Wait, so in your opinion c6gunner, Nazis were warriors for social justice?
That's not really relevant to the original comment, but yeah, as a matter of fact they were.
soÂcial jusÂtice noun justice in terms of the distribution of wealth, opportunities, and privileges within a society.
Nazis built their platform on two things:
1. The fact that Jews owned a disproportionate amount of wealth and controlled many financial institutions, and the desire to "redistribute" this wealth and "privilege". 2. Socialist ideas about improving the lot of the common man and working together for the greater good.
Their idea of "social justice" may not be exactly the same as today's social justice warriors, but it's not that far removed. The main differences are that they appealed more to nationalism, and they targeted a minority ethnic demographic rather than a majority ethnic demographic. Relatively minor differences in the grand scheme of things.
I'm running with that. But pointing out that, at some point, toxicity may well be detrimental to productivity.
I never suggested otherwise. It's hilarious that you accused me of making a strawman, after which you strawmanned my argument and called it a false dichotomy.
Yes, I agree, the strawman you built is indeed a false dichotomy. My actual argument is not.
I don't agree with your assertion. In my 20+ year career in software I don't recall anyone ever being offended at someone's suggestion for improvement.
You must be new to Slashdot. Stick around and meet APK.
Do some people get offended no matter what? Sure. But that is a personal problem with that individual and not related to the environment.
Now we are making progress. Where do you draw that line? And why is your perception of where that line lies the only valid one?
It's also not a reason to have a toxic environment.
Again, whose definition of "toxic" are we using? Take the average feminist studies major and stick her in an infantry unit. She'll be screaming about toxic masculinity in no time. The guys will disagree. Who's right? How do you know?
Is it inevitable that someone will be offended, no matter the team and no matter the techniques and processes? No.
Given long enough, yes. I love my family and we try to be nice each other whenever possible. I try a lot harder with them than I do with random jackasses contributing to an open source project. Yet even there we manage to offend each other. You think you can have a workplace in which nobody ever gets offended? If so you're either thoughtless or insane.
"You're a fucking retard and your code looks like it was written by a lunatic in the middle of an LSD binge! I would say that you should be dragged out into the streets and shot, but that would be a waste of a bullet! Also your wife is only slightly less ugly than you are fat."
Great, riddle me this, dipshit: your top programmer is being a total cunt to your worst programmer. You talk to him and he refuses to tone down his language. What do you do? Fire him? Or let him continue?
You have no clue what a false dichotomy actually is.
You clearly didn't read the comment you responded to. "Disrespectful" and "hostile" are inherently subjective words. As I already said, no matter how much you try to sugar coat things, someone is going to be offended.
And now it's time for a demonstration. Please go explain to APK that his hosts files are total shit, without upsetting him. I'll go get some popcorn.
Ah, so suddenly pointing out a logical fallacy is not a good form of argument. Interesting how things change in such a short period of time!
The original argument was that being nice to everyone was good for "community health". I pointed it that this does not address the question of whether it's good for the actual product you're trying to create. I pointed out that if your ultimate interest is ensuring that nobody ever gets their feelings hurt, the code quality is invariably going to suffer. No matter how much you sugar coat your criticism, SOMEONE is going to be offended. So it's a question of priorities, and of balance. What's your focus - code quality, or feelings? You can care about both, but at some point you have to choose between the two. Which one do you value more?
Way to be disingenuous. You deleted the latter part of what I said
I didn't ignore it; it's just incompatible with the first part of what you said. If you want to protect feelings you can't exclude snowflakes who feel like their code is Teh Best Thing Evar. How do you think APK would feel if you sent him back to the drawing board? The nutbag throws a fit any time anyone suggests that maybe he's taking the wrong approach.
There is a reason that collegial practices are ultimately to the long term health and evolution of a community.
That's an entirely different question than what it does to the health and evolution of the code.
Go ahead and be nice to everyone. Don't argue. Don't make a fuss. Just merge their changes and make everyone happy. Of course the people who actually care about doing good work will lose their fucking minds. But who cares about such curmudgeons? They're just bringing everyone down and destroying your safes space. Shame them and eventually they'll leave, and you'll have a perfectly happy community of incompetents turning out garbage that barely compiles. Hooray for feelings!
For all the complaining about nazis from jews, they're the best evidence that victimhood is a coveted status. If victimhood wasn't so coveted, why would Jews expend so much effort to portray themselves as being victimized by Nazis? Surveys show that Jews are more likely than Nazis to complain that they're not free to express themselves. Victimhood is particularly coveted by Jews.
But it seems to stay niche. in part because you are at the mercy of what they decide you should eat, along with you not being the one picking out produce.
