Your claim was that Apple was growing more slowly than the industry in the USA.
No it wasn't to quote myself. "No Apple has been growing slower than the industry...in fact its shrinking compared to the market. In fact even in the US Android phones are more common than iPhones."
The market is a *worldwide* market...notice the little *even* that is because I'm talking about something different:). That is the magic of English. For your benefit.
The US[and to a lesser extent the UK] is slightly different from the rest of the world which is why I separated it out, because customers pay for their phones by it being bundled into a long contract. Like a hire purchase agreement...only with the real value of the phone hidden from you. The bottom line is as you quoted "in the US Android phones are more common than iPhones" is still an empirical fact, that is because Android performs every quarter not just launch quarters:)...Do you know Android has grown faster than Apple, because it was launched later while having a larger market share. Do I have to go through all ComScore figures and do a time series analysis...or do you understand that fairly simple conclusion. If it hurts your brain think of it like cutting a pie, With Android being the big piece...and Apple being the teeny tiny piece.
You figures are not even close to being right. The link is the same as the other one I provided only its direct from IDC, but it includes a nice graph showing the various OS and how big their market share. Apple is a little confusing as its market share is feast/fast as their product launches have a huge effect on their sales. Next quarter Apple are not going to sell anything close to 48Million Phones, and their market share in that quarter will dive. Averaging out the peaks and troughs. Its not gaining market share because it is growing *the same* as the market.
The figures your looking for is the market grew 46% in 2012. Apples market share was 18.8% in 2011...and is still 18.8% in 2012 because it sold only 46% more phones...the same as what the market grew.
Its easier to see what is happing when averaging over a year. The reality is the big launch was the turning point, and everyone knew it. Its why its market share have dropped 35% since then.:)
When the conflict gets to litigation, everyone except the lawyers lose.
No! No! No! there is often a winner, sometimes a very lucrative winner, the lawyers only get a small portion of the spoils, I'm don't care if lawyers are good or bad people, but pretending mega-corperation are victims to this occupation is a not credible. The truth is Apple won big against Samsung to the tune of 1 Billion Dollars [that goes to Apple], unfortunately *money* even if its a Billion Dollars is useless to Apple...it doesn't know what to do with its $140Billion in cash it has doesn't know what to do with. It wanted a ban on Samsung products, so it products could continue without competition.
Their margins remain the highest in the industry. The smartphone industry has been growing 16% per year globally and Apple has been growing faster. In the United States Apple has crushed Android and now is approaching the point of establishing a monopoly.
How exactly is their brand being diminished?
No Apple has been growing slower than the industry...in fact its shrinking compared to the market. In fact even in the US Android phones are more common than iPhones. I personally would argue that their brand is diminished because its getting harder to justify the massive mark-ups on re-badged foxconn phones.
The geek always quotes retail list for the most expensive version of Office he can find.
Lets get a few things right. I've never been a geek, and only ever seen that word used by bullies. The price is for the version I am eligible. Just because other people are entitled to discounts in educational for Microsoft self serving reasons does not mean I am. I personally have had no problems using LibreOffice...but them its pretty similar to every other office product ever.
There is a different between, maintaining share price over 10 years...and losing 35% of its value in 3 months. Those profits are already accounted for in its current share price. The reality is Apple is slowing http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20130214005415/en/Android-iOS-Combinid. And Timmy the highest paid CEO in the world, and has done *nothing*.
The reality is your arguing Apple is just another electronics company now...and I agree wholeheartedly.
Oct 2011 - Dec 2011, sold 85 mil smartphones. Oct 2012 - Dec 2012, sold 160 mil smartphones.
Thats ignoring Apple are now selling more lower marking 4* Phones Apples market share.
From the statement "iOS posted yet another quarter and year of double-digit growth with strong demand for the iPhone. But what also stands out is how iOS's year-over-year growth has slowed compared to the overall market." your right its better than losing all there customers...not good though.
