The problem is that by allowing illegally obtained evidence, you are officially and legally endorsing criminal activity.
Who wins in a criminal vs criminal case? Would police officers be forced to fall on their own swords - ie commit criminal acts to gain evidence - on order of those above them? It also gives the thumbs up signal to vigilante justice too.
Oh, let's not also forget that it'd put the idea of court orders, seartch warrants, the right to be innocence until proven guilty (admittedly already fading), and a whole host of other rights in their graves.
There's just so much wrong with the idea of allowing illegal evidence, I'm surprised when anyone asks why it's wrong.
An ongoing archive of the internet - pfffft what do we need that for? Thank god people are allowed to try to sue such abhorrent projects into the ground.
Seriously though, there is a reasonable point here, in that they are redistributing copyrighted material without a license. It's about time people started thinking of a way to compromise between such archiving of history and the rights of the authors.
Archive.org obviously still have (or at least should) to access and store copyrighted information that is openly available. What we need is an incredidly easy to use and scalable (the net ain't small,folks) opt-in system. Such a system must: -Be worded, and legally backed up, in a way that makes it impossible to opt out later. -Be beyond reasonable doubt that such authorisation comes form the originator of the material. -have the billions of free blog/lj/etc sites have everyone sign up to it when creating their site/blog purely to shrink the work required by 1000x
But if push comes to shove, I vote for the right to archive the history of the internet over copyright any day of the week.
TO be honest you're doing this shelf a disservice anyway. It can hold much more than powerbooks, such as plates, magazines, monkeys, fish fingers, books, CDs, 750:1 scale whales, etc.
A news item about a shelf is bad enough, but failing to give it a decent multifunction review is just criminal.
Shock horror, company follows national rules when doing business in said country!!! OMG WTF!!!!111
Don't forget that what one nation as a whole believes is 'right' or 'ethical' isn't what another country will believe. Don't you find it just a little arrogant to assume that because they are different to you they are wrong?
Remember that there is no inherent right or wrong in the universe, no sense of morals, no right to freedom rights to censorship, or heck rights to anything. That's just a layer put on top of life by people. And by heck, different people... are different.
If you want to do business is China, you follow Chinese laws. If you don't agree with that, I hope you also support companies breaking local laws wherever you may live.
That's right. With all of the "Bill Gates is the devil, M$ are teh EVIL" stuff they had to do something to show themselves as being more Godly.
And any decent "All American Christian" will tell you that Gays and Lesbians are the work or Satan. MS have no choice but to be nasty to them to get you guys to like them again. THEY'RE DOING GOD'S WORK, PEOPLE!
Look, if you don't start some serious Microsoft loving soon they're going to have to take it to the next Christian Godly level to convince you all. Don't come crying to me when Microsoft start bombing Arabs to further God's work.
(For dim witted bible bashers out there, the above is what is known as "not really true")
"However, BitKeeper is not open source. If BitKeeper wishes to keep their source proprietary then it is morally wrong."
WTF???????????????????? If they put in the $ and effort to produce something why the hell should they be morally obliged to give it away? I hope you realise that you're being morally wrong by not give me the contents of your wage packet every month. That makes about as much sense...
Prices are not even remotely linked to media costs/capacity! DVDs cost LESS to make yet sell for MORE than VHS. CDs cost LESS to make yet sold for MORE than audio tape.
If they want to charge you a lot for it, they still will. You erally think the scum will say "oh, since it all fits on one disc now instead of 4 saving us $0.40, we'll only charge you $20 instead of $100?"
HAHAHAHAHA! Not likely. Saddam becoming the next Pope was a much safer bet than that. Reality is that what you'll hear from their mouths is "BluHDRayDVD is 100x better, so we'll charge you 2x as much. You win by a factor of 50, aren't we kind?"
Sort out the details Get out a new spec Prototypes Verification etc. etc. All before the impending releases of if nothing else the PS3 and XBox2, never mind the PC & TV players?
Why do I get the feeling that this is a token gesture never intended to resolve the disputes, but instead to allow them to look back later and say "well we TRIED to get a common format but everyone else was in too much of a hurry!" If they were really serious about a common format, they would have done it long before now.
