "Oh... THAT!".
Maybe I was unclear what I was trying to do. That's not the sole reason I gave up on GNOME... there was like at least 2 different ways to do desktop switching
by the window manager and by whatever the hell service GNOME was providing to do it. Nautilis was awfully pretty but slow and resource intensive.... The other reason I gave up on GNOME was I was only trying to use it for a month at the request of my friends to see whether I could use it day-to-day at work.
The answer is "yes of course" but being a huge C++ fan and diving into KDE internals in my spare time didn't imply that GNOME would be the desktop of choice for me.
Maybe it was personal limitations of seeing how the pieces of GNOME worked together... [it seemed quite disjoint at the time]... KDE had a more universal feel to it across *most* apps... I won't say it was perfect but it "felt" better.
GNOME-1.4: Still hard to figure out when you first sit down on it.... I personally had trouble changing an Emacs icon to use Xemacs and ran around looking for a "property list" for it... I think you have to manually edit some text file is what someone said... I stopped using GNOME immediately.... That's no way to do a GUI IMO.
KDE3.x: Slow... very slow. Too many virtual functions need to have code relocated at runtime. Luckilly This site is addressing some fundamental linking issues with C++ [among other things] on GNU tools. In fact the GNU tools are starting to be built with some of these optimizations now as was evident on my RedHat box at work. FreeBSD needs to try to do the same since its my main development platform [luckilly its a dual Athlon MP 1600 so *nothing* seems slow there:)]. There are also a few UI issues like the Author of this article suggested but I must say that people want a snappier [speedwise] desktop and don't want the power of an industrial strength server just to run their desktop. [note: I love KDE... I have committed code to KDE... this is as objective as I get:)]
I spend most of my time on Mac OS X. The concept of being able to run the Microsoft Office Suite [which I actually don't yet on my Mac] on a Unix environment with 75% or more of my favorite tools either in place or on their way is very attractive. Let's face it nothing does DOC like Word [thank god!] and for compatibility purposes with all of my coworkers there just isn't a real substitute for everything it does. We use the revision control built into Word and other things so please don't offer Abiword, StarOffice, OpenOffice or KWord as alternatives. You can suggest till your blue in the face but you can't make my company change its stance on what tools must be used.... Its a fight not worth fighting based on my experiences with the alternatives out there. [I write a lot of stuff in LaTeX now... then I cut n' paste to Word when I have to... Time consuming and stupid yes but I don't have Word for OS X yet...:)].
I never got around to experiencing BeOS first hand but I heard it was a thing of beauty... There has been a fair amount of talk about adding the BeOS file system to OpenDarwin's CVS but I don't think anyone has committed the time to it yet.
Advice to KDE: Please please please don't get too bloaty... [application duplication seems to be a bit of a problem there... Why does the standard source distribution have to include these things anyway?] I love IOSlaves and KParts and think they are uber-cool but the end user doesn't give a shit about any of that because it doesn't directly enhance their experience... just gives the developer a woody.
Advice to GNOME: As a developer I do not agree with C as the tool for doing Object Oriented Code... especially when the manner in which things are being wrapped up is very C++ like. GTKmm has a long way to go before it can do what Qt can last I checked so I think that if you code for GNOME and want full access you must use C [correct me if I am wrong please... its been a while and I want to be as fair as possible]. I have to agree with some of the Author's UI comments if his experience was authentic and correctly reflects the actual situation. I still think GNOME is prettier than the KDE defaults but there are very good things coming in that respect it seems from what I have been able to follow on the mailing lists. [again I am unfortunately biased due to my KDE involvement].
Advice for OS X... yes.. sometimes you just have to realize that indeed your shit can also stink. The only major boo-boo I remember was the iTunes installer clobbering some linux partitions... That was naughty but obviously not a test case for Apple 'in-house' or it would have been caught. Live and learn! I understand some people have trouble with the lookupd for OS X dropping out on them from time to time [though I haven't seen this myself yet.] but that's not really a UI comment is it? Hmm, I guess keep doing what you're doing and maybe think about allowing users to pick schemes other than Aqua or Graphite in the appearances menu. Don't rush it though... I love the quality thus far and can deal with a minimal set of choices when it keeps the UI simple and straighforward [yes I still use the single button mouse on OS X because its actually possible to do so due to a good UI design around simplicity.]
