Slashdot Mirror
NSync Copy Protected CD
admiral2001 writes "This article from NewScientist.com details the most mass market venture into copy protected CDs. Namely, NSync's new CD will be released in a least 3 different versions (with different copy protection techniques). Also, one of the types has (small) labelling saying that the CD cannot be played on computers."
I suppose boycotts work better if you were actually intending to make a purchase. Damn the man, foiled again!
Oh I can see it now, "Why do I care, I am a l33t d00d who only listens to great music and not N'Sync." Well, I hate to tell you, but this is only the first step. If it works and only a few people complain then they will start doing this to every CD and that is when it will cause problems for the rest of us. I won't buy this CD because I wouldn't like it but that doesn't mean I'm going to ignore the bigger problem.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Oh bother.
The thing is, this is probably just a sample. The thing to look out for is all the 14 year old girls who never play their CDs in their computers but the CD player their parents bought them for their birthday.
It'll look like a tremendous success. "Oh look! No one cares that this CD came out unsupported on computers, lets mass market!".
Next, you'll have your favorite RIAA-signed musician being forced into the same distribution plan..
Now, go talk to your little sister about how she's going to have to go with out her poppy boy band shit for a while.
Dacels Jewelers can't be trusted.
Look, NSync is about a million times more popular than that first case that got posted here a couple of weeks back. (See? I can't even remember the name of that artist.) If this CD gets out there and there isn't alot of blowback, it will open the door for more copy protected CDs.
What can you do about it? Offer to make copies of CDs for people who already have them. Tell them, "well, you have more than one CD player, right? Like one in your car, a portable one you walk around with, and maybe even one in your bathroom. Wouldn't it be more convenient to just have multiple copies of something you already own? .... Hmmm... my computer can't read it. Must be broken or something. Take it back!"
Or... "Hey, let me try and listen to that in my computer." (since most of us must have at least decent sounding rigs) "WTF? This thing doesn't work at all! Take it back!"
This is the opportunity to let Joe (or Jane) Public learn about copy protection and how it infringes on THEIR rights.
Where the wind blows, the tumbleweed goes.
It just dawned on me, even tho its more than blatent: I cant make copies of these CDs! Not for pirating, not for making MP3s (for myself only), but for the sheer fact of having backups. After losing my CD collection to theft and losing some CDs to wear/tear/scratching, I started making backups of all my cds, and only playing the backups. My plan has proved itself, cause I just had all my CDs stolen once again, but this time, aside from the $5 loss of the carrying case, and the $10 pack of 50 CD-Rs, I'll be back to playin my tunes as soon as I find time to burn.
/me hops on the bandwagon to stop this movement.
"...at least 3 different versions (with different copy protection techniques)."
I was able to copy the CD on my flat-bed copier without any problem and I ened up with a good color, detail, et. al. quality.
However, a friend of mine ended up damaging his copier as he was trying to squeeze the CD through the copy feeder on his non-flat-bed copier.
I don't know about the third method of copy prevention -- as I haven't figured it out yet.
Karma stuck at 50? Add 2-5 inches.. err.. 2-5x Karmas Count to your pen1es.. err.. Karma all naturally and private
Quick.. Everybody steal a page from Scientology!
Everybody buy a copy of the CD. And then return it a few days later, complaining that it doesn't work on your computer or CD player. Go to another store, rinse, repeat.
If enough people did this a few times, all of the sudden, the return rate would be abnormally high on the CD. All of the sudden, the record industry would see this as troublesome and reconsider copy protected CDs.
Gentoo Sucks
any idea why mac users have been succesful in ripping the disc while windows users have not? other OS's could do it, maybe?
/adam
More troubling is that Vivendi Universal is converting ALL of their music released on CD to protected formats.
It is just a matter of time before everything you buy will not play on computers. You will have to rip a disc using the line-in on your soundcard from a regular CD player, break up the tracks and then MP3 them. It won't stop trading, it will slow it down.
I think what might turn this around is... If at least one large music publisher converts all their offerings to CD protection - suddenly that may affect a lot of people (who listen to music on computers) and the number of returns (lost sales) may sky rocket. Consumers may get upset and this will probably cause CD sales in total to tumble maybe an additional 5% or so. Remember that Vivendi et al. are upset because the market dropped 5% over the last year.