I'm getting a little tired of these non-Apple articles when daily I see great technology come out of other electronics companies...Which is after all what Apple is now. Timmy has a major problem, Apple is not prepared for the new norm. Apples biggest profit machine the iPhone had Jobs give away the whole smartphone market to Android [for a few years of amazing profits], an OS that is packed though a range of compelling devices, in different shapes; price ranges, specifications [ranging from joypads; e-ink displays; giant displays; waterproof; projectors;....]; Apple does have 4S and 4 [lower margins] as a product range...which cannibalised the iphone 5 [killing their profit margins] as people wanted the brand more than the device, Steve Jobs wanted to have the market to himself and his...not Little Timmy's response to this was litigation, but lets be fair its not like Timmy has another solution. For completeness the ipod is vanishing [being replace by android phones], they have pretty much walked away from OS X [20% drop is sales], and the iPads dominance has already come to an end [its market share dropped last quarter below 20%]...and will never be as profitable as the iphone.
Apple shares are in freefall falling from $705 a share to $450 and deservedly so. It is no longer the largest company in the world by market cap. Innovation in the form of an iWatch or an iTv is not going to save Apple we are already seeing Smart devices in both these categories. Apple needed to do the boring things like have a phone that people could buy [In China and Brazil]...an iPhone nano [and mini]*years ago*, the same way it needed an iPad mini years ago. It needs do interesting things on its current platforms...Apple could have reinvented the PC market...Microsoft have made a mess with Surface, and its Chromebooks getting all the good press. Hell the needed to spend that cash pile before buying hell Dell would have been fun or twitter or Nintendo, Hell I was thinking Attack Microsoft with an Office suite and hell License their OS [oooh Google did that already]...buy steam Anything.
There has been *NO* real news from Apple. Lets talk about companies that are relevant; and innovate with new exciting devices...not iterations of old ones.
Frankly Tim Cook hasn't been on the job long enough to really tell how he is doing
Apples shares have been in freefall from 705 to 450...and that is under Tim Cook...and his response to this has been *nothing*..Shares rose under Elop too...for a few months. The reality is you might want Cook to catch his breath settle in, but right now Apple is burning. Shareholders are calling for Tim Cook to do something with those Billions, the reality is it might be a little late.
I had a little look at what office would cost me. £220($340) for the crippled version £389.99($605) for the full version. I have used LibreOffice(originally openoffice) and it even has advantages over Microsoft Office its not just bad value. Its insanely overpriced.
Bill G & Steve J had a nice deal to port Office to Macs right after Steve returned.
...that was when Apple was weak. Apple has a short time frame while it is dominant in the tablet space its market share already below 50%], before it moves into irrelevance. Apple with its large stockpiles of Cash...with no new products, reinventing the tired PC market...and that should have included an Office product, but it seems like Apple is content to let its whole company [and its brand] wither away on incremental improvements to its dated electronics products.
In context to your quotes by the measure of a CEO its share value, Ballmer is doing an awful lot better than Cook
Internet Explorer is bundled [not replaceable] on one platform Microsoft's. To compete it needs to exist on other platforms and be replaceable on its [not your] OS. As it stands it continues to hold back the innovation on the Web...the polar opposite of what would have happened it real competition exists. All it is is another incompatible product. The fact that XP users are such on Internet explorer 8 says it all.
I might hate IE to death, but I would defend its right to exist to the grave for monopoly-weakening reasons right now.
Except Microsoft does not compete is abusively bundles IE, The damaged caused by Microsoft set innovation in the web space back years, if IE was a cross platform browser, not welded to their [not your] Operating system, I would agree. Unfortunately it only pollutes standards, without any of the positives that competition brings. Firefox and Chrome [and Opera] have been ahead for so long now its not even funny any more.
IE explorer should be destroyed with fire. So competition can continue unabated.
Ok I wasn't sure I decided if how I felt about steam on Linux...more I suspect that the too negative header to this discussion, when down the side I spotted "Try Linux - Grab Ubuntu Desktop; Ubuntu is our favorite version of Linux. Interested in giving it a whirl? You can install and run Ubuntu from a Live CD or USB stick, or install it to run alongside Windows."
