While you may have more at stake here, I agree with your overall concept, but not as vehemently as you.
What I will say is this: ATT+marketing/advertising==up to their ears...at least that deep. Period. Really.
Any telecom, not just ATT that would deny something like this, I would automatically be suspicious of what they are saying. Sorry, but 'track records', and all that....
I would hope for public access to non-personal details...
Long, uphill fight to get there. Frankly, I don't see it happening anytime soon. I agree with you, and your noble sounding reasons, It will be a huge IP mess. (Intellectual/Imaginary Property-not playing sides here)
The hard part is going to be tracking changes for use in malpractice cases.
While difficult, I don't see that as the 'hard' part. See above.
Medical Records in the USA are currently a can of IP worms.
Quick, easy example: Assume I am a M.D. with my own 'office' and practice. If I retire/move on, and decide to sell my 'practice', your medical records are part of my IP I include in the sale with the rest of the property that makes up 'the practice' and 'office' I am selling. Even though I am selling your med records without your permission, it is my IP, and I can do so legally. Your IP rights on those med records only exist in privacy laws and regs, but does not extend to 'ownership' or copyright, which I own.
BTWnothing to do with the resulting setup, that's just the way it is currently. I get modded down, trolled, and flamed for my stance against the concept of IP here on/. This is one of many reasons why I am against it. It overly complicates what should be simple shit at the expense and detriment of the populace.
P.S. When I had classes on medical records in 1993-'94, IP solely meant Internet Protocol, but the potential problems were obvious even then when all the talk was gaining ground about how the internet would change the world. I got my A.A.S. in Veterinary Technology, and my B.S. in Biochemistry-similar to a Registered Nurse/Physician's Assistant, only for 'other than human' critters. Vet Med seems to try to mirror/chase human medicine, including the bureaucracy. On that note: Your cat's medical records are solely the IP of your Vet.'s clinic. Your personal info required to associate and contact/bill you is protected by privacy laws and reg's, but your cat' record and history/'facts' are fair game. Now, don't 'go ballistic' here-usually your pet is just a 'statistic' to any third party that might get/be involved. At worse case it would be: "well, I remember this one case...Fluffy the cat, where she 'coughed up' hairballs shaped like a frog...."
For example: Iams cat food is wanting to market their product.** A 'natural' place to market a high-cost, semi-tailored, and 'high-quality' cat food, would be Veterinary Clinics that had a 'high' cat traffic. At most, Iams would only find out that your cat was just another of the 485*** anonymous cats seen/treated by that clinic annually. You, nor your cat would be in any way identifiable by any third party.
Your Veterinarian most likely is just as good, if not better at this 'access for the good of the patient while guarding privacy' game as your M.D. is. They get hit with the mal-practice suit just as often, if not more than M.D.'s! Still having to pay for MP insurance, but usually on a much thinner revenue stream/profit margin.
Offtopic? ** not picking on Iams, just was familiar with their cat food in relation to 'uroliths'(think 'bladder stones' as compared to 'kidney stones') in 'fixed'(castrated) male house cats. One of my research projects that earned me an unexpected, nor seeked scholarship from them in school. At the time, they would get my recommendation without hesitation, but Proctor-Gamble bought them out in 1999, and I have heard mixed reports since then...YMMV
What I learned? Select a 'low magnesium' feed, keep the food and water bowls fresh and filled...everyday.(free choice is best for 'fixed' tomcats...male cats(most mammals really, and especially the primates, including humans) have a really 'complicated', twisted, fsck'ed up Urinary Tract) have a complex urinary tract which is prone to obstruction easily.(don't take much to clog the tubes),
Yes, you do understand the confusion here. Or at least recognize that everyone is not using the same script/page here! Perfect timing, right on target, and yes, the linked comic is funny! Well done, and thanks for the laugh!
*crosses legs, and nervously looks around for a chainsaw wielding nurse*
The information should legally belong to the patient...
Well, the way it is set up in the USA, it will either take making medical records being exempt from most IP law, or big changes in IP law to get to the point you are wanting.
Basically, you 'own' the 'facts' in your medical records, but the records themselves are the Doctor's IP. It's difficult to explain in a way that actually sounds rational or reasonable.
