IIS isn't the lowest common denominator. Apache has around 59% installed user base and it IS still "safer".
IIS is attacked because:
1. Problematic design decisions.
2. No code peer review.
3. "Admins" who think running a public service (web server) in a hostile enviorment (the internet) should be something easy done through a GUI...
How do you write: "sleep 50 && killall pppd" using a GUI?
This has nothing to do with Dev tools. a CLI presents a verbal language interface, something like English, Hebrew or French, just specilized. A GUI present a visual language interface like... well, cave drawings.
Sure, cave drawings are easy to understand, and if Corporate America (think Disney) will have it's way that's what we'd be left with, but I don't know any good poetry written in cave drawing language, verbal language do have a few none the less.
You may think that programming is nothing like potery, but if that's what you think, you've missed some very subtle thing about programming.
A natural language can be an encryption scheme as was proven quite wonderfulyl then non other
but the American goverment itself which used teh Indian Navaho (spell?) language in WW2
as an encryption scheme to keep their secret from the Axis countries...
When LINE is ready for prime time, it will mean
having a single executable enviorment that runs
unmodfied on BSD, Linux and Windows.
This is an alternative API which is truly cross
platform - binary compatiable for x86 and compile
compatiable with almost everything else.(S/390 anyone?)
This could mean that the Linux API may become
the France Lingua of virtual machines.
A true "write once, run anywhere" the way JAVA
and.NET wants to be.
Of course, there are many problems to overcome (GUI - X is not a normal part of Win* installs)
but if they are solved we may do unto Windows
what it once did to OS/2 - since OS/2 ran Windows
apps, none wrote for OS/2.
LINE is one cool hack for the hackers that wrote it, but one huge leap for Wolrd Domination;-)
"Computer games don't affect kids.
I mean if Pacman affected our generation as kids, we'd all run around in a
darkened room munching pills and listening
to repetitive music."
There is a big difference between trying to get the law to send someone to jail or pay fines because of posting of tools you don't approve of (like the MPAA) and volunterily saying: "I will not communicate with you, you support SPAM" like MAPS are doing.
Anyone who can't see the difference needs to host a DeCSS mirror for a couple of months (I have;-)
The ArmageddonCon sci-fi con will be held as planned, on the mount of Meggido, Israel, at 29, Dec 2000 - 1 Jan 2001 as planned. Check out www.armageddoncon.org for details!
;-)
Hi Steve,
Sounds like a wonderful idea, but aren't you forgetting that the first
SYN/ACK we send might get lost and we never send it again - since we
don't know nothing about it?
This will mean that every connection where the SYN/ACK is lost will
fail. I have no idea what's the chance to this happening, but it does
sound like you are disobeying TCP standard here a little.
Still cool though;-)
Regards,
Gilad Ben-Yossef
http://benyossef.com
there's much more to that then you think: AOL is stills tuck with a proprietry format. To replace that with HTML maens giving away their business to M$ madnass (who control the browser). Building AOL6 on top of Mozilla is the only way to be able to go HTML and not surrender to M$ PLUS its cross platform so that "AOL everywhere" sloagn is finally possible...
And think about THIS: AOL browser has a 30% share in teh browser scene. Right now AOL browser == IE. What happens when they shift? THose who think the browser war is over dont know nothing : THIS is the reason AOL bought Netscape to begin with.
Currently AOL client is a big pile of bloat using some proporitery format that even AOL doesn't like. A wild bet: AOL bought Netscape and keeps Mozilla so it can have a nice platform to built their next client on, free from Microsoft grip, standart based and cross platform for those web pads that are popping left and right (remember "AOL Everywhere"? Just wait untill Mozilla hits release and you will hear AOL announce a new AOL 6.0 completly rewritten based on Mozilla & its XUL/XPCOM interfaces. Considering that AOL are the biggest ISP in the world, this is going to topple that balance of power in the browser wars. God, I like my field of work... never a dull moment;-)
The point here is NOT any bugs in the code but the famous Microsoft "ease of use" and "low TCO through hiring less experienced admins". In MS world you can get an ecommerce site and never understand (some aspects of) what your doing. Now, the same IS true for any other OS/Software as well, including, say Linux+Apache BUT (and it's a big but) we don't advertise that as a feature! A lot of PHB are falling (or used to) this trap -"I'll get MS products and then I can save on the staff I need because MS products are simple." Guess what? the article describes the result. You need to know what're you doing or you're going to screw it, so all that "ease of use" and "lower TCO" are a phantom (menace?;-) when it comes to (semi) big servers - you're better off getting a UNIX system that need an experienced admin, but at least has less chance of leaving your customers credit cards open to anyone on the Net...
