lets see, chemical to kinetic, hmmm.. battery efficiency: maybe 90% on each of charge and discharge, lets say 80% overall. electric motor efficiency, good ones are >90%. total efficiency: >70%. thousands of times more than this: 70,000% efficiency..... LISA! in this house we obey the laws of thermodynamics!
actually you got all of what you said wrong. Lets just start with the exit polls, because at this stage I doubt you'll get back and read this anyway. Just incase:
Tell me why, in "democratic" countries around the world, exit polls are used as a very reliable marker to check for vote rigging, and are considered almost perfect. Some countries even use the exit polls as the actual vote, and only check the real votes if the exit polls are close! Any time an election has dodgy exit polls anywhere else in the world, americans scream fraud, but at home, its ok? Gimme a fucken break. ah fuckit, Im not gonna reach you and I cant be stuffed trying.
For some possibilities as to who "they " are, try watching these documentaries (mostly available on google video)
"the money masters"
"jfk II the bush connection"
"everybodies gotta learn sometime" then "loose change 2E" then "martial law 911 alex jones"
"terrorstorm"
"painfull deceptions"
"waco rules of engagement"
"peace propaganda and the promised land"
or just go to universal seed and watch some of the stuff there
My answer to who after much (but not enough) research is probably: no particular person, no particular group, but more a collection of elitist groups (often termed the illuminati), each jostling for top spot while pushing the same overall plan (enslave the rest of us).
its funny cos I dont even live in america, and actually Rep/Dem, its all the same shit. you theink "they" let just anyone get airplay to become a serious candidate? Keep the sheeple worrying about the little things so they cant see the asssholes doing a big steaming turds on their faces. Enjoy the shit bath sheeples.
NOT BOGUS STORY. wake the hell up sheeple. You may not care that bush stole the election, but youd have to be a complete frickin idiot not to realise that he did steal it. Dodgy exit polls, mathematical impossibilities, thousands of accounts of one sided errors, the voting machines manufacturer CEO PROMISED BUSH VOTES in a memo!!! how much more fricken obvious does it have to be? (bush promised votes (first link in google, no idea the site but it was a fairly widely printed story) more dodginess.
You can whinge about sources if you want, I dont give a crap, most murdoch/GE/etc owned news companies lie through their teeth, so the only place you CAN go for some of this news is "less reputable" sites.... (eg look up "outfoxed" on google video, a doco by ex fox news reporters, describing how dodgy the station ewnt after murdoch took over)
nor can they hire a non-jew legally (at least thats what some documentaries I've seen claim, its not like I've read the israeli legal code (though perhaps I should)) even though it happens anyway because the palestinians are basically an available slave labour workforce, being unable to get decent jobs.
yes yes, I know that. I'll say it again. All I was saying was that the US could have ignored it, since the US itself was not yet being attacked. This would be morally and politically a bad idea in my opinion, given their allies were being attacked, but nonetheless, it was an option (and the moral argument falls to hypocrisy given the aid being given to israel, a racist violent state occupying other peoples lands illegally). Ah whatever. I tend to think all war is nuts anyway. its not like those involved in the actual fighting ever really have a problem with each other, its just the people at the top, so why not just take out the people at the top? (I know wishful thinking etc etc)
have I been there? no. So could I be vastly mistaken? of course, thats why I said Im not yet sold, with no personal verification its pretty hard to be sure of anything. But you say they didnt emigrate, how do you know this? plenty did, and it seems numbers for prewar jewish populations are a little contradictory (but that could just be someone deliberately muddying the waters, from either side). As to vastly documented, thats the thing, its NOT (at least as far as I know, which is not far enough..)! Actual proof that would stand up in a murder trial seems to be virtually absent. Plenty of people write about it, based on earlier works based on earlier works etc etc, but at the bottom of the pile, theres basically a bunch of "evidence" given in by the soviets, along with confirmed faked evidence, lies and deliberate exagerations. If the CSI lab was caught manufacturing, exagerating and distorting evidence in a normal case, how far do you think the case would go?
anyway, I really havent been looking long enough to argue strongly either way, so ignore me as you wish, though I'd prefer if you'd watch those videos and let me know what you thought (and not swear at me without looking at the things Ive looked at).
perhaps it could be better summed up as: Many dont flat out deny anything, they just believe that much of what we are taught appears to be based mainly on wartime propaganda, already partially discredited evidence and pretty much zero solid evidence, contrary to the widely held opinion that it is based on solid proof, and they think we should be openly looking into this further. Of course, as I mentioned, there are also plenty of actual neo-nazi white supremacists etc latching on and using the issue for their own effed up reasons.
