I'm a Haligonian and I have met Carol Sinclair (acquaintance of an acquaintance).
What a small world. She doesn't seem like the "hostage holding" type at all, and the local ISPs are known for their shitty customer service. Seems like quite a misunderstanding.
[Insert "so, do you know Bob/Joe/Cathy from Canada?" Jokes here]
I used to be a Telus customer. Quite possibly the worst service ever.
About three years ago I was paying $60 a month for a plan with fifty text messages (incoming = 25, outgoing = 25) and around 200 cellular minutes (incoming and outgoing combined).
The overage charges exceeded $0.50 a minute for outgoing and $0.25 for incoming (if I remember correctly).
There was no voicemail or caller ID on this plan, unless I opted to pay an extra $15 a month.
Here in Korea, my phone costs $50 a month regardless of minutes and text messaging... plus I get free, unlimited broadband internet with unlimited live TV streams (+100 channels/shows).
It's just not worth it to own a cellular phone in Canada.
On a more serious note, it doesn't make any sense whatsoever. Your analogies are absurdly flawed: seeing a painting or listening to music is equivalent to playing a game, not to the game itself. No one here (or at least very few) are claiming that playing a game is art. The game itself is art.
You misunderstood. I said:
As a whole, that's just what they are: packaged, bought and sold "worlds" or "realities" for us to play in, which can contain all sorts and varieties of artistic elements, but yet as a whole can not be considered art.
I didn't mean to imply that playing a game was art. I mean to say that the act of playing a game isn't art, nor is the game itself, nor is the act of listening to music. You can have artistic impressions of a game, but a game is not inherently art (the game itself).
What I meant to say (and sorry if this wasn't clear), is that art (music, a painting) is inherently classifiable as art where a video game is inherently not classifiable as art. While their may be artistic attributes to games, like graphics art, the plot, the background score and even the voice acting, the game as a whole is not art. The game itself is not art but there are things in it which are.
Pink Floyd's "The Wall" is wholly art. "Doom" is not.
Yes, but video games aren't static. They're different everytime you play them.
Is the act of playing Monopoly art? The game board has artistic elements, sure, but would you label the game "Monopoly" as art? No, you would call it a game. That's what video games are: games. Games can have artistic attributes or they can not, but it doesn't change the fact that they are games.
I remember reading an article written by Hideo Kojima (of MGS fame) about whether he thought video games were art, and he said no.
He essentially said that he didn't believe video games were art as they offered an open ended experience where players can immerse themselves in order to form unique experiences.
As a whole, that's just what they are: packaged, bought and sold "worlds" or "realities" for us to play in, which can contain all sorts and varieties of artistic elements, but yet as a whole can not be considered art. A player's experience rewound and played forward as a non-interactive product of the player's volition (like a film) can be art, but the act of playing a video game is not by itself art.
This is not to subtract from the idea of video games as I'm an avid video gamer myself. Video games provide us with experiences we could not or would not replicate in real life, and our interaction with these games creates an individually tailored experience which can be chalked full of artistic things, yet not artistic as a whole because it is what you make of it.
Is riding the subway to work art? No. Is seeing a painting on the wall art? The painting itself is, yes, but not the act of seeing it or your choice to go and see it. Is listening to music art? Not the act of listening, but the music itself is art... and you see my point.
Video games offer us a passage to artistic things, but are wholly not art in themselves.
Before I moved to South Korea I had the same misconception. "Oh dear, how will I tell everyone apart?"
Now, after having been immersed for more than a year, I can understand Korean complaints about not being able to tell Westerners apart. You adapt to one environment I guess and you're right in saying that there are different parameters in every culture / race for recognizing facial features.
Your brain adjusts very quickly once you're immersed in that situation. It's only Western ignorance pervading in comments like "all Asians look the same".
Trust me and refer to one of my above comments regarding this, there are no other jobs. That and students these days are so heavily indebted, as are graduates, that these are sometimes the only viable ways to make amends to one's debt.
Yes, but in areas where these call centres operate, there are no other jobs. They set up shop in the most deprived places in whichever country they operate in.
If they opened shop in an area with jobs aplenty, they wouldn't be able to find any employees. In my home city their reputation is horrible yet they are the largest employers, nearly doubling that of the second largest. I worked next to people with Master's Degrees and PhDs unable to find anything better unless they resettled.
Before I got began my current career I worked for a number of telemarketing centres. Namely, in the evenings when I was a student as they were the only places which paid more than minimum wage.
In any case, I doubt this law is going to make a lot of difference. The great bulk of these telemarketing centres are located outside of America's borders in places like Eastern Canada (where I'm from) or as far away as India.
At some centres, we were told to obey the "DNC" or Do Not Call list. At others, we were instructed by our superiors to give it no credence whatsoever. Legally, we were not allowed to call after 9:00pm at night yet it did happen off the record at every outbound call centre I've ever worked at (five).
If call centres disobey all the previous rules and obligations, what makes you think they're going to adhere to this one? Especially call centres in India where these laws have little jurisdiction?
Lastly, as much as these people irritate you, try your best not to lose your temper with them. Most of them are probably students like I was with terrible managers (the cream of the crap) and strict floor regulations that leave them tethered to their computer, sitting upright, unable to drink coffee or indulge in anything, taking calls for their entire eight hour shift with no breaks, having to sit idley while the death threats poured through the lines, having a one-minute-per-day bathroom break policy and doing it all for a paycheque a meaningless few dollars higher than a McD's salaryman.