Is that "holy shit I can carry all my steam games around on my USB stick" take it around to my friends...or even work, play a few rounds of team fortress, without any changes to the machine...because if that is true, that is bigger news to me than Steam on Linux, this is Quake Arena/Doom again, only with a raft of cheap choices. I can finally play people I know. [and share an experience with], and socialise with, rather than anonymous strangers on-line [I would rather play off-line than that].
That chart is pretty interesting. Android is winning market share by stealing it from Symbian...No noticeable uptick in windows devices.
Users do not want windows phone, and increasingly I'm finding little compelling about the current Nokia hardware. I used to say put Android on Nokia Hardware, but I'm not sure if Android will make a difference any more.
Apple produces the previous generations of its existing product line, such as the iPhone 4 and 4S for Virgin Mobile, at the same time as the current generation for full-price carriers.
Thats not a product line:), and all it is did was cannibalise the iphone5 sales in the *US* adding to Apples woes on the stock market. It clearly didn't help is sell more phones in Brazil or China...you know those massive markets experiencing all the smatphone growth right now; Where your expected to pay outright for a phones; where Android already is not just the leader its over 100X market share in Brazil...and last time I looked 21x in China. The iPhone is simply too cheap a product with too high a mark-up [A mark up so high *nobody* will buy one], to be successful in those markets. Apple had a chance, but it squandered it chasing profits, engaging in frivolous lawsuits, rather than cementing its [Mindshare at least] lead with a affordable range of products...and innovating, a new UI every so often wouldn't hurt.
I'm down to a single installation of MS Office (2003) for these edge cases. I've yet to see something that's obliged me to fire it up due to a lack of compatibility
To be fair. I have old copies of Microsoft Office around. I use libreoffice, because. I can just download it, and I'm set to go, without worrying about discs or licenses. To be fair I think more is happening with libreoffice that interests me than Microsoft constant rehashing of the same product...thinks like android remote control for presentation, and persona from Firefox.
...and I have stopped caring for a long time...around the time they got rid of that long startup the OpenOffice used to have [maybe my machine got faster], or it could be people expect word docs a lot less than they used to.
Most people aren't as knowledgable about technology as the average Slashdotter. They aren't stupid just because they confuse a phone called "iPhone" that has a full-size touchscreen, rounded corners, camera, and the ability to run apps with a phone called "iPhone" that has a full-size touchscreen, rounded corners, camera, and the ability to run apps. Your analogy with the fruit is ridiculous.
If those are the only features that an iPhone sells on, then it deserves its shrinking maketshare[and value], and their is nothing to differentiate it as a product...it is simply a brand. Suddenly Apple fanatics, and Google fanatics are on the same page; holding hands; singing "we are the world".
There was never a problem until Apple decided to get into the music business.
I don't mean to correct you, wikipedia has a nice history http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Corps_v_Apple_Computer the short version of it, as part of the original *settlement* they agreed not to get into to music...and then they did.
Slashdot Mirror
Your claim was that Apple was growing more slowly than the industry in the USA.
No it wasn't to quote myself. "No Apple has been growing slower than the industry...in fact its shrinking compared to the market. In fact even in the US Android phones are more common than iPhones."
The market is a *worldwide* market...notice the little *even* that is because I'm talking about something different :). That is the magic of English. For your benefit.