I'd invite comments and criticism if I didn't know already that I was in for it.... so go ahead and get your shot in... I don't care - its only slashdot:)
Yes the G4 PPC technology is kinda old but so is Dvorak:). Shouldn't he also be replaced. I am tired of hearing the same old shit.
Sadly enough he makes a decent point... what next? Of course he has turned a blind eye to the XServe and the potential for the G5 and G6. Not to mention all the really good software technology present in OS X.
What the hell more could he want? The all-digital flat panel monitors are second to none IMO for the price. [I was skeptical of the price/value of them until I bought one... holy cow is it cool].
I have to disagree with this... Perhaps he hasn't noticed that Apple has been doing new things because they are doing new things in software and not hardware so much [except the XServe of course].
Oh... and it wasn't the Xerox "star" it was the Alto. Oh yeah... and Xerox was notorious for developing stuff they didn't market and basically invited Apple to come look at all of it. That story has been told so many times no one knows what the hell happened anymore. *sigh*.
I think this article was written from a completely different perspective than the one I see. I generally like Dvorak but this article just makes me think he is blind.
Well UFS with softupdates would be your friend then wouldn't it.:) I am in the midst of doing some of the research necessary to bring this to UFS on OS X. I have McKusick's USENIX paper in hand... an assload of source to look through and a good dose of coffee/tea [mood depending].
So far one other OpenDarwinite and myself seem to be interested in making this happen + Jordan Hubbard [who probably just doesn't have the time to help much.]
might be used in sherlock or maybe even in Sherlock. "Hey why not use this in, oh... I don't know..... SHERLOCK!"
I am very happy this occurred. If KDE is going to have a commercial partner working on/with its source base I am glad it is Apple. Apple has said that they will commit changes back to KDE. At least that's what the opendarwin.org email said when we got this announcement 3 or 4 days ago.:)
Ok... i am just stating the fact that *after* the announcement I have in/usr/src/UPDATING the fact that it was 4.6. not before. I also got some additional code updated but it was for some part of the kernel I wasn't concerned with [PCCARD or something]. It may have been *very close* to RELEASE but I still have doubts that its exactly the same:).
time machine then?... Like i said... I got stable yesterday from CVSup and it wasn't 4.6 RELEASE... it still said RC #0. Unless you know some source tree I don't and did things in a non-standard way then you didn't have 4.6 RELEASE.
Slashdot Mirror
I saw an ad in DDJ claiming that qt can be used for multiple databases.. It also works on multiple platforms.
Hi Alton,
Saw your "cast away" episode. I thought the part where you described 'chemically cooking' food with acid's was particularly interesting.
Is this generally as safe as cooking with heat? Where can I learn more?
Dave Leimbach
Of course you are right. I think it would be ideal for Apple to do something like use the Crusoe processor core [128 bit VLIW? need to double check] or work on a new unique CPU with AMD or Transmeta or something. Perhaps IBM would want to get in bed too.
If anything is known about new CPU details Apple is keeping the information in an air-tight container.
You should really learn how to use find if you don't know what {} does. Silly xargs user!
1) Apple needs to sell the total package to make money doing what they do. They do a really good job of it right now IMHO. If I could buy a PC clone and load OS X on it Apple only gets a *very* small portion of that total package. For Apple to make money doing this the cost of OS X would have to be more that even Microsoft Office!
2) Do you think Microsoft would sell Office for a new "competing" OS? I think they would drop support for OS X in a heartbeat if they did this.
I don't like to spread rumors of any kind about Apple but I think if they do choose a new CPU it *should* be derived from perhaps the IBM Power series. It has PPC compatibility and is 64bit. Existing software *should* be able to work on it and Apple users would have a lot to look forward to in next generation software.
The big issue is how much are those mothers gonna cost? In reality I know I don't *need* 64bits to get my work done and that CPU makers are really just cramming it down my throat because they feel the need to sell me something.
I bought a dual AMD MP 1600 system in the last 6 months and I tend to use my powerbook more often than that [which is only 667 Mhz G4]. I think that says a lot about what I need and what the industry wants me to want.
I can wait and so can 90% of the public wait for either faster G4's or 64bit Apples.
