Just as an MSCE is proof you're an effective system administrator? The degree is proof you got a degree, nothing more. Ever met anyone with a CS degree who can't code? Ever met a teacher who can't teacher? Education can be gotten through many sources. The ability to perform is what most people people value I think.
What google can do, is encourage other businesses to stop refusing to support Linux. This is a BIG deal- picture Mr. and Ms Walmart who bring home a new Linux based PC to their kids for Christmas. They hook it up to the cable modem, something doesn't quite work out and they call the Cable company, "umm, I'm sorry we can't help you as you are not using Microsoft Windows". That's a bummer and it happens with cable companies, DSL, hardware, etc. We as consumers are usually in an untenable position as the company is usually a monopoly so they really don't care about our opinion. Only another big business can exert the pressure needed to resolve this on a large scale.
It's not a world of unlimited land and natural resources anymore. No country is unaffected by the actions or policies of every other country. We should not all be striving to seek the lowest common denominator. As has been pointed out, if the top 1% of a large population emigrate they can overwhelm an industry or country with a smaller population.
More to the point, those who leave their country to go where the skilled jobs are better paying tend to be those who already have connections there, are extremely bright or wealthy by the standards of their home country; quite the opposite of the stereotypical immigrant. Their home country looses a valuable resource with the capital and education to raise the country's standard of living. Like their less skilled counterparts though, it's unlikely these immigrants will return home country unless their corporate sponsor casts them off.
Unskilled workers fill a niche doing low paying service jobs. They were likely oppressed, unemployed or worse at home. Maybe they would have had to resort or crime or violence to make a living. If the host country offers to legalize their employment and can prevent the dollars they earn from leaving their adopted country that country can increase the immigrants commitment to the adopted country. The immigrants can save and learn and hopefully do well there. The original country, the host country and the person are likely to end up better off.
So who really benefits by wages being steadily depressed? The average person in the US, Europe or industrialized Asia? Do Chinese citizens really benefit when they are seen as an infinite and exploitable resource and their resources are polluted and exploited?
When money is saved by corporations it's not often returned to its workers nor to the shareholders who own the stock through dividends. More often it's paid off to management or "returned" to those to buy, then quickly sell the stocks. Is this the short term behaviour we want to encourage?
I'm not against outsourcing IT or other industries if that outsources builds demand and the economy of another country. I'm not xenophobic. I do think we all need to demand that each government look out for it's citizens best interests first, the citizens of other countries second and corporations only when other governments violate one of the first two rules (dumping, not complying with global standards of behavior towards its citizens or wanton destruction of the environment for instance). Is it time we reverse the notion that low-skilled immigrants are a menace and high-skilled ones should be given special consideration?
So- when the Enclopedia you purchased becomes out of date the publisher drops a new edition on your doorstep? No- I think not. You go out and buy a new copy. You don't know if it's anymore accurate or reliable than the old copy until YOU fact check.
Ever read an article in the popular press or an encylopedia on a topic you know a lot about? Remember feeling that the author really didn't know what they were talking about? I'm not talking here about propaganda generated to incite violence or slander someone. I'm discussing factual inacccuracies caused by ignorance or a developing situation. In these cases, wikipedia, provides broad exposure and it's readers throughout the planet may take the time to make sure it's more reliable, or at least more representative than a traditional encyclopedia probably written in a western democracy by upper middle class white people with a liberal arts education who specialize in selling proprietary information for a profit. Can anyone cite research on wikipedia accuracy vice popular publications, newspapers or trade journals?
Holding someone "responsible" strikes me as a very American trial-lawyer way of thinking. Are you planning to throw them in prison or sue them for libel? Maybe fly them to eastern europe and torture them? Bad information is everywhere. It's each individual's responsible to make sure research they have done has been double checked. This is especially true when you're doing actual reasearch which you plan to publish or submit.
If you're a resident of MA- please take the time to write your Senator and Representative to express your support for Mr. Quinn and the ODF. You can look up your representatives here: http://www.mass.gov/legis/citytown.htm
Here's what I've sent to my Senator. The letter to my Rep added that as one of the few Republicans in the House he might want to take this opportunity to distinquish himself....
