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In the UK we also have a system called TrafficMaster [trafficmaster.co.uk] which analyses traffic flow for their satnav services. There is, however, nothing to prevent them working with the stores to cross-reference number-plates against traffic flow. So now the store can find out exactly where you're driving as well.

That kind of information is something I never signed up for & one of the reasons I'll never have a store loyalty card.

Satnavs are a boon for low stress driving. Handling the traffic on top of that is just great. If you do a lot of driving I recommend it heartily. It saves masses of time a load of fuel and best of all, zero stress. Doesn't stop left or right turns, but all of a sudden there are very few traffic jams.

http://www.trafficmaster.co.uk/

In the UK we call these systems ANPR (automatic number plate recognition), and here they're already deployed in large numbers by private companies and the government/police.

On my average commute to work (~10 miles suburban England) I pass through five fixed government ANPR catchplates (tinfoilhat theory: officially to monitor traffic flow rates, but reputedly linked back to our intelligence organisations), two Trafficmaster ANPR catchplates (a private traffic monitoring company) and a number of petrol/gas station systems too - for example the local Sainsbury's supermarket petrol/gas station has them installed by each pump, and you can actually see the plates as they get recognised by the system behind the counter - according to stickers plastered over the pumps they're apparently "automatically checked against a Police database as you drive up to the pump". The police may also be out and about with their portable ANPR setup which talks to the vehicle licensing and taxation systems.

Additionally ANPR is also used for camera based speed monitoring and automatic fine generation over a baseline using a system called SPECS

Incidentally, according to wikipedia every car trip in the UK is now recorded by an ANPR system.

Individually owned and run systems probably aren't much of a threat to civil liberties anyway, it's when that information is networked and shared that things start to get scary... It's too probably far late to worry about this here in the UK anyway :(

It's been done:
http://www.trafficmaster.co.uk/page.cfm?key=traffi cproducts

(never used their products, bought their stock or worked for them, but I've driven past their cameras plenty of times).

Some references from the Trafficmaster web site that confirm that the Blue Poles do read number plates.

http://www.trafficmaster.co.uk/page.cfm?key=networ k

A new sensor technology was developed for the trunk routes - Passive Target Flow Measurement (PTFM). Using video-based technology, the sensor head captures the centre digits of a vehicle number plate and converts them to an electronic 'tag'. This tag is then followed down the road, from sensor to sensor enabling the time to travel a known distance to be computed.

http://www.trafficmaster.co.uk/page.cfm?key=networ k_ptfm-network

Trunk roads use a different technology to cater for the different traffic patterns experienced on such roads. Traffic turns off at junctions and may stop in lay-bys, at shopping centres etc, so simple speed measurement would not generate quality data. Passive Target Flow Measurement (PTFM) uses number plate recognition technology to ''grab'' the four centre digits of a vehicle number plate. This is turned into a four figure electronic ''tag'' on site - no number plate data is retained.

As the vehicle proceeds along the road and passes the next site(s), average journey times between sites are calculated and sophisticated computer programmes establish the speed of the traffic over those ''links''. In a seamless process, traffic speed on that particular section of road is then delivered to the traffic information product.

Some references from the Trafficmaster web site that confirm that the Blue Poles do read number plates.

http://www.trafficmaster.co.uk/page.cfm?key=networ k

A new sensor technology was developed for the trunk routes - Passive Target Flow Measurement (PTFM). Using video-based technology, the sensor head captures the centre digits of a vehicle number plate and converts them to an electronic 'tag'. This tag is then followed down the road, from sensor to sensor enabling the time to travel a known distance to be computed.

http://www.trafficmaster.co.uk/page.cfm?key=networ k_ptfm-network

Trunk roads use a different technology to cater for the different traffic patterns experienced on such roads. Traffic turns off at junctions and may stop in lay-bys, at shopping centres etc, so simple speed measurement would not generate quality data. Passive Target Flow Measurement (PTFM) uses number plate recognition technology to ''grab'' the four centre digits of a vehicle number plate. This is turned into a four figure electronic ''tag'' on site - no number plate data is retained.

As the vehicle proceeds along the road and passes the next site(s), average journey times between sites are calculated and sophisticated computer programmes establish the speed of the traffic over those ''links''. In a seamless process, traffic speed on that particular section of road is then delivered to the traffic information product.

This private company has erected thousands of cameras on blue poles on major roads around the UK. They scan the number plates of cars, and (allegedly) strip off the leading and trailing alpha-numeric, encrypt the result, and transmit it to a central computer. This can make an statistical analysis of the congestion based om the time for a car to pass two cameras.

How can one be sure that the system has not been compromised by the security services?

The numberplates recorded are supposed to only be the middle portion of the plate, not the whole plate; and the data is supposed to be thrown away after use...

Oh, so you mean like Trafficmaster , which has been around in the UK since the '80s and can be integrated into the radio so that the information received via Trafficmaster over-rides the current radio program or CD/tape?

