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Napster To Abandon MP3 For .NAP
simong writes "As reported in The Register Napster is to abandon the MP3 format for a proprietary .nap format being developed with Bertelsmann. " As Cliff pointed out "dirt.nap is about what Napster amounts to these days anyway." You can get more more information from Yahoo's Reuters feed.
Since when is Louis Armstrong an obscure jazz artist? You need to learn about cdnow.com
With Kazaa being positioned as a good candidate for a napster replacement, quite a few people will end up with it. At least the mp3 sharing market has fragmented, otherwise we would have the successor to SamrtTags.
Chris Cothrun
Curator of Chaos
Bleh!
Stopping posting Napster stories. Nobody cares anymore. Keep it to "Stuff that matters". Maybe just one more when they finally die.
will there be the ability to do a conversion back to MP3 once you have it? This will severely limit the number of users from the non-standard platforms.
I know that the format will be easily cracked (as many people will mention on this thread today) and I know hardly anyone will use it (as more people will post), but for those people who are actually interested in it, would it actually be useful?
Most people download MP3's to burn to CD to listen to later. Would they at least convert to WAV to allow for burning?
Go check out: The blurb about Napster as a company.
In particular:
Funding
Napster, Inc. recently closed a $15 million Series C venture capital funding round. The round was led by Hummer Winblad Venture Partners, with additional investments from Angel Investors LP and other existing investors. As part of the investment in Napster, Hummer Winblad partners Hank Barry and John Hummer joined the Board of Directors and Hank Barry assumed the role of interim CEO.
I think that this means that they are not entirely free to all "jump ship and do something else". When you accept funding for your company, there are all sorts of things you have to agree to, and I wouldn't be surprised if the VC's are hounding them to do SOMETHING, to get that damn money pit back above water.
> I don't really think there need to be any more Napster stories now
Naw, I wouldn't mind knowing when Napster gets liquidated. Between Morpheus and BearShare, I haven't used Napster in ages (of course, they're next).
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I've finally had it: until slashdot gets article moderation, I am not coming back.
(* Does WMA actually deliver on this promise of 1/2 filze size with superior sound? I've never messed with .WMA becase 1) Mirosoft is evil and I don't want them controlling my media and 2) MP3 is fine for me).
Wow, there's a technically informed decision. Frauenhofer isn't exactly a saint either. If you want to base your format on software politics, why aren't you using Vorbis?
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I've finally had it: until slashdot gets article moderation, I am not coming back.
Here is where you ask not what your fellow AC's can do for you, it's what you can do for your fellow AC's. And then you declare your intention to do that not because it is easy, but because it is hard. Then someone takes a shot at you.
If tits were wings it'd be flying around.
I don't understand why they don't all jump ship and do something else. It's plain obvious that they're never going to be "allowed" to do what they want to do. They'll keep bringing them to court until they run out of money. Is it because they have investors who will break their legs and other bits if they fail completely?
This is getting ridiculous. First they filter everything.. and just when you thought that the RIAA et al couldn't pick on them any worse they decide they should switch away from MP3. They might as well just have a court rule that Napster can no longer use eletricity in their operations. Are you kidding me? I'm guessing the number of people who will be using Napster when they make the switch will be countable on my fingers and toes, if that. I don't think the Winamp developers and other players will bother implementing a codec for this crap, and even if Napster makes one, I doubt they'd even include it since it's just plain stupid.
I kind of feel bad for them, though.
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It's a good thing the RIAA sued Napster instead of cooperating -- if they had played Let's Make a Deal, they could have done something evil like this back when Napster had 30 million users and gotten the bulk of them to use their new, tightly controlled standard.
:) They just didn't like someone muscling in on their turf. The real wannabe coopters in the whole deal was Napster.
Note that the whole business plan of Napster as a for-profit company was to leverage their userbase into a bargining arrangment with the RIAA that would give Napster a cut of online music sales.
