The Greatest Generation was immensely proud that only the Bad Guys spied on their citizens. Communists, Nazis, and their filthy ilk.
All nations with police or intelligence agencies conduct surveillance on some part of their population. The thing that made the Communists, Nazis, and Fascists bad was that it wasn't for ordinary crime but for political control and to destroy the opposition to their one party rule. Both the Communists (in many nations) and the Nazis engaged in mass slaughter of innocent people. The US isn't doing that.
The main reason that the surviving members of that group haven't risen up and championed Snowden is that they cannot really believe that their shining ideal has become so tarnished.
Or maybe they have a better understanding of what genuine oppression looks like, having seen the concentration camps themselves.
Havana is also stuck in the past. Cubans themselves call it a time machine. It’s largely unchanged by modern high-tech civilization—what Alvin Toffler calls the Third Wave in his landmark book of the same name. Hardly anyone has a computer, the Internet is banned in private homes, email addresses are for foreigners, cell phones are for the elite, no one can order anything from Amazon.com, and so on. Havana is firmly stuck in the Second Wave, the industrial mass society era of the assembly line, centralized bureaucracy, and the Cold War.
If you were a Cuban you would not have the chance because your first obstacle would be the Cuban government. The internet hardly touches the life of the Cuban people to begin with, let alone meat or cars.
There were clearly some differences. Until his "departure" Mr. Philby (OBE (withdrawn), Order of Lenin, Order of the Red Banner, Red Cross of Military Merit) had a much longer and far more successful government career, was much better educated, was actually married, decorated by both the Queen and Generalissimo Franco, and left via a different airport. It isn't clear if they live in the same suburb of Moscow.
To which country are you referring? If it is the one of my wild guess then I would say you may be the victim of faulty education or indoctrination. You may want to sign up for some courses from a more neutral source if you can.
North Korea is technically at war with the US, South Korea, and the UN armed forces. It is involved with counterfeiting on a global scale, illegal arms trade, drug trade, and supports terrorism. That is on top of diverting food aid sent to help its starving peasants to the North Korean military. Three generations of a dissenter's family get sent to prison camps where they are likely to die. They are used in experiments.
If you can't figure out the difference between North Korea and the US then your meter is broken.
No, what the US is signifying by banning students from Syria, Sudan, Iran and Cuba is that it doesn't want to assist those regimes.
Why do you think that banning 4 out of 200 countries tells the other 195 countries that they need not apply? You seem to be over-generalizing.
I also doubt that there is any real loss of businesses from the US due to this, but kudos for dragging Snowden into it. I am left wondering if you might be off your game today since you didn't work in a condemnation of the NSA as well.
I prefer the Waldorf Insult Salad Shooter less lethal weapon since it's multi-threat. (Plus I like gadgets.) The first volley is tasty salads to distract and calm demonstrators with tasty greens and tangy dressings. If that doesn't work it rapid fires insults until their inner child is bruised enough that they leave. It also has a final emergency mode in which it directly sprays the vinegar and oil dressing. It makes the ground too slick to walk on and man does that vinegar sting!
I might suggest the same. You are pointing to the work of an advisory board, and that is their only power. They are advisors, not "deciders." You should also note that the decision was split.
The PCLOB (or Pee-Klob as it's pronounced in official Washington, D.C.) is an advisory commission that has no actual power. What this means is that while it can offer advice to the president, that's all it can do. The president doesn't have to pay any attention to that advice. In some cases, such a commission can be used by the president as a reason to take action, but that's not what's happening here.
When it comes time to defend Snowden everyone claims that there are other people taking documents, and if he didn't "blow the whistle," then someone else would, so nothing should be done to him, and it would have happened anyway. When it comes time for a conspiracy theory to denigrate the NSA everyone claims the most enormous conspiracy contrary to the law and values of the country would be possible and nobody would come forward to blow the whistle. Both of those positions can't really be true simultaneously, and they are in fact almost certainly essentially backwards.
Well, 9/11 is long past us, and the 9/11 "truthers" have mostly left or gone silent,* we are now in the age of the "NSA truther." Is that "progress" or what?
Get ready for the dirt to be spilled on Darrell Issa, Ted Poe, Paul Broun, Doug Collins, Walter Jones and Alan Grayson. What's the over/under on child porn?