Throwing a fit about a 20 dollar OS upgrade? Were they insane? It sure beats a 199 dollar upgrade to windows XP Pro :).
Dave
This seemed horrible at first... till I actually read the link. Seems like a decent service for 100 bucks a year. Especially if the support is any good.
100MB of iDisk space, more email space, 15MB email space, backup and antivirus software [probably worth the 100 bucks right there if they are any good], and hopefully good customer support [my ISP sometimes sucks a lot when it comes to storage space and email].
I will have to think it over for the 60 grace period before I make the jump.
Dave
Wow guys look!... A new troll! GNOME is as American [United States] as Tequilla :).
:)
Discuss
My bad then... I should have been more explicit/specific about what the situation was... as you can see the entry was already long though.... I over edited myself.
Nautilis icon... right click... properties
3 tabs Basic, Emblems, Permissions.
Which one chances the program being executed? I just looked less than 5 minutes ago and still couldn't find it.
I just tried again... Right click on the Nautilus icon gives me properties...
Properties has 3 tabs "Basic, Emblem, and Permissions"
None of the 3 tabs has a way to change the executed program... real intuitive.
Well two of us couldn't then... I will try it right now again in fact... I still have GNOME installed.
It didn't work that way in 1.4... Go try it then come back and tell me how fucking easy it is... Seriously do it. There was no properties option. I walked through this step-by-step with a friend who also didn't believe me when I made this claim... He said "Oh... THAT!".
Maybe I was unclear what I was trying to do. That's not the sole reason I gave up on GNOME... there was like at least 2 different ways to do desktop switching by the window manager and by whatever the hell service GNOME was providing to do it. Nautilis was awfully pretty but slow and resource intensive.... The other reason I gave up on GNOME was I was only trying to use it for a month at the request of my friends to see whether I could use it day-to-day at work.
The answer is "yes of course" but being a huge C++ fan and diving into KDE internals in my spare time didn't imply that GNOME would be the desktop of choice for me.
Maybe it was personal limitations of seeing how the pieces of GNOME worked together... [it seemed quite disjoint at the time]... KDE had a more universal feel to it across *most* apps... I won't say it was perfect but it "felt" better.
as a KDE supporter and very-very-very part time developer I am pleased to hear this experience was positive for you.
GNOME-1.4: Still hard to figure out when you first sit down on it.... I personally had trouble changing an Emacs icon to use Xemacs and ran around looking for a "property list" for it... I think you have to manually edit some text file is what someone said... I stopped using GNOME immediately.... That's no way to do a GUI IMO.
:)]. There are also a few UI issues like the Author of this article suggested but I must say that people want a snappier [speedwise] desktop and don't want the power of an industrial strength server just to run their desktop. [note: I love KDE... I have committed code to KDE... this is as objective as I get :)]
:)].
:)
KDE3.x: Slow... very slow. Too many virtual functions need to have code relocated at runtime. Luckilly This site is addressing some fundamental linking issues with C++ [among other things] on GNU tools. In fact the GNU tools are starting to be built with some of these optimizations now as was evident on my RedHat box at work. FreeBSD needs to try to do the same since its my main development platform [luckilly its a dual Athlon MP 1600 so *nothing* seems slow there
I spend most of my time on Mac OS X. The concept of being able to run the Microsoft Office Suite [which I actually don't yet on my Mac] on a Unix environment with 75% or more of my favorite tools either in place or on their way is very attractive. Let's face it nothing does DOC like Word [thank god!] and for compatibility purposes with all of my coworkers there just isn't a real substitute for everything it does. We use the revision control built into Word and other things so please don't offer Abiword, StarOffice, OpenOffice or KWord as alternatives. You can suggest till your blue in the face but you can't make my company change its stance on what tools must be used.... Its a fight not worth fighting based on my experiences with the alternatives out there. [I write a lot of stuff in LaTeX now... then I cut n' paste to Word when I have to... Time consuming and stupid yes but I don't have Word for OS X yet...
I never got around to experiencing BeOS first hand but I heard it was a thing of beauty... There has been a fair amount of talk about adding the BeOS file system to OpenDarwin's CVS but I don't think anyone has committed the time to it yet.