from my understanding of it, mainly "just" the widespread usage of gas chambers to kill jews/orders from the top down to exterminate them: ie, they accept that jews were rounded up, placed in forced labour camps, often worked to death, malnourished, tattoed and numbered, persecuted, treated extremely badly, tortured, experimented on, murdered, and at least hundreds of thousands died. Basically what they are saying is that the gas chambers are made up/exagerated, but most of the rest of the story is true. Now I fully admit that this sounds a little crazy, given what we "know", to anyone who hasnt looked at their arguments, and I would have thought this untill recently, but now, while I am not yet convinced they are right, from what I have seen so far, I am convinced of two things and strongly suspicious of the third
1) the holocaust, true or false is being abused for malicious purposes by a variety of groups, and at least parts of it have been willingly exagerated/deceptively portrayed by people who should know better.
2) The holocaust revisionists case, at least on the surface, is quite strong. What I mean by this is that the arguments/evidence I have so far seen are well thought out, cogent, and fairly convincing IF the underlying info checks out. howeverI have not yet had time to thouroughly check out much of this underlying info, so I cant yet say how much is true or not.
3) Some very powerful groups are hiding something. It may not be that the holocaust didnt occur, it may be more related to why it occured or who else was involved, Im not sure yet. Why else have this media blackout on what their arguments are, deceptive statements about what they actually believe, and worldwide (already fairly successful) push for anti free-speech laws jailing people for even discussing it? (this is the one im only semi sure of. It's probably mostly widespread unconcious denial on the media's part, after buying the "info" given out on the holocaust, and therefore having an emotional response to people trying to deny its occurance, not "conspiracy", however not everything can be explained by this)
of course, Im just a youngish whipper-snapper with no personal experience in the area (though my grandma was held in a Japanese POW camp, and is still messed up over half a century later) so its hard for me to be sure of much of anything. Its ALL stories to me, I've just gotta decide which ones I believe.(and watch out for the white supremacist assholes hijacking the issue for their own racist purposes)
You know what really got me thinking? before I even looked into it, I was talking about a different issue, and my mum mentioned holocaust deniers, and how its rediculous, and my own grandma has the tattoos to prove it. When I stumbled onto some revisionist stuff, and saw that they werent actually denying that, I realised: hell most people probably feel this way, knowing someone involved, and for this reason will look no further, except this proves nothing; one it was a japanese camp, but two, its based on a misunderstanding of what they are actually denying, and its not the rounding up and tattooing.
If you feel like having a look through, heres a video archive revisionist look at the operation reinhardt death camps, and the evidence for/against them. I would be grateful if someone with decent knowledge in the area could watch them properly and point out any (serious) lies, errors or relevant ommisions in them (not just nitpicking though)
Im sorry, what part of "now I'm not saying america shouldn't have gone into the war," didnt you comprehend, the "now I'm not saying america shouldn't have gone into the war," part, or the "now I'm not saying america shouldn't have gone into the war," part?
erm, 10 points for reading comprehension. Im saying they had the option to stay out of the war BEFORE they engineered japan into pearl harbour, not after. Im not saying it would necessarily have been the right thing to do, just saying the option was there for them to look the other way, and they(US leadership) decided (probably rightly) not too.
as to the iranian president, sure he sounds nuts, if you have never actually read any holocaust revisionist information and realised while they havent proved anything fully to my satisfaction (from what I've read/seen so far), they most certainly HAVE raised a lot of doubts, enough to not just label outright as crazy anyone buying into it a little more. Once you realise this, and know a little more about israel than fox news will tell you, he actually comes across as an intelligent rational man. Of course thats just the interview, I have no idea what sane/crazy stuff he has said (or people have claimed he has said) elsewhere
as to israel, I really dont get it. Is racism good? No? then why the fuck are people putting up with a nation state founded on the idea of racism/racial superiority, and not only that, founded on other peoples land? dont give me that "they lived there once" crap, that was thousands of years ago, how about you go donate your house to an american indian. Or someone with some Neanderthal dna. Why was it not ok for apartheid south africa to have separate rules for blacks and whites and oppress/kill/torture etc blacks (whose land they lived on), while its ok for israel to have laws basically making jewish people the only legal human beings in the state? Was Biko a terrorist? Mandella? no they were fighting for what should have been basic human rights of equality and freedom. So why are we calling people defending their homeland against racist violent powerful nations attacking and occupying their land, torturing and killing their families and denying them their rights terrorists?