"NASA is super bloated and the shuttle is the biggest waste of tax payer money!!! Ohh with all that money spent on the shuttle, we could have had 20 cures for AIDS and 42 for Cancer!"
That's an even worse waste! What were those other 60 teams thinking? PHB: "Hey, let's cure AIDS/Cancer" Bod: "Sir, that's already been done!" PHB: "STFU, we've got Space Shuttle money to spend!"
What is it with computer ners and doing things the long complicated way? If you want to tell if someone is male or female, it's much easier to do it in person than over a computer. Heck if you insist on using a computer at least give yourself a headstart and use webcams.
Anyway, isn't the idea that a good AI is indistinguishable from a female just a little bit.... sexist?
With the professional imaging market essentially BEING Photoshopm I'd expect that the camera guys would be falling over themselves to have increased support from Photoshop? Sure they might gain a few $s this way selling their own cruddy software, but look at it this way:
-Photoshop pros looking for a camera - lots.
-High end Nikon owners looing for an imaging app other than Photoshop - few.
Nikon use your brain - Photoshop IS the high end imaging market. Preventing improved Photoshop support is pretty much the same as preventing more profit.
He wants to save formatting, so copy/paste is out? Not so, the clipboard is quite capable of storing more than plain text. He wants to save formatting so remaking the file is out? Well if your new chosen software can't make it from scratch, a file conversion won't help, either!
If the user doesn't have word but was sent it? How is this any different to me recieving any file I can't open, eg an AutoCAD or Photoshop file if I don't have either?
The file was created before they switched to Linux? Plan ahead, next time, or install OO.o which does an OK job with word docs.
Considering that most OSS advocates are under the bizarre assumption that everyone can code, the macro/API solution is perfectly valid. You only need one person to do it and release it, anyway. You're saying there's not a single person out there both capable and willing to do this?
And as for MS actively stopping people from doing any of the above? Re-read the message title - bullsh*t! The Word/Excel APIs wouldn't be well documented and accessible with a pre-provided scripting language if MS were serious about hiding this stuff. Plus as has been stated, the details are available if you want to agree to their terms. If you don't, then it's your damn fault, not theirs.
Really, it's easy. If they're selling untested, unmarked parts and this is a problem, just don't buy untested, unmarked parts! Let the market sort itself out. If the market decides that the cost saving here isn't worth it, the demand for slightly cheaper untested parts will surely dry up, and the manufacturers will catch on and stop trying to sell them.
If there are enough people out there though who DO want the cost saving brought on by buying untested crap - let them! Nobody says you have to buy cheap crap if it's on the shelf. You get what you pay for. You want good quality - pay good money. You want bad quality - pay peanuts.
Basic Economics, really. And it's not as if the likes of Crucial, Corsair, Kingston etc. are doing it.
Why is this even an issue? I think it's commonly accepted wisdom EVERYWHERE that going for the lowest bidder will give you cheap rubbish. Computer components are no different.
What, you expect Microsoft to solve all of your problems for you? YOU saved it with YOUR copy of Office, it was YOUR choice to use.DOC format... I see no sane reason why Microsoft gets the blame for your choices.
It's not as if there aren't dozens of ways out, either, so you're not locked in by any stretch of the imagination. 1 - Open with word processor of choice. There are many, with varying degrees of usefulness. EASY! 2 - Export to A N Other file format in Word. EASY! 3 - Create add-in for Word to export to whatever file format you either choose or create. EASY! 4 - Copy/paste. Magic how that works, eh. EASY! 5 - Remake the file. If the contents are that important, you'll do it. EASY! 6 - Stick with Word. Well it was good enough for you last year, why notr this year? EASY! 7 Write your own app that accesses the document through MS's documented API to pull out what you need from the file and save as required. EASY!
What is it with you lot that makes you whine and cry so much that MS won't do your work for them??
Does anyone know what the drives and media for this will cost?
At the right price point this could be killer for backups and media storage. 300GB media (even if write once) for less than £10 and a drive less than £200 would have me on board right away.
