doesn't believe proprietary software is OK under any circumstance.
1) There is a huge gap between believing something is wrong and imposing that belief on others. The rest of your argument is based on that leap of logiic.
Do you believe anyone who says something is 'not OK under any circumstances' is a fascist?
2) Not even a Stallman quote - is that the best you can do?
Hmmmm, as there is no official iPod software for Linux users at all, I'd say all Linux software to use iPods would fall under "stupid third party addons" and "weird hacks", no?
Good point - I should have elaborated. I meant third party add-ons or hacks to your music management program.
"you can't use those cards, because they're not releasing the source"
Whoa! Chill, I wasn't using the imperative, just suggesting people use FOSS friendly cards to support FOSS.
It would be more like I'm saying:
"if you support FOSS you shouldn't use those cards, because they're not releasing the source"
As to the rest of your rant, if you're a gamer, sure, you're probably dual booting to windows and perhaps an nvidia/ati solution is better for you. But as far as choosing ATI/Nvidia for pure linux? Not many people need performance beyond intel's offering.
Releasing the records was an error. A mistake. It was erroneous.
Well, that's true - in retrospect, it was a mistake. However, describing the deliberate release of the records as 'erroneous' mischaracterises the event. If I was going to sum up the deliberate release of user's data without their permission, I wouldn't use the word 'erroneous'.
Under ubuntu it will not synch the music to save my life. I tried several different ipod sync systems that were not command line and thaey all fail to do it reliably.
Please be a little more specific - what programs & what went wrong? I use an ipod (3g standard one) under ubuntu all the time without a problem.
Huh? Using "a very low-end" card over one with much more Linux functionality,
1) I listed two cards (not just the low end) 2) A bug free, but slow/low featured card is superior to a buggy fast/full featured card (IMO) 3) I'm sick of people's support of cards that don't have kernel mode binary blobs as 'political', when it's practical. 4) As other people in this thread have pointed out, nvidia's linux drivers are only useful for linux - think of the atheos, *bsd (minus freebsd), etc, etc users out there. Please.
There is so much to comment on here - I have no idea where to start!
First - FTFA:
Includes the Sansa Media Converter to support all picture and video formats
All video formats? (raises eyebrow?) I f#cking doubt it. How about DRMd WMV9? I doubt it can handle HD content too!
Minimum System Requirements
* Windows XP
* Windows Media Player 10+
Uh-huh. Good linux support there!
Lastly, FTFS:
Might this be a great alternative MP3 player for Linux users?
Linux users have better support for iPods than windows itunes users do - they can copy songs off the iPod to another computer (without stupid third party addons, weird hacks, or scary warnings). They can also use iPods that with HFS filesystems. All seamlessly.
I guess it could be argued that most linux users would prefer a music player from a company that doesn't push DRM heavily (but sandisk pushes DRM as much as Apple does.
Still, twice the space & lighter than the equivilant ipod. Sounds if not good, then less crap. Let's hope their rockbox strategy works - that would really make a difference.
and had never heard of "Unichrome" -- that has got to be the most uniniviting name for a GPU ever.
They're very low-end, (used in cheap laptops, via's embedded line, etc) so if your a windows-gamer-fanboy, you're not going to have heard of them. (and if you judge a card by its name, you have bigger problems than that).
Anyway, if you have political issues with Nvidia that's one thing, but otherwise they've run fine under Linux for years.
No they don't. They run better than ATI's offering. There's a number of things that don't work correctly. (TwinView doesn't support multiple monitors with different resolutions, framebuffer/x switching support is poor, you can't report (linux) bugs to the kernel team, you're allowing an unaudited binary blob to run in kernelland, I can go on and on).
If Nvidia & ATI were the only choices, then fine, I'd reccommend Nvidia's buggy binary blob over ATIs buggier binary blob. But they're not. Two companies have offered the specs & a reference GPLd driver - I reccommend them and I think other supporters of FOSS should do likewise.
Saying a reccommendation of a driver that actually supports linux over one that doesn't is 'political' is.... well - let's say I suspect you have a political agenda of your own.
There is a much better reuters article here - I suggest you read that rather than the linked article.
The first four paragraphs of the article contain the story (not too much there) - the rest is fluff - and inaccurate fluff at that - I'm going to go completely OT to look at some of the absurdities it contains:
The Brazilian case highlights an issue that has been brewing for sometime over the information that search engine and other internet companies keep on their databases about their users.
No, it doesn't highlight that - the cases are not similar in any form, other than both involving large internet companies
The recent blunder made by AOL in which the internet company erroneously published 20 million search requests....
Erroneously? AOL deliberately published the search requests.
Early this year, Google successfully defended a subpoena from the US Department of Justice to hand over its data in another child porn investigation case.