ah whatever, the few on here that will agree with me already know this stuff, the rest of you will just dismiss it since it doesnt mesh with what you "know" and plug your brainwash 2000 tubes back in. It's like cypher says; "ignorance is bliss".
no he doesnt say he doesnt believe it happened, he says he has seen no proof for it, and thinks it may not have happened, and that some open discussion and research about this should occur. Of course this sounds crazy, up untill the point where you actually LOOK at what the holocaust "deniers" (hint, they dont deny anything near what you think they do) are saying, and realise "hey, some of this makes a lot of damn sense". of course most of you will ignore this and label me neo-nazi or some other rubbish, but to tell you the truth, I would be in your position doing the same to someone saying what Im saying only a few months ago. I'm still definately not sold on all of the holocaust revisions claims, but Ive gotto tell you, if this was a fair court case, theyd be winning from what Ive seen.
as to the guy claiming some shit about archeometry, apart from the fact that its an ad hom attack, what the frack are you on about anyway, I linked a physics professor's peer reviewed paper, showing proof of controlled demolition, and you pull archeometry out your ass? you know where you can shove it right back in, dont you.
oil demand is artificial. There I said it. Yep I mean it. WE DONT NEED OIL. the whole world could have been off oil years ago had it tried, had it spent half or a quarter what it spent on "stabilising" the middle east (ie screwing the locals out of their inheritance) on switching to wind, solar, elctric cars etc. Dont have the battery tech? imagine what a few tens of billions in research thrown at the problem instead of at "clean oil/coal" would have done. We'd have our 4000 whr/kg lithium air cells by now and have cars driving thousands of kms per charge. ITS ALL BULLSHIT, so you keep pretending like we NEED to kill those middle eastern children so we dont starve, personally, I'll keep reducing my dependance on oil/fossil fuels (by going renewable on my electric, electric on my transport and continuing to ride further than most people drive each week on my pushie, and hopefully, if enough people do the same, the oil groups will lose some of their power over life and death of the worlds population. Hope you sleep well knowing your humvee is powered on the lives of innocent children...)
watch the documentary in my sig ("the money masters") on google video, and then see if you still feel that way. As to not leaving you alone: The insane were leaving you guys alone fine, germany deliberately did not want to engage america, and I doubt japan really did either, but where semi-forced into it by america itself (no excuse for bombing pearl harbour I know, but it argues against your comment of "insane people not leaving you alone") for the express purpose of convincing the majority of americans that going into the war was a necessary evil.
now I'm not saying america shouldn't have gone into the war, given that their allies were being attacked etc, but they certainly could have not gone into the war, if they were willing to live with the possibility of an axis controlled europe.. (which obviously would not be likely to be.. erm... pleasant.. though it seems america/most of world is headed towards police state mentality anyway)
twomore links you should really read, though I doubt many will.
well thats all I can do. I cant FORCE you to watch them, and I doubt many will, but if even a couple do, and realise something interesting about the world as they knew it, I'll be happy
exactly:) (plus of course even our current understanding posits zero point fluctuations, although I've not heard of even a theoretical way to utilise them (not looked either though)
and again, you HAVE NOT READ what I linked, in which the answers to your questions/problems are given. NANO-THERMITE EXPLOSIVE GELL EXISTS ALREADY. This is not a secret. Very small particles of aluminium and iron oxide are dispersed through a gel, giving you a plastic style moldable explosive with, I imagine (but dont know for certain), none of the normal explosive residue indicators (but a whole buch of new ones, as picked up in the linked paper)
here I'll link it again. Make sure to read the pdf linked near the top, as it is in this that the Prof. goes through the chemical analysis evidence for thermite use and information on current nano-thermite tech and also a link to a patent for a device for using thermite to cut vertical beams, not just horizontal ones (patented early 2001 interestingly)
also, Im not dissagreeing withyou, and I understand that newton etc was not invalidated, just expanded upon. That doesnt change the fact that the double slit experiment would behave entirely differently under purely newtonian physics, and that the actual results would be seen as impossible...
but on the other side of the coin, Ive got to agree with another poster here and say I dont know any "scientists" who wouldnt run down the road yelling for all to see if they had actually examined and confirmed the working sof this device...
I understand what your saying, but just think about one thing: what if the conspiracy nuts are right/partially right.