Hon Steven Panagiotakos Room 218 Boston, MA 02133
Dear Senator,
I am writing to express my support for the recent efforts of the Massachusetts CIO, Peter Quinn in his drive to ensure accessibility for the citizens of Massachusetts. I'm very disappointed the Senate would consider ignoring or altering the recommendations of Mr. Quinn and his staff. The citizens of Massachusetts deserve to have unfettered access to the electronic records of the state. Our state has an opportunity to step out and obtain widespread recognition for leadership; we should not succumb to backroom deals or crooked politics- it is vital we follow the recommendations of Mr. Quinn and adopt the Open Document Format for all documents and publications. I value our freedom to choose and do not wish to be subject to the whims of a monopoly. The adoption of the Open Document Format is an important step in taking back the information paid for by our tax dollars. What is paid for by all should be accessible to all and no alternative is acceptable.
It's not so much earlier software not running with later (although I could cite examples of internally developed software) as new software not running with the old and having no recourse other than shelling out $100 or so on an otherwise useless (to me) update. As an example, specific to gaming, the new expansion pack to BF2 is cited as only running under Microsoft Windows XP. Now it does run fine under W2K but the downloadable installer specifically checks and stops the installation so you have to work around it. There are many other examples I could cite. Games are the only reason I can imagine to keep Microsoft Windows on a home PC- they are also what most males under the of 30 actually use the computer in their home for. For teenagers, the critical applications seems to be MP3 player downloads, AIM (or varients) and, of course, games.
Please- you must work for a RBOC. Rogers is uquitous in Canada- they seem to be the sponsor for every other ad on TV, every sports stadium, every billboard, every cell phone, everything. The notion they need to cancel USENET to save money just doesn't stand up. More likely they recognized they don't make money off USENET the way they most likely do though cooperative deals with commercial websites, blogs and so on and decided to kill off that relic of the good old days on the internet. I for one, still use USENET largely because it's obscure enough most of the users in my regular haunts actually know what they are talking about and aren't being paid to promote one particular view or another.
Ummm... I guess. It's not a dialect in the grand scheme of things.
The easiest way to look at it is something like this: When you were a kid you were taught to be respectful of your elders. You said, "Sir" and "Ma'am", used proper grammar and avoided profanity when talking to your parents, your parents' friends, clergy, etc. It was totally different when speaking to your friends, buddies, brothers, sisters, and others around the same age (in effect, your peers). You used improper grammar, called each other names, and used profanity whenever you thought no adults were near.
The English language is less regimented in the sense that we don't actually teach the difference but everyone uses it and knows there is a difference. The Koreans not only make this distinction when they speak, but they teach it formally. The Korean word for the everyday language one uses within their peer group is "ban mal". Literally translated it means: half language.
A child capable of entering University should have no problem understanding the basics of his native language. If it's really necessary to use an adult to "interpret", that's indicative of some disfunction more serious than the child's ability to speak the "dialect".
If only I hadn't just used all my moderation points; I'd mod this up six ways to Sunday. Who knew (not I! and maybe not some of you reading this) one could find researchers in MS employ who are substantive to the point of being fascinating. Leslie Lamport's site, for instance, is well worth a scan. I find it amazing MS is willing to invest in people of this quality.
1) A bigger knowledgeable user base means bugs get spotted more quickly- otherwise you get hundreds of similiarly worded reports which may or may not be related to the same problem. It's a lot of work to determine what's unique, what's RTFM, etc.
2) I don't often use the ISV support unless those ISVs contribute their source to the kernel. Why should I tie my OSS kernel to ATI or NVIDIA's proprietary software? That's working in the wrong direction....
3) Manufacturers ignore Linux because they fear reprisal from Microsoft. Why else would they not even advertise support for Linux when it exists!
4) Formats are the function of applications, not the OS. Openoffice is already cross platform. It's the best known solution for Linux but it runs just fine on Microsoft Windows- the problem is encouraging large organizations to allow their employees to install and use Openoffice.