I can also see at least one lawsuit (perhaps class action) if they piss off enough people. And if they convert all their offerings - they will piss off a lot of people. Sign me up for the class action when it happens.
It is also worth noting that many people who don't read slashdot have cd burners now - even those not computer literate. This will surely piss them off too. Not to mention that the question "Why can't I make a mix cd from cds I bought?" will come up VERY often, and be difficult to answer.
There will be backlash if a critical mass of CDs are copy-protected. I'm really interested to see the fallout. Remember, the consumer is king... And this sort of copy protection is definately "pissing on the king's cornflakes".
CHANGELOG:
- Initial release
-- CD uncopyable
-- Band unlistenable
- 2.0 release
-- Fixed 2,144 bugs enabling people to copy CD. CD now uncopyable.
-- Changed demographic to younger audience; teens beginning to sense lack of talent. Note that this breaks backward compatibility
- 3.0 release
-- Fixed 53,944 bugs enabling people to copy CD. Gave up.
- 3.0.1 bugfix
-- Fired previous maintainer when it was discovered he had a soul.
-- Fixed another 128,535 bugs enabling people to copy CD. CD uncopyable.
-- Discovered simple cabling could be used to make a D-A-D copy. Sucessfully lobbied to illegalize cabling.
-- Hired armed enforcers to prevent people from humming songs.
-- Added technology to CDs to prevent any sort of listening to them whatsoever. Players now burn in unholy flame.
-- Band still unlistenable.
-Denor
Well N*Sync isn't the greatest music ever written, but they're actually pretty good. And why wouldn't they be? They have some of the highest-paid writers, voice trainers and musicians working for them. That doesn't mean that any of the people behind them are the next Beethoven, but they know how to write a catchy tune that sticks in your head.
All in all, some decent music is produced under the N*Sync brand. Their ballads are clearly targeted towards their early teen and pre-teen female audiences, but they're musically sound. Their more up-beat songs are actually quite catchy. The Backstreet Boys are more consistent in their sound, and I think that generally their music can be considered catchy more often, but when the N*Sync brand gets it right, they product some absolutely great tracks, such as "Bye Bye Bye," and "I Want You Back." Still, it's getting difficult to market the Backstreet Boys brand as the models creep closer to 30 and get married.
But that aside, we should be worried about this copy protection. If this technogy turns out to be reasonably effective for this market with few complaints, it will be much easier to roll it out on all future CDs. Remember, the RIAA doesn't assume that any technology will be 100% effective, but if it stops 99.9% of the population, then it will have done its job. Sure the geeks will still be able to obtain it, from ripping themselves or through obscure P2P clients, but the vast majority of people won't be able to get their hands on the MP3s, and that's all that really matters for the RIAA. The DMCA will take care of the misfits.
- j
"Both the UK and US versions will play on a Windows PC and both let a PC CD burner make a copy onto a blank CD."
;)
;)
"Copying using home CD recorders is variable, with the US CD giving a "no disk" message on some recorders."
So this is lovely! The US version is still rippable. Except on the "consumer" home CD recorders that pay the royalties to the RIAA anyways because the only thing they were usable for was copying other CDs.
This is even more fscked than at first glance.
It's just the German version. German geeks: your mission is clear. Buy and return as many NSuck CD's as possible!
Gentoo Sucks
At the risk of being redundant, someone needs to mod up one of the mentions about the UK version not having copy protection at all. How in the blue blazes is that supposed to prove anything at all? Here's the scenario:
I live in US, and I buy the CD. *shudder...just remember it's hypothetical* I try to rip it, I fail. I go to the p2p and download the entire CD. I then promptly burn that and distribute to all my friends who want the CD to play on their computers. I also distribute the mp3's to those who want them for their MP3 players.
This experiment will only prove how far people will go to circumvent copy protection, not how well the protection works. In a worst case scenario, the artists *shudder again* lose money because people quit buying the copy protected CDs and instead get unprotected copies from their friends.
Once again, RIAA, wrong answer. To quote Anne Robinson, you are the weakest link, goodbye.