Remote graphics display, ability to mount drives at chosen mount points, a built in SU utility...
Oh wait! doesn't Unix family OS have these for years?
Oh OK! so W2K isn't a "warmed over NT4SP6". It's a warmed over Unix;-)
Now seriously, if you you STILL have to run a GUI and IE5.x on your "Advanced Server" - then although they learned SOME things they haven't gotten IT yet (pun intended).
JERUSALEM CITY, ISRAEL - November 1, 1999 - The Mossad. The Mossad has announced today a surprising turn in the world of espionage: The Mossad has announced it will release the sources of the Mossad backdoor to Checkpoint's Firewall-1 and VPN-1 product together with other (yet unnamed) backdoors in other Israeli developed products under the GPL. The surprising move seems to be related to CultOfTheDeadCow releasing the source of it's BackOrifice remote management program under the GPL some time ago and to the recent initiative of the CIA to open a CIA sponsored start up for developing high tech espionage products.
The Mossad spokesperson, Zach Lohem-zedek, commented that the major reasons behind this announcement were the dwindling budget of the Mossad in the current age of peace and success the Mossad have had in the past in utilizing Open Source tools such as Linux for it's day to day work.
About the Mossad The Mossad is the Israeli counter intelligence agency (similar to the CIA in the US). It was funded in *T&^!@ by *^&&*! and 28&*Y(@!93^(. To contact the Mossad please pick up your phone and say, in a slow and calm voice: "Roger this is karma. The bat has swallowed the can, over" and hang up. You will be contacted shortly.
As someone working for said company (GTek) I am amazed how someone can spew such an ugly lie. If I was an American I would probably sue you...;-) I don't think this is the right forum to tell all the stories I know about the inside workings of Packard Bell, but I can assure you one thing Mr. Konopka, as someone who has a personal knowledge of the facts- without GTek PB was dead LONG ago. The simple fact that GTek outlived Packard Bell is a sure proof of that. An ex senior vice president at Packard Bell (Hi isaac!;-) once told me that no one is useless - in the worst case they can serve as a bad example. Packard Bell is one very good "bad example" of what happens when managment does not listen to it's customers nor it's own employees.
Packard Bell was the name of an old Amaerican company that made Radios and TV's and was all but a goner when a team of ex-Israelis took over the brand name and strated making computers. They were once the biggest in retail computers and produced not half bad machines. The rumours about "used" parts where most probably a publicity stunt by Compaq more then true incidents. Their big drop came when technical troubles in mass installing Win95 dropped the quality level of their product to sub zero degrees and the rest was a slippery slope from there on... Yes, I used to work for them (not directly). There were some good people there, but the company was a gonner long ago.
Packard Bell was the name of an old Amaerican company that made Radios and TV's and was all but a goner when a team of ex-Israelis took over the brand name and strated making computers. They were once the biggest in retail computers and produced not half bad machines. The rumours about "used" parts where most probably a publicity stunt by Compaq more then true incidents. Their big drop came when technical troubles in mass installing Win95 dropped the quality level of their product to sub zero degrees and the rest was a slippery slope from there on... Yes, I used to work for them (not directly, but it doesn't amtter). There were some good people there, but the company was a gonner long ago.
The answer is very simple - Fetcmail is SO evoloved and so well covering it's ground that there is very little one might add to this project before it over bloats (something I don't think ESR is likely to allow to happen). Therefor, the project is simply not very interesting in itslef. The linear growth we DO see is due probably to things people have been doing WITH Fetchmail rather then "IN" Fetchmail.
This has probably said before but - check out Qmail, it's use of binary hashed files and Maildir format makes its a formidable solution for HUGE mail sites. It i also VERY flexible, much better then Sendmail. Wonderful documantation.
because of the greatness of Maildir format, you an store mailboxes on NFS volumes which is a great thing for HUGE mail sites (out of disk space? get a (good but) cheap NFS file server and slap it in!
Oh, did I mentioned a hefty $$ reward for finding security holes in it that went unclaimed?;-)
I'm REALLY pleaed with it, and it currently drives a site of 300,00 users (a webmail application) and just works.
hmm... -= WARNING: COMMERCIAL PLUG =- People who need something like that might want to check out http://www.kiddonet.com. It only runs on WinBlows machine (gasp!) but all the server infrastructre is Open Source stuff (I know, i built the damn thing;-) and it's free.
Slashdot Mirror
IIS isn't the lowest common denominator. Apache has around 59% installed user base and it IS still "safer".
IIS is attacked because:
1. Problematic design decisions.
2. No code peer review.
3. "Admins" who think running a public service (web server) in a hostile enviorment (the internet) should be something easy done through a GUI...