I don't think that the RIAA is saavy enough to "coopt" anyone. (That's Microsoft's job
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Business. Numbers. Money. People. Computer World.
That's giving the customer what they want, for sure :)
Like it or not, MP3 is the standard, and people aren't going to change away from it unless another format allows greater benefits for the end user (better quality/compression ratio) or the other format is aggressively pushed by Microsoft (not that WMA isn't necessarily better than MP3, but I hardly expect Microsoft to let it succeed or fail on its own merits).
Nothing in file sharing is really going to change unless media companies really go after MP3 traders for their actions, which won't happen because of the massive potential backlash. You can destroy the Napster of the month for years, but all that will happen is people will trade underground the way they did before Napster made it so easy.
On the plus side, torpedoing easy-to-use file sharing programs is going to boost overall computer literacy, as people learn to track down their MP3s on Usenet and FTP sites and/or apply DeCSS-style cracks to the wide variety of "secure" music formats. If you think of the 'net as an ecosystem, the destruction of one of the larger trees in the forest is just causing explosive adaptation among Internet users. If the RIAA had been careful, they could have preserved Napster long enough to channel most of its users into more profitable channels. As it is, they've destroyed the biggest centralized point for MP3 trading, and they'll never have another chance to influence so many music traders at once again.
Your right to not believe: Americans United for Separation of Church and
Not only was Napster great for getting music that isn't currently in print, it was great for getting music that never was or will be in print.
A lot of live or studio outtake stuff will never make it into print, due to either artist reluctance, contract BS, or other legal impediments. Sure, much of it is "available" if you want to spend a lot of time and money BSing around on the trading circuit, but it was nice to be able to get a song here or there.
2a) That's what a good firewall--like the free-as-in-beer Zone Alarm--is for. When it asks to connect to the Internet, you tell it "No way, Jose!" and "Remember this answer".
2b) You can uninstall the spyware afterward without affecting the performance of the Satellite at all.
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Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
That's it. Napster is now a non-entity. I bailed when they started making it harder to use, locking out Napigator (or trying!) and removing all the songs I wanted to grab. I've moved on to AudioGalaxy, and I'll move on to something else when that bites the dust.
I don't really think there need to be any more Napster stories now. Because the plain and simple facts are, Napster no longer offers what people originally wanted to use Napster for. And it looks like it will be offering less and less in the future. I think it's finished.
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Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
And ogg vorbis? With a name that rolls off the tounge like that, I'm sure it'll be a household name in no time. "Hey mommy I want an ogg vorbis player for xmas?" Riight.
"Mommy, I want an MPEG audio layer III player for Christmas!"
Also note that both "Emm-Pee-Three" and "Ogg Vohr-Biss" have 3 syllables. Neither is inherently easier to say than the other. And besides, Ogg Vorbis is named after characters from Terry Pratchett! How much cooler can you get than that? ;-)
I use a Mac and don't have an ISDN, DSL, satellite, or cable connection - so I'm stuck using IRC channels. It sucks and I can never find what I look for - which is exactly how the RIAA wants it. If anybody can show me a decent program that works, I would really appreciate it. (I already tried Macster, Napster, Mactella, and LimeWire)
== Paul Rickard, Editor of The Microsoft Boycott Campaign ====
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Mod up a post Rob doesn't like and you'll never mod again
But instead, they destroyed Napster and along with it their last chance to coopt the music-trading community.
Like that old guy said, If you strike [Napster] down, [the music-sharing community] will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine.
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Mod up a post Rob doesn't like and you'll never mod again
Good point. Oh, uh, by the way, Microsoft Office has how many hundred million users?
:)
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Mod up a post Rob doesn't like and you'll never mod again
Ah, screw it... I haven't had enough coffee this morning to live up to that task. heh. Feel free.
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It's an impressive feat to put the last nail in your own coffin while your on the inside!
