Slashdot Mirror
Engelbart Colloquium at Stanford
Lansdowne writes "Douglas Engelbart, the father of the mouse, has begun a 10-week free colloquium entitled 'An In-Depth Look at The Unfinished Revolution'. A course description is available, as are live and archived webcasts. Based on the first session, this looks like a great series for the thinking Slashdotter."
This cannot be true! Surely all of these things were invented/pioneered by M$ in their never-ending quest for innovation ! Seriously, though. I was fortunate to work for David Evans, who was on Engelbart's team when alot of this stuff was developed. David was the one using the mouse gizmo at SRI during that famous lecture. David had a film of the presentation which I saw in about 1985, and I've got say it made the hairs on the back of your neck stand up - absolutely mind blowing. These guys were easily 20 years ahead of the game. Tremendous stuff.
It's a joke.
Or it should be.
Funny anyhow.
An early philosophy lesson is the all real scotsman trick is a trick.
Goes like:
"all scotsmen (do or are something)". fair, testable hypothesis.
riposte "I know a scotsman who (doesn't or isn't something)". complete debunking of hypothesis.
Response to riposte "Ah, but all real scotsmen (do or are something)". Cobblers. This is a definition of "real scotsmen" as only those who do what's suggested, which makes the thing tautological/circular, and thus useless in debate.
So "first real post" == "any post but mine is unreal".
It's a joke OR stupid. Your pick.
So where shall this mirror reside?
-- Ender, Duke_of_URL
http://bacteriophage.dynip.com
-- Ender, Duke_of_URL
What objection to bloated, inefficient, enormous MPEG-2? Maybe because it can't stream and they don't want anyone to be able to archive it themselves?
Luckily I got Streambox VCR before the court order put the smackdown on them, so I'll be able to download it and watch at my leisure... and no I'm not going to post it anywhere and make it available to intellectual property thieves.
E.
F_uck you, s_hit-eater. Leave the guy alone, and stop trolling around. I'm pretty sure he knows that, and there was no need for your putrid tone.
so this is the bastard responsible for my carpal tunnel syndrome. he can expect a summons tomorrow morning.
hi bacteriaphage!
earth to clueless: it has nothing to do with your cable modem. Irrespective of what your cable salesperson told you, a cable modem does not solve all problems. if the server you wish to retrieve information from is bogged down handing other requests and stops accepting connections, there is nothing your cable modem can do.
Understand, stupid?
there are a couple of pseudo thinkers Effuegas, Foogle, Signal 11 come to mind. There was that kish faggot too, but I haven't seen him in a while. Maybe he's died of aids or something.
hehe im with you ;-)
That bitch Foogle isn't worthy to be mentioned with Signal11
I found this site a while ago when /. ran the piece about him, but I can't find any evidence of an actual product? It seems all they do is write papers and give lectures. It would be cool to see AUGMENT's source, unless it is tied up in some kind of copyright. Perhaps one or two pieces of software? Links to actual implementations? None, although the papers are somewhat interesting, that can't be all they do...
...but where are the references to seasons?
A mirror with non-streamed data is very good for those of us who can't arrange our schedules as we like, even if there's a day/week rotate out period where .mov/.avi files go away...
-- Ender, Duke_of_URL
Think CHILD PORN. Child pornography exploits children in order to make it. By making it legally viewable you all people to produce it because there is a demand. Exploits and molests children. Stamp the demand injure less children. The extremes of anything are usually bad..
The Swedish audience (including me) are under the impression that Mr Hakan Lans invented the mouse, and, the color monitor. Are we really that wrong?
Olaf
At last, Englebart.
A topic worthy of Slash
Unlike TPM
Is Malda learning?
Does he have it within him?
If so, I forgive
http://slashdot.org/articles/99/11/28/0638259.shtm l
f ect.html
:)
Discussed the addendum, to the paper.
But the actual article:
http://ssadler.phy.bnl.gov/adler/SDE/SlashDotEf
is apparently down... appears that user is gone.
I've got a copy somewhere, but I'm not going to host it, risking a DoS.
-- Ender, Duke_of_URL
As soon as you join a "community" your IQ drops 50 points or so. You can now sit on your high horse and just follow the herd.
It feels like the average high scoring slashdotter is no better than a 14 year old punks playing quake, their ways of "owning" you is just more articulated.
Conformity is king
Just in time..thanks for showing up, guys. Remember, though, it's a school night, so don't be hax0ring too late..
I've loved Englebart ever since I read about him in Steven Levy's "Hackers: Heroes of the Digital Computer Revolution"... too bad I won't get to see this webcast since its Slashdotted and probably will be all week.
What format is the webcast in by the way?
E.
earth to clueless: i'm a stupid idiot and iv'e got nothing better to do then rant and rave about retarded crap, he he he. watch me pick my nose while i bitch at this guy, he he he...
its old, we dont care anymore, and if you dont like the topic, dont read it.
