Domain: apcc.com
Stories and comments across the archive that link to apcc.com.
Comments · 36
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Re:Nice idea, but the cost...Not only is the summary wrong - so is the friggin article.
I went to their home page and downloaded the pdf.
Here's the deal - BATTERIES NOT INCLUDED!!!
The ten grand buys you a switch. That's it. A switch controlled by a computer, and an inverter. You still need to buy batteries (that will give you a grand total of 1 kw for 10 hours, so forget about running more than a couple of computers off this).
They're trying to sell you on buying a bunch of solar cells (NOTE - NOT INCLUDED IN THE PRICE EITHER) that you connect to the switch, and depending on their output, you either suck off the sun or the power grid.
Their big marketing scam - TAX CREDIT of $500 - $2500 for Solar Power Systems.
In other words, you can do this yourself with off-the-shelf parts - buy one of these http://www.apcc.com/resource/include/techspec_ind
e x.cfm?base_sku=SU5000UXINET&tab=features&ISOCountr yCode=usfor under 2 grand, and with the other 8 grand, buy a sh*tload of batteries for it, and you're ahead of the game cost-wise. Heck, buy two, phase-lock them, and you can run your washer and electric dryer at the same time - something you can't do with their $10,000 system (which is really a lot more after you add the batteries). -
Re:APC needs to make a mini-styled UPS!
Just stick two CS 500s side by side and balance it on the top!
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Power strip that deals with wall warts
Many others have posted about the short cords that go from the wart to the plug. Another solution is a power strip like this one which has a special section for wall warts where they won't cover other outlets.
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Re:Use SMART?
I second that. You can have Smart Run a script when things fails, like Mailing the details of the failiure and then turning off the computer.
For other computer parts lsensor might do the trick.
For exemple: http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_Monitor_your_hard_dis k(s)_with_smartmontools
if it's an external device, the best thing would be to get a controlable UPS And turn off (again with a small script)
Just think RAID, UPS, smart monitors and deamons and with a bit of imagination, you can come up with a soultion. -
Buy an online UPS
I don't remember how much these things cost but an online UPS (one that converts AC -> DC feeds the battery and then feeds the PC/equipment from the battery) can reduce line noise significantly. It isn't the most elegant solution but feeding pc/sound card/sound equipment from a noiseless source can improve things considerably and it is very easy to install. APC has a specific solution for high-end audio/video systems that appears perfect for you (its called a power conditioner and is, essentially, an online UPS with very little battery time). Caution: the words "high performance AV system" usually mean $$$$$$. Check the link http://www.apcc.com/products/family/index.cfm?id=
3 10&ISOCountryCode=USAlternatively you may try balanced XLR->XLR cables that are used by professionals. I use these for my microphones (which provide a very low signal) and I am quite happy. Note that 4.5mm jack can also be balanced but you have to explicitly request it. Also bear in mind that a strong signal is much less sensitive. Long lengths of microvoltage-level signal are a not a good idea but line-level (-5/+5) signal is quite resistant. You may also buy ferrite cores for your cables (even power cables that have ferrite cores pre-installed!) and see if it makes a difference. Shielded cable may also be useful. Don't go spending a lot before trying.
Finally, always remember: a very good power supply (as in expensive audio equipment) can handle noise quite effectively.
P.
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APCAnyone try APC's TravelPower series? I figure some of the slashdot geeks have had experience with 'em.
At first it sounds convenient, but it also makes me think that it can make everything seem more complicated than it needs to be. Here's the link:
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Quicky UPS-sizing guide...
Yes, you can. "Volt-amps" are units of electric power, V*I, where V and I are vectors (the load may be reactive and the V vector and the I vector may not be parallel). If the V and I vectors are going in the same direction, they can be considered scalars and "volt-amps" becomes "watts."
Batteries are rated in "Amp-hour" ratings. That is, they can (to a first approximation), deliver current "I" for time "t" where I*t= the rating. I say "to a first approximation" because the time-to-discharge as a function of current draw is not actually linear, but is really more like an exponential.
Of course, there's some efficiency lost in the DC-AC converter electronics. I don't have a clue what it is; perhaps 80% efficiency is good?
So you have a setup like mine: PC with 500W supply, monitor, printer, speakers. I would recommend NOT putting the printer and speakers on the UPS. Only essential equipment that needs power in order to shut everything down gracefully should be on the UPS.