The US[and to a lesser extent the UK] is slightly different from the rest of the world which is why I separated it out, because customers pay for their phones by it being bundled into a long contract. Like a hire purchase agreement...only with the real value of the phone hidden from you. The bottom line is as you quoted "in the US Android phones are more common than iPhones" is still an empirical fact, that is because Android performs every quarter not just launch quarters :)...Do you know Android has grown faster than Apple, because it was launched later while having a larger market share. Do I have to go through all ComScore figures and do a time series analysis...or do you understand that fairly simple conclusion. If it hurts your brain think of it like cutting a pie, With Android being the big piece...and Apple being the teeny tiny piece.
http://www.comscore.com/Insights/Press_Releases/2013/2/comScore_Reports_December_2012_U.S._Smartphone_Subscriber_Market_Share I'm sorry why are you posting figures tha agree with me, as though they don't its a little eerie. From the article "Google Android ranked as the top smartphone platform with 53.4 percent market share (up 0.9 percentage points)"
http://www.idc.com/getdoc.jsp?containerId=prUS23946013#.UR7MG5G3PGg
You figures are not even close to being right. The link is the same as the other one I provided only its direct from IDC, but it includes a nice graph showing the various OS and how big their market share. Apple is a little confusing as its market share is feast/fast as their product launches have a huge effect on their sales. Next quarter Apple are not going to sell anything close to 48Million Phones, and their market share in that quarter will dive. Averaging out the peaks and troughs. Its not gaining market share because it is growing *the same* as the market.
The figures your looking for is the market grew 46% in 2012. Apples market share was 18.8% in 2011...and is still 18.8% in 2012 because it sold only 46% more phones...the same as what the market grew.
Its easier to see what is happing when averaging over a year. The reality is the big launch was the turning point, and everyone knew it. Its why its market share have dropped 35% since then. :)
When the conflict gets to litigation, everyone except the lawyers lose.
No! No! No! there is often a winner, sometimes a very lucrative winner, the lawyers only get a small portion of the spoils, I'm don't care if lawyers are good or bad people, but pretending mega-corperation are victims to this occupation is a not credible. The truth is Apple won big against Samsung to the tune of 1 Billion Dollars [that goes to Apple], unfortunately *money* even if its a Billion Dollars is useless to Apple ...it doesn't know what to do with its $140Billion in cash it has doesn't know what to do with. It wanted a ban on Samsung products, so it products could continue without competition.
Their margins remain the highest in the industry.
The smartphone industry has been growing 16% per year globally and Apple has been growing faster.
In the United States Apple has crushed Android and now is approaching the point of establishing a monopoly.
How exactly is their brand being diminished?
No Apple has been growing slower than the industry...in fact its shrinking compared to the market. In fact even in the US Android phones are more common than iPhones. I personally would argue that their brand is diminished because its getting harder to justify the massive mark-ups on re-badged foxconn phones.
The geek always quotes retail list for the most expensive version of Office he can find.
Lets get a few things right. I've never been a geek, and only ever seen that word used by bullies. The price is for the version I am eligible. Just because other people are entitled to discounts in educational for Microsoft self serving reasons does not mean I am. I personally have had no problems using LibreOffice...but them its pretty similar to every other office product ever.
There is a different between, maintaining share price over 10 years ...and losing 35% of its value in 3 months. Those profits are already accounted for in its current share price. The reality is Apple is slowing http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20130214005415/en/Android-iOS-Combinid. And Timmy the highest paid CEO in the world, and has done *nothing*.
The reality is your arguing Apple is just another electronics company now...and I agree wholeheartedly.
are you LITERALLY retarded?
...I think anyone you uses the words *retarded* [or adds tard to the end of a real world like Gonadtard] should be instantly blocked.
Anyone who used the literally in fucking capitals no less, should be traced and their computer smashed into little tiny pieces and then fed to them.
Someone who combines these atrocities...I can only assume they are going to build another ring of hell.
Oct 2011 - Dec 2011, sold 37 mil iphones.
Oct 2012 - Dec 2012, sold 48 mil iphones.
http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20130214005415/en/Android-iOS-Combinid
Compared to Androids
Oct 2011 - Dec 2011, sold 85 mil smartphones.
Oct 2012 - Dec 2012, sold 160 mil smartphones.
Thats ignoring Apple are now selling more lower marking 4* Phones Apples market share.
