As innovative as a browser based word app may be, to restrict its use to only about 11% of internet users is shooting itself in the foot.
I use Opera myself, and there should really be no reason it wouldn't (couldn't) work in Opera. If this is going to be sucessful it will HAVE to work in IE, otherwise hardly anyone will take notice outside the sort of people who read slashdot.
with the NSA spying on Americans without a warrant...would you feel the same if the president in charge was Hillary Clinton? Even if you really get warm fuzzies thinking that Bush is only doing his best to protect us in a war, the War on Terrorism® will NOT be over at the end of his term. With the approval ratings looking as they are, it seems very possible that a Democrat will be in the White House again in 2008- will you want them to have this same power? Do you trust them to use it as judiciously as you trust Bush to?
Remember, precedents stick around much longer than presidents
You're exactly right, and that's why something like Adblock cannot ever become mainstream. The majority of websites exist in their free to browse form because of ads, and if blocking them became the standard, those free to view sites wouldn't be able to pay hosting or bandwith costs and would go away. If you must block ads, go ahead, but try to keep the spread of the practice to a minimum- it could mean much worse things than FF users being blocked from certian sites.
This is an interesting topic because I am actually playing Civ 3 right now (the balencer mod- it's like a new game!).
I am always frustrated by the AI players. If you don't constantly give them things, they hate you. Yet they NEVER offer to give you things or even accept a fair trade (world map for world map for example). And they never ask what they can trade for a resource, tech or luxury- they demand it or declare war on you instead. I can understand how all civs being willing to bend over to keep the peace would be boring, but shuoldn't some of the civs act more civilized?
Also, since I am playing a mod right now, will moding be as easy in Civ 4?
Wow, I thought everyone on Slashdot hated monopolies and loved anything free (wheither as in beer or as in speech).
Opera is better than IE, you're right about that. In many ways it's better than Firefox (and Firefox copied many of it's features from Opera).
Now, before you fan boys start slobbering all over your keyboards, try Opera out. Check out how quickly you can go between pages in your history. Using Opera right now, I can use a tightly integrated mouse gesture (which I didn't have to find, download, restart my browser, test and if I didn't like it do it over again) to go bach to the last page and then back forward and what I am typing will still be here. Try that in Firefox.
When a new version comes out, everything still works- I don't have to go re-install a ton of extensions to get it how I like it. The new trashcan is awesome- if I close a tab, I can re-open it at any time (as long as I didn't quit the application) and not only will it reopen instantly, but it retains it's history.
That being said, there are lots of cool things about Firefox that Opera doesn't allow. Many of the extensions are very specific to things people do online, and it would not make sense to integrate that into a browser like Opera since most people wouldn't use them. There are times in the day I will use both- Opera for general browsing and FF for specific things I do.
It's amazingly asinine of you to say that you'd have to worry about your standards compliant code not working on various browsers. Have you seen the acid2 page in Opera vs. Firefox vs. IE recently? IE blows ass on it, but Opera and Firefox are pretty damn close, with Opera just barely better (thought neither is perfect). If you write standards compliant code and a browser can't support it, then who is at fault?
You said it yourself- market forces will correct it. People are, for the most part pretty ignorant about what a browser is, but it is steadily improving, and a company like Opera ASA making a move like this will actually help educate people. Opera ASA is still a for profit company who is making a profit in spite of giving away it's browser. It's a somewhat risky but clever move on their part. As more people try Opera and the word about the company and the quality of the software it makes gets out, more people will want to try their comercial software. Opera ASA decided to release their browser for free to build mindshare, and it seems like it's working. Now, imagine if they decided to do some real marketing - on TV to get Joe Sixpack. He would learn in 30 seconds that IE is NOT "the internet" and that he can try another browser. The Mozilla Foundation could do this as well, but I don't know if they have the cash laying around that Opera does.
BTW, for a laugh, on Win XP right click IE on the start tab and delete it. It will warn you with "Are you sure you want to delete the internet from your start menu?" Dear lord, who would ever want to delete the internet from their computer after spending so much time downloading it?!
I noticed those when I was flying from Salt Lake to Calgary once...they are fields in the desert/arid areas of the west. There is a sprinkler (like a radius of a circle) that circles around a central point creating a circular green field...mostly alfalfa and soy beans I think. Sometimes for one reason or another they don't use the entire field and make Pac-Men.