My monitor eats maybe 50W, and my PC consumes 500W max: 550W worst-case.
According to this page, a APC BackUPS 650 (rated for 640VA), will operate a 400W load for seven minutes. With a perfect 120V output, that (perfectly resistive!) load is drawing 3.333A. With the 80% efficiency I mentioned above, it implies that the battery has an amp-hour rating of about 0.5Ah (500mAh). (0.5Ah * 0.8 eff)/3.333A = 0.12 hours (7.2 minutes).
My 550W load (assuming again that it's purely resistive) will draw 4.6A at 120V. This same UPS (assuming that the switching electronics can handle it!) will operate my machine for 0.087 hour (5.2 minutes), plenty of time to shut down.
So: to find the minimum-sized UPS you need, add up the load of the essential equipment, calculate the required current, and find a UPS with a big enough battery to provide you with a comfortable shutdown time. -
Re:Electrical issues
Check this out: APC Matrix
A bit pricey at $5k, but should provide regulated AC all the time, plus a few hours of battery backup for all your normal devices (a/c, heating, etc notwithstanding) -
Depends on your budget
NetBotz are the best-known and most fully-featured system, but they're kind of pricey.
A cheaper alternative is APC's solution while providing just the environment info you want.
If you are also looking into remote power management, Server Technology's Power Tower product is being integrated with a new environmental device (for $100-200 or so, according to reports) which allows you to keep your interactions and monitoring all on one interface for environmental and power both. -
Re:"Combined with a form of fusion"
Meaning basically, the Matrix is nothing more than a giant UPS?
Strange you would say that. Yes, it is. -
Re:Federal Regulation
Some time ago, I did this for a few years without any problem. My neighbor and I were pretty good buddies and both into 3D FPS shooters like Quake. (which was brand new at the time). So I purchased 300' of Ethernet cable, terminated both ends, got a pair of these bad boys, and fragged away. We even shared ISP service for a while.
Fiberoptics was too expensive, and wi-fi was unheard of at the time.
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Call an electrician
Call an electrician, preferably the one your colocation provider uses so s/he knows the existing system already.
You could also call a vendor like APC and ask about power distribution to x00 rackmounted hosts, I'm sure they have a solution they will sell/lease you. -
Re:Well looks like I have one of them...
I've got two of them...
The recall instructions above seem to be for America only. I'm in the UK and am given these instructions instead.
The difference seems to be that I'm only supposed to disconnect the battery, not remove it, and the whole unit, battery and all, gets swapped.
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URL for registering online
The primary page for the recall is http://www.apcc.com/rely/.
The main page includes a link to perform online registration for the recall instead of waiting on hold via phone. The link is similar to the URL given in the story but without the "pressrel.cfm" at the end for going to the press release. In fact, the main page includes a link to the press release but the PR does not include a link directly to the recall main page. -
Well looks like I have one of them...
Just checked the CS 500 under my desk and sure enough mine is one of the ones in the recall.
Here's the more detailed page with instructions to finding out if your's is one of them.
And the recall instructions I got once I registered my UPS.
Looks like all they are doing is replacing the "dangerous" unit with a "safe" unit of the same model, as they ask you to remove the battery from the recall unit and reuse it in the replacement unit.
I was kinda hoping to get a fresh battery with this recall. But then this does save them a hell lot in shipping considering how heavy the batteries are. With 2.1 million unit, every ounce saved amounts to quite a bit of money.
Hopefully I get a replacement soon, power at my apartment sucks. -
Well looks like I have one of them...
Just checked the CS 500 under my desk and sure enough mine is one of the ones in the recall.
Here's the more detailed page with instructions to finding out if your's is one of them.
And the recall instructions I got once I registered my UPS.
Looks like all they are doing is replacing the "dangerous" unit with a "safe" unit of the same model, as they ask you to remove the battery from the recall unit and reuse it in the replacement unit.
I was kinda hoping to get a fresh battery with this recall. But then this does save them a hell lot in shipping considering how heavy the batteries are. With 2.1 million unit, every ounce saved amounts to quite a bit of money.
Hopefully I get a replacement soon, power at my apartment sucks. -
UPS for Dummies �
'Was checking their press announcement and found this quote: "APC recommends that the user immediately remove the UPS unit from service by turning off all connected equipment, turning the UPS unit off, and then unplugging the unit from the electrical outlet." Umm... really, if you own a UPS and you need that information, you shouldn't own a computer, let alone an UPS.
