Slashdot Mirror

And help increase the noise for any autoprofilers:
http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=bush%20schedu le%20june
http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=how%20to%20ma ke%20a%20pipe%20bomb
http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=world+trade+cente r+memorial
http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=anfo+igniter

And to any CIA employees: my commendations on your impeccable information gathering systems, and have a nice day!

And help increase the noise for any autoprofilers:
http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=bush%20schedu le%20june
http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=how%20to%20ma ke%20a%20pipe%20bomb
http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=world+trade+cente r+memorial
http://search.yahoo.com/search?p=anfo+igniter

And to any CIA employees: my commendations on your impeccable information gathering systems, and have a nice day!

There has been a net warming of the earth over the last century and a half, and our greenhouse gas emissions are contributing at some level. Both of these statements are almost certainly true.

Judging from the media in recent months, the debate over global warming is now over. There has been a net warming of the earth over the last century and a half, and our greenhouse gas emissions are contributing at some level. Both of these statements are almost certainly true. What of it? Recently many people have said that the earth is facing a crisis requiring urgent action. This statement has nothing to do with science. There is no compelling evidence that the warming trend we've seen will amount to anything close to catastrophe. What most commentators--and many scientists--seem to miss is that the only thing we can say with certainly about climate is that it changes. The earth is always warming or cooling by as much as a few tenths of a degree a year; periods of constant average temperatures are rare. Looking back on the earth's climate history, it's apparent that there's no such thing as an optimal temperature--a climate at which everything is just right. The current alarm rests on the false assumption not only that we live in a perfect world, temperaturewise, but also that our warming forecasts for the year 2040 are somehow more reliable than the weatherman's forecast for next week.
--snip--
Moreover, actions taken thus far to reduce emissions have already had negative consequences without improving our ability to adapt to climate change. An emphasis on ethanol, for instance, has led to angry protests against corn-price increases in Mexico, and forest clearing and habitat destruction in Southeast Asia. Carbon caps are likely to lead to increased prices, as well as corruption associated with permit trading. (Enron was a leading lobbyist for Kyoto because it had hoped to capitalize on emissions trading.) The alleged solutions have more potential for catastrophe than the putative problem. The conclusion of the late climate scientist Roger Revelle--Al Gore's supposed mentor--is worth pondering: the evidence for global warming thus far doesn't warrant any action unless it is justifiable on grounds that have nothing to do with climate.

Lindzen is the Alfred P. Sloan Professor of Meteorology at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. His research has always been funded exclusively by the U.S. government. He receives no funding from any energy companies.

Why should I bother? I'll let an MIT professor do it.

Wow! Who do I believe? A magazine by politicians or the Alfred P. Sloan Professor of Meteorology at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. His research has always been funded exclusively by the U.S. government, and receives no funding from any energy companies.

Do you really think that going against the group-think would win Libertarians any votes?

You obviously never heard about this. I believe this level of fear and response would be greatly increased if people were hearing stuff from the ground or using it for web surfing. The idea is that it would give people a lot of people information that might cause panic, and a mass panic on an airplane is not exactly a good place to have one.

Also, this fear the web thing is a bit over-stated on your part, considering some planes are going to begin having internet access, which short of shoots down the entire argument of this guy. There is far more information available via the internet then in any phone call. I think the real reason is they do not want to have any people chattering away and people complaining about them talking too loudly.

As for your terrorists comment, you simply ignore what the author is trying to say. He is saying this lack of wireless devices on airplanes is bullshit, because if they would take down planes, terrorists would have tested every device possible to try to interfere with equipment and see if you cannot bring a plane to the ground. You really should spend less time at Digg.

You are indeed correct. JetBlue landing gear mishap.

A Prius starts at around $22K. What kind of new car can you buy for ~$7500? Will it have all the features that are in the $22K Prius? Will it be a deathtrap compared to a Prius? You do realize that there still is a tax credit for Priuses of $787.50 per http://www.irs.gov/newsroom/article/0,,id=157557,0 0.html and http://www.aceee.org/transportation/hybtaxcred.htm #table. It was $1575 before 3/31/07 and before that it was $3150.