Unless you want to go tape (yuck) the only home user backups systems with a decent amount of data are DVDs (currently 20+ disks for my needs. ugh) or spare HDs (more expensive and cumbersome than I'd like).
A cheap HIGH capacity near-disposable media would be a godsend.
The problem is that many goverment institucions give info or documents in propietary formats, as microsoft word.doc files or excel tables. In that case if you wan't to read that you'll need to sing an agreetment with Microsoft, even if you are gona to export it to another format 5 secs after have opened it.
What part of that is Microsoft's problem? If your issue is gov's giving out info in MS DOC format the solution is not to punish Microsoft by forcing them to erode away part of their business, but rather to discuss with those gov's a more suitable format.
Talk about using a hammer to do a screwdriver's job....
So I don't really see your point. Just because people make great efforts to accomplish something that would be trivial if MS released the specs or adhered to an open standard, doesn't mean that MS is in the right, does it?
Oh I'm sorry, I forgot that the OSS guys had some God-given right to have Micrsoft do all their work for them. Why on earth should MS have to make it easy for someone else to rip off their work? Sure OO.o are fine to go ahead and get compatability with MSOffice, but I fail to see why MS should have to go out of their way to actively help a competitor. And a competitor who have a large number of rabid supporters that want to put them out of business at that.
Grow up. You want something to work? Do the goddamn work yourself.
Slashdot Mirror
The problem is that by allowing illegally obtained evidence, you are officially and legally endorsing criminal activity.
Who wins in a criminal vs criminal case? Would police officers be forced to fall on their own swords - ie commit criminal acts to gain evidence - on order of those above them? It also gives the thumbs up signal to vigilante justice too.
Oh, let's not also forget that it'd put the idea of court orders, seartch warrants, the right to be innocence until proven guilty (admittedly already fading), and a whole host of other rights in their graves.
There's just so much wrong with the idea of allowing illegal evidence, I'm surprised when anyone asks why it's wrong.
This is a case for the archive IMO. This company is really trying to suppress incriminating evidence, not protect its IP.
Yes, but they're trying to do that by saying that they had an illegal copy, ie. 'IP infringement'.
Supressing evidence is the aim, allaged IP infringement is the weapon.
An ongoing archive of the internet - pfffft what do we need that for? Thank god people are allowed to try to sue such abhorrent projects into the ground.
Seriously though, there is a reasonable point here, in that they are redistributing copyrighted material without a license. It's about time people started thinking of a way to compromise between such archiving of history and the rights of the authors.
Archive.org obviously still have (or at least should) to access and store copyrighted information that is openly available. What we need is an incredidly easy to use and scalable (the net ain't small,folks) opt-in system. Such a system must:
-Be worded, and legally backed up, in a way that makes it impossible to opt out later.
-Be beyond reasonable doubt that such authorisation comes form the originator of the material.
-have the billions of free blog/lj/etc sites have everyone sign up to it when creating their site/blog purely to shrink the work required by 1000x
But if push comes to shove, I vote for the right to archive the history of the internet over copyright any day of the week.
Front page news on slashdot today - a shelf.
TO be honest you're doing this shelf a disservice anyway. It can hold much more than powerbooks, such as plates, magazines, monkeys, fish fingers, books, CDs, 750:1 scale whales, etc.
A news item about a shelf is bad enough, but failing to give it a decent multifunction review is just criminal.
I do of course mean having the print head OFF the cartridge is something many other makers have been doing.
Come on, they outsourced their inventing long ago.
And as others have pointed out, this isn't innovation this is just copying. Print head on cartridge was something most other makers do anyway.
Pathetic. There was a day when HP led the field in printing. Now look at what they've become.
...is Mario WPA enabled? Without decent wireless security that princess will just get stolen again. :(
I volunteer to take over. Please contact me at:
Mr Spy
123 FBI Street
Secretsville
12345
and I will arrange for you to visit me to hand over all relevant material.
Thank you.
Shock horror, company follows national rules when doing business in said country!!! OMG WTF!!!!111
Don't forget that what one nation as a whole believes is 'right' or 'ethical' isn't what another country will believe. Don't you find it just a little arrogant to assume that because they are different to you they are wrong?