Advice to KDE: Please please please don't get too bloaty... [application duplication seems to be a bit of a problem there... Why does the standard source distribution have to include these things anyway?] I love IOSlaves and KParts and think they are uber-cool but the end user doesn't give a shit about any of that because it doesn't directly enhance their experience... just gives the developer a woody.
Advice to GNOME: As a developer I do not agree with C as the tool for doing Object Oriented Code... especially when the manner in which things are being wrapped up is very C++ like. GTKmm has a long way to go before it can do what Qt can last I checked so I think that if you code for GNOME and want full access you must use C [correct me if I am wrong please... its been a while and I want to be as fair as possible]. I have to agree with some of the Author's UI comments if his experience was authentic and correctly reflects the actual situation. I still think GNOME is prettier than the KDE defaults but there are very good things coming in that respect it seems from what I have been able to follow on the mailing lists. [again I am unfortunately biased due to my KDE involvement].
Advice for OS X... yes.. sometimes you just have to realize that indeed your shit can also stink. The only major boo-boo I remember was the iTunes installer clobbering some linux partitions... That was naughty but obviously not a test case for Apple 'in-house' or it would have been caught. Live and learn! I understand some people have trouble with the lookupd for OS X dropping out on them from time to time [though I haven't seen this myself yet.] but that's not really a UI comment is it? Hmm, I guess keep doing what you're doing and maybe think about allowing users to pick schemes other than Aqua or Graphite in the appearances menu. Don't rush it though... I love the quality thus far and can deal with a minimal set of choices when it keeps the UI simple and straighforward [yes I still use the single button mouse on OS X because its actually possible to do so due to a good UI design around simplicity.]
I'd invite comments and criticism if I didn't know already that I was in for it.... so go ahead and get your shot in... I don't care - its only slashdot
Dave
and neither should you!!!
ah... who cares
Yes the G4 PPC technology is kinda old but so is Dvorak :). Shouldn't he also be replaced. I am tired of hearing the same old shit.
Sadly enough he makes a decent point... what next? Of course he has turned a blind eye to the XServe and the potential for the G5 and G6. Not to mention all the really good software technology present in OS X.
What the hell more could he want? The all-digital flat panel monitors are second to none IMO for the price. [I was skeptical of the price/value of them until I bought one... holy cow is it cool].
I have to disagree with this... Perhaps he hasn't noticed that Apple has been doing new things because they are doing new things in software and not hardware so much [except the XServe of course].
Oh... and it wasn't the Xerox "star" it was the Alto. Oh yeah... and Xerox was notorious for developing stuff they didn't market and basically invited Apple to come look at all of it. That story has been told so many times no one knows what the hell happened anymore. *sigh*.
I think this article was written from a completely different perspective than the one I see. I generally like Dvorak but this article just makes me think he is blind.
Well UFS with softupdates would be your friend then wouldn't it. :) I am in the midst of doing some of the research necessary to bring this to UFS on OS X. I have McKusick's USENIX paper in hand... an assload of source to look through and a good dose of coffee/tea [mood depending].
So far one other OpenDarwinite and myself seem to be interested in making this happen + Jordan Hubbard [who probably just doesn't have the time to help much.]
Dave
Repetitive even... redundant... dejavuish
might be used in sherlock or maybe even in Sherlock. "Hey why not use this in, oh... I don't know..... SHERLOCK!"
:)
I am very happy this occurred. If KDE is going to have a commercial partner working on/with its source base I am glad it is Apple. Apple has said that they will commit changes back to KDE. At least that's what the opendarwin.org email said when we got this announcement 3 or 4 days ago.
Dave
Ok... i am just stating the fact that *after* the announcement I have in /usr/src/UPDATING the fact that it was 4.6. not before. I also got some additional code updated but it was for some part of the kernel I wasn't concerned with [PCCARD or something]. It may have been *very close* to RELEASE but I still have doubts that its exactly the same :).
:).
At least we aren't fighting over BSD dying
time machine then?... Like i said... I got stable yesterday from CVSup and it wasn't 4.6 RELEASE... it still said RC #0. Unless you know some source tree I don't and did things in a non-standard way then you didn't have 4.6 RELEASE.
So why did you read the article... why did you bother to comment? Everything you wrote smells of asshole.
November 25th.
not possible.. I updated last night and built it. This morning I updated it again. Now it actually says FreeBSD 4.6 RELEASE not RC #0.