Calling that a "Child porn investigation case" is one of the most misleading statements I've ever heard. It was a "porn on the 'net fishing expedition."
What I've heard in the Linux community is to stay away from anything ATI if you plan to use it with Linux.
The same applies to nvidia. Try Intel or Unichrome cards. Support companies that support FOSS.
Oh, and for the people who'll inevitably reply with the "they cant release the source, because of 3rd party IP" (I am tired of that particular whine) - why can't ATI/Nvidia release the source for the code they do have IP rights over? (and allow the OSS community to fill in the blanks).
Live it from the top down. It's critical that no one person in a company ever appears to be above a code of ethics. That means it's particularly important that executives and top managers also adhere to the guidelines of an ethics code. If managers say one thing but do something else, that's nothing more than a license for the rest of the company to follow suit. "Good role modeling by top managers is a must," Swanson says. "Without it, ethics codes can be seen as mere window dressing."
You ever read that Steve or Bill?
Mind you - I'm not exactly on z4's 'side' here - I don't like software patents (and it doesn't look like z4 have a product, but rather are an 'IP' company). That said however, live by the sword, die by the sword hey MS? Want to enforce your FAT patents? Expect more of this sort of shit in the future.
1) Who cares. If they don't mind missing out on high-paying (but boring) jobs in the finance & defense sectors (amongst others) - areas that are traditionally paranoid about network access, then they don't have to.
2) WTF from TFA:
"taking a mobile phone away from a teenage girl is the same as child abuse."
*shakes head* Child abuse?
3) It's Anne Kirah, not Ann Kiera. I know she works at MS and has a ridiculous job title, but at least try to spell one of her names right.
I also realize that 99% of all people use the word "PC" to denominate what we used to call "IBM compatible PCs".
Errr, yes - and Macs are what we used to call "IBM compatible PCs" - ie, based on a bog standard, run of the mill, common or garden variety x86 PC architecture. (and 99% of the world can't tell the difference between the internet and the web - I expect higher standards from slashdot posters).
From the link you so kindly provided:
(and also because Apple's ram prices are stupidly high).
If you spec up a machine from Apple to match a machine from Dell (rather than the other way round), you find the equivilant Mac PC is far more expensive.
I find it a little sad that Mac people have to compare to Dell of all retailers (surely the bar is set higher than Dell). Why not do a price comparison with an Asus PC? They're made in the same factory after all.
Have a look at the Asus coreduos notebooks - lighter, and much cheaper than the equivilant mac - made in the same factory, with the same cheap 60 hours/week labour, and presumably to the same build quality.
people like RMS actually believe that you should not be allowed to use proprietary software because it's not "free." They want to enforce their brand of freedom to make you free. It's fascism.
I'm mildly surprised by that statement - can you point me to where I can find RMS calling for governmental regiulation of proprietary software?
Seems more like he's creating an alternative, educating people to its superiorities & letting the market decide?
Not if the DRM is so liberal that you never notice it.
When someone bitches about iTunes DRM, I always know that they've ABSOLUTELY NEVER bought any iTunes music. If they had, they'd realize you never even notice that the DRM is there.
*sighs* Utterly stupid. The inverse of what you're saying is when someone whines about how unobtrusive itunes DRM is, I always know that they're AN APPLE ONLY HOUSEHOLD, with iPods, etc.
If you had a different mp3 player, ran linux, want to use audio samples in derivative works (in jurisdictions where that's legal), incorporate music into teachings, etc, etc etc, then you would know that Apple's DRM can get in the way alot. (especially as its enforcing US copyright laws all over the world).
I know Apple's DRM works for you, but don't bash everyone else, just because you have the lack of imagination to not understand why people want unencumbered music.
Oh - and I notice you didn't actually manage to refute the GP's point quoted:
DRM-locked music is inherently inferior to free music.
2 files. Identical content. One with restrictions, one without. Please explain why one is not inherently inferior to the other.
The current list of companies subscribing to the EICC [eicc.info] includes Apple.
According to Apple's report, they only joined the EICC after being shamed into it by the original 'sweatshop ipods' tabloid report.
use corporate social responsiblity as the deciding factor in my purchases. I will also prefer an Apple laptop over an Acer laptop.
Apple's laptops are made (mostly) by asustek, in the same chinese factories as the Acers. If you're looking for corporate social responsiblity, forget buying a laptop (or almost any electronic item) for now.
Slashdot Mirror
I just want proper graphics support out of the box.
:-)
Thanks for agreeing with me
With Intel & Unichrome cards - you do get proper support, straight off the install! Much better than nvidia/ati blobs.
That sounds like a cute method!
In linux, you plug the ipod in & drag the music you want from the music player to wherever you want the files.
doesn't believe proprietary software is OK under any circumstance.
1) There is a huge gap between believing something is wrong and imposing that belief on others. The rest of your argument is based on that leap of logiic.