What if tesla or some other person since him had discovered some aspect of physics allowing virtually free or near free energy production. Im not saying it happened, but imagine for a sec it did. Now think of the interests that would want to keep it under raps:
- every military in the world, would want to keep it for themselves and themselves alone
- every energy company (fossil fuels especially) would want to either bury it or control it
- many other industries which want to keep their lucrative status quo (eg combustion engine manufacturers, therefore car companies etc) and cant be bothered/see it as less profitable to adapt to this new tech
- elite worldview says its better for me to have 1 dollar and you to have nothing than for us all to have 10 dollars. combine this with the fact that many of the most powerful people at least partially hold this view, and that were such an energy source distributed amongst thrid world countries "we" (first world) would likely lose control of them and be unable to use them as our slave labour, and youve got even more people out to squash it.
- assuming for a second that it HAD happened and been squashed, those doing the squashing would be facing some pretty serious charges should it come out(eg: crime against humanity fits I think), and would have had to be powerfull to squash it once (hell they could be using it for themselves), so would continue trying to squash it.
now all of this ignores what seems like a fact that most scientists would give an arm and a leg to discover something like this, and would never keep it under wraps, but consider:
- virtually all scientists are (justifiably) at least somewhat skeptical of these sorts of claims, many are downright hostile.
- none will be surprised if this turns out to be just another hoax.
- what if it wasnt a hoax but the discoverers where just bought off?
of course most of this is very low probability paranoid stuff, but given the huge payoff for confirmation and the willingness to undergo scientific scrutiny, I'd say, lets give em that scrutiny and prove them wrong (but hopefully prove them right)
of course it would be much easier if they just released the design and let others try to build it, but that would be a pretty selfless act... (plus its not like many scientists go round building "free energy gadgets" from the web as it is..)
Look I've done my thermodynamics, I know the rules, according to what we know. I've also done some quantum physics, and heard about zero point fluctuations. Now Im 95% sure this is just rubbish to scam some free press for something else, but, WE DONT KNOW EVERYTHING, in fact, looking at the current state of string theory, qunatum theory, etc etc, we seem to have a bunch of complex equations that mostly work as advertised, but we dont really know why.
So with that said, considering they are doing what I consider the right thing (ie putting it out there to be verified by qualified independant scientists), and considering how many times "science" has thought they knew it all and had it allmost all wrong, I think we should at least give them the chance to have the qualified physicists etc come in and test it, because, think about it, we dont know everything.
hell maybe we are in a matrix style simulation, and this device is a cheat code.....
if any of you bothered to read the link supplied, you would see that thermite CAN be an explosive, in nanoparticle form (ie smaller particles, more surface area, faster reaction, BOOM), and is called nano-thermite.
Although my personal opinion after much research is that both normal thermite to cut/weaken supports (using the patented device in the linked paper) and nano-thermite as an explosive to bring down the weakened building was used, there is no reason to assume that no other explosive was present, although given no-one has admitted picking up residue from explosives apart from nano-thermite, this would seem to be unlikely.
There was some speculation that thermo-baric (fuel air) bombs were used, since they seem to be one of the few non-nuclear devices capable of being both compact/portable and creating the huge overpressures needed to pulverise an entire building to dust floor by floor. I would be interested to hear just exactly what fuel is used in thermobarics and what explosive charge to start the shockwave, and what residue would be expected from them? (though I imagine it's probably classified:( )
oh and for those 9/11 newbies, YES there was opportunity to pre-plant all these devices, the towers underwent a 36 hour powerdown over the weekend before 911, with security cameras and locks not working, and "engineers" going in and out. Also the security for the WTC, the dulles airport (where one of the flights took off from) and one of the airlines involved was stratasec/securacom, run by Bush's brother! Not hard to bypass security when you ARE security. I would imagine that they had preplanted what they could in hidden spots weeks prior to 9/11, awaiting a favorable weather report (see here for why) then it seems on the 6/11 they got that report, so suddenly the booker primary school visit was finalised, among other things, and they set up the powerdown to plant all the rest of the esplosives and cutters necessary.
oh and by the way, there were 47 very large steel box columns in the core, and over 250 steel columns round the edge, all starting extremely thick in the basement and tapering towards the top, and as you say, they where over an inch thick. Actually near the base they where over 4 inches thick! This tells you just how stupid it is when people suggest that the jet fuel made much difference at all to them. Each floor contained over 1000 tonnes of steel and concrete, the jets dumped a maximum of perhaps 5 tonnes of kerosene (jet fuel) on each floor (probably less than this), while the rest burned up outside in a giant fireball (which seemingly exceeded the size the amount of fuel present should have created, though I've only seen this theory one place so far and havent verified the calculations yet). When was the last time that 1Kg of kerosene contained enough energy to noticeably weaken/heat 200 kg of steel and concrete? even more so since that steel was connected in an unbroken column to another 100 floors of it, like a giant heat sink (although admittedly the heat would not have had time to travel all that far in only one hour with the pissy little heat gradient present...