Electronic Frontier Foundation for online civil rights information
Bye, Bye, Bye
Hey, hey
Bye, bye (bye, bye)
Bye, bye (bye, bye)
RIAA I'm doing this tonight
You're probably gonna start a fight
I know this can't be right
Hey RIAA come on, I loved you endlessly
And you weren't there for me
So now it's time to leave and make it alone
I know that I can't take no more, it ain't no lie
I wanna see you out that door
RIAA bye, bye, bye
(Bye)I don't want to be a fool for you
Just another player in your game for two
You may hate me but it ain't no lie
Bye, bye, bye
(Bye)I don't really want to make it tough
I just wanna tell you that I had enough
Might sound crazy but it ain't no lie
Bye, bye, bye
Oh, oh you just hit me with the truth
Oh RIAA you're more than welcome to
So give me one good reason RIAA come on
I live for you and me
And now really come to see
That life would be much better
Once you're gone
I know that I can't take no more, it ain't no lie
I wanna see you out that door
RIAA bye, bye, bye
(Bye)I don't want to be a fool for you
Just another player in your game for two
You may hate me but it ain't no lie
Bye, bye, bye
(Bye)I don't really want to make it tough
I just wanna tell you that I had enough
Might sound crazy but it ain't no lie
Bye, bye, bye
I'm giving up I know for sure
I don't wanna be the reason for your love no more
(Bye, bye)
I'm checkin' out, I'm signin' off
I don't want to be the loser and I've had enough
I don't wanna be your fool
In this game for two
So I'm leaving you behind
Bye, bye, bye
I don't wanna make it tough
But I've had enough and it ain't no lie, bye-bye
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
So you don't like N'Synch?
/.ers) * $15 return = an assload of lost revenues.
Don't let that stop you from helping!!
Buy a copy - open it - return it, complaining that it is defective. Hey, you don't even have to listen to it. No cost to you, and they can't resell it after the packaging is open. While you're at it, do it at the most expensive record store around.
Let's see, (# of
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."
From what it seems, there's a bit more to it than this. I would immagine that each version of the cd has a different watermark on it. They know that it is still gonna be ripped & coppied, they just want to find out which protection scheme is gonna be broken by the most people. The version with the least number of copies out there will be the format the industry settles on.
Has anyone thought about the trademark agreement? Doesn't Panasonic own the "COMPACT-DISC" trademark? I think I remember reading somewhere a long time ago that the way you are able to use this trademark is by insuring that everything with the label is playable in all players with the "COMPACT-DISC" trademark on it.
Any thoughts?
It's simple really. Release a rumor to the slashdot community that your latest CD has copy protection (when secretly it doesn't) so that all those quick-clickers can start a grass roots movement to buy millions of CDs and return them. Only they find out that they can't return them because there is nothing wrong with playing the CD.
Honestly, I don't know whether the CD is really copy protected or not. I just thought it was interesting to see all the slashdotters wanting to go out and buy a CD.
Note that Sony called this a "test."
Sony is not without its scientists. They know what a "control group" is.
Guarantee you, they will be able to distinguish among UK, US and German versions; they will be monitoring, tracking and pushing internal reports back and forth on this.
What we should hope to see is lots of rips from US and Germany, and none from the UK. Send them a message that copy-protection will only make their goods a target for the rip artistes.
I survived the Dick Cheney Presidency 7 to 9 AM 7-21-07
Quite right. I'll bet a lot of kids in Nsync's "target demographic" (a much more accurate description than "audience" or "listeners") have computers in their rooms, but no other music playing systems. I don't have any kids, but it would make more sense to me to supply them with a PC with a CD drive than with a PC and a seperate stereo. You can't change the skin on a stereo.
This is going to irritate a lot of other people when they start applying this to music that *isn't* disposible. Even high-end audiophiles are ripping to hard disk, using systems like the Linn. They've discovered that digital audio played back from a hard disk and re-clocked is free of the jitter inherent in even the best CD players.
"How perfectly Goddamn delightful it all is, to be sure" Charles Crumb
Well, since you commented in the thread, apparently you'll be capable of giving it neither.
w00t!
Damnit, what is it going to take for the minions of Slashbots to quit cracking the comments about the copy protected artists not being worth copying? I was getting ready to Moderate this damned thread but I kept finding myself modding posts down so I gave up.