As for "35 mpg" cheap city car, what mileage #s are you quoting? The current EPA mileage estimates are quite overinflated, esp. city. For example, when Consumer Reports tested an 06 Civic EX w/1.8L 4 and 5 speed auto, they got 18 city, 43 highway for an overall mileage of 28 mpg. They hybrid version got 26 city, 47 highway, 37 overall. You can see a list of vehicles w/top gas mileage at http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/cars/buyingleas ing/most-fuelefficient-cars-206/index.htm. The only one that even gets 35 city is the Prius. The next best get 28 or 26 mpg city. The Yaris is a crap car and the Honda Fit is very slow (even slower than a Prius).

Consumer Reports found a shortfall in mileage for 90% of the vehicles they tested http://autos.msn.com/advice/CRArt.aspx?contentid=4 023460.

The regenerative braking really cuts down on brake wear. If you're light on the brakes, you're doing regen almost the whole time until you're down below ~5 mph when the Prius switches to friction brakes. There are documented cases where Prius owners are still on the original pads after 100K miles. That's a pretty significant cost savings in itself.

Last year, IBM reported over $18 billion in revenue from Software alone. Which is more total revenue than Oracle, SAP, and every other software company not named Microsoft earned last year. I'd say IBM already is great software company (or at least a large one).

Last year, IBM reported over $18 billion in revenue from Software alone. Which is more total revenue than Oracle, SAP, and every other software company not named Microsoft earned last year. I'd say IBM already is great software company (or at least a large one).

I bet they'll have sex with Chris Hansen.

I'm reminded of the gruesome story about the chimp that mauled a man, chewing his genitals off.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7087194/

If we grant chimps "human rights" then does the chimp get the same due process as humans? How would you try the chimp with a jury of his peers?

What if the chimp wants to marry? What if some guy wants to marry the chimp? Yeah, yeah, these obviously aren't regarded as basic human rights at this time, but you can see what a slippery slope this can become.

I wonder what kind of shielding they're going to have to add to pass government safety regulations. Boeing's new 787 had to scrap their wifi plans and change to ethernet, simply because the shielding weighed significantly more than the wired infastructure. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16831581/

A jerk talking on his cellphone while I'm trying to enjoy a quiet plane ride.

Personally, I'd rather have a cell phone jerk on a plane sitting next to me than a screaming child ten rows away from me.

Of course with the "THINK OF CHILDREN!" attitude, no one throws unruly children off the plane. Oh wait... They did once

But I personally wish people they would have an airline that allowed only those 10 or older and charge a bit more. I don't know why movie theaters do that either...

No, not the UK. The USA extradites its citizens to Mexico instead.
Dog' the Bounty Hunter loses extradition battle

Not sure which car you mean, but VW have several efficient small cars. Here in the UK, the smallest current VW is the Fox and it can get about 45 mpg (combined) - I think that's an imperial gallon, not US. There was a Lupo 3L a couple of years back that was even better - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Lupo

Recently, VW have unveiled the Polo Bluemotion, which is a slightly bigger car than the Fox but can achieve over 70 mpg, and emits 102 grams CO2/km (less than the Prius) and it's not even a hybrid. http://www.volkswagen.co.uk/company/press/feb06_bl uemotion

For those wanting a bigger car, there'll be a Passat Bluemotion later this year - 55 mpg for a family saloon. http://motorshow.cars.uk.msn.com/motorshow/geneva2 007/Article.aspx?cp-documentid=3820465

Ugh. Come on, dude. Google is your friend when it comes to this kind of thing. It is not horribly difficult to find the incident that the GP was referring to. Even if the sources are biased, it serves as a launchpad to discover the truth. As for your "one isolated incident" rhetoric, that also happens to be one of the great things about the internet. You can find out things that some people don't necessarily want you to know. As for what to make of it all, you have to judge the evidence and draw your own conclusions.

The NEWSWEEK Poll, conducted March 28-March 29, has a margin of error of plus or minus 4 percentage points for questions based on all registered voters and plus or minus 6 percentage points for results based on registered Republicans and Republican leaners. In conducting the poll, Princeton Survey Research Associates International interviewed 1,004 adults aged 18 and older.

The NEWSWEEK Poll, conducted March 28-March 29, has a margin of error of plus or minus 4 percentage points for questions based on all registered voters and plus or minus 6 percentage points for results based on registered Republicans and Republican leaners. In conducting the poll, Princeton Survey Research Associates International interviewed 1,004 adults aged 18 and older.