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Re:Answered my own question
>PS, if you hate it when a link is not a link, get phoenix and the text link extension
Personally, while that does bother me, it bothers me more that people won't hyperlink on slashdot, considering that you'll almost always end up with a broken URL if you don't. :)
[ Oh, for crying out loud! What the hell? I can't post a link with a space in it? Pretend the broken link is actually broken, TYVM. ] -
Re:Answered my own question
>PS, if you hate it when a link is not a link, get phoenix and the text link extension
Personally, while that does bother me, it bothers me more that people won't hyperlink on slashdot, considering that you'll almost always end up with a broken URL if you don't. :)
[ Oh, for crying out loud! What the hell? I can't post a link with a space in it? Pretend the broken link is actually broken, TYVM. ] -
Re:Ground one end
One of the reasons for the 100 meter spec for distance of Ethernet runs is potential voltage. If you are on a ship with long runs of Ethernet, you should definately ground the shields using good straps to the hull or to studs that aren't covered in paint. I would ground both ends and perhaps along the middle. I'd also use something akin an APC ProtectNet or Tripp Lite DNET1. The longer the run, the higher the potential voltage on the line and ground these to the hull as well.
The shield, while it could carry a charge, is mostly about radiation -- into or out of the shielded cable. If you are running your Ethernet along power like the fool on the houseboat (inducting 60Hz into his Ethernet) you are asking for collisions, power spikes, etc. The potential charge on Ethernet conductors itself over longer runs probably will spell trouble all by itself without assistance from 60 cycle.
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How about a small UPS?
I've used one for a digital readout system before and it lasted for about 8 hours. I'm sure that APC would have something small that you could plug in and charge, then plug your hub in wherever you wanted to use it.
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Re:Writeback kicking it
No need to devise a way of sending out a power-down signal for those with APC UPSes. They have a product named PowerChute (and even a linux version!) that machines connected to a UPS can use to communicate to each other. It has configurable shutdown times, so mission critical servers can stay up for the longest time possible, while not so important ones can be shut down immediately. We use it extensively in my office, and it really lengthens the battery length on our UPS.
Also worth nothing -- we have our Exchange server begin shutdown almost immediately after the power goes out, as it takes exchange nearly 15 minutes just to shut down. We are actively looking for an alternative to Exchange. -
VA? Watts?
| The other thing that's irritating it that they
| rate these things in "VA" (watts?), when watt-
| hours would be a more useful to know.APC has published a white paper that explains the differences between Watts and Volt-Amps.
Further, it explains why VA are really more relevant when figuring out which UPS would look good on you.
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Re:Many IT jobs moved offshore ...
APS, Arizona's largest power company
APC? They're cutting information systems staff worldwide, including Ireland and India. -
A few suggestionsFor the size room you're making, instead of a raised floor, consider a cable tray (basically, a ladder a meter from the ceiling) in which you can lay cables. Raised floors are better, but also cost a mint and aren't always practical to install.
- Also, as everyone said, power. keep in mind that the UPSes you'll need probably don't plug into normal outlets; pick them out, and call the electrician - Hubble twist-lock-y things are what you need, but check out APC (and other) web sites for the specs on the plug; you don't need to know what they mean, just copy them carefully for the electrician.
- The portable air conditioners are nice, but still need drains - talk to the facilities people while you're doing the lay-out - if there are pipes in the walls in a convenient place, take advantage of them and put the A/C units by them.
- Don't worry too much about humidity. back in the day you had to 'cause there was paper in the computer rooms from the big line printers. i doubt you have that, so make sure the A/C people realize that and don't sell you super-fancy humidity controls that you likely don't need.
- As has been mentioned - a meter behind the racks, and 2 meters in front, computers are heavy and the more space you have the easier it will be to get them in the racks.
- IMO, don't use it for storage, no shelves, no drawers in the desk/table, etc. It's a machine room, not a storage room. Put the computers in, and stay the hell out. It's temping, since it's locked, and probably not full, etc. But don't do it, you'll lose control really fast, and it'll be a disaster.
- Again, power: circuits, and more circuits. However many you have, you don't have enough. One room I designed has two 30A circuits per rack, and in some cases that's not enough, mounted on the cable tray so cords don't go back to the wall behind the racks - remember, you need to be able to walk (and carry heavy things) back there.