This is really common in the UK - a company called TrafficMaster gather data from their own network of sensors over most major roads in the country and make it available in a number of ways. You can get it off their website (with a sub), through a variety of standalone devices like the one in the article (except more flexible as they cover the entire network) or licensed to integrated in-car systems. My parents BMW has had TrafficMaster integrated into the GPS nav system for a good few years now - not only can it show you how to get somewhere it can find a quicker route if the traffic's bad.

Something simialr has been working in the UK for a while. Have a look at www.trafficmaster.co.uk

Rus

Ditto here in the UK, we have been using this system for at least three years.

Trafficmaster

This data feeds most of the radio, TV, PDA, satnav and breakdown agency traffic reports. You can view live reports here:

Royal Automobile Club
Automobile Association

A network of cameras, which look like blue lampposts on trunk roads (highways) and fly-swatters on motorway bridges (interstates) digitally capture registration numbers (licence plates) and time how long it takes to get from A to B, or A to C etc. If a significant portion of numberplates arrive at A but don't arrive at B or C, then the computer presumes that there is a blockage somewhere near A. It also uses averaging to spot changes in normal traffic flow which indicate delays rather than blockages.

Interestingly, the trunk road system can be easily socially hacked with very major results. There are many classic cases of Trafficmaster being confused by temporary major changes in traffic flow, particularly infrequent events such as village fetes, town picnic days, jousting re-enactments, fireworks etc. If a bunch of cars all go past camera A and then turn off to park in a field for two hours to watch fireworks, the system will flag up point A as a traffic blockage!

I've known some mischevious parish council members specifically plan their event parking arrangements around buggering up Trafficmaster, making sure that the parking entrance is *after* the blue lamp camera... :-)

Ditto here in the UK, we have been using this system for at least three years.

Trafficmaster

This data feeds most of the radio, TV, PDA, satnav and breakdown agency traffic reports. You can view live reports here:

Royal Automobile Club
Automobile Association

A network of cameras, which look like blue lampposts on trunk roads (highways) and fly-swatters on motorway bridges (interstates) digitally capture registration numbers (licence plates) and time how long it takes to get from A to B, or A to C etc. If a significant portion of numberplates arrive at A but don't arrive at B or C, then the computer presumes that there is a blockage somewhere near A. It also uses averaging to spot changes in normal traffic flow which indicate delays rather than blockages.

Interestingly, the trunk road system can be easily socially hacked with very major results. There are many classic cases of Trafficmaster being confused by temporary major changes in traffic flow, particularly infrequent events such as village fetes, town picnic days, jousting re-enactments, fireworks etc. If a bunch of cars all go past camera A and then turn off to park in a field for two hours to watch fireworks, the system will flag up point A as a traffic blockage!

I've known some mischevious parish council members specifically plan their event parking arrangements around buggering up Trafficmaster, making sure that the parking entrance is *after* the blue lamp camera... :-)

Ditto here in the UK, we have been using this system for at least three years.

Trafficmaster

This data feeds most of the radio, TV, PDA, satnav and breakdown agency traffic reports. You can view live reports here:

Royal Automobile Club
Automobile Association

A network of cameras, which look like blue lampposts on trunk roads (highways) and fly-swatters on motorway bridges (interstates) digitally capture registration numbers (licence plates) and time how long it takes to get from A to B, or A to C etc. If a significant portion of numberplates arrive at A but don't arrive at B or C, then the computer presumes that there is a blockage somewhere near A. It also uses averaging to spot changes in normal traffic flow which indicate delays rather than blockages.

Interestingly, the trunk road system can be easily socially hacked with very major results. There are many classic cases of Trafficmaster being confused by temporary major changes in traffic flow, particularly infrequent events such as village fetes, town picnic days, jousting re-enactments, fireworks etc. If a bunch of cars all go past camera A and then turn off to park in a field for two hours to watch fireworks, the system will flag up point A as a traffic blockage!

I've known some mischevious parish council members specifically plan their event parking arrangements around buggering up Trafficmaster, making sure that the parking entrance is *after* the blue lamp camera... :-)

In the UK and Europe we have the Trafficmaster system. There are blue camera posts at signifcant points along major roads that take you number plate - the system then compares the time between two cameras for each plate to work out congestion. You can subscribe to get the data real time, and its displayed at motorway service stations, etc.

> I have my switched on cycling
Its somewhat easier to stop on a cycle than a motorcycle (especially one doing the sort of speeds that the rider in question was :-). But then again, there is very little in common between the cycling experience and the motorcycling experience (except that both are at high risk from oter road users. Number one rule of surviving on a motorcycle - EVERYONE else on the road is an idiot).

> as its easier to call
Uh, on my phone the difference is one button. The "on" button.