I wouldn't assume Third World users are so ignorant as to rely solely on Wikipedia or any other source- but some information is better than none isn't it? It's not as if the Wikipedia is a front for any particular agenda.
Ideally I think the scheme could distribute low-cost or discarded PCs (hosting OSS of course) with the information in areas with adequate power. It's great people will be able to have a low-cost, distributable reference source but the print version tosses out the ability explore using the links to other wikipedia topics. Curiosity usually leads me to explore beyond what I originally looked up. Some might call that exploration a waste of time- I prefer to think of it as recharging my enjoyment of learning.
A little research is in order. Yes- the FEMA website has some javascript which check for the version of the browser. No- it's not "allegedly". Computer code is a matter of fact- it's there or it's not. The people are not victims they are Americans in the way of Nature. No- the code didn't check for the latest version of Microsoft's IE- it checked for 6.0.
Now that we've established you are adverse to specifics and research we return to our regularly scheduled programming...
Wow- I just testing this and the document saved from Openoffice in RTF at 2.1MB went to 87MB when opened and saved (no editing) from Microsoft Word 2003! How is performance that bad even possible? I'm definitely going to fold this little example into my courses as another good reason to avoid "bit-rot" as I refer to it.
You know I'm retired from the military and while there are lots of our comrades deployed and fighting there are lots of them here at home too- supporting the deployed troops and preparing for their next round overseas. Furthering your education is an important part of the military- just as in any job. I think he should be commended for devoting some of this precious time to this topic and helping to further the use of open formats. I don't think the poster suggested this is the overriding concern of his life and I suspect you have limited knowledge of the military and thus are in no position to judge.
Despite being a Massachusetts State funded institution, the University I teach for (UMASS) also has a defacto MS Office only policy. In my courses, and in dealing with them, I've found they do have the flexibility to handle other formats and I've gradually been able to move away from MS Windows only formats. I first suggested.rtf which works fine when sending things to the University and have now implemented a OpenDoc or HTML only policy for work submitted for my classes. As a result, at least several hundred students now have OpenOffice on their desktops and hopefully a few more are using Linux as well. I'd suggest using RTF as an intermediate exchange format and suggesting OpenOffice to your fellow students who would no doubt welcome the opportunity to save a few bucks. Remember- students are the University's customers not the other way round.
I would give your reply more respect if it were grammatically correct or even logically consistent. How can something (science) not be itself (scientific)? That which is not scientific, is by definition not science- but pseudo science (i.e. ID) or simply "belief". I don't think anyone here has said religion is "wrong"- just that it's beliefs should not be passed off as established fact. Your clumsy association of scientists with "the media and the ACLU" falls flatly on it's face. Just as there is no single religion, and no consolidated doctrine, there is no single "Bible" but instead, translations and interpretations of original documents. Christian belief is centered around cultural norms and the interpretation of the Bible adopted by a particular church- simple as that. Even within that framework there has always existed dissent- where it not for that dissent there might not be a Roman Catholic church, the Mormons or the many Protestent denominations.
The lack of popular games for Linux really is the only reason to keep Microsoft Windows on any machine. Let's home EA and a few other publishers begin to release for Linux.
If he then used the knowledge he'd gained to break into cars sure he could and should be arrested. However, my understanding is that he is in trouble for PUBLISHING the information- something completely different. To continue with the comparison, a vulnerability with cryptonite locks for bicycles was recently published on the internet complete with an "instructional" video. Instead of suing, Kryptonite rightly responded with a lock which provided better security. Since it's the job of virus software to provide security I would think that Viguard should be open to suit for failing adding vulnerabilities itself. I'm not a lawyer- what do you think?
Is your comment an attempt at sarcasm or a blatant show of ignorance? I mean, have you ever visited RPM.org where the entire source code and documentation of the RPM system (not to mention the text of Maximum RPM) has been made freely available?
Slashdot Mirror
Just as an MSCE is proof you're an effective system administrator? The degree is proof you got a degree, nothing more. Ever met anyone with a CS degree who can't code? Ever met a teacher who can't teacher? Education can be gotten through many sources. The ability to perform is what most people people value I think.