Suggested Moderation: (Score: 3, Insightful)
Earlier Slashdot article
Biographical Sketch
--
--
"Insert witty quote here."
If you look at Doug Engelbart's biography, you'll see he spent much of his career dealing with military sponsors. The language he uses seems to be designed to be intelligible to military funding authorities more than business 'consultant-speak'.
The writer of the session notes seems to be well educated and is using precise words from a large vocabulary, probably with a target reading level around college graduate, maybe as high as postdoc. It is mostly standard english with few words that I would label as 'consultant-speak' and those that are are clearly denoted as such by capitalization and quotation.
Translated, the first session is a statement of the problem. The problem is that the world is becoming, at an exponential rate, a much more complex place and our organizations cannot handle the ever increasing rate of change and the problems for individuals and society that this change brings. (Any slashdotter has witnessed this in the area of computers with various orgaizations flailing around trying to handle the implications of new developments, such as the Internet itself.)
The second session is about how the organizations can improve their adaptability regarding change, without the use of new technology, but keeping aware that new technology will arise and change the problems and solutions. This is done ahead of the actual need, so as to ease the transition when the time does come.
My translations aren't quite right, but that's partly a consequence of not using the "right" words and partly a consequence of it being 4:07 am here and I've been awake for too long...
--john dougan
The difference between the right word and the almost right word is like the difference between lightning and the lightning bug. --Mark Twain
My first thought was: "Laboring to produce a mouse."
And also: "And paralyzing the world with RSI instead."
This may be offtopic, but seeing as it is the first post, I don't quite see how it can be redundant...
-- The act of censorship is always worse than whatever is being censored. Always.
If you want the use of children in the production of sexually explicit imagery to be illegal then that's fine. Illegalizing an action that most likely causes harm is probably a good idea. Data that has been transfered can even be used to prove that a crime has been committed (such as child porn leading to police tracking down the creators).
Censorship is just wrong. It has always been wrong and it will always be wrong. No mere possible physical/possible emotional harm of people could possibly compete with the downright evil of censorship.
Preventing people from having and transferring data is *always* bad. I don't care what that data is, I don't care what the circumstances are. People have the right to transfer whatever bits they want to transfer, and neithor governments, you, or anyone else has the right to stop them.
-- The act of censorship is always worse than whatever is being censored. Always.
"There are no shortcuts to any place worth going."
"Be regular and orderly in your life, so that you may be violent and original in your work." -Flaubert
"There are no shortcuts to any place worth going."
"Be regular and orderly in your life, so that you may be violent and original in your work." -Flaubert
"There are no shortcuts to any place worth going."
"Be regular and orderly in your life, so that you may be violent and original in your work." -Flaubert
"There are no shortcuts to any place worth going."
"Be regular and orderly in your life, so that you may be violent and original in your work." -Flaubert
Now I finally understand. Check out:
e archCenter1968/ResearchCenter1968.html
:)
http://sloan.stanford.edu/mousesite/Archive/Res
Bootstrapping is this: a group of researchers develop a set of tools designed to improve (er, "augment") human intelligence. This is equivalent to the economist-speak of "improving productivity."
These researchers then use the results of their research (an "augmentation system") to make them more efficient in doing their research!
The end result is that augmentation systems (what we now call "computers attached to the internet") that conform to information ergonomics (meaing easy-to-use and easy-to-understand) help us to spiral our intelligence upwards.
The results of the research can then be used by other groups (who may in turn make innovations that others again can use).
It's an interesting idea. I have two critiques, however. First, I think this already happens to some extent... but it's true that researchers are not focused on it. Hence the 20 year lag between Engelbart's augmentation system and the WWW. Hence, there haven't been any major breakthroughs in the way we use computers to store information for our use. (The WWW+search engines, or relational databases, or OO databases, or expert systems are all far from any kind of Nirvana of information storage).
Second, if Englebart really wants his ideas to change the business & social landscape, he needs to use language that is accessible (ie "ergonomically designed information").
Ah, there are a few more interesting things that I could go on talking about, but I'll leave it there
Is it just me or does this guy look like the recently (and unfortunately) departed Desmond Llewelyn? (AKA Q from the Bond Movies)
The MyTh - I am a figment of the Imagination - [Im Probably even not here]
From the Meriam-Webster at:= colloquium
/-kwE-&/
http://www.brittanica.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?va
Main Entry: colloquium
Pronunciation: k&-'lO-kwE-&m
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural -quiums or colloquia
Etymology: Latin, colloquy
Date: 1844
: a usually academic meeting at which specialists deliver addresses on a topic or on related topics and then answer questions relating to them
Use Adsense for Charity
Could someone help them out with a mirror. Preferably in a non-streaming format.