No, it won't be them. The "dirt," for anyone paying attention, belongs to Wyden.
It is no different than any other law - something illegal is illegal until the law is changed, or you follow proper lawful procedures. There are procedures to lawfully reveal classified information, Snowden didn't follow them.
So far no court case has ended with a decision finding the NSA's programs illegal. If you want to claim anything is unconstitutional you've got a number of hurdles besides that. You have to deal with legal precedent as well as Article II powers recognized by the courts.
You'll have to forgive him, some people forget that the only allowable posts are those kissing Snowden's ass for betraying his country before the bill comes due. It's possible that once it does come due you may not feel like it either.
As is the custom of many on Slashdot, you have it backwards.
Snowden has had no trial, only charges filed, even though he basically admits to breaking the law and damaging US national security.
The US government has been to court on repeated occasions and the laws and policies in question have passed muster at final judgment.
These views are, of course, unpopular and will remain so unless or until a wave a unstoppable suicide bombings strikes Western Europe and some select American cities. Then a few people might have an inkling that explaining how the surveillance system works is a bad idea since that suggests how it can be avoided. Do you ever take the bus or plane? Go to a stadium? The future awaits.
Then, and only then, should Snowden be considered for prosecution.
Then we can cut straight to the prosecution of Snowden.
The NSA programs haven't been demonstrated to violate the law, quite the reverse. As far as we have seen they have been authorized by law and passed muster with the courts, at least those issuing a final judgment. After investigations the allegations of "torture" haven't born out. The approved methods were lawful when they were performed. The views of activists aren't legal opinions or judgments.
Slashdot Mirror
Probably not, I seem to be passing the Turing test. ;)
You do seem comfortable with your opinions.
Individual Cubans may be fine people, that doesn't change the nature of their totalitarian government. Or do you have a different theory?
More like the Joker than Batman.
The Greatest Generation was immensely proud that only the Bad Guys spied on their citizens. Communists, Nazis, and their filthy ilk.
All nations with police or intelligence agencies conduct surveillance on some part of their population. The thing that made the Communists, Nazis, and Fascists bad was that it wasn't for ordinary crime but for political control and to destroy the opposition to their one party rule. Both the Communists (in many nations) and the Nazis engaged in mass slaughter of innocent people. The US isn't doing that.
The main reason that the surviving members of that group haven't risen up and championed Snowden is that they cannot really believe that their shining ideal has become so tarnished.
Or maybe they have a better understanding of what genuine oppression looks like, having seen the concentration camps themselves.
Cold Fjord, is that you?
Actually no, it wasn't.
In the formative days of our former democracy...
FTFY...
The US is still a democratic republic. The lower house of the legislature is scheduled for elections this year.
From the second link:
Havana is also stuck in the past. Cubans themselves call it a time machine. It’s largely unchanged by modern high-tech civilization—what Alvin Toffler calls the Third Wave in his landmark book of the same name. Hardly anyone has a computer, the Internet is banned in private homes, email addresses are for foreigners, cell phones are for the elite, no one can order anything from Amazon.com, and so on. Havana is firmly stuck in the Second Wave, the industrial mass society era of the assembly line, centralized bureaucracy, and the Cold War.
If you were a Cuban you would not have the chance because your first obstacle would be the Cuban government. The internet hardly touches the life of the Cuban people to begin with, let alone meat or cars.
The Lost World, Part I
The Lost World, Part II
There were clearly some differences. Until his "departure" Mr. Philby (OBE (withdrawn), Order of Lenin, Order of the Red Banner, Red Cross of Military Merit) had a much longer and far more successful government career, was much better educated, was actually married, decorated by both the Queen and Generalissimo Franco, and left via a different airport. It isn't clear if they live in the same suburb of Moscow.
To which country are you referring? If it is the one of my wild guess then I would say you may be the victim of faulty education or indoctrination. You may want to sign up for some courses from a more neutral source if you can.
Apparently you've never heard of Kim Philby, and yes, you don't get it.
North Korea is technically at war with the US, South Korea, and the UN armed forces. It is involved with counterfeiting on a global scale, illegal arms trade, drug trade, and supports terrorism. That is on top of diverting food aid sent to help its starving peasants to the North Korean military. Three generations of a dissenter's family get sent to prison camps where they are likely to die. They are used in experiments.
If you can't figure out the difference between North Korea and the US then your meter is broken.
