The decline of the PC gaming market is more to blame for that than anything else. Computer RPGs (and therefore Western RPGs) are having a hard time due to that; companies that produce for computers focus on FPSes and RTSes because those are proven money-makers in an industry that's dwarfed by console gaming. Also, all of the big computer RPG franchises were controlled by companies that are bankrupt (or nearly so) like Interplay and Sir-Tech. Well, except for Ultima, which is owned by EA and exists today only in MMORPG form (some would call that a fate worse than death).
If you're assuming that "JRPGs are still doing the typical check-the-dresser-for-a-health-potion 'interactivity'!" you haven't played one in the last 5 years. Try picking up Dark Cloud 2 to see how different things have gotten.
The Dark Cloud series is the exception that proves the rule. Most Japanese RPGs haven't moved too far from the styles of gameplay that Dragon Warrior, Shining Force, and Secret of Mana made popular.
On top of that, I just don't see the need to fracture the RPG or any other genre for that matter into locales.
Blame the games themselves for that, or perhaps the game developers. This isn't an artificial distinction that someone conjured from thin air; it's been there for about two decades now.
You forgot Might & Magic. Just pointing it out because forgetting Might & Magic in a discussion of Western RPGs is like forgetting Jose Carreras in a discussion of great tenors: He might be "the third guy" but it's still bad form to leave him out.
And the US invented the automobile...you don't see a lot of people claiming those are the best across the board, now do you?
There's a difference between saying that the Japanese make better RPGs on average and saying that the Japanese have made 99% of all of the RPGs that are worth playing, ever. One is a matter of opinion, the other is just silly.
So in my mind, asking people to compare Japanese RPGs to Western ones to show the differences in design philosophy is kind of laughable. It's akin to comparing US FPS or RTS games to Japanese ones, there are just certain genres that various locales haven't quite got down yet.
What? The West invented the video game RPG, and you say that we "haven't quite got [them] down yet"? Are you kidding?
Seems to me like the guy's link to Game Over wouldn't have been mentioned if it wasn't relevant. Of course, facts being irrelevant hasn't stopped the media from reporting on them before.
Being the one who leaks an early version is another, IMHO. That goes straight to the heart of trust and inherently makes him unfit for further work in the industry.
Not only that, but there's little point to it. Review versions are often tweaked and polished before the final retail game comes out, so anyone who downloaded the review version ends up having to download the final version. This is why warez groups tend to stay away from them.
Why not? The games are a lot more fun to play on the cube
In your opinion. Which was my point; most people who would buy an XBox before a GameCube would not buy a GameCube in its stead. The two styles are just too different.
Seriously, I don't understand what makes people play the same old stuff over and over again (inset any racing game or sports game here) instead of playing stuff that's FUN. Paper Mario 2, as an example.
Ironic that you would use a sequel as an example of something that's not "the same old stuff over and over again."
Nintendo said that 3rd parties will be alienated if they dont like nintendo innovations. However, if these companies like the innovations, they will probably make games only for the revolution.
Let me just add that third-parties would have to like the Revolution a whole lot to make games exclusively for it. Or Nintendo would have to go the Sony/MS route and pay them off.
All of these people saying that just because the positive studies were paid for by video game companies doesn't mean that they're invalid, yet what happens when a study paid for by Microsoft states that, for example, Microsoft servers are ultimately cheaper than Linux ones?
Not that I don't agree that Jack Thompson is full of shit, or that I don't have doubts about the Microsoft studies in question, but let's be logically consistent here.
I've felt it myself. Playing video games has made me more willing to do stupid things that I otherwise shouldn't. I've had to stop playing videogames, because I didn't like who I was becoming after playing them.
I guess it couldn't possibly be something wrong with you, right?
...which, might I add, comes entirely from the movie Runaway Jury...
The only way game makers could be held at least partially culpable for a violent crime committed by young users of their products (barring the silly "violent games directly incite otherwise normal children into doing crimes" idea) is if it was illegal to sell violent games to minors, and either (a) the makers knowingly did it anyway (or at least didn't care if their games were sold to minors), or (b) the makers specifically marketed their violent games to minors. AFAIK, none of those things are true in any case--at least, not yet.
