Loki Goes Postal

xwred1 writes: "Loki has announced a new port today, up to now known as "Secret Project Q": They are going Postal! Press release is here, and the game product page/overview is here. Seems to be a healthy sign of life from Loki, they are obviously still getting good things done despite the chapter 11."

Comments

Linux and Video

[Wind_Walker]

Now that we're getting more OpenGL games than ever coming out for Linux, I think it might be a good time to address the problem of video card hardware support.

Many of us don't have 3D accelerators that work under Linux. While I'd like to have my hardware working under Linux, I realize that it's probably not going to happen any time this millenium.

So instead, I have a suggestion. Mesa currently has only one mode for software rendering--high quality. Is there any way that a low-quality software rendering mode could be introduced into Mesa? How difficult would it be to add this to the libraries, maybe have it switched on/off by an environment variable? How much of a slow-down would it introduce into the libraries, by having forked logic like this?

Because honestly, if I were to buy a copy of Quake III right now (this example would work the same with Postal once it comes out), I'd have to buy the Windows version because I haven't the "right" hardware 3D-accelerator. A sped-up, but much less visually correct, version of Mesa might make it easier for someone like me to bite the bullet and buy the Linux version, so that when I upgrade/if I upgrade to a 3D accelerated card, I'll have it under the OS I prefer.

(I realize this is pretty selfish, but it's also one of the reasons why you're not going to see many Windows users switching over to Linux any time soon. If I can't install Linux on someone else's 600Mhz Athalon, and be able to show them a kick-ass 3D game with a frame rate higher than 1.5/s...)

this is neither healthy nor a sign of life

[ebbv]

as much as i love loki and all they've done, this is not a good sign. i'd love to see loki become as successful as any of the really big game houses. porting old, mediocre (at best) games is not how it's going to happen. even i have a limit to the number of games i'll buy that i have no intention of playing just to support the company.

loki should be porting diablo 2, planescape torment, total annihilation, warcraft 3, etc. big, mainstream games that lots of people want to play. the question is, why aren't they? that's almost certainly due to the original authors not being interested in a linux version.

as much as i hate to admit it, i think linux's chances as a game platform have gone down the drain. the linux hype has gotten considerably less prevelant, and i'm willing to bet there are fewer people running it as their main home OS than in recent memory and that number is only going down.

there have not been any major improvements in this area which would draw people to it recently.. ease of installation hit the point where anyone able to install windows could do it a while ago. however, once the system is up and running, it's not so easy to get new things (like Mesa) set up. this has not improved.

and as i said, it's been a while since a big game was ported to linux.

all in all i don't see any light at the end of this tunnell. it pains me to say so because i've been using linux as my main desktop OS for years and years and always was really optimistic about it.
...dave

Re:this is neither healthy nor a sign of life

[BradleyUffner]

..."big, mainstream games that lots of people want to play. the question is, why aren't they? that's almost certainly due to the original authors not being interested in a linux version. "

Thats' easy, it's a licensing issue. If they decide to port a new game who gets the money for it? The orriginal authors, or Loki? If Loki gets the money for it then the orriginal author ends up not making as much money for the windows version because of sales lost to the linux version. If the orriginal author gets the money then Loki loses out. If the money is split then the orriginal author still end up not making as much money.

Re:this is neither healthy nor a sign of life

[vecna_99]

i couldn't disagree more. i don't want diablo ii ported to linux because i've already played it on my mac, and discovered that it more or less sucks. same with TA. haven't played planescape torment, so i can't comment on that.

it's pure folly for the linux game market to try to compete head-to-head with the PC game market; there's no reason why your average gamer would buy the same big mainstream game for linux when he can buy it for windows.

here are the priorities that loki should adopt:

1) port games that are mod-friendly and have a thriving mod community! we already have Q3 and UT. how about Bungie's Myth or Myth II? what about Half-Life?
loki should have a decent shot at getting companies to license ports of these games, mostly because they're all older games and are no longer a major revenue source for the owners.

2) port GOOD games that fail in the PC market due to insufficient promotion. it must be very frustrating for the owner of a game see the game sell poorly because everybody's buying this year's Tribes 2 instead. these games will be good opportunities for Loki to take advantage of.
(Postal, incidentally, falls into this category. for such a simple game, it's loads of fun. i played the demo for more hours than i've played two or three other games combined.)

as long as the linux gaming experience is just a clone of the PC gaming experience, it'll never flourish. while it's important to have good linux ports of popular network-only games, so linux gamers can attend LAN parties, the world of linux gaming should be a new lease on life for high-quality games that weren't pushed hard enough by their publishers.

-vecna_99

Re:In case you didn't notice their home page...

[dinivin]

Tribes 2 is done and out... You can order it from any of Loki's usual distributors.

Dinivin

Re:Signs of life...

[Jethro]

You know, I might actually buy a CD with Linux ports of all the ol' Apogee games. Maybe if they had the graphics updated a bit. I think that'sa wonderful idea.

Re:Postal sucks and Loki is screwed

[Svartalf]

"Part of Loki's problem is the intentional segregation. It was originally impossible to patch Quake 3 Windows to the Linux version, and the Linux and Mac versions were sold separately. Loki's tactics were intended to get them the money they were due and to gauge Linux support. However, it didn't work - Linux copies sold a tiny fraction of the number sold. Loki blamed it on most Linux users also being Windows dual-booters and that they settled on the Windows version and could wait for the patch. "

Originally impossible? Yes and no. The Q3A Windows versions weren't patchable until the Linux version shipped. When it shipped, Id offered the downloads- and it was all she wrote for the Linux version. Had they NOT offered a "patch" (or delayed it even further...), while it was not in keeping with their philosophy with prior games, it would have helped the sales of the game on the Linux front.

Also, as an attempt to gauge Linux gaming support, it was a failure, less due to there not being support and more due to the patch being out and a severe lack of physical avaialability of the game in the storefronts. When it shipped, I tried to purchase the game- in one of the largest software markets in the country and one of the largest Linux userbases in the country and in the world (Dallas, TX). I couldn't- at least not off of a store shelf. Why? Because the retailers that were supposed to stock it on the shelves didn't. The ones that did deliberately choked off sales by not stocking anywhere near enough (6-10 copies on the shelf of a release such as this doesn't cut it and insisting on taking pre-paid orders for more isn't any better) and by the time one of the stores had enough in stock (Fry's) the damage was already done.