WOW, I can hardly figure out where to start here.
HOSTS?
"When was the last time terrorists killed someone over the internet?!"
That feature is in beta - coming soon !!!
"It isn't about terrorism at all. It is about control and about policing the rest of the world."
If you repeat a word over and over enough (terrorism), it loses meaning, is trivialized.
It IS about control.
DNS is part of that control. (think bypass, sieve)
What if you HAD to pull the plugs?
Think about that, I'll wait.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYGKV1MaIaY

(God, I love the internet :-)
"Should U.S. DHS be trusted?"
Better question is about the policies of the Bush (v2.1b) administration.
Question authority. Talk to power, carry a big stick, etc.
Ummmm, what was the topic?
DNS (Mockapetris-Postel), right.
Defeat? With your own invention? (ARPANET)
http://www.dei.isep.ipp.pt/~acc/docs/arpa.html
Talk about shooting yourself in the foot and having a name such as "Smith" or "Wesson".
Apathy, lack of awareness and naivety is the greatest enemy.
We're (U.S.) so good at picking up the pieces.
Education, prevention, awareness - not so good.
Some need to understand you can use the internet to harm people - physically.
It's called a malicious Logic Bomb.
It IS rocket science.
Ask your ex SysAdmin about them.
Bios, Firmware, Flash memory, chip crowding, reconfigure with malice, and watch it burn.
Been there, seen that. Do that on a National scale and you have a society meltdown right in front of your eyes, wait two days - stir.
People were writing these things for hardware in the 80's and 90's, X-platform.
Remember all that talk of "hardware eating viruses" that would crop up occasionally, and how that person would be flamed out of the thread?
Ridicule and denial ... the American way. Fingers in ears -la-la-la-la-la-la-la-la.
There are no unbelievers on the battlefield.
"The truly powerful signing key is for Windows Update"
Why would you want any of that when you own the hardware?
Think (rouge) Eastereggs:
Microcode:
Disguised Bugs:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Easter_egg_(media)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hidden_track
http://www.acm.org/classics/sep95/

Really, people have no idea what's going on now.
I've been banging this drum since 1997.
The NSA/CIA/DHS is starting to trickle out awareness of this very thing.
Joel Brenner - The National Counterintelligence Strategy of the United States 2007, speaking last Thursday at the American Bar Association.
(He speaks about the hardware problem near the end)

http://www.abanet.org/natsecurity/multimedia/2007/ breakfasts/joel_brenner_transcript.pdf
http://www.abanet.org/natsecurity/multimedia/2007/ breakfasts/joel_brenner.mp3
http://www.abanet.org/natsecurity/

Richard Clarke on Countdown with Keith Olbermann
Jan 22, 2007

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16771741/

CLARKE: ... China is building cyber warfare units. The Chinese general said publicly that if we get into hostilities with the United States, we will reach out through cyber space and turn off the American electric power grid. From what I can tell and what I learned when I was in government, that's possible.
Not just China.
I'll play Chicken Little, you ... think about it.
I'll wait.

Not so fast ... the current pope is a fan of Intelligent Design: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10007382/

The poll numbers themselves suggest that faith in God and belief in evolution are not even close to mutually exclusive: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17875540/site/newsweek /

Scroll down to numbers 12 and 13, those relevant to this discussion. Evangelical protestants are the only group which are overwhelmingly against evolution. Majorities of the other Christian groups believe that evolution did occur, but that God probablity had his hand in it. The nonevangelical groups answered the evolution being well founded/accepted question significantly more in the affirmative than in the negative.

The issue is that the evangelical protestants constitute the largest Christian group in America.

Grr, I'm a damn fool. Link to raw poll results.

It appears the 48% statistic given by slashdot and the MSNBC / Newsweek article may have been transcribed incorrectly by the journalist summarizing the data. According to the poll data tables (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17875540/site/newswee k/) (see table 13) linked from the original article, the 48% is actually the number of people who said evolution is 'Well-supported.'

Also from the same table:
--39% think evolution is 'Not well supported.'
--13% 'don't know.'

But this doesn't change my opinion that it's still a rather poor poll question.

You have to click through a few links to get to it, but the actual poll states:

13. Do you think the scientific theory of evolution is well-supported by evidence and widely accepted within the scientific community?