It should be noted that the same thing applies to everything that previous posters have mentioned: movies, books, the news, etc.
I'm pretty certain that McDonald's never denied that eating its food could make you fat like the tobacco industry denied that smoking its product could give you cancer.
Remember what happened to Square? In 1998, it was making money hand over fist. Just five years later, due to bad decision-making, it came out on the losing end of a merger with Enix. I could easily see the same thing happening to Nintendo, just not with Microsoft. Or EA, for that matter.
Somehow I knew you were going to say that, despite the fact that it would be completely absurd to say something like "Blacks shouldn't be able to marry blacks, but that's not racist because whites shouldn't be able to marry blacks either."
Or if you're one of those people that ignores logic and common sense, believing that being a homosexual is a choice, replace "whites" with "Christians" and "blacks" with "Jews."
Note especially that WND article about halfway down the first page.
As for your crack about Americans, what makes you think they are stupid?
I don't think that they are stupid. I just don't think that they're particularly smart, either.
Did they just stumble into being the greatest nation in the world?
No, they got there on the shoulders of their forefathers. Americans used to be a lot less complacent and reliant on the government for everything. We've grown fat and sluggish much like the Roman Empire did before its fall. Not to say that most of today's nations are any better, but it's only a matter of time until somebody else becomes the main superpower on Earth, most likely China.
Slashdot Mirror
The decline of the PC gaming market is more to blame for that than anything else. Computer RPGs (and therefore Western RPGs) are having a hard time due to that; companies that produce for computers focus on FPSes and RTSes because those are proven money-makers in an industry that's dwarfed by console gaming. Also, all of the big computer RPG franchises were controlled by companies that are bankrupt (or nearly so) like Interplay and Sir-Tech. Well, except for Ultima, which is owned by EA and exists today only in MMORPG form (some would call that a fate worse than death).
Rob
If you're assuming that "JRPGs are still doing the typical check-the-dresser-for-a-health-potion 'interactivity'!" you haven't played one in the last 5 years. Try picking up Dark Cloud 2 to see how different things have gotten.
The Dark Cloud series is the exception that proves the rule. Most Japanese RPGs haven't moved too far from the styles of gameplay that Dragon Warrior, Shining Force, and Secret of Mana made popular.
On top of that, I just don't see the need to fracture the RPG or any other genre for that matter into locales.
Blame the games themselves for that, or perhaps the game developers. This isn't an artificial distinction that someone conjured from thin air; it's been there for about two decades now.
Rob
Grandparent said that we should get guns off of the streets and away from children, not take them from law-abiding citizens.
Rob
You forgot Might & Magic. Just pointing it out because forgetting Might & Magic in a discussion of Western RPGs is like forgetting Jose Carreras in a discussion of great tenors: He might be "the third guy" but it's still bad form to leave him out.
Rob
And the US invented the automobile...you don't see a lot of people claiming those are the best across the board, now do you?
There's a difference between saying that the Japanese make better RPGs on average and saying that the Japanese have made 99% of all of the RPGs that are worth playing, ever. One is a matter of opinion, the other is just silly.
Rob
So in my mind, asking people to compare Japanese RPGs to Western ones to show the differences in design philosophy is kind of laughable. It's akin to comparing US FPS or RTS games to Japanese ones, there are just certain genres that various locales haven't quite got down yet.
What? The West invented the video game RPG, and you say that we "haven't quite got [them] down yet"? Are you kidding?
Rob
This should be obvious, but when most people see a product that they feel is overpriced, they simply don't buy it.
When it comes to computer software, you'd be surprised.
Rob
Seems to me like the guy's link to Game Over wouldn't have been mentioned if it wasn't relevant. Of course, facts being irrelevant hasn't stopped the media from reporting on them before.
Rob
Being the one who leaks an early version is another, IMHO. That goes straight to the heart of trust and inherently makes him unfit for further work in the industry.
Not only that, but there's little point to it. Review versions are often tweaked and polished before the final retail game comes out, so anyone who downloaded the review version ends up having to download the final version. This is why warez groups tend to stay away from them.