What google can do, is encourage other businesses to stop refusing to support Linux. This is a BIG deal- picture Mr. and Ms Walmart who bring home a new Linux based PC to their kids for Christmas. They hook it up to the cable modem, something doesn't quite work out and they call the Cable company, "umm, I'm sorry we can't help you as you are not using Microsoft Windows". That's a bummer and it happens with cable companies, DSL, hardware, etc. We as consumers are usually in an untenable position as the company is usually a monopoly so they really don't care about our opinion. Only another big business can exert the pressure needed to resolve this on a large scale.
Education and knowledge seem to have no value- it's only the degree and the name at the top of the certificate which has any currency...
It's not a world of unlimited land and natural resources anymore. No country is unaffected by the actions or policies of every other country. We should not all be striving to seek the lowest common denominator. As has been pointed out, if the top 1% of a large population emigrate they can overwhelm an industry or country with a smaller population.
More to the point, those who leave their country to go where the skilled jobs are better paying tend to be those who already have connections there, are extremely bright or wealthy by the standards of their home country; quite the opposite of the stereotypical immigrant. Their home country looses a valuable resource with the capital and education to raise the country's standard of living. Like their less skilled counterparts though, it's unlikely these immigrants will return home country unless their corporate sponsor casts them off.
Unskilled workers fill a niche doing low paying service jobs. They were likely oppressed, unemployed or worse at home. Maybe they would have had to resort or crime or violence to make a living. If the host country offers to legalize their employment and can prevent the dollars they earn from leaving their adopted country that country can increase the immigrants commitment to the adopted country. The immigrants can save and learn and hopefully do well there. The original country, the host country and the person are likely to end up better off.
So who really benefits by wages being steadily depressed? The average person in the US, Europe or industrialized Asia? Do Chinese citizens really benefit when they are seen as an infinite and exploitable resource and their resources are polluted and exploited?
When money is saved by corporations it's not often returned to its workers nor to the shareholders who own the stock through dividends. More often it's paid off to management or "returned" to those to buy, then quickly sell the stocks. Is this the short term behaviour we want to encourage?
I'm not against outsourcing IT or other industries if that outsources builds demand and the economy of another country. I'm not xenophobic. I do think we all need to demand that each government look out for it's citizens best interests first, the citizens of other countries second and corporations only when other governments violate one of the first two rules (dumping, not complying with global standards of behavior towards its citizens or wanton destruction of the environment for instance). Is it time we reverse the notion that low-skilled immigrants are a menace and high-skilled ones should be given special consideration?
So- when the Enclopedia you purchased becomes out of date the publisher drops a new edition on your doorstep? No- I think not. You go out and buy a new copy. You don't know if it's anymore accurate or reliable than the old copy until YOU fact check.
Ever read an article in the popular press or an encylopedia on a topic you know a lot about? Remember feeling that the author really didn't know what they were talking about? I'm not talking here about propaganda generated to incite violence or slander someone. I'm discussing factual inacccuracies caused by ignorance or a developing situation. In these cases, wikipedia, provides broad exposure and it's readers throughout the planet may take the time to make sure it's more reliable, or at least more representative than a traditional encyclopedia probably written in a western democracy by upper middle class white people with a liberal arts education who specialize in selling proprietary information for a profit. Can anyone cite research on wikipedia accuracy vice popular publications, newspapers or trade journals?
Holding someone "responsible" strikes me as a very American trial-lawyer way of thinking. Are you planning to throw them in prison or sue them for libel? Maybe fly them to eastern europe and torture them? Bad information is everywhere. It's each individual's responsible to make sure research they have done has been double checked. This is especially true when you're doing actual reasearch which you plan to publish or submit.
If you're a resident of MA- please take the time to write your Senator and Representative to express your support for Mr. Quinn and the ODF. You can look up your representatives here: http://www.mass.gov/legis/citytown.htm
Here's what I've sent to my Senator. The letter to my Rep added that as one of the few Republicans in the House he might want to take this opportunity to distinquish himself....