I do not care whether the copy protection is on an artist I like or one that I dislike. The point is that this travesty is creeping into the mainstream music industry, and if nothing is done the cost of adding this protection to future artists you might care about will be so insignificant that it won't be an issue whether they do it or not.
So get a damned clue people. This shit needs to be acted on now, either through letters to the labels involved or through active cracking of the protection schemes. The audio passthrough cables don't count here, as we need something that is so painfully easy to use (recording one long-ass wav file then editing each song out is normally fine for most studio works but try doing that on a live album with no breaks. I've done it and it sucks) that it's almost seamless in its operation.
Don't get complacent about this shit, because by the time they copy protect YOUR favorite artist it might be too late to stop them.
Often, companies will be unwilling to sell heavily copyrighted materials if they think it'll hamper sales so much.
But if they slap it on an N'Sync CD, which, whether you like it or not, is going to get a large amount of CDs bought, they can always use the CD sales and say "Hey, we had copyright protection and the consumer liked it. Lets go ahead and put it on everything."
I would like to request that people stop using the phrase "copy protection" and instead use the term "copy prevention"
This has a number of advantages:
- copy protection implies that copying is bad (which it is not)
- copy prevention implies that the music industry is preventing me from making a legitimate copy. (which it is)
- copy prevention (somewhat) signifies that it is futile to prevent people to make copies. They can try and they might stop 90% of the people but it just takes 1 person to get this on MP3 and upload it to the net for the cat to be out of the bag.
With the RIAA's latest move it has become much less clear exactly what we are purchasing from them.
If you're paying for the license to listen to the music, then you should be allowed to copy the CD, transfer to another medium, etc. As long you don't violate the license.
However, if you're paying for the media (i.e. the CD), then once it's in your possession you can do whatever you want with it - including duplication.
It's fucked up antics like this that piss me off about the RIAA. Either I'm buying the music or I'm buying the media - which is it? From now on, if I buy a CD and find out its copyprotected, I am going to assume that what I've purchased is the media, not the license to listen to the music, and should I figure out how to rip MP3s from it then I'll freely trade them with whomever I can.
What you just explained is what most people who do not like this music, do not like about this music.
It is manufactured, easily digestible, put in a pretty little package and sold by the millions.
It is what the record companies want you to buy, it is easy for them to sell, especially when it is all over TRL.
The music is too perfect, there is no soul to it. N*sync has no emotional attachment to the songs because all they did was sing them.
Sure they look good and arguably can dance and arguably have good voices, but its manufactured, and pushed upon its audience, who buy it because all their friends are going to have it and its all over MTV and popular radio.
Its the perfect formula.
The same can be said for mainstream rap and rock, with the exception that some of them, infact, more likely most of them, actually write their own songs. It is still over produced to the point where seeing how much talent these bands don't have in concert is painful.
Now I know that all this may fail HOWEVER as a failsafe, just make sure you buy the CD using a credit card (not check card). If they refuse to give you your money back, threaten to have the bank stop the charges. That'll usually convince them to fold. If it doesn't, make good on the threat. Leave the CD in the store and walk out. Then, when you get home, call the bank that issued the credit card and ask what you need to do to block a charge. You'll probably need to write a letter explaining the charge you want blocked, and maybe attach a copy of the reciept (so make sure you have it). When you do what they bank wants, they'll stop the charge and bill the merchant. You won't be charged anything.
Believe me, it won't take a whole lot of this to put a stop to this copy protection. The mamangers of the specific stores will get all pissed off about this and raise a stink to the higher ups. It won't take too long before the root of the problem is traced back to this batch of CDs, and the recording company in question gets yelled at.
In Canada, we collect a levy on CDR media, rigthly or wrongly this allows us the RIGHT as a citizen to make copies of any music CD for our own personal use.
d s
I can take YOUR NSync CD and make a copy for myself (%insert_your_own_joke_here%).
See more about this here: http://neil.eton.ca/copylevy.shtml#copy_for_frien
So, does this mean that this 'version' of the NSync CD wont be sold here in Canada? Or will I have to start buying and returning CDs and showing them that their product infringes my rights as a Canadian according to the Copyright Act...
This could be seriously fun...
If you start arguing who is better, Brittney Spears or Christina Agulera I will have to shoot you.
Of course. There can't be any argument, Christina Aguilera is obviously better.
And I bet she uses Emacs, too.