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I'm not Apple fan boy but don't see how a patent from Apple stops other products. It just adds to the cost. If the product is that great, all they need is to get a license from Apple and pass the cost on to you. I am sure Apple is willing to see other companies adopt their technology. Works great for Panasonic, Philips, Sony with Blu-Ray.

Personally I think that handing over security to Microsoft is like asking the Hell's Angels to provide security at a Rolling Stones concert.

Thanks for pointing this out, and correcting me. It sounds like Sony would still get the benefit of licensing fees

No, a neutral Blu-Ray forum gets the licensing fees. Sony makes money the old fashioned way, selling hardware and software (media).

Do you know why this (Java support) a big deal to Microsoft? It doesn't sound like there's any practical reason to me

Why don't know why but we know it's a big deal to Microsoft, because the only thing that stopped HD-DVD and Blu-Ray combining a few years back was the refusial of the Blu-Ray consortium to add iHD (Microsofts menuing format) into the Blu-Ray standard.

Well, if you want to argue semantics, LG doesn't have an 'EULA' for Blu-Ray; it's a 'FLLA' or 'Format and Logo Licence Agreement'.

http://www.blu-raydisc.info/license_info/rewritabl e/flla.htm :

Under FLLA, licensee will be granted a license to use the Blu-ray Disc Format Specifications and Blu-ray Disc Logo to develop, manufacture, use or sell the products categorized as follows.

Unfortunatly, in order to read the licence, you have to pay to get one which is either $15k or $2.5k, I'm not quite sure... Either way it's a smidge out of my price range so I can only hazard a guess to what might be in it.

True, they do get liscencing fees (all the info you could ever want about that is here) But Sony is (according to that website) obligated by the same liscencing aggreements and must pay the same fees. So even if we ignore that the the Assoc. itself needs some amount of money from the fees to maintain itself, those fees are still split up among atleast the Board of Directors. Which is enough to warrent an assumption that Sony couldn't survive solely on a cut of the liscencing fees. The real money in Blu-Ray for Sony would come in the form of what essentially boils down to a rebate on its liscencing fees plus whatever they get from the actual media sale.

Ergo my initial conclusion that the PS3's success depends on the games, not the relativly few Sony Blu-Ray disks. I suppose I could have been a bit clearer why I discounted the other blu-ray disks towards Sony's success with the PS3 (as the presence of Blu-Ray disks and Sony's machine playing Blu-Rays does not necessitate a success for the PS3, only disks made by Sony can contribute any real measurable success to the PS3 as are the only disks that significantly feedback into the PS3 production loop.) In any case, the real, true success will come because of games, Blu-Ray is an augmentation but Sony has clearly said they intended the added functionality to lead into blu-ray (atleast they have said so significantly more so than vice versa.)

On the larger scale, yes, any disk sale benefits Sony and moves them towards success. But they don't affect the PS3's profitability because their impact is blunted by other available options and relativly small ability to contribute directly back to the PS3 cost. Its the same idea as saying Sony's blu-ray player would not have impacted the PS3 if it had come out on time or not.

Sony, by appointment by the above Blu-ray Disc Association Board of Directors as the Blu-ray Disc License Entity is responsible for Blu-ray Disc Information Agreement (IA) and Blu-ray Disc License Agreement.

Nine leading companies have jointly established the basic specifications for a next generation large capacity optical disc video recording format called "Blu-ray Disc". The Blu-ray Disc enables the recording, rewriting and play back of up to 27 gigabytes (GB) of data on a single sided single layer 12cm CD/DVD size disc using a 405nm blue-violet laser.

"Blu-ray Disc" Key Characteristics

1) Large recording capacity up to 27GB (single sided single layer).
2) High-speed data transfer rate 36Mbps.
3) Easy to use disc cartridge.

The companies established the basic specifications for the Blu-ray Disc are:

* Hitachi, Ltd.
* LG Electronics Inc.
* Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Ltd.
* Pioneer Corporation
* Royal Philips Electronics
* Samsung Electronics Co., Ltd.
* Sharp Corporation
* Sony Corporation
* Thomson