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All these formats have a tough road ahead of them. .MP3 is so FIRMLY entrenched in the market that it could take years before people give it up, if ever:
.MP3. They know that all their software works with it, they know what to do with it, they are aware of its limitations, and they know how to work around them. Expecting people to jump ship to a new format, just because it is available, especially when it offers DECREASED flexibility is also foolish. Consumers seem more than happy with the compression and sound quality of MP3 - it would take something truly amazing to come along to convince them to change. WMA and its 1/2 file size (supposedly at the same quality *) doesn't seem to be doing it.
.WMA becase 1) Mirosoft is evil and I don't want them controlling my media and 2) MP3 is fine for me).
1) hardware: lots of people are selling hardware MP3 players for PDAs, Cars, pants pockets, and home stereos. Anyone who thinks consumers will throw these away so soon is foolish. Lots of people I know buy players that only play MP3. Many of these are not upgradeable. They will be around for a long time, and MP3 will be too.
2) software: lots of software already exists for ripping CDs into MP3s. iTunes has done wonders for introducing some of the less technical folk to digital music. Lots of people I know use musicmatch and realjukebox. These programs aren't going to magically stop working, and the MP3 files they produce won't either. Winamp, Musicmatch, iTunes, RealJukebox and their brethren will be around for a long time...
3) habit: people are used to
In conclusion, I don't see any reason people would leave MP3 for a new format any time soon. This i especially true for new formats with confusing DRM that restricts people from playing music whereever they go. Consumers don't want the hassle of backing up license keys to their music. They already bought it. Why do they need to license it?
(* Does WMA actually deliver on this promise of 1/2 filze size with superior sound? I've never messed with
I think we can look to Napster to learn about how the business model for music distribution works when you're working with the music industry. Napster was an important force because of it's user base when it emerged, the music industry wanted it both ways. They wanted to be part of a popular site, and they wanted the retarded level of control with their imaginary "secure" music distribution systems that they guaranteed Napster became so assy that the reason they bought it was removed.
The only model that made sense for Napster was the one that was initially discussed. The music industry allows a subscription based service which is "all you can download." Now we're stuck with some SDMI still born
In any case, here's some links to what I use these days:
The best Gnutella client: LimeWire
eDonkey
Audio Galaxy
You can actually get this to work on Linux? I've tried everything I can think of, and all I get is a tiny window that can't be resized. I tried doing research on the Web and Usenet, but all anyone ever talks about is how difficult it is to set up. I don't think I saw a single person who got it to run correctly.
BTW, I'm using the latest LimeWire with the latest jre on Redhat 7.1 (it was a chore just to get java functioning at all on Redhat). Has anyone solved this "tiny window" problem? I saw several others referring to it on Usenet, but no solutions.
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"Any fool can make a rule, and any fool will mind it."
"Any fool can make a rule, and any fool will mind it."
--Henry David Thoreau
Thanks for the suggestion, but I found where the problem lies. There was a bug in the original 1.6 release that prevented window resizing on the "Welcome" window, though apparently some WMs like Sawfish let you resize the window regardless of what the app says (I use IceWM by the way, though I tried WindowMaker and Enlightenment and neither of them worked either).
Anyway, the LimeWire folks released a new version today (1.6b) that fixed the problem. I downloaded that, and the problem was fixed. Simple as that.
I agree with you, LimeWire looks like a great app, and seems to run in Linux better than in Windows. I suppose I could whine about it not being free (as in speech), though I'm content to just keep my mouth shut and use it for the moment. :-)
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"Any fool can make a rule, and any fool will mind it."
"Any fool can make a rule, and any fool will mind it."
--Henry David Thoreau
If manufacturs pick up on it I'll be able to the same thing with ogg files. But I don't see the same convenience coming out of formats like wma, liquid audio and the like.
Sorry but something has got to give and as a consumer I'll expect it to come from the record companies.
I don't want knowledge. I want certainty. - Law, David Bowie
Oh, and it isn't CD quality. That alone kills it. Whatever they charge must be lower than what a CD costs. Much lower.