Do you believe anyone who says something is 'not OK under any circumstances' is a fascist?
2) Not even a Stallman quote - is that the best you can do?
Try again.
Hmmmm, as there is no official iPod software for Linux users at all, I'd say all Linux software to use iPods would fall under "stupid third party addons" and "weird hacks", no?
Good point - I should have elaborated. I meant third party add-ons or hacks to your music management program.
"you can't use those cards, because they're not releasing the source"
Whoa! Chill, I wasn't using the imperative, just suggesting people use FOSS friendly cards to support FOSS.
It would be more like I'm saying:
"if you support FOSS you shouldn't use those cards, because they're not releasing the source"
As to the rest of your rant, if you're a gamer, sure, you're probably dual booting to windows and perhaps an nvidia/ati solution is better for you. But as far as choosing ATI/Nvidia for pure linux? Not many people need performance beyond intel's offering.
Releasing the records was an error. A mistake. It was erroneous.
Well, that's true - in retrospect, it was a mistake. However, describing the deliberate release of the records as 'erroneous' mischaracterises the event. If I was going to sum up the deliberate release of user's data without their permission, I wouldn't use the word 'erroneous'.
Under ubuntu it will not synch the music to save my life. I tried several different ipod sync systems that were not command line and thaey all fail to do it reliably.
Please be a little more specific - what programs & what went wrong? I use an ipod (3g standard one) under ubuntu all the time without a problem.
Huh? Using "a very low-end" card over one with much more Linux functionality,
1) I listed two cards (not just the low end)
2) A bug free, but slow/low featured card is superior to a buggy fast/full featured card (IMO)
3) I'm sick of people's support of cards that don't have kernel mode binary blobs as 'political', when it's practical.
4) As other people in this thread have pointed out, nvidia's linux drivers are only useful for linux - think of the atheos, *bsd (minus freebsd), etc, etc users out there. Please.
There is so much to comment on here - I have no idea where to start!
First - FTFA:
Includes the Sansa Media Converter to support all picture and video formats
All video formats? (raises eyebrow?) I f#cking doubt it. How about DRMd WMV9? I doubt it can handle HD content too!
Minimum System Requirements
* Windows XP
* Windows Media Player 10+
Uh-huh. Good linux support there!
Lastly, FTFS:
Might this be a great alternative MP3 player for Linux users?
Linux users have better support for iPods than windows itunes users do - they can copy songs off the iPod to another computer (without stupid third party addons, weird hacks, or scary warnings). They can also use iPods that with HFS filesystems. All seamlessly.
I guess it could be argued that most linux users would prefer a music player from a company that doesn't push DRM heavily (but sandisk pushes DRM as much as Apple does.
Still, twice the space & lighter than the equivilant ipod. Sounds if not good, then less crap. Let's hope their rockbox strategy works - that would really make a difference.
and had never heard of "Unichrome" -- that has got to be the most uniniviting name for a GPU ever.
They're very low-end, (used in cheap laptops, via's embedded line, etc) so if your a windows-gamer-fanboy, you're not going to have heard of them. (and if you judge a card by its name, you have bigger problems than that).
Anyway, if you have political issues with Nvidia that's one thing, but otherwise they've run fine under Linux for years.
No they don't. They run better than ATI's offering. There's a number of things that don't work correctly. (TwinView doesn't support multiple monitors with different resolutions, framebuffer/x switching support is poor, you can't report (linux) bugs to the kernel team, you're allowing an unaudited binary blob to run in kernelland, I can go on and on).
If Nvidia & ATI were the only choices, then fine, I'd reccommend Nvidia's buggy binary blob over ATIs buggier binary blob. But they're not. Two companies have offered the specs & a reference GPLd driver - I reccommend them and I think other supporters of FOSS should do likewise.
Saying a reccommendation of a driver that actually supports linux over one that doesn't is 'political' is.... well - let's say I suspect you have a political agenda of your own.
There is a much better reuters article here - I suggest you read that rather than the linked article.
The first four paragraphs of the article contain the story (not too much there) - the rest is fluff - and inaccurate fluff at that - I'm going to go completely OT to look at some of the absurdities it contains:
The Brazilian case highlights an issue that has been brewing for sometime over the information that search engine and other internet companies keep on their databases about their users.
No, it doesn't highlight that - the cases are not similar in any form, other than both involving large internet companies
The recent blunder made by AOL in which the internet company erroneously published 20 million search requests....
Erroneously? AOL deliberately published the search requests.
Early this year, Google successfully defended a subpoena from the US Department of Justice to hand over its data in another child porn investigation case.
Calling that a "Child porn investigation case" is one of the most misleading statements I've ever heard. It was a "porn on the 'net fishing expedition."