Currently most people use 3rd party apps to keep their machine virus-free, yet recent moves by Microsoft have led many to believe it is considering a non-free MS branded anti-virus application. Don't you think that if there are holes in the OS that allow viruses to get on the machine, the company should be responsible to fix them and remove any infections for free, as your product is therefore defective?
Reading this made me think of something....Bill Gates has $750 million just laying around....that's $750 million he got from people who buy what he and his company sell....so basically he is redistributing the wealth of the masses by overcharging tham buy at least $750 million.
If we wanted to give money to charity, we would...but don't overcharge us so YOU can give our money to charity and make yourself look good!
Perhaps you should consider The GIMP vs. Photoshop. The GIMP is free and works well, but the comercial version of the software is better because they have greater funding for R&D. All the makers of the GIMP can do is try and copy and keep up.
Firefox and Opera are similar. Opera creates innovations and Firefox copies them through extensions. If you want Joe Average to switch browsers AND use all these nifty new features he has never even considered from using IE, you can't expect him to go out and research several different extensions which do the same thing in diffrent ways, and possibly won't work version to version.
Opera does almost everything Firefox can do with extensions right out of the box, and it's still smaller.
I can tell my mom over the phone how to do mouse gestures in Opera, but I can't tell her where to get extensions to do the same thing, how to install them and how to keep them current nearly as easily.
If you have not tried Opera recently, go try Opera 8 beta. www.opera.com
Customize it to get rid of the clutter, skin it how you like, use the awesome mail client, even get it to read web pages to you...just give it a fair shot.
As far as the whole free beer thing....why can't anyone sell software? I don't understand the position many of you on this board take that all software should be free. Why do you think people make software? Most do it expecting to be paid for their work.
If a company like Opera ASA makes a really good product (which they do) and they use open data standards, why does it hurt your feelings so much if the source is closed? There has to be a model for commercial software for innovation to continue.
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As innovative as a browser based word app may be, to restrict its use to only about 11% of internet users is shooting itself in the foot.
I use Opera myself, and there should really be no reason it wouldn't (couldn't) work in Opera. If this is going to be sucessful it will HAVE to work in IE, otherwise hardly anyone will take notice outside the sort of people who read slashdot.
with the NSA spying on Americans without a warrant...would you feel the same if the president in charge was Hillary Clinton? Even if you really get warm fuzzies thinking that Bush is only doing his best to protect us in a war, the War on Terrorism® will NOT be over at the end of his term. With the approval ratings looking as they are, it seems very possible that a Democrat will be in the White House again in 2008- will you want them to have this same power? Do you trust them to use it as judiciously as you trust Bush to? Remember, precedents stick around much longer than presidents
can I get her phone number??
Would .gay block lesbian sites too then? 'Cause if so I'm not interested in blocking that TLD...
The only reason we'd cut the cable is because you guys can't spell fiber correctly.
You're exactly right, and that's why something like Adblock cannot ever become mainstream. The majority of websites exist in their free to browse form because of ads, and if blocking them became the standard, those free to view sites wouldn't be able to pay hosting or bandwith costs and would go away. If you must block ads, go ahead, but try to keep the spread of the practice to a minimum- it could mean much worse things than FF users being blocked from certian sites.
This is an interesting topic because I am actually playing Civ 3 right now (the balencer mod- it's like a new game!).
I am always frustrated by the AI players. If you don't constantly give them things, they hate you. Yet they NEVER offer to give you things or even accept a fair trade (world map for world map for example). And they never ask what they can trade for a resource, tech or luxury- they demand it or declare war on you instead. I can understand how all civs being willing to bend over to keep the peace would be boring, but shuoldn't some of the civs act more civilized?
Also, since I am playing a mod right now, will moding be as easy in Civ 4?
Wow, I thought everyone on Slashdot hated monopolies and loved anything free (wheither as in beer or as in speech).
Opera is better than IE, you're right about that. In many ways it's better than Firefox (and Firefox copied many of it's features from Opera).
Now, before you fan boys start slobbering all over your keyboards, try Opera out. Check out how quickly you can go between pages in your history. Using Opera right now, I can use a tightly integrated mouse gesture (which I didn't have to find, download, restart my browser, test and if I didn't like it do it over again) to go bach to the last page and then back forward and what I am typing will still be here. Try that in Firefox.