Well-supported: 48%
Not well-supported: 39%
Don't Know: 13%

It looks like the submitter got mixed up with the two stats that were both 48%.

Disclaimer: This quote has been modified from the original version. It has been reformatted to fit within Slashdot's HTML limits.

12. Which one of the following statements come closest to your views about the origin and development of human beings? Humans developed over millions of years from less advanced forms of life, but God guided this process (or) Humans developed over millions of years from less advanced forms of life, but God had no part in this process (or) God created humans pretty much in the present form at one time within the last 10,000 years or so?

Right. The problem is that evolution goes really, really slow. We can't see hit happen in real-time, so it's hard for some people to see what is happening. The exact same thing happened before, when religious poeple were prosecuting scientists who said that the earth was not flat.

No sane religious person will argue that the earth is flat now, and hopefully the same will be the end of the story with this resistance to the results of extended and detailed scientific study into about how natural life on earth evolves.

The vatican gets it, but I guess the people who don't get it are the same people who think that being religious and being pro any kind of war can mix.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10101394/
http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/01/18/news/evolut ion.php

Do you think the scientific theory of evolution is well-supported by evidence and widely accepted within the scientific community?

48% said the scientific theory of evolution IS well-supported. This is diametrically opposed to the /. editor's summary, "Given the straightforward question, 'Is evolution well-supported by evidence and widely accepted within the scientific community?', some 48% of Americans said 'No.'"

Am I missing something here?

Read the source poll instead:
  http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17875540/site/newsweek /

The article is inaccurate: it's only 39% of americans who reject evolution and 48% accept it. Still, the poll shows clearly how these things cannot be polled reliably over a quick phone conversation: people need to think before they answer. According to the poll, 40% of ATHEISTS say they believe either that God created us in our current form, or that God guided our evolution process over millions of years. I repeat: 40% of ATHEISTS say that God helped in our creation.

90% of Americans believe there is a God. Does believing in a God, but accepting evolution a contradictory statement? On the surface it is yes. But I do not think we have a full grasp of humanity and how long we have been around.
 
The possibilities of many civilizations over a long period of time before 6000 years ago is fully possible. If 90% of people believe there is a God, would not their God control time as well? Could not God create and destory man as many times as he wanted? Our history with God as we know it only goes back 6000 years or so. But this is just "as we know it".
 
Man at the beginning of time was not concerned of logging his events in history. Mainly because it was the least of his concerns (food and survival were far more important) Also i've questioned, does genetic code mean we actually evolved from somthing? Think about it, genetics is just tiny bits and pieces to a whole puzzle. if you use some of the same puzzle to make somthing else, it does not mean it has "evolved". Look at the chimera goats with human kidneys growing in them. These goats did not 'evolve' but now will have partial human genetics from our intervention. Just some thoughts..

Very interesting! But I wonder, humans have a longer lifespan than most animals, how is this possible if they are low on a essential vitamin? Could the genetic "defect" actually be a "feature" to enable a longer life? Or a more developed brain? (I'm ignoring the list of other animals you gave here.)

Recent studies actually indicate that vitamin supplements are quite useless, and sometimes even unhealthy. And as a personal anectdotal comment: I've been taking vitamins like crazy for many years. I always got my cold in winter anyway. (Now I hardly get any colds anymore, my personal protection against it is drinking a lot of tea and water.)

Hmm.... sounds nasty.

Each of the ~1200 superconducting magnets is about 50 foot long. There's a photo here showing one being put in place (March 2005):
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7119458/

Here you go Coped, Try Google, this is only one reference there are plenty more including papers in "peer reviewed journals" of the time for whatever that is worth.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15391426/site/newsweek /

Just because you were a kid and not paying attention at the time doesn't mean it didn't happen and by the way, MULTIPLE times....

However, this IS the first time (to my knowledge) that we have had the hubris to decide it's entirely our work.

Try looking up the little Ice age in Europe then take a look at the history of the Sahara.
The planetary climate is more than just a little bit variable.

Mind you, I STILL think that reducing energy use, pollution & yadda is a good idea.

Half the USA wants evolution out of the classroom and ban scientific research.

Next they'll take the telescopes away because they are 'Tools of Blasphemy!'

Kansas, not a scientific powerhouse?

Remember to have some BONG HITS 4 JESUS !

People have already shut down sheep-cities by leaving harmless, if not offensive, marketing collateral around.