Hon Steven Panagiotakos
Room 218
Boston, MA 02133
Dear Senator,
I am writing to express my support for the recent efforts of the Massachusetts CIO, Peter Quinn in his drive to ensure accessibility for the citizens of Massachusetts. I'm very disappointed the Senate would consider ignoring or altering the recommendations of Mr. Quinn and his staff. The citizens of Massachusetts deserve to have unfettered access to the electronic records of the state. Our state has an opportunity to step out and obtain widespread recognition for leadership; we should not succumb to backroom deals or crooked politics- it is vital we follow the recommendations of Mr. Quinn and adopt the Open Document Format for all documents and publications. I value our freedom to choose and do not wish to be subject to the whims of a monopoly. The adoption of the Open Document Format is an important step in taking back the information paid for by our tax dollars. What is paid for by all should be accessible to all and no alternative is acceptable.
Respectfully,
It's not so much earlier software not running with later (although I could cite examples of internally developed software) as new software not running with the old and having no recourse other than shelling out $100 or so on an otherwise useless (to me) update. As an example, specific to gaming, the new expansion pack to BF2 is cited as only running under Microsoft Windows XP. Now it does run fine under W2K but the downloadable installer specifically checks and stops the installation so you have to work around it. There are many other examples I could cite. Games are the only reason I can imagine to keep Microsoft Windows on a home PC- they are also what most males under the of 30 actually use the computer in their home for. For teenagers, the critical applications seems to be MP3 player downloads, AIM (or varients) and, of course, games.
Please- you must work for a RBOC. Rogers is uquitous in Canada- they seem to be the sponsor for every other ad on TV, every sports stadium, every billboard, every cell phone, everything. The notion they need to cancel USENET to save money just doesn't stand up. More likely they recognized they don't make money off USENET the way they most likely do though cooperative deals with commercial websites, blogs and so on and decided to kill off that relic of the good old days on the internet. I for one, still use USENET largely because it's obscure enough most of the users in my regular haunts actually know what they are talking about and aren't being paid to promote one particular view or another.
Ummm... I guess. It's not a dialect in the grand scheme of things.
The easiest way to look at it is something like this: When you were a kid you were taught to be respectful of your elders. You said, "Sir" and "Ma'am", used proper grammar and avoided profanity when talking to your parents, your parents' friends, clergy, etc. It was totally different when speaking to your friends, buddies, brothers, sisters, and others around the same age (in effect, your peers). You used improper grammar, called each other names, and used profanity whenever you thought no adults were near.
The English language is less regimented in the sense that we don't actually teach the difference but everyone uses it and knows there is a difference. The Koreans not only make this distinction when they speak, but they teach it formally. The Korean word for the everyday language one uses within their peer group is "ban mal". Literally translated it means: half language.
A child capable of entering University should have no problem understanding the basics of his native language. If it's really necessary to use an adult to "interpret", that's indicative of some disfunction more serious than the child's ability to speak the "dialect".
If only I hadn't just used all my moderation points; I'd mod this up six ways to Sunday. Who knew (not I! and maybe not some of you reading this) one could find researchers in MS employ who are substantive to the point of being fascinating. Leslie Lamport's site, for instance, is well worth a scan. I find it amazing MS is willing to invest in people of this quality.
1) A bigger knowledgeable user base means bugs get spotted more quickly- otherwise you get hundreds of similiarly worded reports which may or may not be related to the same problem. It's a lot of work to determine what's unique, what's RTFM, etc.
2) I don't often use the ISV support unless those ISVs contribute their source to the kernel. Why should I tie my OSS kernel to ATI or NVIDIA's proprietary software? That's working in the wrong direction....
3) Manufacturers ignore Linux because they fear reprisal from Microsoft. Why else would they not even advertise support for Linux when it exists!
4) Formats are the function of applications, not the OS. Openoffice is already cross platform. It's the best known solution for Linux but it runs just fine on Microsoft Windows- the problem is encouraging large organizations to allow their employees to install and use Openoffice.
I wouldn't assume Third World users are so ignorant as to rely solely on Wikipedia or any other source- but some information is better than none isn't it? It's not as if the Wikipedia is a front for any particular agenda.