- Also, in addition to a phone, put normal old network jacks in the walls. I know, you'll have switches in there somewhere, but probably not near where you want the desk, and nor does the cable tray go there. If you're having cabling done anyhow, a few jacks right near the patch panel are cheap and well worth it.
- Leave room for expansion, pack it as tight as you can. Remember, when you add hardware, you need to add A/C and maybe UPS and power. Leave lots of room. If you're over 60-70% full today, you're in trouble real soon now.
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ACPI Fix: Flash your BIOS...
You can get a "tweaked" bios that adds the ACPI on/off feature again. I got one for my KG7-RAID to fix some quirky hardware issues. Check www.biosmods.com Then, get a floppy disk, reboot, flash, and you're all set to go.* I found a great wealth of info (even for non-abit owners) at Paul's KG7FAQ
*Flashing the BIOS can be risky for the inexperienced. Don't lose power! (how?). -
Re:Point of failureI agree. 90% of all problems I believe are related (not necessarily caused by - but related) to unconditioned power. I use the cheap and effective yet less known about APC LINE-R line conditioners, up to 1250 VA. They can be had from places like www.pricewatch.com/ and http://www.streetprices.com/ for about $115-$130. Well worth it, but they offer no battery backup, but *superior* line conditioning, like the integrated line conditioners on their (APC) very high end UPS's. I'd rather pay for a superior conditioner than pay for some lead acid batteries, and inverter and a "regular" conditioner. The cheap UPS's use crappy relays and a fast clamp time, thus they are not "real." TO me anyway, with exacting standards. Watch the tolerance on "conditioned" output on cheap UPS's.
BACK to hard drives, I have had great success with both Maxtor and IBM, and reasonably high success with Seagate SCSI - just not Medalist drives or the types with the nasty-medalist fluid bearing design, some barracudas (none RECENT) suffer from this. I have seen many IDE drives fail, usually on lower memory systems when lots of thrashing / swapping occurs, and secretary's need to have every "office" application open along with www.revlon.com.
Outside of that, since I work in IT, I have seen obscene failure rates with Western Digital products - there are have been times when ONTRACK got $3000+ for someone's hard drive having been failed, needs the "CRITICAL" data, blah blah blah (learn to backup - beeeotch, need to be a BOFH.) Dell was putting these garbage 6GB WDs in the Optiplex systems for a while and were really good at saying F**k You when you wanted them to do something extra nice when the broken hard drive cost you money and downtime. Cute Dell.
Aside from the nasty 75GXP, particularly the ones made in Hungary, the new IBM drives and especially the 120GXP drives are simply superior in performance, I'll get back to you in a few months on MBTF on the 120GXP, but I don't suspect any problems, plus I do in fact check the SMART status with the superior IBM support disks to see if any shit is about to hit the fan. The 60GXP was very reliable, but I never got in more than 3-4 months on that one. None of my drives ever spin down or get shut off, I think cycling the power all the time can piss drives off as well - just a superstition. For Win32 victims, there is decent SMART Defender software to give you an early heads up, I'm sure some *nix variant of SMART polling has appeared or will, I just don't care to monitor *nix operations that carefully because impending hardware failure seems to be easier to see coming... Just a feeling.
Touching on power once again, I would also suggest a PC Power and Cooling (overpriced) or an ENERMAX power supply, there are many other decent vendors, but these seem to get the job done, have a medusa pile of wires - more than any case needs, and are relatively quiet and reliable.
Watch the temp on some of the hard drives as well, keeping the airflow good is essential. I kept an 18GB HDD on for almost 3 years straight until I got my 60GXP (soon to be upgraded to a 120GXP =), and I have had several SCSI drives in other machines as well, and thank goodness knock on wood never had any HDD failure.
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Re:Eeesh
Especially the ones with phone jacks (if you're stuck with dialup).
It's not just for dialup, DSL comes over phone lines thus surge protecting that stuff is also a good idea. If you have cable modem, then you can also surge protect that (probably a good idea to surge protect your cable TV line even if you don't have a cable modem). Plus, you should surge protect ethernet (BP280s as well as others have this) around servers and if you're sharing a LAN maybe with a neighbor or something like that. -
APC MasterSwitch
APC makes something pretty close to what you're asking for.