again, for newbies to the scene, NIST could not find steel from the crash/fire area exposed to temperatures higher than 300C, and most was exposed to a fair bit less than this. (ignoring for the moment, as they did, the "partially evaporated" steel beams). As to people claiming the "jet fuel cant melt steel" argument is a strawman since it doesnt need to melt to collapse, it would be, except MANY WITNESSES REPORTED LITTERALLY DRIPPING MOLTEN STEEL BEAMS in the rubble, and there are pictures and video available showing yellow to yellow-white hot molten metal, far hotter than should have been present (again see the attached paper for pictures, or watch any good 9/11 CT film, they will probably show one of the clips)
you know what really annoys me? how many supposedly "skeptical" and "logical" people, look for reassurance that the conspiracy is false in the mainstream press, without actually reading what the conspiracy theorists have to say! Anyone with an ounce of real logic would realise that, were there to be a conspiracy as described by the 911 truthers, you're not going to find the mainstream news, THEY ARE LIKELY IN ON IT (at least the high level managers, some editors, CEOs and controlling mega corps are, most lower level people and actual reporters are not likely to be, although neither are they doing their jobs)! now this is not to say that every person in a news outfit knows whats happening, most are probably like you, brainwashed by their (mainstream media's MSM) own bullshit. Just think of a million reporters, all thinking like you "these CT's are nuts, i know they are wrong, I read it in a X article, I dont need to find out what they are really saying from the horses mouth, whereas the one or two who actually go out of their way to find out the truth are promplty shut up about it by those in the know (and uder the thumb). In fact I have heard (anonymous unfortunately) statements from people claiming to be MSM people syaing just this exact thing. For an example not directly related to 911, watch "outfoxed" on google video (by ex fox news employees), then extrapolate to the other 6 or 8 TOTAL large media conglomerates worldwide
Slashdot Mirror
lets see, chemical to kinetic, hmmm.. battery efficiency: maybe 90% on each of charge and discharge, lets say 80% overall. electric motor efficiency, good ones are >90%. total efficiency: >70%. thousands of times more than this: 70,000% efficiency..... LISA! in this house we obey the laws of thermodynamics!
Tell me why, in "democratic" countries around the world, exit polls are used as a very reliable marker to check for vote rigging, and are considered almost perfect. Some countries even use the exit polls as the actual vote, and only check the real votes if the exit polls are close! Any time an election has dodgy exit polls anywhere else in the world, americans scream fraud, but at home, its ok? Gimme a fucken break. ah fuckit, Im not gonna reach you and I cant be stuffed trying.
For some possibilities as to who "they " are, try watching these documentaries (mostly available on google video) "the money masters" "jfk II the bush connection" "everybodies gotta learn sometime" then "loose change 2E" then "martial law 911 alex jones" "terrorstorm" "painfull deceptions" "waco rules of engagement" "peace propaganda and the promised land"
or just go to universal seed and watch some of the stuff there
My answer to who after much (but not enough) research is probably: no particular person, no particular group, but more a collection of elitist groups (often termed the illuminati), each jostling for top spot while pushing the same overall plan (enslave the rest of us).
its funny cos I dont even live in america, and actually Rep/Dem, its all the same shit. you theink "they" let just anyone get airplay to become a serious candidate? Keep the sheeple worrying about the little things so they cant see the asssholes doing a big steaming turds on their faces. Enjoy the shit bath sheeples.
You can whinge about sources if you want, I dont give a crap, most murdoch/GE/etc owned news companies lie through their teeth, so the only place you CAN go for some of this news is "less reputable" sites.... (eg look up "outfoxed" on google video, a doco by ex fox news reporters, describing how dodgy the station ewnt after murdoch took over)
how is this flamebait? do you mods actually look what option you are selecting? whatever.
nor can they hire a non-jew legally (at least thats what some documentaries I've seen claim, its not like I've read the israeli legal code (though perhaps I should)) even though it happens anyway because the palestinians are basically an available slave labour workforce, being unable to get decent jobs.