For example: *note: I am not an M.D., but work with me here!* Let's say I am a M.D.(general practitioner), and you come to me with a rash. I(or more likely a nurse or assistant) will 'get your history' by giving you all of those PITA questionaires, and asking you questions. All of this gets entered in a format that becomes your med records. I will then look at your 'history' before I even see you, which gives me a chance to narrow causes down some. I will then enter the exam room, and try to get more info to help diagnose your ailment. This also goes into your records.
I then refer you to a Dermatologist, as all I can figure out is that you seem to eat a lot of CheezyPoofs, and may be allergic to them. Up to this point, it seems pretty simple. You own the 'facts', but I hold the copyright/IP of your records.
Now, as far as the Dermatologist is concerned, you have no 'history' or records yet. You will have to sign some papers giving me permission to pass on a 'copy' of your 'facts'(history) to the Dermatologist you were referred to. I also have to give permission to him for access to your medical records, as they are my IP.
I can give you a copy of your records, but they are my IP, containing your facts. Legally, you can't pass them on to anyone else without getting my permission. At the same time, I can't pass out copies of your records to third parties without getting your consent, to protect your privacy/facts unless I was sneaky and slipped some waiver in the mess of paperwork you filled out and signed.(I doubt this happens often-my post is an extremely simplified version, not getting into med regs and privacy regs/laws)
Now, if I decide to retire, I will sell your records along with my patient list, notes, etc. as IP, and the office/land and equipment/furniture as real property. (Yes, I have just sold your 'facts' without your consent-legally)
Pretty wacky, isn't it? The wiki was not overly helpful here, some digging will be required for the 'full story', but here is what there is.
It would seem similar to a writer(patient) dictating a book to someone(Doctor), having that someone turn it into a manuscript for publishing. The writer may own the words used in that manuscript, but that someone legally owns the IP on the manuscript. Both would have to agree to turn it over to a third party for publishing. Writer's consent is needed mostly due to privacy laws and regs, while that someone actually owns the copyright/IP.
Not the best analogy maybe, but trying a car analogy here...*head a splodes*
I haven't had to deal with this stuff for over 15 years, so maybe someone more current and knowledgeable can chime in here.
On the surface, it doesn't seem too difficult or tricky, but it really is a big mess when you lift the lid.
You way overestimate the value of yourself and your opinion to me! There's nothing in your post important, informative, or insightful enough for me to like or dislike. Get over yourself.
...but at no point does one have to go into a CLI to install or run an application.
Yes, Linux has been like that for some years now. So what's your point?
Until the community address Linux's deficiencies, you are just another fanboy troll.
What Linux deficiencies? I, and many others are happy with Linux, and some see Windows as deficient.
So by your formula, that makes you the fanboy troll?!? That makes no sense. It made no sense when you tried that against me.
No more entertaining than watching a 'Master Craftsman' at work, which I can appreciate. While pirates may still be human beings, 'people' implies a certain willingness to accept and work within society's bounds, which pirates do not. I consider them 'targets', not 'people'.
I don't watch any TV, btw. so it would be difficult to watch too much of it.
Well, I did not know whether to go that route, or whether Fla. would flood from the increased tidal forces, got distracted hunting gators...and forgot! Gotta find the gators!
I'd always heard that predators in general tasted bad...
Not in my experience. I wish I could find the links, or remember the sources right now...
I have a buddy that is a History major-Early American. He has shown me diaries/journals from some of our early explorers/settlers, and it seemed a lot of trappers ('Mountain Men') developed a reputation for preferring Mountain Lion/Cougar meat over all others when given a choice.
Eating cat always reminded me of eating pork. I don't think I would ever confuse them, but I imagine a lot of people could be fooled.
I keep trying to avoid posting while drinking, but an obvious 'Epic Fail' this time. I reread my comment, and wondered what my own point was.
Sounds to me like you work for Greenpeace
Maybe I should infiltrate them, then turn alcoholic!
I think my point was about looking out for the dangers that can crop up from all of this patenting genomes/sequences/DNA, it could come back around to bite us in the butt.
...I first tasted free-range chicken a few years ago and will never go back to that store bought crap...