From the statement "iOS posted yet another quarter and year of double-digit growth with strong demand for the iPhone. But what also stands out is how iOS's year-over-year growth has slowed compared to the overall market." your right its better than losing all there customers...not good though.
Even the styling of their signature products has been directly copied from other company's work from the 70s.
....they copied Sony http://www.electricpig.co.uk/2012/07/27/apple-prototypes-show-iphone-inspired-by-sony-and-kickstand-ipad/index.html
I'm getting a little tired of these non-Apple articles when daily I see great technology come out of other electronics companies...Which is after all what Apple is now. Timmy has a major problem, Apple is not prepared for the new norm. Apples biggest profit machine the iPhone had Jobs give away the whole smartphone market to Android [for a few years of amazing profits], an OS that is packed though a range of compelling devices, in different shapes; price ranges, specifications [ranging from joypads; e-ink displays; giant displays; waterproof; projectors;....]; Apple does have 4S and 4 [lower margins] as a product range...which cannibalised the iphone 5 [killing their profit margins] as people wanted the brand more than the device, Steve Jobs wanted to have the market to himself and his...not Little Timmy's response to this was litigation, but lets be fair its not like Timmy has another solution. For completeness the ipod is vanishing [being replace by android phones], they have pretty much walked away from OS X [20% drop is sales], and the iPads dominance has already come to an end [its market share dropped last quarter below 20%]...and will never be as profitable as the iphone.
Apple shares are in freefall falling from $705 a share to $450 and deservedly so. It is no longer the largest company in the world by market cap. Innovation in the form of an iWatch or an iTv is not going to save Apple we are already seeing Smart devices in both these categories. Apple needed to do the boring things like have a phone that people could buy [In China and Brazil]...an iPhone nano [and mini]*years ago*, the same way it needed an iPad mini years ago. It needs do interesting things on its current platforms...Apple could have reinvented the PC market...Microsoft have made a mess with Surface, and its Chromebooks getting all the good press. Hell the needed to spend that cash pile before buying hell Dell would have been fun or twitter or Nintendo, Hell I was thinking Attack Microsoft with an Office suite and hell License their OS [oooh Google did that already]...buy steam Anything.
There has been *NO* real news from Apple. Lets talk about companies that are relevant; and innovate with new exciting devices...not iterations of old ones.
Frankly Tim Cook hasn't been on the job long enough to really tell how he is doing
Apples shares have been in freefall from 705 to 450...and that is under Tim Cook...and his response to this has been *nothing*..Shares rose under Elop too...for a few months. The reality is you might want Cook to catch his breath settle in, but right now Apple is burning. Shareholders are calling for Tim Cook to do something with those Billions, the reality is it might be a little late.
I had a little look at what office would cost me. £220($340) for the crippled version £389.99($605) for the full version. I have used LibreOffice(originally openoffice) and it even has advantages over Microsoft Office its not just bad value. Its insanely overpriced.
Bill G & Steve J had a nice deal to port Office to Macs right after Steve returned.
...that was when Apple was weak. Apple has a short time frame while it is dominant in the tablet space its market share already below 50%], before it moves into irrelevance. Apple with its large stockpiles of Cash...with no new products, reinventing the tired PC market...and that should have included an Office product, but it seems like Apple is content to let its whole company [and its brand] wither away on incremental improvements to its dated electronics products.
In context to your quotes by the measure of a CEO its share value, Ballmer is doing an awful lot better than Cook
Internet Explorer is bundled [not replaceable] on one platform Microsoft's. To compete it needs to exist on other platforms and be replaceable on its [not your] OS. As it stands it continues to hold back the innovation on the Web...the polar opposite of what would have happened it real competition exists. All it is is another incompatible product. The fact that XP users are such on Internet explorer 8 says it all.
I might hate IE to death, but I would defend its right to exist to the grave for monopoly-weakening reasons right now.
Except Microsoft does not compete is abusively bundles IE, The damaged caused by Microsoft set innovation in the web space back years, if IE was a cross platform browser, not welded to their [not your] Operating system, I would agree. Unfortunately it only pollutes standards, without any of the positives that competition brings. Firefox and Chrome [and Opera] have been ahead for so long now its not even funny any more.