U.S. Aircraft Carrier Leaving Disaster Zone After Tsunami
After reading about it for so many years now we finally get to see a demonstration of the 1,000 squirrels versus 1 ox in a demonstration. Pull!
No, what the US is signifying by banning students from Syria, Sudan, Iran and Cuba is that it doesn't want to assist those regimes.
Why do you think that banning 4 out of 200 countries tells the other 195 countries that they need not apply? You seem to be over-generalizing.
I also doubt that there is any real loss of businesses from the US due to this, but kudos for dragging Snowden into it. I am left wondering if you might be off your game today since you didn't work in a condemnation of the NSA as well.
I prefer the Waldorf Insult Salad Shooter less lethal weapon since it's multi-threat. (Plus I like gadgets.) The first volley is tasty salads to distract and calm demonstrators with tasty greens and tangy dressings. If that doesn't work it rapid fires insults until their inner child is bruised enough that they leave. It also has a final emergency mode in which it directly sprays the vinegar and oil dressing. It makes the ground too slick to walk on and man does that vinegar sting!
I might suggest the same. You are pointing to the work of an advisory board, and that is their only power. They are advisors, not "deciders." You should also note that the decision was split.
Advisory Board Report Won't Alter NSA Operations Despite Hype
The PCLOB (or Pee-Klob as it's pronounced in official Washington, D.C.) is an advisory commission that has no actual power. What this means is that while it can offer advice to the president, that's all it can do. The president doesn't have to pay any attention to that advice. In some cases, such a commission can be used by the president as a reason to take action, but that's not what's happening here.
No, Snowden is at best a leaker, he could be worse.
Which "malfeasance" are you referring to? I haven't heard of them doing anything illegal (even if some might tend to make you uncomfortable).
I don't think there is any doubt. He is on the Intelligence committee.
When it comes time to defend Snowden everyone claims that there are other people taking documents, and if he didn't "blow the whistle," then someone else would, so nothing should be done to him, and it would have happened anyway. When it comes time for a conspiracy theory to denigrate the NSA everyone claims the most enormous conspiracy contrary to the law and values of the country would be possible and nobody would come forward to blow the whistle. Both of those positions can't really be true simultaneously, and they are in fact almost certainly essentially backwards.
Well, 9/11 is long past us, and the 9/11 "truthers" have mostly left or gone silent,* we are now in the age of the "NSA truther." Is that "progress" or what?
*Except you, and you know who you are.
Get ready for the dirt to be spilled on Darrell Issa, Ted Poe, Paul Broun, Doug Collins, Walter Jones and Alan Grayson. What's the over/under on child porn?
No, it won't be them. The "dirt," for anyone paying attention, belongs to Wyden.
It is no different than any other law - something illegal is illegal until the law is changed, or you follow proper lawful procedures. There are procedures to lawfully reveal classified information, Snowden didn't follow them.
So far no court case has ended with a decision finding the NSA's programs illegal. If you want to claim anything is unconstitutional you've got a number of hurdles besides that. You have to deal with legal precedent as well as Article II powers recognized by the courts.
You'll have to forgive him, some people forget that the only allowable posts are those kissing Snowden's ass for betraying his country before the bill comes due. It's possible that once it does come due you may not feel like it either.
As is the custom of many on Slashdot, you have it backwards.
Snowden has had no trial, only charges filed, even though he basically admits to breaking the law and damaging US national security.
The US government has been to court on repeated occasions and the laws and policies in question have passed muster at final judgment.
These views are, of course, unpopular and will remain so unless or until a wave a unstoppable suicide bombings strikes Western Europe and some select American cities. Then a few people might have an inkling that explaining how the surveillance system works is a bad idea since that suggests how it can be avoided. Do you ever take the bus or plane? Go to a stadium? The future awaits.
The US doesn't recognize the ICC. One of the reasons is the prospect of political prosecutions of the sort you suggest.
Then, and only then, should Snowden be considered for prosecution.
Then we can cut straight to the prosecution of Snowden.
The NSA programs haven't been demonstrated to violate the law, quite the reverse. As far as we have seen they have been authorized by law and passed muster with the courts, at least those issuing a final judgment. After investigations the allegations of "torture" haven't born out. The approved methods were lawful when they were performed. The views of activists aren't legal opinions or judgments.