Yeah, and their eggs are as good a comparison as the meat!
And, yeah, you are correct about the open fire/spit method. Addressing this audience, the outdoors option never got out of Mom's basement! My bad!
My first thought on tasting free-range chicken was "hey, this tastes just like fire roasted rattlesnake!"
*chuckles out loud*
Thanks for sharing that, it brightened my day!
Those poor kids I went to college with never knew what to expect at one of my cookouts! But I'll have to give them credit, most tried stuff, and even became 'repeat offenders' at those events! (In Oklahoma, so I have eaten and served many a rattler!)
and am now considering a dual boot system at home so the wifey (yes beleive it or not I am married, and no I don't need to inflate her) can still boot Winblowz, and I can run off Ubuntu which I never would have thought to do without the information I garnered here.
Good luck with the dual boot. Make sure anything important is backed up first. I've never had a problem with Ubuntu trashing my XP partition when I used to dual boot, but you never know.
I am also married, and 'had' to keep XP around for her, but it was not long until I would find her on my PC with Kubuntu, playing some of the games.
You might try Kubuntu, coming from Windows. As long as you don't get the 'Alternate CD' iso, it will act as a 'Live CD' that you can boot into without installing. Gives you a chance to try different distros without the installation time/effort.
I won't say this with authority, but you might find more difference between the Gnome and KDE desktops than you will with the actual *nix 'under the hood'.
If you have any questions, or trouble, feel free to contact me. Just use my username in front of 'hotmail.com' or same in front of 'suddenlink.net', but be patient. I usually only get around to checking them once a week, unless something is going on. I may not have the answer, but if I do, then so will you. If I don't, I usually know where/how to find the answer. So far for me, here, and the specific distro forums have been the most help.
I actually was trapped by that movie! It was like being under the influence of some powerful drug...like curare. Paralyzed! Staring at the screen in horrid fascination! How could something like this ever hit film? Yet I could not look away.
There is a difference between dying in an accident and dying because your leader thinks fighting a way over oil or colonialism is a good idea.
If you are the one dying, it makes no difference. Dead is dead. Period.
Both are easily avoided if you only have factor in your own actions. Get more than one person in the same area, and both people have to want to avoid a conflict or a wreck.
Every country needs a military but youre naive if you think that most conflicts arent optional.
Of course it's optional...but only for the aggressor!
I think youre kidding yourself if you cant see this simple difference.
And you accuse me of being naive? How ironic. Hehhehe.
BTW, you can't cant a see, but you can cant a log...with a cant hook. There is a reason we use apostrophes in contractions.
If the Second Circuit rules as I believe it will, this will mark the end of these abusive litigations by the RIAA.
I had noticed that you seemed positively gleeful so far, and was going to ask you about that.
I see why now! Indeed!
After this, the RIAA will have to go to court only with proper, scientifically verifiable, legally obtained evidence showing that the person they're suing actually committed copyright infringement, and will have to have proper legal theories and pleadings.
I think having to use those tactics will confuse and confound them for some time.
Slashdot Mirror
Bricked your Wii?
I would not take bricks to my Wii. It's too painful to even contemplate!
Take bricks to your own Wii...out of my sight!
...but it was full of bugs, like lot of larries printed on the screen at the same time.
Dude! Ehww!!
You just inadvertently got caught up in a Massive Multi-player On-line Circle Jerk!
That wasn't a bug, it was a bukkake fest...online...with bad graphics...
You prevert!
We know, now.
Well, just check with the 'Ministry of Truth'...
Or, as we all know, "The cake is a lie."
Is this a good place for a 'In Sovie)(&)(*&)&%&E%
While you may have more at stake here, I agree with your overall concept, but not as vehemently as you.
What I will say is this:
ATT+marketing/advertising==up to their ears...at least that deep. Period. Really.
Any telecom, not just ATT that would deny something like this, I would automatically be suspicious of what they are saying. Sorry, but 'track records', and all that....
I would hope for public access to non-personal details...
Long, uphill fight to get there. Frankly, I don't see it happening anytime soon.
I agree with you, and your noble sounding reasons, It will be a huge IP mess. (Intellectual/Imaginary Property-not playing sides here)
The hard part is going to be tracking changes for use in malpractice cases.