IE explorer should be destroyed with fire. So competition can continue unabated.
I've never been a fan of MSIE, but to say "most" would cheer for its demise seems a little gratuitous. Competition is good.
Internet Explorer is not a cross platform browser. It does not *compete* it abusively bundles Internet Explorer.
Ok I wasn't sure I decided if how I felt about steam on Linux...more I suspect that the too negative header to this discussion, when down the side I spotted "Try Linux - Grab Ubuntu Desktop; Ubuntu is our favorite version of Linux. Interested in giving it a whirl? You can install and run Ubuntu from a Live CD or USB stick, or install it to run alongside Windows."
Is that "holy shit I can carry all my steam games around on my USB stick" take it around to my friends...or even work, play a few rounds of team fortress, without any changes to the machine...because if that is true, that is bigger news to me than Steam on Linux, this is Quake Arena/Doom again, only with a raft of cheap choices. I can finally play people I know. [and share an experience with], and socialise with, rather than anonymous strangers on-line [I would rather play off-line than that].
Just for information really with Serious Sam 3: BFE is available cheaper :) here
http://www.indieroyale.com/
That chart is pretty interesting. Android is winning market share by stealing it from Symbian...No noticeable uptick in windows devices.
Users do not want windows phone, and increasingly I'm finding little compelling about the current Nokia hardware. I used to say put Android on Nokia Hardware, but I'm not sure if Android will make a difference any more.
Apple produces the previous generations of its existing product line, such as the iPhone 4 and 4S for Virgin Mobile, at the same time as the current generation for full-price carriers.
Thats not a product line :), and all it is did was cannibalise the iphone5 sales in the *US* adding to Apples woes on the stock market. It clearly didn't help is sell more phones in Brazil or China...you know those massive markets experiencing all the smatphone growth right now; Where your expected to pay outright for a phones; where Android already is not just the leader its over 100X market share in Brazil...and last time I looked 21x in China. The iPhone is simply too cheap a product with too high a mark-up [A mark up so high *nobody* will buy one], to be successful in those markets. Apple had a chance, but it squandered it chasing profits, engaging in frivolous lawsuits, rather than cementing its [Mindshare at least] lead with a affordable range of products...and innovating, a new UI every so often wouldn't hurt.
I'm down to a single installation of MS Office (2003) for these edge cases. I've yet to see something that's obliged me to fire it up due to a lack of compatibility
To be fair. I have old copies of Microsoft Office around. I use libreoffice, because. I can just download it, and I'm set to go, without worrying about discs or licenses. To be fair I think more is happening with libreoffice that interests me than Microsoft constant rehashing of the same product...thinks like android remote control for presentation, and persona from Firefox.
Most people aren't as knowledgable about technology as the average Slashdotter. They aren't stupid just because they confuse a phone called "iPhone" that has a full-size touchscreen, rounded corners, camera, and the ability to run apps with a phone called "iPhone" that has a full-size touchscreen, rounded corners, camera, and the ability to run apps. Your analogy with the fruit is ridiculous.
If those are the only features that an iPhone sells on, then it deserves its shrinking maketshare[and value], and their is nothing to differentiate it as a product...it is simply a brand. Suddenly Apple fanatics, and Google fanatics are on the same page; holding hands; singing "we are the world".
Actually, we just want iPhones like everybody else.
Actually we want Android phones...its why Apple only have 0.4% of the Brazilian Market. http://www.statista.com/statistics/245189/market-share-of-mobile-operating-systems-for-smartphone-sales-in-brazil/ compared to Androids 56%
The law suit was against Apple iTunes.
There was never a problem until Apple decided to get into the music business.
I don't mean to correct you, wikipedia has a nice history http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Corps_v_Apple_Computer the short version of it, as part of the original *settlement* they agreed not to get into to music...and then they did.