And I want to know what their copy protection scheme is. I want to be able to download from my PC, transfer it to my laptop or .nap player, or burn it to my newly purchased CD-RW and eventually be able to play those files in my car during those long cross country trips when I pass through bum-f*** Kentucky and all I can get is Bluegrass stations and Baptist ministries.
And did I mention that I use linux as my desktop at home?
I buy CDs when I can. I used Napster to get maybe a handful of songs and wasn't enthused. If the record companies want to get a person like me to purchase songs off the Internet they must charge a reasonable price. And from where I'm sitting, even a buck is too much.
I don't want knowledge. I want certainty. - Law, David Bowie
Actually, yes, Napster have licensed Adobe's most advanced encryption technology. A ".NAP" is a
Tell your friends about xenu.net
I want to DL music because I can't buy the music I want locally here. I usually import a 8-a dozen CDs a year. When what I want isn't on radio and isn't in the local shops here, you bet your ass I want to hear it somewhere before I buy it. 2 years ago when mp3s were common I DL a couple of songs a week and buy from a dozen different artists. I would try a few songs from new artists and buy their CD if I liked it. 100% of the artists I buy today I had not heard of 3 years ago.
Now, since mp3 sites are gone from the web and I don't like to use the usenet, irc, or nap type stuff, I don't buy music anymore. There are only about 3-4 artists I like enough to buy CDs w/o having to listen to them. Moreover, I don't know when new CDs are released. Since my music isn't available locally, there are no TV ads, etc telling me something new is available. I have to go out to look for websites for info like that. I don't bother.
What would allow me to sample more music and buy more CDs? Web based mp3 sites only. I use a modem. I want to SEE info on exactly what I'm DL'ing before spending 30min to get it. Would I try a new format if it were free? No. I'm not going to waste time learning the ins and outs of a new format. If I were that desperate I would be using gnutella now wouldn't I?
So why am I so lazy that I won't spend a little time to find free music? Because I have a job. I work, I make $. $ to buy CDs. Except there are no CDs I want to buy now, because there's nowhere I can sample any.
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Their .NET-worth is in the toilet. This is .NOT what they .NEED right .NOW. They will .NEVER get .NEW users this way. I guess the big companies have succeeded again. .NOT good .NEWS.
Jason
Hmm I use Morpheus all the time, and it's definitely better than Napster, at least to find the music I'm into (triphop, d&b, lounge). On Napster I could hardly ever find any of this kind of music. I tried bearshare a while back and personally wasn't impressed at all. Another program I've been very impressed with is Direct Connect although it's mainly for movies, not mp3s.
I'm also interested to see what Ian Clarke (founder of freenet) is doing with his startup Uprizer. Clarke has hinted that uprizer will provide some kind of compensation scheme for content producers. He envisions a system where it will become very easy to become a patron. So there could be 200,000 12-year old patrons supporting a band with their pocketmoney. I think that people really don't want to rip off the artists they love. However, in this day and age, there is simply no acceptable legal means of doing so on the internet.
Slashdot is basically all yesterdays stories today. It is not a news gathering site, it is a community where people share news they think other people would be interested in. A story is ALWAYS going to be on some other news site first.
So bugger off.
Ever since they blocked all non uptodate clients, I havent been able to connect anyway. I really dont care, I only use opennap and audiogalaxy. (which are staying with mp3 for now)
I am !amused.
Users to abandon .NAP for .MP3
More
Do they think Napster users want to share music if they have to pay for it? They just need to bury it and give in. The .nap format is just the final blow to stop the faint pulse.
while ( horse == dead ) { beat(); }
Why is it that the proponents of "one nation under God" are so eager to get rid of "liberty and justice for all"?
The real tragedy of Napster is that we may never again have such easy access to the more obscure music that isn't currently "in print." In its heyday, Napster helped introduce me to some old jazz and blues recordings that I would never have been able to find in a record store.