While difficult, I don't see that as the 'hard' part. See above.
Medical Records in the USA are currently a can of IP worms.
Quick, easy example:
Assume I am a M.D. with my own 'office' and practice. If I retire/move on, and decide to sell my 'practice', your medical records are part of my IP I include in the sale with the rest of the property that makes up 'the practice' and 'office' I am selling. Even though I am selling your med records without your permission, it is my IP, and I can do so legally. Your IP rights on those med records only exist in privacy laws and regs, but does not extend to 'ownership' or copyright, which I own.
BTWnothing to do with the resulting setup, that's just the way it is currently. /.
I get modded down, trolled, and flamed for my stance against the concept of IP here on
This is one of many reasons why I am against it. It overly complicates what should be simple shit at the expense and detriment of the populace.
P.S. When I had classes on medical records in 1993-'94, IP solely meant Internet Protocol, but the potential problems were obvious even then when all the talk was gaining ground about how the internet would change the world. I got my A.A.S. in Veterinary Technology, and my B.S. in Biochemistry-similar to a Registered Nurse/Physician's Assistant, only for 'other than human' critters. Vet Med seems to try to mirror/chase human medicine, including the bureaucracy.
On that note:
Your cat's medical records are solely the IP of your Vet.'s clinic. Your personal info required to associate and contact/bill you is protected by privacy laws and reg's, but your cat' record and history/'facts' are fair game. Now, don't 'go ballistic' here-usually your pet is just a 'statistic' to any third party that might get/be involved.
At worse case it would be: "well, I remember this one case...Fluffy the cat, where she 'coughed up' hairballs shaped like a frog...."
For example:
Iams cat food is wanting to market their product.**
A 'natural' place to market a high-cost, semi-tailored, and 'high-quality' cat food, would be Veterinary Clinics that had a 'high' cat traffic.
At most, Iams would only find out that your cat was just another of the 485*** anonymous cats seen/treated by that clinic annually. You, nor your cat would be in any way identifiable by any third party.
Your Veterinarian most likely is just as good, if not better at this 'access for the good of the patient while guarding privacy' game as your M.D. is. They get hit with the mal-practice suit just as often, if not more than M.D.'s! Still having to pay for MP insurance, but usually on a much thinner revenue stream/profit margin.
Offtopic?
** not picking on Iams, just was familiar with their cat food in relation to 'uroliths'(think 'bladder stones' as compared to 'kidney stones') in 'fixed'(castrated) male house cats. One of my research projects that earned me an unexpected, nor seeked scholarship from them in school.
At the time, they would get my recommendation without hesitation, but Proctor-Gamble bought them out in 1999, and I have heard mixed reports since then...YMMV
What I learned? Select a 'low magnesium' feed, keep the food and water bowls fresh and filled...everyday.(free choice is best for 'fixed' tomcats...male cats(most mammals really, and especially the primates, including humans) have a really 'complicated', twisted, fsck'ed up Urinary Tract) have a complex urinary tract which is prone to obstruction easily.(don't take much to clog the tubes),
Yahoooey!
I've pre-ordered it already 'cause I heard it was built using the Railroad Tycoon game engine and Leisure Suit Larry code!
Now I can not only bill like a Doctor, but can play 'Doctor' while I do it!
Yes, you do understand the confusion here. Or at least recognize that everyone is not using the same script/page here!
Perfect timing, right on target, and yes, the linked comic is funny!
Well done, and thanks for the laugh!
*crosses legs, and nervously looks around for a chainsaw wielding nurse*
It doesn't belong to the patient. You can ask the Doctor/clinic to correct mistakes, but the Doctor actually owns the IP of your medical records.
The information should legally belong to the patient...
Well, the way it is set up in the USA, it will either take making medical records being exempt from most IP law, or big changes in IP law to get to the point you are wanting.
Basically, you 'own' the 'facts' in your medical records, but the records themselves are the Doctor's IP. It's difficult to explain in a way that actually sounds rational or reasonable.