From what I've seen it's also expensive as fuck. I got a $60 coupon in the mail from one of those companies once which encouraged me to look into it. Doing some math, my grocery budget would have to almost quadruple were I to use their service. Even with the "free" $60 I got from them, ordering the first weeks food would have been more expensive than what I normally spend in a week.
Or you could go without for 3 months, save that $45 each month, and buy a secondhand android device for $135. Then for the next 15 months save your $45 each month, and have $675 to buy a laptop.
Unfortunately budgeting and self-control seem to be rare skills indeed.
So communism failed and that is why capitalism is grinding these people to dust?
Which people?
Fear of the communist boogie man has kept working class Americans and Europeans stupid, poor and hopeless.
Anger over capitalism has killed and empoverished well over a hundred million people in the last century. If you're talking about "stupid poor and helpless Europeans", chances are you're talking primarily about the old eastern block.
That's not how statistics work. Unless you're suggesting that 100% of minorities in America are undeserved. In which case you're an idiot and probably don't know any minorities.
Start with solid education FIRST. Learn to do arithmetic without a calculator, learn to do research without Google, learn to read a book without swiping
Agreed, that's very important. Like, for example, if the author of this idiotic article had learned proper arithmetic she would know that "85% of those with only one device were underserved" is not the same thing as "85% of the underserved have only one device".
Either that or if she had developed decent reading skills she would have looked at page 5 of the paper and seen there, in clear English, the words "Overall, just under one in five (19%) students from 'underserved' backgrounds report having access to only one device at homeâ"more than three times higher than the percent of students not qualifying as underserved who reported this"
Unfortunately she never developed such basic skills, and thus ended up having to work as a "reporter".
Slashdot Mirror
You need to work on your reading comprehension skills.
Wait, so in your opinion c6gunner, Nazis were warriors for social justice?
That's not really relevant to the original comment, but yeah, as a matter of fact they were.
soÂcial jusÂtice
noun
justice in terms of the distribution of wealth, opportunities, and privileges within a society.
Nazis built their platform on two things:
1. The fact that Jews owned a disproportionate amount of wealth and controlled many financial institutions, and the desire to "redistribute" this wealth and "privilege".
2. Socialist ideas about improving the lot of the common man and working together for the greater good.
Their idea of "social justice" may not be exactly the same as today's social justice warriors, but it's not that far removed. The main differences are that they appealed more to nationalism, and they targeted a minority ethnic demographic rather than a majority ethnic demographic. Relatively minor differences in the grand scheme of things.
I'm running with that. But pointing out that, at some point, toxicity may well be detrimental to productivity.
I never suggested otherwise. It's hilarious that you accused me of making a strawman, after which you strawmanned my argument and called it a false dichotomy.
Yes, I agree, the strawman you built is indeed a false dichotomy. My actual argument is not.
I don't agree with your assertion. In my 20+ year career in software I don't recall anyone ever being offended at someone's suggestion for improvement.
You must be new to Slashdot. Stick around and meet APK.
Do some people get offended no matter what? Sure. But that is a personal problem with that individual and not related to the environment.
Now we are making progress. Where do you draw that line? And why is your perception of where that line lies the only valid one?
It's also not a reason to have a toxic environment.
Again, whose definition of "toxic" are we using? Take the average feminist studies major and stick her in an infantry unit. She'll be screaming about toxic masculinity in no time. The guys will disagree. Who's right? How do you know?
Is it inevitable that someone will be offended, no matter the team and no matter the techniques and processes? No.
Given long enough, yes. I love my family and we try to be nice each other whenever possible. I try a lot harder with them than I do with random jackasses contributing to an open source project. Yet even there we manage to offend each other. You think you can have a workplace in which nobody ever gets offended? If so you're either thoughtless or insane.
Hey I'm cool with that.
"You're a fucking retard and your code looks like it was written by a lunatic in the middle of an LSD binge! I would say that you should be dragged out into the streets and shot, but that would be a waste of a bullet! Also your wife is only slightly less ugly than you are fat."
*cries*
*me not raising a fuss about the crying*
-fin-
That works for you, right?
Bingo. Don't forget to tuck your tail on your way out.
Great, riddle me this, dipshit: your top programmer is being a total cunt to your worst programmer. You talk to him and he refuses to tone down his language. What do you do? Fire him? Or let him continue?
You have no clue what a false dichotomy actually is.
You clearly didn't read the comment you responded to. "Disrespectful" and "hostile" are inherently subjective words. As I already said, no matter how much you try to sugar coat things, someone is going to be offended.
And now it's time for a demonstration. Please go explain to APK that his hosts files are total shit, without upsetting him. I'll go get some popcorn.