Unfortunately, the court cases surrounding Napster have poisened the well to such an extent that I doubt that we'll ever see an "all music ever created" service again at any price.
** The opinions expressed here are my own, and do not reflect those of my employers - past, present, or future**
Slashdot: Yesterdays Register stories, today...
Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.
the first person to get their grubby hands on the .nap codec and encode any Metallica album.
That would be priceless.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." - Jack Nicholson
RIP Napster, we hardly knew ye.
Well, that would be anyone who has ever bought an MP3 player. Or used an MP3 encoder. Legally, you gotta pay Fraunhofer/Thompson for every player or encoder.
I'm amazed they got this far with as strict of a licence they have. Encoders like lame or bladenc are in reality, illegal to use unless you have a licence. So if you run Linux and burn MP3's, its likely you are breaking the law.
I'm surprised the Free Software community hasn't rallied more around Ogg Vorbis, given the harsh licencing of MP3.
No, Thursday's out. How about never - is never good for you?
How many people will pay to use a proprietary format?
If you don't have anything nice to say, say it often.
If you don't have anything nice to say, say it often.
- Ed the Sock
...unless they get a deal with winAmp. Maybe their integrated player will be the ONLY player for music downloaded on Napster. And somehow, it has to be compatible with my hardware player I just spent $300 on.
There is no longer anything that can be done with computers that is nontrivial and clearly legal. -- Paul Phillips
None. Or very few. As noted on this thread, bye-bye Napster! Nice knowing ya.
sulli
RTFJ.
No, this definitely will NOT work in your portable. In fact, they will probably make it difficult for your average non-techie to play it anywhere EXCEPT inside the Napster client.
Yes, that means it won't work in your nice new solid state digital audio player. Yes, that also means I'm not interested.
Uh, you don't get it. There isn't going to be ANY way to encode your audio to .nap. All .nap files will be official and come from the Napster servers. You can't just encode your own music and then share it under the new system.
I think I uninstalled that already but thanks for the reminder.
Napster is dead, other client have come up; whatever they do will have no effect on P2P anymore.
We all know that, and so does Napster. So why are they building a new system?
To save their own ass; to appease the corporations...The only way Napster can still make some money is by selling itself to a company. Sure the business itself is not going to be profitable, BUT it is obvious that P2P -is- popular, just that corporations need to find a way to manage it to their own benefit.
(In Napster's POV) If Napster can partner with enough big music companies (ie: BMG) and begin the first commercial P2P system, and get a patent on it, they can still turn a profit in a long run via licensing fees (since we also know that as soon as Big Business finds out how to make money from P2P, they will....
'nuff said...
than the number of people who paid for an open format (CD)
and we all know where that went
I had the same problem with Mandrake 8.0... Did some hunting and found the solution... If you, like me, use KDE 2.1, restart into GNOME. Run the shell script... The little window will be full size and let you install the program.
I restarted back into KDE, and Lime Wire 1.6 works great! Much faster and smoother than the earlier version.
=== The price of freedom is eternal vigilance
Given a reasonably level playing field, who would win a fight between a bear and a shark?
p.s. WinMx doesnt contain any spyware (yipee!)
p.p.s I dont work for winmx (honest guv), I just want that critical mass that nap used to have....Why are the RIAA still hounding Napster when the game has clearly evolved on to the next level?
Napster is dead, long live OpenNap
So, has Napster spoke about this change with it's users? Which users, you say? Well that's a fair question.
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Rome taught me patience and assiduous application to detail. Virtues which temper the boldness of great, general views.
How long will it be before Napster sues another company for copyright infringement?
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Will the new format work in the current portable MP3 players, or will it require a new player that can decode the format, or worse still a proprietary player?
Napster is desperate for keeping the big labels off their backs. Too bad they'll have few users if any, now.
What is this .NAP? MP3 with crypto?
------I can please only one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't looking good either.------
Also in the news: Amiga Q2 gross profits up 40% to $39.50.
m00.