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What a small world. She doesn't seem like the "hostage holding" type at all, and the local ISPs are known for their shitty customer service. Seems like quite a misunderstanding.
[Insert "so, do you know Bob/Joe/Cathy from Canada?" Jokes here]
Biological viruses in the batteries and Vista on the hard drive... That cocktail can only mean... Good god man! What have you done?
I used to be a Telus customer. Quite possibly the worst service ever. About three years ago I was paying $60 a month for a plan with fifty text messages (incoming = 25, outgoing = 25) and around 200 cellular minutes (incoming and outgoing combined). The overage charges exceeded $0.50 a minute for outgoing and $0.25 for incoming (if I remember correctly). There was no voicemail or caller ID on this plan, unless I opted to pay an extra $15 a month. Here in Korea, my phone costs $50 a month regardless of minutes and text messaging... plus I get free, unlimited broadband internet with unlimited live TV streams (+100 channels/shows). It's just not worth it to own a cellular phone in Canada.
You misunderstood. I said:
As a whole, that's just what they are: packaged, bought and sold "worlds" or "realities" for us to play in, which can contain all sorts and varieties of artistic elements, but yet as a whole can not be considered art.
I didn't mean to imply that playing a game was art. I mean to say that the act of playing a game isn't art, nor is the game itself, nor is the act of listening to music. You can have artistic impressions of a game, but a game is not inherently art (the game itself).
What I meant to say (and sorry if this wasn't clear), is that art (music, a painting) is inherently classifiable as art where a video game is inherently not classifiable as art. While their may be artistic attributes to games, like graphics art, the plot, the background score and even the voice acting, the game as a whole is not art. The game itself is not art but there are things in it which are.
Pink Floyd's "The Wall" is wholly art. "Doom" is not.
Yes, but video games aren't static. They're different everytime you play them. Is the act of playing Monopoly art? The game board has artistic elements, sure, but would you label the game "Monopoly" as art? No, you would call it a game. That's what video games are: games. Games can have artistic attributes or they can not, but it doesn't change the fact that they are games.
He essentially said that he didn't believe video games were art as they offered an open ended experience where players can immerse themselves in order to form unique experiences.
As a whole, that's just what they are: packaged, bought and sold "worlds" or "realities" for us to play in, which can contain all sorts and varieties of artistic elements, but yet as a whole can not be considered art. A player's experience rewound and played forward as a non-interactive product of the player's volition (like a film) can be art, but the act of playing a video game is not by itself art.
This is not to subtract from the idea of video games as I'm an avid video gamer myself. Video games provide us with experiences we could not or would not replicate in real life, and our interaction with these games creates an individually tailored experience which can be chalked full of artistic things, yet not artistic as a whole because it is what you make of it.
Is riding the subway to work art? No. Is seeing a painting on the wall art? The painting itself is, yes, but not the act of seeing it or your choice to go and see it. Is listening to music art? Not the act of listening, but the music itself is art... and you see my point.
Video games offer us a passage to artistic things, but are wholly not art in themselves.
Hope that made sense.
Before I moved to South Korea I had the same misconception. "Oh dear, how will I tell everyone apart?" Now, after having been immersed for more than a year, I can understand Korean complaints about not being able to tell Westerners apart. You adapt to one environment I guess and you're right in saying that there are different parameters in every culture / race for recognizing facial features. Your brain adjusts very quickly once you're immersed in that situation. It's only Western ignorance pervading in comments like "all Asians look the same".
This was years ago, I've moved on to much better things. It was either work in a cell centre or be over my head in debt and not have a place to live.
Trust me and refer to one of my above comments regarding this, there are no other jobs. That and students these days are so heavily indebted, as are graduates, that these are sometimes the only viable ways to make amends to one's debt.
Yes, but in areas where these call centres operate, there are no other jobs. They set up shop in the most deprived places in whichever country they operate in. If they opened shop in an area with jobs aplenty, they wouldn't be able to find any employees. In my home city their reputation is horrible yet they are the largest employers, nearly doubling that of the second largest. I worked next to people with Master's Degrees and PhDs unable to find anything better unless they resettled.
In any case, I doubt this law is going to make a lot of difference. The great bulk of these telemarketing centres are located outside of America's borders in places like Eastern Canada (where I'm from) or as far away as India.
At some centres, we were told to obey the "DNC" or Do Not Call list. At others, we were instructed by our superiors to give it no credence whatsoever. Legally, we were not allowed to call after 9:00pm at night yet it did happen off the record at every outbound call centre I've ever worked at (five).
If call centres disobey all the previous rules and obligations, what makes you think they're going to adhere to this one? Especially call centres in India where these laws have little jurisdiction?
Lastly, as much as these people irritate you, try your best not to lose your temper with them. Most of them are probably students like I was with terrible managers (the cream of the crap) and strict floor regulations that leave them tethered to their computer, sitting upright, unable to drink coffee or indulge in anything, taking calls for their entire eight hour shift with no breaks, having to sit idley while the death threats poured through the lines, having a one-minute-per-day bathroom break policy and doing it all for a paycheque a meaningless few dollars higher than a McD's salaryman.
"What are you doing down there?" "I'm making a highly complicated dohickie... do you have elbow macaroni or glue on sparkles?"