Right now, I have a hard time believing that TerroristsTM have any significant interest in attacking the mainland United States or Britain. What would be the point? They've already proven they can do it and worried the public and governments to the point that our freedoms are being eroded daily.

Right now it might 'only' be video cameras. Soon it could be a McCarthy-style witch hunt seeking out those who disagree with a practically endless war in the Middle East or with the slow loss of rights in the homeland. It can all lead to having to check in and check out with a centralized network when we're going somewhere or doing something.

People are so obsessed with the bearded Jihadi coming to get them that they are willing to go along with everything.

This message brought to you by FEAR!

the Keithies. Current voting is in the "Stuff That You Missed on the TVs that the Internets Made Famous" category.

"Joshua Kinberg, creator of Bikes Against Bush, was arrested in NYC [original link 404d] for vandalism while being interviewed by MSNBC. Kinberg's website describes his project as 'using a Wireless Internet-enabled bicycle outfitted with a custom-designed printing device, the Bikes Against Bush bicycle can print text messages sent from web users directly onto the streets of Manhattan in water-soluble chalk". Both Wired and Popular Science [original link changed] have done stories on Kinberg's work." Update: 08/30 01:30 GMT by J : Mr. Kinberg has been released; he describes his arrest and brief stay behind bars on this MSNBC blog.

The idea is to load the drivers license with information proving citizenship

For the love of all that is right in the world, stop trying to use them for more than they were designed.

* By used, I mean to offer evidence to the person 'using' it that the possessor has permission to drive on the roads. It's only evidence, it's not conclusive. Using it for other things (e.g. checking age at a bar) is foolish.

** For instance, checking the car's registration against the DMV database to see if the driver's name, address, tags, and VIN line up.

Hmm... they want to be able to meet with a ten-year-old girl in person. Now I may have been around the seedier sides of the internet a bit too much, but does that sound a little disturbing to you?

A nervous-looking man wearing a conservative suit and carrying a briefcase enters an ordinary suburban home. He hears the "ten year old" he's arranged to meet call that she will be down in a minute as soon as she fetches her MP3 player.

He is startled when Chris Hansen enters the room...

Honestly though, I'm starting to feel like some sort of devious anti-industry genius has infiltrated the RIAA and is brilliantly coordinating a devastating bad-publicity campaign.

The original article is an opinion piece for a small college newspaper. The whole article is garbage. 1. Take the "spitting distance" mileage, for example. The new EPA combined mileage put the Chevy Aveo at 26 mpg, the Toyota Prius at 46 mpg. So I guess 20 miles more per gallon is "spitting distance." 2. The "Dust-to-dust" study is from a marketing firm, not a science journal. It arrives at an artificially high cost for the Prius by assigning it an arbitrary lifespan of 100k miles, and a Hummer 300k miles. There's Prius being used as cabs that have 200k on them now: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8839690/ And, insofar as a car lasting, what car do you expect to repair less? A Toyota Prius or a GM Hummer? You can check Consumer Reports for the answer to that one. A good analysis of the flaws in dust-to-dust is available at: http://www.truedelta.com/blog/?p=48 3. The Sudbury info is seriously outdated, and the comment about moon buggies (like, when did Nasa test moon buggies -- early 1970's) ought to have given the author a clue. Sudbury was polluted by a century of mining (1870 on). In fact, some of Sudbury's nickel went into making the Statue of Liberty. Currently, the mine is owned by INCO (not Toyota), and produces 100,000 tons of nickel a year, of which Toyota buys 1% (1000 tons). Nickel, by the way, is primarily used to make stainless steel. The Mail on Sunday newspaper, which ran the story the college article is a thin re-write of (visible here http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/articles/ news/news.html?in_article_id=417227&in_page_id=177 0 ), used a stock photo from 1994 to illustrate the pollution (visible here http://www.photoboy.com/bin/Cklb?vmo=1173985067754 ). There were, of course, no Prius in existence or being manufactured in 1994. Sudbury is no longer as polluted, as INCO and the city have planted over 8 million trees there since 1979. The best history online of the Sudbury devastation/reforestation comes from GM Canada (the trees were all cut down in 1871 to help rebuild Chicago after the fire), and it provides telling photos of some of the reclamation from 1979 to present. http://www.gmcanada.com/inm/gmcanada/english/about /MissionGreen/Daily/Sep22.html The acid rain problem David Martin of Greenpeace is talking about in is the situation pre 1972. INCO on regreening and SO2 emissions http://www.inco.com/development/community/profiles /sudbury/default.aspx

Yes, he says he resigned.
His employer says says he was fired.