How do you write: "sleep 50 && killall pppd" using a GUI?
This has nothing to do with Dev tools. a CLI presents a verbal language interface, something like English, Hebrew or French, just specilized. A GUI present a visual language interface like
Sure, cave drawings are easy to understand, and if Corporate America (think Disney) will have it's way that's what we'd be left with, but I don't know any good poetry written in cave drawing language, verbal language do have a few none the less.
You may think that programming is nothing like potery, but if that's what you think, you've missed some very subtle thing about programming.
A natural language can be an encryption scheme as was proven quite wonderfulyl then non other
but the American goverment itself which used teh Indian Navaho (spell?) language in WW2
as an encryption scheme to keep their secret from the Axis countries...
Gilad
When LINE is ready for prime time, it will mean
.NET wants to be.
;-)
having a single executable enviorment that runs
unmodfied on BSD, Linux and Windows.
This is an alternative API which is truly cross
platform - binary compatiable for x86 and compile
compatiable with almost everything else.(S/390 anyone?)
This could mean that the Linux API may become
the France Lingua of virtual machines.
A true "write once, run anywhere" the way JAVA
and
Of course, there are many problems to overcome (GUI - X is not a normal part of Win* installs)
but if they are solved we may do unto Windows
what it once did to OS/2 - since OS/2 ran Windows
apps, none wrote for OS/2.
LINE is one cool hack for the hackers that wrote it, but one huge leap for Wolrd Domination
Just imagine:
Bill gates and RMS walk into a boxing arena.
In the old Mad Max fashion it's "Two men enter, one men leaves":
RMS catches Bill in a recursive acrynum...
Bill tries to embrace and extend RMS...
Live video feed on Slashdot...
hehe...
"Computer games don't affect kids.
I mean if Pacman affected our generation as kids, we'd all run around in a
darkened room munching pills and listening
to repetitive music."
There is a big difference between trying to get the law to send someone to jail or pay fines because of posting of tools you don't approve of (like the MPAA) and volunterily saying: "I will not communicate with you, you support SPAM" like MAPS are doing.
;-)
Anyone who can't see the difference needs to host a DeCSS mirror for a couple of months (I have
The ArmageddonCon sci-fi con will be held as planned, on the mount of Meggido, Israel, at 29, Dec 2000 - 1 Jan 2001 as planned. Check out www.armageddoncon.org for details!
;-)
Is the real world worth it? ;-)
Hi Steve, Sounds like a wonderful idea, but aren't you forgetting that the first SYN/ACK we send might get lost and we never send it again - since we don't know nothing about it? This will mean that every connection where the SYN/ACK is lost will fail. I have no idea what's the chance to this happening, but it does sound like you are disobeying TCP standard here a little. Still cool though ;-)
Regards,
Gilad Ben-Yossef
http://benyossef.com
Compatibality done backwards.
there's much more to that then you think: AOL is stills tuck with a proprietry format. To replace that with HTML maens giving away their business to M$ madnass (who control the browser). Building AOL6 on top of Mozilla is the only way to be able to go HTML and not surrender to M$ PLUS its cross platform so that "AOL everywhere" sloagn is finally possible...
And think about THIS: AOL browser has a 30% share in teh browser scene. Right now AOL browser == IE. What happens when they shift?
THose who think the browser war is over dont know nothing : THIS is the reason AOL bought Netscape to begin with.
Currently AOL client is a big pile of bloat using some proporitery format that even AOL doesn't like. A wild bet: AOL bought Netscape and keeps Mozilla so it can have a nice platform to built their next client on, free from Microsoft grip, standart based and cross platform for those web pads that are popping left and right (remember "AOL Everywhere"? Just wait untill Mozilla hits release and you will hear AOL announce a new AOL 6.0 completly rewritten based on Mozilla & its XUL/XPCOM interfaces. ;-)
Considering that AOL are the biggest ISP in the world, this is going to topple that balance of power in the browser wars.
God, I like my field of work... never a dull moment
The point here is NOT any bugs in the code but the famous Microsoft "ease of use" and "low TCO through hiring less experienced admins". ;-) when it comes to (semi) big servers - you're better off getting a UNIX system that need an experienced admin, but at least has less chance of leaving your customers credit cards open to anyone on the Net...
In MS world you can get an ecommerce site and never understand (some aspects of) what your doing. Now, the same IS true for any other OS/Software as well, including, say Linux+Apache BUT (and it's a big but) we don't advertise that as a feature!
A lot of PHB are falling (or used to) this trap -"I'll get MS products and then I can save on the staff I need because MS products are simple."