For example: *note: I am not an M.D., but work with me here!*
Let's say I am a M.D.(general practitioner), and you come to me with a rash. I(or more likely a nurse or assistant) will 'get your history' by giving you all of those PITA questionaires, and asking you questions. All of this gets entered in a format that becomes your med records.
I will then look at your 'history' before I even see you, which gives me a chance to narrow causes down some. I will then enter the exam room, and try to get more info to help diagnose your ailment. This also goes into your records.
I then refer you to a Dermatologist, as all I can figure out is that you seem to eat a lot of CheezyPoofs, and may be allergic to them.
Up to this point, it seems pretty simple. You own the 'facts', but I hold the copyright/IP of your records.
Now, as far as the Dermatologist is concerned, you have no 'history' or records yet. You will have to sign some papers giving me permission to pass on a 'copy' of your 'facts'(history) to the Dermatologist you were referred to. I also have to give permission to him for access to your medical records, as they are my IP.
I can give you a copy of your records, but they are my IP, containing your facts. Legally, you can't pass them on to anyone else without getting my permission.
At the same time, I can't pass out copies of your records to third parties without getting your consent, to protect your privacy/facts unless I was sneaky and slipped some waiver in the mess of paperwork you filled out and signed.(I doubt this happens often-my post is an extremely simplified version, not getting into med regs and privacy regs/laws)
Now, if I decide to retire, I will sell your records along with my patient list, notes, etc. as IP, and the office/land and equipment/furniture as real property. (Yes, I have just sold your 'facts' without your consent-legally)
Pretty wacky, isn't it? The wiki was not overly helpful here, some digging will be required for the 'full story', but here is what there is.
It would seem similar to a writer(patient) dictating a book to someone(Doctor), having that someone turn it into a manuscript for publishing. The writer may own the words used in that manuscript, but that someone legally owns the IP on the manuscript. Both would have to agree to turn it over to a third party for publishing. Writer's consent is needed mostly due to privacy laws and regs, while that someone actually owns the copyright/IP.
Not the best analogy maybe, but trying a car analogy here...*head a splodes*
I haven't had to deal with this stuff for over 15 years, so maybe someone more current and knowledgeable can chime in here.
On the surface, it doesn't seem too difficult or tricky, but it really is a big mess when you lift the lid.
...you are not going to like it.
You way overestimate the value of yourself and your opinion to me! There's nothing in your post important, informative, or insightful enough for me to like or dislike.
Get over yourself.
...but at no point does one have to go into a CLI to install or run an application.
Yes, Linux has been like that for some years now. So what's your point?
Until the community address Linux's deficiencies, you are just another fanboy troll.
What Linux deficiencies?
I, and many others are happy with Linux, and some see Windows as deficient.
So by your formula, that makes you the fanboy troll?!? That makes no sense. It made no sense when you tried that against me.
Well, if it's /. hackers, then maybe some good will come of him being 'Rick-Rolled' several times a day...what 'good', I don't know.
Maybe CmdrTaco should get in the /.bunker soon....
No more entertaining than watching a 'Master Craftsman' at work, which I can appreciate. While pirates may still be human beings, 'people' implies a certain willingness to accept and work within society's bounds, which pirates do not. I consider them 'targets', not 'people'.
I don't watch any TV, btw. so it would be difficult to watch too much of it.
That should clear it up for you.
Yeah, that's why I did not include ludicrous, or 'it's gone PLAID!'
Well, I did not know whether to go that route, or whether Fla. would flood from the increased tidal forces, got distracted hunting gators...and forgot!
Gotta find the gators!
I'd always heard that predators in general tasted bad...
Not in my experience.
I wish I could find the links, or remember the sources right now...
I have a buddy that is a History major-Early American. He has shown me diaries/journals from some of our early explorers/settlers, and it seemed a lot of trappers ('Mountain Men') developed a reputation for preferring Mountain Lion/Cougar meat over all others when given a choice.
Eating cat always reminded me of eating pork. I don't think I would ever confuse them, but I imagine a lot of people could be fooled.
*hangs head sheepishly*
I keep trying to avoid posting while drinking, but an obvious 'Epic Fail' this time. I reread my comment, and wondered what my own point was.
Sounds to me like you work for Greenpeace
Maybe I should infiltrate them, then turn alcoholic!