> the polis when somebody endangers my life in a way think they care about.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but what makes you think the police care about somebody endangering your life? As an example: The speed limit on the road I live on is 30mph. Personally, I think it's too high (not because I live there, but because I don't see how you can drive down it at 30mph with any degree of safety. There are families with children that live down there). The local police have been asked, several times, to do something about people driving at high speeds (I estimate above 70mph) down that road. Usually late on Friday/Saturday evening (yes, there is a pronounced pattern to it). And the response was "there's not much we can do unless somebody gets killed". That's right. It's not a word-for-word quote, but it expresses the sentiment - and the word "killed" _is_ a direct quote.

> cell coverage can be large; many tens of miles in the obscure areas where demand is low
Such as, perhaps, a non-urban dual carriageway between population centres? Like, say, the A14...

> See statewatch [statewatch.org].
Thanks for the link.

> BTW I dont think they'd bother to catch this particular motorbike;
But it was you who first suggested they might try (using his phone).

> more insidious is they can use phone velocity to work out your speed down, say, the M5 over an afternoon
There are easier (and more reliable) ways than using a phone signal. Ways that don't require you to have a mobile phone, don't require it to be switched on. Perhaps they could use cameras which recognise your number plate. Although Trafficmaster claim that their cameras do not retain the registration data, there's no reason why the same technology cannot be used to track your speed over distance. Such as, for instance the S.P.E.C.S. system. Isn't this where we came in?

By driving a car on the public highway in the UK, you are agreeing to a series of conditions, such as displaying a registration that can be traced back to you, having insurance, paying road tax, etc. You could not run a road system as big as the UKs without this. That registration number is there for a reason - so your car can be traced back to the owner.

Would it be OK if someone stood by the road noting down all the registrations of the cars that passed? It seems that this is a story because cameras are involved. There are cameras all over the UK's roads allready - some to discourage traffic offenses, others to track traffic flow (the TrafficMaster System), and undoubtably others which keep track of you going in to 'sensitive' areas. If you dont like this - dont drive a car in the UK.

The real story here is that driver who want to avoid the congestion charge will simply go around the city, moving the congestion and polution to other, currently quiet roads, and that there has been no investment in public transport to give a viable alternative to driving.

See Trafficmaster's web page.

I've done the maths, and other than for city centres in rush hour when you (and I) really should take the bus anyway, I think this will actually result in a net saving for UK motorists.

Here are the proposed charges as per the BBC .

> Average charge proposals per mile
> Top charge: 45p, central London, rush-hour
> Motorway weekday: 3.5p
> Other roads weekday: 4.3p
> Rural roads busy times: 1p
> Rural roads off-peak: free
> Birmingham to Manchester - £7.40
> Leeds to Liverpool - £6
> Road tax scrapped
> Fuel duty cut by between 2p and 12p

Depending on the efficiency of your car, UK petrol currently costs between 5p and 15p per mile (70p/litre, US$4/gallon).

With a 12p (20%) reduction in petrol prices, this would mean petrol would cost between 4p and 12p per mile, a saving of between 1p and 3p per mile.

Road tax (aka tax disc) costs between GBP100 and GBP160 per year. Having ZERO car disc tax would give a further saving of between 0.5 and 2p per mile, depending on the category of your car and the miles you drive per year.

Total saving of between 1.5p and 5p per mile on petrol & disc tax combined.

Let's say we drive an efficient car with average yearly milage of around 12,000 miles (normal for a Brit). We'd get a 4p reduction per mile.

• Rural roads, even at peak times, would be cheaper to drive on.

• Motorways (interstates) would slightly cheaper, and trunk roads (highways) would be about the same cost.

• Meanwhile, you just wouldn't be able to regularly afford to drive in city centres in rush hour.

My opinion is that these figures sound fine for a 12p reduction in petrol tax and zero tax disc, but anything significantly less than a 12p reduction and zero tax disc would be a problem. I'd also like to see a stricter definition of "rural" and "other" roads (are A roads that pass through rural areas "rural" or does "rural" only apply to B & unclassified roads? If only B&C roads, that could mean an increase in rat-runs).

It will also require a huge increase in park-and-ride bus schemes. Many of these existing schemes are on, or butted against, "green belt" conservation areas. There are potential conflicts of interest in granting planning permission to expand these sites.

On the whole though, this is a superb idea.

As for privacy, your numberplate is tracked in the UK already (do you seriously think the police can't get your movements out of Trafficmaster? Get real!).

FYI, I live in the Cotswolds, a rural area near Cheltenham, Gloucestershire, UK.

But, that has already been solved. UK motorists have already been tracked for years across large parts of the road network. Why worry about potential invasion of privacy when it has already been invaded by a private company? (they have operations in USA too).

But, that has already been solved. UK motorists have already been tracked for years across large parts of the road network. Why worry about potential invasion of privacy when it has already been invaded by a private company? (they have operations in USA too).

But, that has already been solved. UK motorists have already been tracked for years across large parts of the road network. Why worry about potential invasion of privacy when it has already been invaded by a private company? (they have operations in USA too).