When a new version comes out, everything still works- I don't have to go re-install a ton of extensions to get it how I like it. The new trashcan is awesome- if I close a tab, I can re-open it at any time (as long as I didn't quit the application) and not only will it reopen instantly, but it retains it's history.
That being said, there are lots of cool things about Firefox that Opera doesn't allow. Many of the extensions are very specific to things people do online, and it would not make sense to integrate that into a browser like Opera since most people wouldn't use them. There are times in the day I will use both- Opera for general browsing and FF for specific things I do.
It's amazingly asinine of you to say that you'd have to worry about your standards compliant code not working on various browsers. Have you seen the acid2 page in Opera vs. Firefox vs. IE recently? IE blows ass on it, but Opera and Firefox are pretty damn close, with Opera just barely better (thought neither is perfect). If you write standards compliant code and a browser can't support it, then who is at fault?
You said it yourself- market forces will correct it. People are, for the most part pretty ignorant about what a browser is, but it is steadily improving, and a company like Opera ASA making a move like this will actually help educate people. Opera ASA is still a for profit company who is making a profit in spite of giving away it's browser. It's a somewhat risky but clever move on their part. As more people try Opera and the word about the company and the quality of the software it makes gets out, more people will want to try their comercial software. Opera ASA decided to release their browser for free to build mindshare, and it seems like it's working. Now, imagine if they decided to do some real marketing - on TV to get Joe Sixpack. He would learn in 30 seconds that IE is NOT "the internet" and that he can try another browser. The Mozilla Foundation could do this as well, but I don't know if they have the cash laying around that Opera does.
BTW, for a laugh, on Win XP right click IE on the start tab and delete it. It will warn you with "Are you sure you want to delete the internet from your start menu?" Dear lord, who would ever want to delete the internet from their computer after spending so much time downloading it?!
I noticed those when I was flying from Salt Lake to Calgary once...they are fields in the desert/arid areas of the west. There is a sprinkler (like a radius of a circle) that circles around a central point creating a circular green field...mostly alfalfa and soy beans I think. Sometimes for one reason or another they don't use the entire field and make Pac-Men.
Currently most people use 3rd party apps to keep their machine virus-free, yet recent moves by Microsoft have led many to believe it is considering a non-free MS branded anti-virus application. Don't you think that if there are holes in the OS that allow viruses to get on the machine, the company should be responsible to fix them and remove any infections for free, as your product is therefore defective?
I'm kinda jealous of you- I think it would be interesting to be able to watch them all for the first time in order (number wise, not production-wise).
Reading this made me think of something....Bill Gates has $750 million just laying around....that's $750 million he got from people who buy what he and his company sell....so basically he is redistributing the wealth of the masses by overcharging tham buy at least $750 million. If we wanted to give money to charity, we would...but don't overcharge us so YOU can give our money to charity and make yourself look good!
Perhaps you should consider The GIMP vs. Photoshop. The GIMP is free and works well, but the comercial version of the software is better because they have greater funding for R&D. All the makers of the GIMP can do is try and copy and keep up. Firefox and Opera are similar. Opera creates innovations and Firefox copies them through extensions. If you want Joe Average to switch browsers AND use all these nifty new features he has never even considered from using IE, you can't expect him to go out and research several different extensions which do the same thing in diffrent ways, and possibly won't work version to version. Opera does almost everything Firefox can do with extensions right out of the box, and it's still smaller. I can tell my mom over the phone how to do mouse gestures in Opera, but I can't tell her where to get extensions to do the same thing, how to install them and how to keep them current nearly as easily. If you have not tried Opera recently, go try Opera 8 beta. www.opera.com Customize it to get rid of the clutter, skin it how you like, use the awesome mail client, even get it to read web pages to you...just give it a fair shot. As far as the whole free beer thing....why can't anyone sell software? I don't understand the position many of you on this board take that all software should be free. Why do you think people make software? Most do it expecting to be paid for their work. If a company like Opera ASA makes a really good product (which they do) and they use open data standards, why does it hurt your feelings so much if the source is closed? There has to be a model for commercial software for innovation to continue.