yes yes, I know that. I'll say it again. All I was saying was that the US could have ignored it, since the US itself was not yet being attacked. This would be morally and politically a bad idea in my opinion, given their allies were being attacked, but nonetheless, it was an option (and the moral argument falls to hypocrisy given the aid being given to israel, a racist violent state occupying other peoples lands illegally). Ah whatever. I tend to think all war is nuts anyway. its not like those involved in the actual fighting ever really have a problem with each other, its just the people at the top, so why not just take out the people at the top? (I know wishful thinking etc etc)
anyway, I really havent been looking long enough to argue strongly either way, so ignore me as you wish, though I'd prefer if you'd watch those videos and let me know what you thought (and not swear at me without looking at the things Ive looked at).
perhaps it could be better summed up as: Many dont flat out deny anything, they just believe that much of what we are taught appears to be based mainly on wartime propaganda, already partially discredited evidence and pretty much zero solid evidence, contrary to the widely held opinion that it is based on solid proof, and they think we should be openly looking into this further. Of course, as I mentioned, there are also plenty of actual neo-nazi white supremacists etc latching on and using the issue for their own effed up reasons.
1) the holocaust, true or false is being abused for malicious purposes by a variety of groups, and at least parts of it have been willingly exagerated/deceptively portrayed by people who should know better.
2) The holocaust revisionists case, at least on the surface, is quite strong. What I mean by this is that the arguments/evidence I have so far seen are well thought out, cogent, and fairly convincing IF the underlying info checks out. howeverI have not yet had time to thouroughly check out much of this underlying info, so I cant yet say how much is true or not.
3) Some very powerful groups are hiding something. It may not be that the holocaust didnt occur, it may be more related to why it occured or who else was involved, Im not sure yet. Why else have this media blackout on what their arguments are, deceptive statements about what they actually believe, and worldwide (already fairly successful) push for anti free-speech laws jailing people for even discussing it? (this is the one im only semi sure of. It's probably mostly widespread unconcious denial on the media's part, after buying the "info" given out on the holocaust, and therefore having an emotional response to people trying to deny its occurance, not "conspiracy", however not everything can be explained by this)
of course, Im just a youngish whipper-snapper with no personal experience in the area (though my grandma was held in a Japanese POW camp, and is still messed up over half a century later) so its hard for me to be sure of much of anything. Its ALL stories to me, I've just gotta decide which ones I believe.(and watch out for the white supremacist assholes hijacking the issue for their own racist purposes)
You know what really got me thinking? before I even looked into it, I was talking about a different issue, and my mum mentioned holocaust deniers, and how its rediculous, and my own grandma has the tattoos to prove it. When I stumbled onto some revisionist stuff, and saw that they werent actually denying that, I realised: hell most people probably feel this way, knowing someone involved, and for this reason will look no further, except this proves nothing; one it was a japanese camp, but two, its based on a misunderstanding of what they are actually denying, and its not the rounding up and tattooing.
If you feel like having a look through, heres a video archive revisionist look at the operation reinhardt death camps, and the evidence for/against them. I would be grateful if someone with decent knowledge in the area could watch them properly and point out any (serious) lies, errors or relevant ommisions in them (not just nitpicking though)
deathcamp investigation
interview with Dr F piper, mainstream Auschwitz historian)
also google "dsmrd"
Im sorry, what part of "now I'm not saying america shouldn't have gone into the war," didnt you comprehend, the "now I'm not saying america shouldn't have gone into the war," part, or the "now I'm not saying america shouldn't have gone into the war," part?
as to the iranian president, sure he sounds nuts, if you have never actually read any holocaust revisionist information and realised while they havent proved anything fully to my satisfaction (from what I've read/seen so far), they most certainly HAVE raised a lot of doubts, enough to not just label outright as crazy anyone buying into it a little more. Once you realise this, and know a little more about israel than fox news will tell you, he actually comes across as an intelligent rational man. Of course thats just the interview, I have no idea what sane/crazy stuff he has said (or people have claimed he has said) elsewhere
as to israel, I really dont get it. Is racism good? No? then why the fuck are people putting up with a nation state founded on the idea of racism/racial superiority, and not only that, founded on other peoples land? dont give me that "they lived there once" crap, that was thousands of years ago, how about you go donate your house to an american indian. Or someone with some Neanderthal dna. Why was it not ok for apartheid south africa to have separate rules for blacks and whites and oppress/kill/torture etc blacks (whose land they lived on), while its ok for israel to have laws basically making jewish people the only legal human beings in the state? Was Biko a terrorist? Mandella? no they were fighting for what should have been basic human rights of equality and freedom. So why are we calling people defending their homeland against racist violent powerful nations attacking and occupying their land, torturing and killing their families and denying them their rights terrorists?