Well, said - but to expand on that a little:
What I've heard in the Linux community is to stay away from anything ATI if you plan to use it with Linux.
The same applies to nvidia. Try Intel or Unichrome cards. Support companies that support FOSS.
Oh, and for the people who'll inevitably reply with the "they cant release the source, because of 3rd party IP" (I am tired of that particular whine) - why can't ATI/Nvidia release the source for the code they do have IP rights over? (and allow the OSS community to fill in the blanks).
I think Microsoft needs to read their own Put it in writing: Your business has ethics - particularly point 8:
You ever read that Steve or Bill?
Mind you - I'm not exactly on z4's 'side' here - I don't like software patents (and it doesn't look like z4 have a product, but rather are an 'IP' company). That said however, live by the sword, die by the sword hey MS? Want to enforce your FAT patents? Expect more of this sort of shit in the future.
2) WTF from TFA:
*shakes head* Child abuse?
3) It's Anne Kirah, not Ann Kiera. I know she works at MS and has a ridiculous job title, but at least try to spell one of her names right.
You are so right - they will never ever get old.
I also realize that 99% of all people use the word "PC" to denominate what we used to call "IBM compatible PCs".
Errr, yes - and Macs are what we used to call "IBM compatible PCs" - ie, based on a bog standard, run of the mill, common or garden variety x86 PC architecture. (and 99% of the world can't tell the difference between the internet and the web - I expect higher standards from slashdot posters).
From the link you so kindly provided:
(and also because Apple's ram prices are stupidly high).
If you spec up a machine from Apple to match a machine from Dell (rather than the other way round), you find the equivilant Mac PC is far more expensive.
I find it a little sad that Mac people have to compare to Dell of all retailers (surely the bar is set higher than Dell). Why not do a price comparison with an Asus PC? They're made in the same factory after all.
Have a look at the Asus coreduos notebooks - lighter, and much cheaper than the equivilant mac - made in the same factory, with the same cheap 60 hours/week labour, and presumably to the same build quality.
people like RMS actually believe that you should not be allowed to use proprietary software because it's not "free." They want to enforce their brand of freedom to make you free. It's fascism.
I'm mildly surprised by that statement - can you point me to where I can find RMS calling for governmental regiulation of proprietary software?
Seems more like he's creating an alternative, educating people to its superiorities & letting the market decide?
Macs are priced similarly to PCs
1) Macs are PCs.
2) Macs are more expensive than the equivilant from a different PC manufacturor.
(I suggest doing a comparison with an Asus rather than dell - after all, they're made in the same factory)
Not if the DRM is so liberal that you never notice it.
When someone bitches about iTunes DRM, I always know that they've ABSOLUTELY NEVER bought any iTunes music. If they had, they'd realize you never even notice that the DRM is there.
*sighs* Utterly stupid. The inverse of what you're saying is when someone whines about how unobtrusive itunes DRM is, I always know that they're AN APPLE ONLY HOUSEHOLD, with iPods, etc.
If you had a different mp3 player, ran linux, want to use audio samples in derivative works (in jurisdictions where that's legal), incorporate music into teachings, etc, etc etc, then you would know that Apple's DRM can get in the way alot. (especially as its enforcing US copyright laws all over the world).
I know Apple's DRM works for you, but don't bash everyone else, just because you have the lack of imagination to not understand why people want unencumbered music.
Oh - and I notice you didn't actually manage to refute the GP's point quoted:
DRM-locked music is inherently inferior to free music.
2 files. Identical content. One with restrictions, one without. Please explain why one is not inherently inferior to the other.
Indeed.
On top of that, according to this bbc report, the audit was pretty lax - interviewing just 100 employees from more than 30,000.
Also, we have this report of the audit - but noone knows where the factory is to independantly verify it.
Can we trust Apple? They just denied the initial report - and now it seems there was some violations. Is this report the complete truth?
The current list of companies subscribing to the EICC [eicc.info] includes Apple.
According to Apple's report, they only joined the EICC after being shamed into it by the original 'sweatshop ipods' tabloid report.
use corporate social responsiblity as the deciding factor in my purchases. I will also prefer an Apple laptop over an Acer laptop.
Apple's laptops are made (mostly) by asustek, in the same chinese factories as the Acers. If you're looking for corporate social responsiblity, forget buying a laptop (or almost any electronic item) for now.
And it just so happens that the two best quality laptop builders are Apple and IBM (now Lenovo, not sure how things will change).
Apple doesn't build laptops - they have them made for them by Asustek (mostly), using cheap asian labour.
Interestingly, Asustek is not on the linked list.
Whatever dude, you mightent see them, but seeing google makes a coupla billion off 'em each year, at least a few people are clicking on them...
It's a trial run - from tfa:
Please, read this - and you'll realize that I am not the mac fanboy you are looking for ;-)
(still not convinced?)