Rob
Why not? The games are a lot more fun to play on the cube
In your opinion. Which was my point; most people who would buy an XBox before a GameCube would not buy a GameCube in its stead. The two styles are just too different.
Seriously, I don't understand what makes people play the same old stuff over and over again (inset any racing game or sports game here) instead of playing stuff that's FUN. Paper Mario 2, as an example.
Ironic that you would use a sequel as an example of something that's not "the same old stuff over and over again."
Rob
Last I checked, World of Warcraft gave them a thorough trouncing.
Rob
Maybe you should have hung on to the GameCube, huh guys?
That assumes that people would go ahead and buy a GameCube in lieu of an XBox, something that doesn't seem very likely.
Rob
Nintendo said that 3rd parties will be alienated if they dont like nintendo innovations. However, if these companies like the innovations, they will probably make games only for the revolution.
Let me just add that third-parties would have to like the Revolution a whole lot to make games exclusively for it. Or Nintendo would have to go the Sony/MS route and pay them off.
Rob
Prominently horrible.
Rob
All of these people saying that just because the positive studies were paid for by video game companies doesn't mean that they're invalid, yet what happens when a study paid for by Microsoft states that, for example, Microsoft servers are ultimately cheaper than Linux ones?
Not that I don't agree that Jack Thompson is full of shit, or that I don't have doubts about the Microsoft studies in question, but let's be logically consistent here.
Rob
I've felt it myself. Playing video games has made me more willing to do stupid things that I otherwise shouldn't. I've had to stop playing videogames, because I didn't like who I was becoming after playing them.
I guess it couldn't possibly be something wrong with you, right?
Rob
...which, might I add, comes entirely from the movie Runaway Jury...
The only way game makers could be held at least partially culpable for a violent crime committed by young users of their products (barring the silly "violent games directly incite otherwise normal children into doing crimes" idea) is if it was illegal to sell violent games to minors, and either (a) the makers knowingly did it anyway (or at least didn't care if their games were sold to minors), or (b) the makers specifically marketed their violent games to minors. AFAIK, none of those things are true in any case--at least, not yet.
It should be noted that the same thing applies to everything that previous posters have mentioned: movies, books, the news, etc.
Rob
I'm pretty certain that McDonald's never denied that eating its food could make you fat like the tobacco industry denied that smoking its product could give you cancer.
Rob
I think it far more likely that the video rental industry will have a problem with this, as you just mentioned in the case of movies.
Rob
Sort of like the auras in Warcraft 3 (and WoW, I presume), but a lot more fruity. Couldn't you just pat the fire spirit on the back or something?
Rob
You misspelled "VIII."
Or "X-2," really, but hey, I'm willing to be conservative here.
Rob
Remember what happened to Square? In 1998, it was making money hand over fist. Just five years later, due to bad decision-making, it came out on the losing end of a merger with Enix. I could easily see the same thing happening to Nintendo, just not with Microsoft. Or EA, for that matter.
Rob
I was agreeing with the poster that said, "Legally, there's nothing different from a homosexual individual than a heterosexual."
And the difference is that heterosexuals, in general, are allowed to marry who they want to marry.
Rob
Somehow I knew you were going to say that, despite the fact that it would be completely absurd to say something like "Blacks shouldn't be able to marry blacks, but that's not racist because whites shouldn't be able to marry blacks either."
Or if you're one of those people that ignores logic and common sense, believing that being a homosexual is a choice, replace "whites" with "Christians" and "blacks" with "Jews."
Rob
Never, have I ever seen anyone on the right compare either Clinton with Hitler.
e r
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Clinton+Hitl
Note especially that WND article about halfway down the first page.
As for your crack about Americans, what makes you think they are stupid?
I don't think that they are stupid. I just don't think that they're particularly smart, either.
Did they just stumble into being the greatest nation in the world?
No, they got there on the shoulders of their forefathers. Americans used to be a lot less complacent and reliant on the government for everything. We've grown fat and sluggish much like the Roman Empire did before its fall. Not to say that most of today's nations are any better, but it's only a matter of time until somebody else becomes the main superpower on Earth, most likely China.
Rob