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APC UPS's will
Most decent APC UPS's will give you a power consumption figure if you use their UPS managment software (which is free for Linux). http://www.apcc.com/products/management/pcp_linux
. cfm. Or you could get a DMM and go a little ad hoc work yourself (don't know how electronically inclined you are, I would have to break out some college notes myself). -
One company sizes online
PcPowerCooling.com has a few web pages to cycle through that does some power supply sizing. You pick what type of power supply, how big a case, how many CPUs, RAM, disks, and it suggests. And they sell some really good stuff.
And while I'm on the topic of selector web pages, APCC.Com also has some interesting selectors. UPS, Cable, surge, and other things.
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Re:Don't trust thisI usually don't respond to stuff like this, but...
Let me prefix this with I fully agree that the closer you can get to a True Sine Wave UPS, the better. However, I fully feel that my original comment is correct and true.
A couple of Data Points:
Almost all UPS manufacturers include a Equipment Protection Warranty. If the UPS's bad waveform fries your equipment they will replace it. See http://www.apcc.com/support/service/equipment_pro
t ection_policy.cfm for an example. If the pseudo-sinewave that they put out really caused that much grief do you think they would warrant your equipment against damage up to $25,000?Also, the first thing all modern switching power supplies do is to rectify the incoming AC and then filter it with a capacitor, ending up with about 370 or so volts DC, which it then chops up to produce the lower +- 3.3-12 Volts used in PC's. The resulting output of the rectifier and Filter Cap (and power factor correcttion, EMI/RFI filtering, etc. etc. etc.) is virtually identical regardless of the input waveform - whether sine or pseudo-sine. I would have to do some nasty math to determine which waveform would be better - my guess is that it would be a toss up.
For a more technical information than you probably ever wanted to know about switching power supplies, I wholehartedly recommend the ON Semiconductor SWITCHMODE Power Supply Reference Manual at http://www.onsemi.com/pub/Collateral/SMPSRM-D.PDF
I'll also stand by my statement about motors. I'll restate to make myself more clear: Switchmode Power Supplies and UPS's get along just fine. Anything else you might have problems with.
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The right way to do this. APCIf you have any funds to spend on doing this right, and any interest in your insurance company paying out if your rack goes up in flames, do this right...
Something like the APC MasterSwitch, for about US$60/outlet.
Supports serial control, and has built-in ethernet with SNMP, HTTP, telnet access. You can assign individual usernames and passwords with access to any one or a group of outlets. SNMP traps on invalid passwords or SNMP community strings so you can detect hacking attempts.
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Re:Not quite what you asked for, but ...
I'm also not quite sure what the original poster wants, but when a box in a cabinet gets so unhappy that it's not controllable via the network, I use APC's MasterSwitch, which is basically and eight-plug power strip with an ethernet jack and the ability to turn the outlets on and off individually.
I have also heard interesting things about the watchdog cards that have Linux drivers in the kernel, although I've never used them myself.
Both these solutions strike me as ugly, but I guess it beats driving to a colloc in the middle of the night. -
Re:Not to be critical, but . . .
Woah woah woah, "not everybody can afford a backup generator"? If your ISP or the place where you stash your webservers don't have a UPS (battery powered uninteruptable power supply--APC is the best) then you shouldn't be hosting there. UPSes can be bought for $1-2000, as well as reasonably sized generators I might add, and if your business can't spend that as a necessary cost then it will not last long. If you find yourself needing a generator more than once every two months, you need to move locations.
I hate to preach, but in critical situations there are essentials like automated backups, virus checkings, and stable®ulated power. If you have not enough money to have a T1 but more money than $20/month for hosting, consider colocation. This is a safer alternative because you can inspect the facilities in person before you sign up or get into contracts. Buyer beware
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MasterSwitch
At a former ISP job in Maine, we used the APC MasterSwitch to handle the remote power admin on our primary servers. The device acts as a normal UPS, but contains a simple web server allowing access to remotely power cycle any of it's 8(?) outlets.
Pros:
The device allows for quick and simple access, updates, and additions to the configuration. It boasts a serial port on the unit for local administration and diagnostics. In general, it's an overall quick fix and has a sleek interface.
Cons:
IIRC, the price tag on this device isn't exactly pretty ($699). Going this route requires (obviously) new hardware & some possible legwork, as I don't recall how friendly this unit is on the network. If you "forget" the root password, APC does have a tool to reset it, however, this can only be done at an APC location.
We found this solution more practical and flexable then phone units (ring once, ring twice, reboot).
Brandon Crafts
bcrafts@SyPahoAoM.com