Remember that there is no inherent right or wrong in the universe, no sense of morals, no right to freedom rights to censorship, or heck rights to anything. That's just a layer put on top of life by people. And by heck, different people... are different.
If you want to do business is China, you follow Chinese laws. If you don't agree with that, I hope you also support companies breaking local laws wherever you may live.
That's right. With all of the "Bill Gates is the devil, M$ are teh EVIL" stuff they had to do something to show themselves as being more Godly.
And any decent "All American Christian" will tell you that Gays and Lesbians are the work or Satan. MS have no choice but to be nasty to them to get you guys to like them again. THEY'RE DOING GOD'S WORK, PEOPLE!
Look, if you don't start some serious Microsoft loving soon they're going to have to take it to the next Christian Godly level to convince you all. Don't come crying to me when Microsoft start bombing Arabs to further God's work.
(For dim witted bible bashers out there, the above is what is known as "not really true")
"However, BitKeeper is not open source. If BitKeeper wishes to keep their source proprietary then it is morally wrong."
WTF????????????????????
If they put in the $ and effort to produce something why the hell should they be morally obliged to give it away? I hope you realise that you're being morally wrong by not give me the contents of your wage packet every month. That makes about as much sense...
Prices are not even remotely linked to media costs/capacity! DVDs cost LESS to make yet sell for MORE than VHS. CDs cost LESS to make yet sold for MORE than audio tape.
If they want to charge you a lot for it, they still will. You erally think the scum will say "oh, since it all fits on one disc now instead of 4 saving us $0.40, we'll only charge you $20 instead of $100?"
HAHAHAHAHA! Not likely. Saddam becoming the next Pope was a much safer bet than that. Reality is that what you'll hear from their mouths is "BluHDRayDVD is 100x better, so we'll charge you 2x as much. You win by a factor of 50, aren't we kind?"
So they've got to:
Sort out the details
Get out a new spec
Prototypes
Verification
etc. etc.
All before the impending releases of if nothing else the PS3 and XBox2, never mind the PC & TV players?
Why do I get the feeling that this is a token gesture never intended to resolve the disputes, but instead to allow them to look back later and say "well we TRIED to get a common format but everyone else was in too much of a hurry!" If they were really serious about a common format, they would have done it long before now.
Deceipt at it's best!
"NASA is super bloated and the shuttle is the biggest waste of tax payer money!!! Ohh with all that money spent on the shuttle, we could have had 20 cures for AIDS and 42 for Cancer!"
That's an even worse waste! What were those other 60 teams thinking?
PHB: "Hey, let's cure AIDS/Cancer"
Bod: "Sir, that's already been done!"
PHB: "STFU, we've got Space Shuttle money to spend!"
Google web search, desktop search, maps, images, videos, usenet, shopping, mail, RSS, whatever etc etc...
Maybe we should all save ourselves some time and only take note of what Google ISN'T doing.
What is it with computer ners and doing things the long complicated way? If you want to tell if someone is male or female, it's much easier to do it in person than over a computer. Heck if you insist on using a computer at least give yourself a headstart and use webcams.
Anyway, isn't the idea that a good AI is indistinguishable from a female just a little bit.... sexist?
With the professional imaging market essentially BEING Photoshopm I'd expect that the camera guys would be falling over themselves to have increased support from Photoshop? Sure they might gain a few $s this way selling their own cruddy software, but look at it this way:
-Photoshop pros looking for a camera - lots.
-High end Nikon owners looing for an imaging app other than Photoshop - few.
Nikon use your brain - Photoshop IS the high end imaging market. Preventing improved Photoshop support is pretty much the same as preventing more profit.
He wants to save formatting, so copy/paste is out? Not so, the clipboard is quite capable of storing more than plain text.
He wants to save formatting so remaking the file is out? Well if your new chosen software can't make it from scratch, a file conversion won't help, either!
If the user doesn't have word but was sent it? How is this any different to me recieving any file I can't open, eg an AutoCAD or Photoshop file if I don't have either?