I think my point was about looking out for the dangers that can crop up from all of this patenting genomes/sequences/DNA, it could come back around to bite us in the butt.
...I first tasted free-range chicken a few years ago and will never go back to that store bought crap...
Yeah, and their eggs are as good a comparison as the meat!
And, yeah, you are correct about the open fire/spit method.
Addressing this audience, the outdoors option never got out of Mom's basement! My bad!
My first thought on tasting free-range chicken was "hey, this tastes just like fire roasted rattlesnake!"
*chuckles out loud*
Thanks for sharing that, it brightened my day!
Those poor kids I went to college with never knew what to expect at one of my cookouts! But I'll have to give them credit, most tried stuff, and even became 'repeat offenders' at those events! (In Oklahoma, so I have eaten and served many a rattler!)
Ah! I did misunderstand. My sincere apologies!
and am now considering a dual boot system at home so the wifey (yes beleive it or not I am married, and no I don't need to inflate her) can still boot Winblowz, and I can run off Ubuntu which I never would have thought to do without the information I garnered here.
Good luck with the dual boot.
Make sure anything important is backed up first. I've never had a problem with Ubuntu trashing my XP partition when I used to dual boot, but you never know.
I am also married, and 'had' to keep XP around for her, but it was not long until I would find her on my PC with Kubuntu, playing some of the games.
You might try Kubuntu, coming from Windows. As long as you don't get the 'Alternate CD' iso, it will act as a 'Live CD' that you can boot into without installing. Gives you a chance to try different distros without the installation time/effort.
I won't say this with authority, but you might find more difference between the Gnome and KDE desktops than you will with the actual *nix 'under the hood'.
If you have any questions, or trouble, feel free to contact me. Just use my username in front of 'hotmail.com' or same in front of 'suddenlink.net', but be patient. I usually only get around to checking them once a week, unless something is going on.
I may not have the answer, but if I do, then so will you. If I don't, I usually know where/how to find the answer. So far for me, here, and the specific distro forums have been the most help.
Thanks, I had forgotten about the Little Rock Nine.
Though reading that, I had never realised that it ended up becoming a federal matter.
Same here, and noticed from your link they were awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor. Not a frequently given award to civilians!
LOL!
I apologize, as you are correct.
I actually was trapped by that movie! It was like being under the influence of some powerful drug...like curare. Paralyzed! Staring at the screen in horrid fascination! How could something like this ever hit film? Yet I could not look away.
Damn! I guess its nightmares again tonight!
Again, sorry. No harm was intended.
LOL!
Your point is made, and taken!
Some things have changed, and some haven't the past thirty-some years.
Good luck by the way.
There is a difference between dying in an accident and dying because your leader thinks fighting a way over oil or colonialism is a good idea.
If you are the one dying, it makes no difference. Dead is dead. Period.
Both are easily avoided if you only have factor in your own actions. Get more than one person in the same area, and both people have to want to avoid a conflict or a wreck.
Every country needs a military but youre naive if you think that most conflicts arent optional.
Of course it's optional...but only for the aggressor!
I think youre kidding yourself if you cant see this simple difference.
And you accuse me of being naive? How ironic. Hehhehe.
BTW, you can't cant a see, but you can cant a log...with a cant hook.
There is a reason we use apostrophes in contractions.
...all those nubile, hot young physics groupies...
Scientist: "Hah! well mine is 100 nanometers!, and can go on for up to 18 microseconds"
All those nubile, hot young physics groupies: "Ohhhh my! That is so large! And lasts so long!"
Scientist: "Now who's your Daddy?"
All those nubile, hot young physics groupies: *squeals of delight, desire, adulation, and one porcine*
LOL!!!
Well played, AC.
Okay Mr. Biden, don't you have a ribbon cutting or something to do. We know you're jealous you didn't get your own NSA hacked Blackberry!
If the Second Circuit rules as I believe it will, this will mark the end of these abusive litigations by the RIAA.
I had noticed that you seemed positively gleeful so far, and was going to ask you about that.
I see why now! Indeed!
I think having to use those tactics will confuse and confound them for some time.
I am hoping for this positive outcome.