Guess what? the article describes the result. You need to know what're you doing or you're going to screw it, so all that "ease of use" and "lower TCO" are a phantom (menace?
Strangly, I too installed W2K and was impressed:
;-)
Remote graphics display, ability to mount drives at chosen mount points, a built in SU utility...
Oh wait! doesn't Unix family OS have these for years?
Oh OK! so W2K isn't a "warmed over NT4SP6". It's a warmed over Unix
Now seriously, if you you STILL have to run a GUI and IE5.x on your "Advanced Server" - then although they learned SOME things they haven't gotten IT yet (pun intended).
Just my 2c,
JERUSALEM CITY, ISRAEL - November 1, 1999 - The Mossad.
The Mossad has announced today a surprising turn in the world of espionage: The Mossad has announced it will release the sources of the Mossad backdoor to Checkpoint's Firewall-1 and VPN-1 product together with other (yet unnamed) backdoors in other Israeli developed products under the GPL. The surprising move seems to be related to CultOfTheDeadCow releasing the source of it's BackOrifice remote management program under the GPL some time ago and to the recent initiative of the CIA to open a CIA sponsored start up for developing high tech espionage products.
The Mossad spokesperson, Zach Lohem-zedek, commented that the major reasons behind this announcement were the dwindling budget of the Mossad in the current age of peace and success the Mossad have had in the past in utilizing Open Source tools such as Linux for it's day to day work.
About the Mossad
The Mossad is the Israeli counter intelligence agency (similar to the CIA in the US). It was funded in *T&^!@ by *^&&*! and 28&*Y(@!93^(. To contact the Mossad please pick up your phone and say, in a slow and calm voice: "Roger this is karma. The bat has swallowed the can, over" and hang up. You will be contacted shortly.
(C) 1999 Mossad, Israel.
As someone working for said company (GTek) I am amazed how someone can spew such an ugly lie. If I was an American I would probably sue you... ;-) ;-) once told me that no one is useless - in the worst case they can serve as a bad example. Packard Bell is one very good "bad example" of what happens when managment does not listen to it's customers nor it's own employees.
I don't think this is the right forum to tell all the stories I know about the inside workings of Packard Bell, but I can assure you one thing Mr. Konopka, as someone who has a personal knowledge of the facts- without GTek PB was dead LONG ago. The simple fact that GTek outlived Packard Bell is a sure proof of that.
An ex senior vice president at Packard Bell (Hi isaac!
Packard Bell was the name of an old Amaerican company that made Radios and TV's and was all but a goner when a team of ex-Israelis took over the brand name and strated making computers. They were once the biggest in retail computers and produced not half bad machines. The rumours about "used" parts where most probably a publicity stunt by Compaq more then true incidents. Their big drop came when technical troubles in mass installing Win95 dropped the quality level of their product to sub zero degrees and the rest was a slippery slope from there on... Yes, I used to work for them (not directly). There were some good people there, but the company was a gonner long ago.
Packard Bell was the name of an old Amaerican company that made Radios and TV's and was all but a goner when a team of ex-Israelis took over the brand name and strated making computers. They were once the biggest in retail computers and produced not half bad machines. The rumours about "used" parts where most probably a publicity stunt by Compaq more then true incidents. Their big drop came when technical troubles in mass installing Win95 dropped the quality level of their product to sub zero degrees and the rest was a slippery slope from there on... Yes, I used to work for them (not directly, but it doesn't amtter). There were some good people there, but the company was a gonner long ago.
The answer is very simple - Fetcmail is SO evoloved and so well covering it's ground that there is very little one might add to this project before it over bloats (something I don't think ESR is likely to allow to happen). Therefor, the project is simply not very interesting in itslef.
The linear growth we DO see is due probably to things people have been doing WITH Fetchmail rather then "IN" Fetchmail.
This has probably said before but - check out Qmail, it's use of binary hashed files and Maildir format makes its a formidable solution for HUGE mail sites. It i also VERY flexible, much better then Sendmail. Wonderful documantation.
;-)
because of the greatness of Maildir format, you an store mailboxes on NFS volumes which is a great thing for HUGE mail sites (out of disk space? get a (good but) cheap NFS file server and slap it in!
Oh, did I mentioned a hefty $$ reward for finding security holes in it that went unclaimed?
I'm REALLY pleaed with it, and it currently drives a site of 300,00 users (a webmail application) and just works.
hmm... ;-) and it's free.
-= WARNING: COMMERCIAL PLUG =-
People who need something like that might want to check out http://www.kiddonet.com.
It only runs on WinBlows machine (gasp!) but all the server infrastructre is Open Source stuff (I know, i built the damn thing
Thats it! no sophisticated tripple points remeark... ;-)
Good luck!