Use Adsense for Charity
Ok, you can get your webcasts now! :-) Have fun, I saw the first 10 mins before I had to go to class this morning and he seems to be very intelligent and funny.
t ml), if you promise me two things: (i) that you go register when the registration server comes back up (if you haven't already done so), and (ii) provide us feedback on your access experience by doing the survey at http://www.bootstrap.o rg/colloquium/col_webcast_survey1.html after you have had a chance to access the webcast. [The former is serious, the latter is just kidding, but would definitely appreciate it nonetheless.]
Thank you for your message. I just checked. You are correct, the Stanford registration server seems to be down. The seminar-on-demand server is up and going, though.
Ordinarily, you are supposed to be registered first before they will provide you with the password for access. However, we have made it so that during these first few days, the colloquium content page is NOT password protected yet.
I'll give you that link right now (goto http://stanford -online.stanford.edu/engelbart/colloquium/index.h
Presently, the colloquium is not available in other formats (as it is not just video stream we are talking about here) and not mirrored anywhere yet. If demand keep building, we might have to do the latter.
Thanks for the encouraging word. Look forward to your participation.
Have fun, PPY
Use Adsense for Charity
OK, it was all good, till you decided to say it'd be good reading for the "thinking slashdotter". wouldn't that, uh, thin the ranks a little? :)
JUST KIDDING. I'm sure we all think. I just can't always vouch for the quality of our thoughts :) And that definitely includes me...
If you can't figure out how to mail me, don't.
For linux tips: http://www.linuxtipsblog.com
English isnt my native language!
Both Realplayer and Quicktime run on more than one operating system and would have been a marginally better choices. I wonder what objection they had to plain-old MPEG 2 video?
From the biographical sketch of Douglas C. Engelbart:
Pioneering Firsts
I hate the "mouse" but in light of everything he's done, how can I complain? ;-)
Take slashdot as an example. Somone submits a story about software licenses. A bunch of us beat our heads together in public about the merits of the GPL, the BSD, and so on. Moderators work it over and make it easy to find the better written arguments. And then a day later, the information is effectively all dead, and we all get to go through the same scramble the next time software licenses come up.
Wouldn't it be better if we were working *toward* something here? Say if we were all trying to develop a document that summarizes the basic arguments, so we don't have to go through the same old stuff every time?
The trouble is that whenever anyone tries to perfect something like this, they run into some kind of difficulties. I tend to think of this as "The Curse of Xanadu" (now open sourced, but still apparently dead: www.udanax.com).
(And it doesn't bode well that he's using terms like "CoDIAK". Screwed up capitialization is is one of the marks of a doomed project.)
Anyway, I second the recommendation to check out The Bootstrap Alliance. It looks like they're going for it: http://www.bootstrap.org/alliance/dkr/.
Good point, with regard to the military sponsers.
And you're dead on, with regard to the fact that consultspeak words are always capatilized or enclosed in quotation marks. I didn't notice that the first time I read it.
However, I still have to disagree about your assertion regarding "precise words from a large vocabulary." The problem with the course description is not that the words too sophisticated or aimed at too high a level or any such thing. The problem, in my opinion, is precisely that they are imprecise or, at the very least, unneccesary. Regardless of how many Harvard or Stanford degrees one has, reading this sort of stuff is a chore. One dire symptom of consultantspeak is the overuse of these "sophisticated" (for lack of a better word) words; in my opinion this is usually an attempt to trade clarity for "impressiveness." It seems to me that in this respect, the session descriptions are about as guilty as you can get.
I far prefer your descriptions - sure, they'd need to be touched up a bit before replacing those on the web page - but they say what they mean, in what I would consider clear and precise English.
Comments?I can see broadly what they're saying on a general level, but, to use a technical term from mathematics... there seems to be a lot of arm waving going on. Can someone help me out here?
:)
:)
Unfortunatly, most of the web page is in consultant speak too, but it appears that they are talking about (1) making it easy for people to search for information and (2) figure out what the hell it is saing. I assume that there are some indexing ideas for (1) and some ideas based on linking for (2). I did not see any specific mention of Artificial Intelegence to assist in the process of indexing or paraphrasing (Wow! That is a cool though a world full of humans who can not understand each others execpt through there computer paraphrtasors.. that would make a good short story). There dose not appear to be any math here. They may also be talking about orginisational stuff, but I donno.
I think it is clear that what they are tring to do is a good idea and Englebart may have some deep insights into the ``ergonomics of information'' (i think that keeps it from sounding like consultant speak). It is woth mentioning that there have been a lot of snake-oil salesmen who did not realize they were snake-oil salesmen (Freud, early medicin, all religious leaders, etc.), but some of them have actually inspired people to create soemthing great (Feurd bullshit and bleading people did sorta pave the way for modern medicin and psychology). I am not really qualified to judge this one, but whenever you strik out for the frengis of science and the applicable experemental method you run the risk of fathering a field of blabering idots. Example: Psychology has turned into a science which actually gets results while Scosiology has turned into who knows what.