Does it really matter? He was shown the door, one way or another.

"You're shifting the definition of "unicorn"."

Nope. They are just really small unicorns.

"Because that's not how medical science works. If you want to sell your snake oil as healthy, it's up to you to prove it has the effects you claim without any detractions."

We already have people on Atkins diet. Have had them for years. But studying the health-effects on the diet on them is "not how medical science works"? Then what are we supposed to do then? If it's wrong to study whether Atkins is dangerous or not, then there's not much to be done, is there? That way people could keep on claiming that it might be dangerous. And if someone tried to actually study the issue, we would get complaints saying "That's not how medical science works".

"I'm not interested in spending my time debunking crackpot diets any more than historians want to spend time debunking moon landing or holocaust deniers."

First you compared Atkins to anorexia, and now you are comparing it to Holocaust-deniers? Is it just me, or are you starting to lose it? And if you are "not interested in spending my time debunking crackpot diets", why are you taking part in this discussion then?

And what makes it a "crackpot diet"? It obviously works. As to health-concerns... The best you came up with is "it MIGHT be dangerous". Hardly a damning evidence I was looking for. As to evidence to the contrary:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15625548/

I have now linked to one study that showed that Atkins IS effective method of losing weight. I also linked to a study that disputes the claim that it's dangerous. What next?

Sorry, I wasn't trying to draw an American vs Japanese argument, just it seems to boil down to such many a times.

So sure, considering hybrids first started selling ~1997, and the most popular version is the 2004 generation of the Prius, 7-8 years for battery replacement is pulled out of nothing; do the math.

I don't know how much energy is used to create the battery, but the battery is fully recycled (Toyota offers $200 bounty), it has a 150K mi warranty in California (100K in some other states). Also, the battery SoC is kept between 40% and 80% constantly with no deep-cycling under normal usage, it's not mistreated like a cel-phone/laptop battery, and so tends to last a long time as current real history is proving. No Prius has had it's battery replaced due to age yet.

Batteries cost $3000 USD retail ignoring junk yards for parts, and the price of technology constantly deflating due to economies of scale and such.

A well-known Canadian taxi driver has already bruised up his taxi Prius well over 200Km http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8839690/ with no battery replacement.

It's relatively safe to say a Prius will last as long as any other vehicle on the road under normal care which happens to be a lot of just rotate tires and oil and not much else.

If find it strange some single out the Prius when most don't even keep their other vehicles past 10 years. I think the energy calculations should include the amount needed to produce the gasoline used by the vehicle by the amount the vehicle uses, lifetime.

Then some personal hard numbers (making me probably biased :P):
$3743.90 petro
$ 144.20 oil
$ 740.05 service
$ 356.22 tire replacement
$4984.37 total over 62399K miles ~ $0.08 per mi.

Maybe it's "The Age" that needs to be supporting its position with real numbers...

And then there's a 2005 Civic LX, also with 330,000 miles. They want $15,000 for it?!?!

What were these cars used for? Cabs? Cross country couriering?!?

Thirty years ago it was rare to expect any car, let alone a US built one, to last much more than 150k. Manufacturing has greatly improved. Even manufacturers that build ``below average'' vehicles are putting out product that lasts far longer than the bad old days. There is no prima facie reason that a Hummer wouldn't last for 300k miles given that, unlike the Prius, Hummers don't have uber-expensive batteries that will almost certainly need to be replaced at 100k miles.

http://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&safe=of f&q=foxpro+%22close+button+disable%22
-- 2 of the 3 are link farms
http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=foxpro+%22clo se+button+disable%22&FORM=MSNH
-- both of the links are valid.

Luckily, I just happened to have searched for this yesterday!

To err is human, to really f-up requires root.

From , "nine months worth of information concerning the yearly payout from the Alaska Permanent Fund was gone."

Really? Why is the that the oil money payouts or the military contract accounts are the only ones that ever get deleted? The IRS is using the same database that they've been using for the past fifty plus years, but they never seem to have that problem.