Ah, so suddenly pointing out a logical fallacy is not a good form of argument. Interesting how things change in such a short period of time!
The original argument was that being nice to everyone was good for "community health". I pointed it that this does not address the question of whether it's good for the actual product you're trying to create. I pointed out that if your ultimate interest is ensuring that nobody ever gets their feelings hurt, the code quality is invariably going to suffer. No matter how much you sugar coat your criticism, SOMEONE is going to be offended. So it's a question of priorities, and of balance. What's your focus - code quality, or feelings? You can care about both, but at some point you have to choose between the two. Which one do you value more?
You somehow decided this was a false dichotomy.
The technical term for your argument is straw man.
Thank you captain obvious.
"Either you work out or you'll be out of shape"
"Hurt durr that's a false dichotomy"
Sure it is. I'm very happy that you learned a new phrase, but maybe you shouldn't use it until you actually understand it.
You hurt my feelings. If you don't delete your account I shall cry.
Way to be disingenuous. You deleted the latter part of what I said
I didn't ignore it; it's just incompatible with the first part of what you said. If you want to protect feelings you can't exclude snowflakes who feel like their code is Teh Best Thing Evar. How do you think APK would feel if you sent him back to the drawing board? The nutbag throws a fit any time anyone suggests that maybe he's taking the wrong approach.
There is a reason that collegial practices are ultimately to the long term health and evolution of a community.
That's an entirely different question than what it does to the health and evolution of the code.
Go ahead and be nice to everyone. Don't argue. Don't make a fuss. Just merge their changes and make everyone happy. Of course the people who actually care about doing good work will lose their fucking minds. But who cares about such curmudgeons? They're just bringing everyone down and destroying your safes space. Shame them and eventually they'll leave, and you'll have a perfectly happy community of incompetents turning out garbage that barely compiles. Hooray for feelings!
For all the complaining about nazis from jews, they're the best evidence that victimhood is a coveted status. If victimhood wasn't so coveted, why would Jews expend so much effort to portray themselves as being victimized by Nazis? Surveys show that Jews are more likely than Nazis to complain that they're not free to express themselves. Victimhood is particularly coveted by Jews.
I don't see why you can't respect people's feelings and have great code quality.
"Your code wiped out three of our production servers. For the second time. This week. You're fired!"
*cries*
"Oh, OK OK, don't be sad. You're rehired."
*cries some more*
"With a raise! And you get to be the project lead!"
Feelings protected. Enjoy your code.
But it seems to stay niche. in part because you are at the mercy of what they decide you should eat, along with you not being the one picking out produce.
From what I've seen it's also expensive as fuck. I got a $60 coupon in the mail from one of those companies once which encouraged me to look into it. Doing some math, my grocery budget would have to almost quadruple were I to use their service. Even with the "free" $60 I got from them, ordering the first weeks food would have been more expensive than what I normally spend in a week.
Food allergies and illness are rampant among those who are sensitive to these engineered toxins and bad practices
Which is nobody. However hypochondria seems to have become hip of late, which manifests with the same symptoms.
I getgetmy fast food from the Kernel. Does that count?
Can't comment for him, but yes, I would like to see nlggers and cr4ckers both behave rationally. Wouldn't you?
Or you could go without for 3 months, save that $45 each month, and buy a secondhand android device for $135. Then for the next 15 months save your $45 each month, and have $675 to buy a laptop.
Unfortunately budgeting and self-control seem to be rare skills indeed.
So communism failed and that is why capitalism is grinding these people to dust?
Which people?
Fear of the communist boogie man has kept working class Americans and Europeans stupid, poor and hopeless.
Anger over capitalism has killed and empoverished well over a hundred million people in the last century. If you're talking about "stupid poor and helpless Europeans", chances are you're talking primarily about the old eastern block.
In America, statistically yes definitely.
That's not how statistics work. Unless you're suggesting that 100% of minorities in America are undeserved. In which case you're an idiot and probably don't know any minorities.
Start with solid education FIRST. Learn to do arithmetic without a calculator, learn to do research without Google, learn to read a book without swiping
Agreed, that's very important. Like, for example, if the author of this idiotic article had learned proper arithmetic she would know that "85% of those with only one device were underserved" is not the same thing as "85% of the underserved have only one device".
Either that or if she had developed decent reading skills she would have looked at page 5 of the paper and seen there, in clear English, the words "Overall, just under one in five (19%) students from 'underserved' backgrounds report having access to only one device at homeâ"more than three times higher than the percent of students not qualifying as underserved who reported this"
Unfortunately she never developed such basic skills, and thus ended up having to work as a "reporter".