My opinion is that Engelbert dose know what he is talking about, but that he may have made a mistake in tring to apply the computer interface ergonomics we know him for to the social world. I personally REALLY want to see information ergonomics developed (paraphrasing and autolinking via AI's and user interfaces which make these things easy), but it may be unrealistic to develop it in the context of creating social changes.. who knows.. I hope it works. We could use a little more intelegence in our public decission making processes.. and maybe a little understanding is all that is required.
Information ergonomics (I keep saing this I know what it means.. and I am not confident that I know exactly what bootstrapping is) should be very useful to science, but I do not know that it would be as useful as just creating more brilliant people via good psychological research into education and critical thinking skills. Translation: Englebart says the data buss is too slow, but I'm point out that just adding more processors might help as much in the short term.
Regardless, the talk should be inspiring if you
want to make the world a better place..
Jeff
BTW> I also have a sneeking suspission that information ergonomics is part of the door into real intelegent AI, but that is just wild speculation.
The Christian religion has been and still is the principal enemy of moral progress in the world. -- Bertrand Russell
Is this stuff for real? Even if I tried, I couldn't write a better parady of the kind of corporate-consultantspeak nonsense that
passes for wisdom in the valley these days. Or does Engelbart have to phrase it this way to get the attention of the people who
need to hear it most? Or if I had gone to business school, would I find this sort of prose as easy to parse as I do my own area of the scientific literature?
Having seen Englebart speak before (his Turing award speech at CHI 98), I can tell you that he's anything but a practitioner of the dark and evil consultant-speak.
At this point, I'd say he's a guy with ideas that are huge, so huge that he'll never see them come to fruition in his lifetime (he's pretty old already). He generally talks over people's heads, often going off on vectors, but motivated, perceptive people usually gain a few insights when they hear him.
Anyway, he is probably sincere when he uses terms like 'paradigm shift.' If anyone can envision a true shift, in the Kuhn meaning of the term, it's Engelbart -- He truly believes he can change the world. I think he's always been ahead of his time, so think of this as a sneak preview...
When they say Englebart invented "bootstrapping" I got the drift that they weren't talking about loading a kernel into RAM.
:). Yup, this will happen by boosting our collective IQ... but what exactly does that mean?
One of the sites I jumped to says bootstrapping is "finding what you need to know to innovate, learning it, then innovating." OK. Makes sense. But I think it goes deeper than that. Another site talks about how the idea of bootstrapping may fundamentally change our social institutions and allow greater social progress (that's when I clicked they weren't talking about booting a computer
I can see broadly what they're saying on a general level, but, to use a technical term from mathematics... there seems to be a lot of arm waving going on. Can someone help me out here?
I'm quite surprised that no-one, not even an Anonymous Coward made a crack about the physical and biological incompatibilities of fathering a mouse...
Check out the Bootstrap Institute as well as a Biography of him and his accomplishments.
He's aiming at a wide section of people.
Personally I'm looking forward to catching this online.
a poor little AC who finally choose a nick.....
Well, this is probably a surefire target for flames as well as for "flamebait, -1", but I can afford the Karma hit, so what the hell. I'd really like a decent answer here.
Engelbart has done a lot of great stuff, there is no doubt about that. But unless I'm missing something, the course description should be enough to turn off a thinking slashdotter, or thinking human being of any persuasion whatsoever. I mean, consider session 1:
The Next Frontier - How Big is Big?The first session will set the context for the overall colloquium by describing the conundrum of increasing urgency and complexity of problems facing society's organizations and institutions, and the concomitant requirement for a strategic approach to augmenting organizational capabilities. This will include the necessity to shift paradigms, a particularly difficult activity for large organizations, and introduce the elements of Bootstrapping strategy and the ways in which the material will be covered throughout the colloquium.
Or session 2:
Augmenting Organizational Capabilities.
The second session will present ways in which organizations can augment their capabilities by being pro-active in the evolution of techniques and approaches within the "human systems'" perspective, keeping in mind, and in advance of improvements in "tool systems." This pro-active approach is meant to reduce the time for large scale improvements that require simultaneous changes in human system elements and tools.
Is this stuff for real? Even if I tried, I couldn't write a better parady of the kind of corporate-consultantspeak nonsense that passes for wisdom in the valley these days. Or does Engelbart have to phrase it this way to get the attention of the people who need to hear it most? Or if I had gone to business school, would I find this sort of prose as easy to parse as I do my own area of the scientific literature?
Someone help me out here! What is going on? Has the emperor lost his clothes yet again? Or is there just something wrong with my eyes?