The file was created before they switched to Linux? Plan ahead, next time, or install OO.o which does an OK job with word docs.
Considering that most OSS advocates are under the bizarre assumption that everyone can code, the macro/API solution is perfectly valid. You only need one person to do it and release it, anyway. You're saying there's not a single person out there both capable and willing to do this?
And as for MS actively stopping people from doing any of the above? Re-read the message title - bullsh*t! The Word/Excel APIs wouldn't be well documented and accessible with a pre-provided scripting language if MS were serious about hiding this stuff. Plus as has been stated, the details are available if you want to agree to their terms. If you don't, then it's your damn fault, not theirs.
Really, it's easy. If they're selling untested, unmarked parts and this is a problem, just don't buy untested, unmarked parts! Let the market sort itself out. If the market decides that the cost saving here isn't worth it, the demand for slightly cheaper untested parts will surely dry up, and the manufacturers will catch on and stop trying to sell them.
If there are enough people out there though who DO want the cost saving brought on by buying untested crap - let them! Nobody says you have to buy cheap crap if it's on the shelf. You get what you pay for. You want good quality - pay good money. You want bad quality - pay peanuts.
Basic Economics, really. And it's not as if the likes of Crucial, Corsair, Kingston etc. are doing it.
Why is this even an issue? I think it's commonly accepted wisdom EVERYWHERE that going for the lowest bidder will give you cheap rubbish. Computer components are no different.
What, you expect Microsoft to solve all of your problems for you? YOU saved it with YOUR copy of Office, it was YOUR choice to use .DOC format... I see no sane reason why Microsoft gets the blame for your choices.
It's not as if there aren't dozens of ways out, either, so you're not locked in by any stretch of the imagination.
1 - Open with word processor of choice. There are many, with varying degrees of usefulness. EASY!
2 - Export to A N Other file format in Word. EASY!
3 - Create add-in for Word to export to whatever file format you either choose or create. EASY!
4 - Copy/paste. Magic how that works, eh. EASY!
5 - Remake the file. If the contents are that important, you'll do it. EASY!
6 - Stick with Word. Well it was good enough for you last year, why notr this year? EASY!
7 Write your own app that accesses the document through MS's documented API to pull out what you need from the file and save as required. EASY!
What is it with you lot that makes you whine and cry so much that MS won't do your work for them??
Does anyone know what the drives and media for this will cost?
At the right price point this could be killer for backups and media storage. 300GB media (even if write once) for less than £10 and a drive less than £200 would have me on board right away.
Unless you want to go tape (yuck) the only home user backups systems with a decent amount of data are DVDs (currently 20+ disks for my needs. ugh) or spare HDs (more expensive and cumbersome than I'd like).
A cheap HIGH capacity near-disposable media would be a godsend.
The problem is that many goverment institucions give info or documents in propietary formats, as microsoft word .doc files or excel tables. In that case if you wan't to read that you'll need to sing an agreetment with Microsoft, even if you are gona to export it to another format 5 secs after have opened it.
What part of that is Microsoft's problem? If your issue is gov's giving out info in MS DOC format the solution is not to punish Microsoft by forcing them to erode away part of their business, but rather to discuss with those gov's a more suitable format.
Talk about using a hammer to do a screwdriver's job....
So I don't really see your point. Just because people make great efforts to accomplish something that would be trivial if MS released the specs or adhered to an open standard, doesn't mean that MS is in the right, does it?
Oh I'm sorry, I forgot that the OSS guys had some God-given right to have Micrsoft do all their work for them. Why on earth should MS have to make it easy for someone else to rip off their work? Sure OO.o are fine to go ahead and get compatability with MSOffice, but I fail to see why MS should have to go out of their way to actively help a competitor. And a competitor who have a large number of rabid supporters that want to put them out of business at that.
Grow up. You want something to work? Do the goddamn work yourself.
The one thumb interface is significantly better than the three finger salute.
It's not every day we get a 3x improvement in productivity!
"These things are so light and easy to attach, we would like to have several on everything that flies"
Try getting back in your hive now, bitch!