ah whatever, the few on here that will agree with me already know this stuff, the rest of you will just dismiss it since it doesnt mesh with what you "know" and plug your brainwash 2000 tubes back in. It's like cypher says; "ignorance is bliss".
as to the guy claiming some shit about archeometry, apart from the fact that its an ad hom attack, what the frack are you on about anyway, I linked a physics professor's peer reviewed paper, showing proof of controlled demolition, and you pull archeometry out your ass? you know where you can shove it right back in, dont you.
oil demand is artificial. There I said it. Yep I mean it. WE DONT NEED OIL. the whole world could have been off oil years ago had it tried, had it spent half or a quarter what it spent on "stabilising" the middle east (ie screwing the locals out of their inheritance) on switching to wind, solar, elctric cars etc. Dont have the battery tech? imagine what a few tens of billions in research thrown at the problem instead of at "clean oil/coal" would have done. We'd have our 4000 whr/kg lithium air cells by now and have cars driving thousands of kms per charge. ITS ALL BULLSHIT, so you keep pretending like we NEED to kill those middle eastern children so we dont starve, personally, I'll keep reducing my dependance on oil/fossil fuels (by going renewable on my electric, electric on my transport and continuing to ride further than most people drive each week on my pushie, and hopefully, if enough people do the same, the oil groups will lose some of their power over life and death of the worlds population. Hope you sleep well knowing your humvee is powered on the lives of innocent children...)
now I'm not saying america shouldn't have gone into the war, given that their allies were being attacked etc, but they certainly could have not gone into the war, if they were willing to live with the possibility of an axis controlled europe.. (which obviously would not be likely to be.. erm... pleasant.. though it seems america/most of world is headed towards police state mentality anyway)
explaining what the fuss is about israel
english MP mr Galloway blows ignorant "reporter" OUT OF THE FRICKEN WATER! hehe makes me laugh every time.
interview with iranian prime minister.[sarcasm] WOw he sounds really crazy...[/sarcasm]
two more links you should really read, though I doubt many will.
well thats all I can do. I cant FORCE you to watch them, and I doubt many will, but if even a couple do, and realise something interesting about the world as they knew it, I'll be happy
exactly :) (plus of course even our current understanding posits zero point fluctuations, although I've not heard of even a theoretical way to utilise them (not looked either though)
here I'll link it again. Make sure to read the pdf linked near the top, as it is in this that the Prof. goes through the chemical analysis evidence for thermite use and information on current nano-thermite tech and also a link to a patent for a device for using thermite to cut vertical beams, not just horizontal ones (patented early 2001 interestingly)
paper showing why we know the towers where explosively demolished
pdf linked showing latest results, including strong evidence of thermite usge in the analysis of the molten metal from the ruins
also, Im not dissagreeing withyou, and I understand that newton etc was not invalidated, just expanded upon. That doesnt change the fact that the double slit experiment would behave entirely differently under purely newtonian physics, and that the actual results would be seen as impossible...
but on the other side of the coin, Ive got to agree with another poster here and say I dont know any "scientists" who wouldnt run down the road yelling for all to see if they had actually examined and confirmed the working sof this device...
- every military in the world, would want to keep it for themselves and themselves alone
- every energy company (fossil fuels especially) would want to either bury it or control it
- many other industries which want to keep their lucrative status quo (eg combustion engine manufacturers, therefore car companies etc) and cant be bothered/see it as less profitable to adapt to this new tech
- elite worldview says its better for me to have 1 dollar and you to have nothing than for us all to have 10 dollars. combine this with the fact that many of the most powerful people at least partially hold this view, and that were such an energy source distributed amongst thrid world countries "we" (first world) would likely lose control of them and be unable to use them as our slave labour, and youve got even more people out to squash it.
- assuming for a second that it HAD happened and been squashed, those doing the squashing would be facing some pretty serious charges should it come out(eg: crime against humanity fits I think), and would have had to be powerfull to squash it once (hell they could be using it for themselves), so would continue trying to squash it.
now all of this ignores what seems like a fact that most scientists would give an arm and a leg to discover something like this, and would never keep it under wraps, but consider:
- virtually all scientists are (justifiably) at least somewhat skeptical of these sorts of claims, many are downright hostile.
- none will be surprised if this turns out to be just another hoax.
- what if it wasnt a hoax but the discoverers where just bought off?
of course most of this is very low probability paranoid stuff, but given the huge payoff for confirmation and the willingness to undergo scientific scrutiny, I'd say, lets give em that scrutiny and prove them wrong (but hopefully prove them right)
of course it would be much easier if they just released the design and let others try to build it, but that would be a pretty selfless act... (plus its not like many scientists go round building "free energy gadgets" from the web as it is..)