Ideally I think the scheme could distribute low-cost or discarded PCs (hosting OSS of course) with the information in areas with adequate power. It's great people will be able to have a low-cost, distributable reference source but the print version tosses out the ability explore using the links to other wikipedia topics. Curiosity usually leads me to explore beyond what I originally looked up. Some might call that exploration a waste of time- I prefer to think of it as recharging my enjoyment of learning.
Who cares... I'm sure this will be very useful to the gamers, cube weenies and home office crowd.
Dude,
You are a Microsoft whore.
Dude,
A little research is in order. Yes- the FEMA website has some javascript which check for the version of the browser. No- it's not "allegedly". Computer code is a matter of fact- it's there or it's not. The people are not victims they are Americans in the way of Nature. No- the code didn't check for the latest version of Microsoft's IE- it checked for 6.0.
Now that we've established you are adverse to specifics and research we return to our regularly scheduled programming...
Amen.
Wow- I just testing this and the document saved from Openoffice in RTF at 2.1MB went to 87MB when opened and saved (no editing) from Microsoft Word 2003! How is performance that bad even possible? I'm definitely going to fold this little example into my courses as another good reason to avoid "bit-rot" as I refer to it.
You know I'm retired from the military and while there are lots of our comrades deployed and fighting there are lots of them here at home too- supporting the deployed troops and preparing for their next round overseas. Furthering your education is an important part of the military- just as in any job. I think he should be commended for devoting some of this precious time to this topic and helping to further the use of open formats. I don't think the poster suggested this is the overriding concern of his life and I suspect you have limited knowledge of the military and thus are in no position to judge.
Despite being a Massachusetts State funded institution, the University I teach for (UMASS) also has a defacto MS Office only policy. In my courses, and in dealing with them, I've found they do have the flexibility to handle other formats and I've gradually been able to move away from MS Windows only formats. I first suggested .rtf which works fine when sending things to the University and have now implemented a OpenDoc or HTML only policy for work submitted for my classes. As a result, at least several hundred students now have OpenOffice on their desktops and hopefully a few more are using Linux as well. I'd suggest using RTF as an intermediate exchange format and suggesting OpenOffice to your fellow students who would no doubt welcome the opportunity to save a few bucks. Remember- students are the University's customers not the other way round.
I would give your reply more respect if it were grammatically correct or even logically consistent. How can something (science) not be itself (scientific)? That which is not scientific, is by definition not science- but pseudo science (i.e. ID) or simply "belief". I don't think anyone here has said religion is "wrong"- just that it's beliefs should not be passed off as established fact. Your clumsy association of scientists with "the media and the ACLU" falls flatly on it's face. Just as there is no single religion, and no consolidated doctrine, there is no single "Bible" but instead, translations and interpretations of original documents. Christian belief is centered around cultural norms and the interpretation of the Bible adopted by a particular church- simple as that. Even within that framework there has always existed dissent- where it not for that dissent there might not be a Roman Catholic church, the Mormons or the many Protestent denominations.
The lack of popular games for Linux really is the only reason to keep Microsoft Windows on any machine. Let's home EA and a few other publishers begin to release for Linux.
If he then used the knowledge he'd gained to break into cars sure he could and should be arrested. However, my understanding is that he is in trouble for PUBLISHING the information- something completely different. To continue with the comparison, a vulnerability with cryptonite locks for bicycles was recently published on the internet complete with an "instructional" video. Instead of suing, Kryptonite rightly responded with a lock which provided better security. Since it's the job of virus software to provide security I would think that Viguard should be open to suit for failing adding vulnerabilities itself. I'm not a lawyer- what do you think?
Dude- tmobile offers the same thing with better plans and has for almost a year.
Did anyone else notice his Attorney General web site is running on MS Software (IIS and W2K)? I wonder if they'll pull the license...
// Signed//
Seriously, I wrote him and pointed this out.
A supportive MA voter
Is your comment an attempt at sarcasm or a blatant show of ignorance? I mean, have you ever visited RPM.org where the entire source code and documentation of the RPM system (not to mention the text of Maximum RPM) has been made freely available?