So with that said, considering they are doing what I consider the right thing (ie putting it out there to be verified by qualified independant scientists), and considering how many times "science" has thought they knew it all and had it allmost all wrong, I think we should at least give them the chance to have the qualified physicists etc come in and test it, because, think about it, we dont know everything.
hell maybe we are in a matrix style simulation, and this device is a cheat code.....
Although my personal opinion after much research is that both normal thermite to cut/weaken supports (using the patented device in the linked paper) and nano-thermite as an explosive to bring down the weakened building was used, there is no reason to assume that no other explosive was present, although given no-one has admitted picking up residue from explosives apart from nano-thermite, this would seem to be unlikely.
There was some speculation that thermo-baric (fuel air) bombs were used, since they seem to be one of the few non-nuclear devices capable of being both compact/portable and creating the huge overpressures needed to pulverise an entire building to dust floor by floor. I would be interested to hear just exactly what fuel is used in thermobarics and what explosive charge to start the shockwave, and what residue would be expected from them? (though I imagine it's probably classified :( )
oh and for those 9/11 newbies, YES there was opportunity to pre-plant all these devices, the towers underwent a 36 hour powerdown over the weekend before 911, with security cameras and locks not working, and "engineers" going in and out. Also the security for the WTC, the dulles airport (where one of the flights took off from) and one of the airlines involved was stratasec/securacom, run by Bush's brother! Not hard to bypass security when you ARE security. I would imagine that they had preplanted what they could in hidden spots weeks prior to 9/11, awaiting a favorable weather report (see here for why) then it seems on the 6/11 they got that report, so suddenly the booker primary school visit was finalised, among other things, and they set up the powerdown to plant all the rest of the esplosives and cutters necessary.
oh and by the way, there were 47 very large steel box columns in the core, and over 250 steel columns round the edge, all starting extremely thick in the basement and tapering towards the top, and as you say, they where over an inch thick. Actually near the base they where over 4 inches thick! This tells you just how stupid it is when people suggest that the jet fuel made much difference at all to them. Each floor contained over 1000 tonnes of steel and concrete, the jets dumped a maximum of perhaps 5 tonnes of kerosene (jet fuel) on each floor (probably less than this), while the rest burned up outside in a giant fireball (which seemingly exceeded the size the amount of fuel present should have created, though I've only seen this theory one place so far and havent verified the calculations yet). When was the last time that 1Kg of kerosene contained enough energy to noticeably weaken/heat 200 kg of steel and concrete? even more so since that steel was connected in an unbroken column to another 100 floors of it, like a giant heat sink (although admittedly the heat would not have had time to travel all that far in only one hour with the pissy little heat gradient present ...
again, for newbies to the scene, NIST could not find steel from the crash/fire area exposed to temperatures higher than 300C, and most was exposed to a fair bit less than this. (ignoring for the moment, as they did, the "partially evaporated" steel beams). As to people claiming the "jet fuel cant melt steel" argument is a strawman since it doesnt need to melt to collapse, it would be, except MANY WITNESSES REPORTED LITTERALLY DRIPPING MOLTEN STEEL BEAMS in the rubble, and there are pictures and video available showing yellow to yellow-white hot molten metal, far hotter than should have been present (again see the attached paper for pictures, or watch any good 9/11 CT film, they will probably show one of the clips)
you know what really annoys me? how many supposedly "skeptical" and "logical" people, look for reassurance that the conspiracy is false in the mainstream press, without actually reading what the conspiracy theorists have to say! Anyone with an ounce of real logic would realise that, were there to be a conspiracy as described by the 911 truthers, you're not going to find the mainstream news, THEY ARE LIKELY IN ON IT (at least the high level managers, some editors, CEOs and controlling mega corps are, most lower level people and actual reporters are not likely to be, although neither are they doing their jobs)! now this is not to say that every person in a news outfit knows whats happening, most are probably like you, brainwashed by their (mainstream media's MSM) own bullshit. Just think of a million reporters, all thinking like you "these CT's are nuts, i know they are wrong, I read it in a X article, I dont need to find out what they are really saying from the horses mouth, whereas the one or two who actually go out of their way to find out the truth are promplty shut up about it by those in the know (and uder the thumb). In fact I have heard (anonymous unfortunately) statements from people claiming to be MSM people syaing just this exact thing. For an example not directly related to 911, watch "outfoxed" on google video (by ex fox news employees), then extrapolate to the other 6 or 8 TOTAL large media conglomerates worldwide