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Sega To Take X-Box To Arcades
kikta writes "Well, after our previous speculation about what Sega would do after they got out of the hardware biz, it appears we have our answer. CNN is reporting that they will be producing motherboards to port the Xbox to the arcade. GamePro also weighed in on the announcement."
I didn't think this was all that big of a deal. There have long been suggestions of Sega working with Microsoft on the XBox. Didn't we even hear that the XBox might play Dreamcast discs natively at some point? Rumor or not, this isn't really huge news.
Unless you look at the hardware, of Sega discussing building an arcade version of the XBox. Again, I really don't consider this news. Sega pulled out of the _home_ console market, they were always doing well in the arcade market, and never intended to pull out of that at all.
So put two and two togeather. Sega makes games for XBox, and Sega makes arcade games. Wouldn't it make sense that Sega would want an Arcade version of XBox in order to make the transition from Arcade to home easiest?
They may not have put out a good (read: profitable) game system since the Genesis, but innovative games like Jet Set Radio and the ridiculously addictive Samba de Amigo should show everyone that Sega's still got plenty to offer when it comes to the often-stale world of video games.
Easy does it!
This comment has been submitted already, 276865 hours , 59 minutes ago. No need to try again.
This is a poor decision on Sega's part. First of all, arcades have been dying for years. The arcade of today is stuffed with crappy driving and ski simulators that cost $1.50 per 20 seconds of play. This is the environment Sega thinks that they can be successful in?
Furthermore, who on earth is going to pay ($1.00 or more?) to play arcade ports of games that are available for a home system? Just go buy an Xbox and the games and you don't have to pay to play. If you want to try the game first, you could always rent it or borrow it from a friend.
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So now I can look forward to paying 50 cents to see the blue screen of death. I wonder if the arcade attendants will need to get MCSE certification...
What do you mean they cut the power? How can they cut the power, man? They're animals!
I would reluctantly guess that we can expect to see more of Sega's best stuff on XBox. I am of two minds about this, because it will tempt me to buy an XBox, and I already wanted a Gamecube.
-- Support Ometz le-Serev.
I don't believe the future of arcades is the Pac-man and Donky Kong (or even Mortal Kombat) of years past. If you want to compete against someone in a high quality, graphically appealing game it can be done at home.
However, the future of arcades does appear to be in PC networked games. In a remote corner of a mall near Hartford, CT this weekend I noticed what used to be a shop full of 20 networked PC's with kids playing Quake.
How much future is there for the stand up two player model?
It's a great idea, since it gives people a chance to sample the Xbox, and there's some money to be made, too.
Nintendo did thid back in the mid 1980's, remember the Play-Choice 10, anyone?
This may be seen as off topic, but...
SEGA has done two great things for the world. Hedgehogs and driving games. SEGA should do hedgehogs and driving games. Simple as that.
Do one or two things exceptionally well, bugger volume! I'd pay a premium to play SEGA hedgehog or driving games on ANY platform - Arcade(yes please!), PC, Xbox, PS2, gamecube, handheld... you name it, I'll play it.
Hedgehogs and driving games!
Sonic Team - the U2 of games!
...exactly how?
Contrary to the popular belief, there indeed is no God.
Back in March, I posted this reply to a story about capcom calling it quits. Specifically, I said:
Today, the situation is quite difference. In fact, the X-Box seems to put the final nail in the coffin. Arcade game manufacturers may very well stop creating arcade games on custom hardware. Instead, they'll compile for an X-Box style platform. Why? For the ease of conversion to the home game. That's where the money is. The arcade game is just the 'advertisement' to create the buzz.
I don't pretend to have my finger on the pulse of the arcade industry, but it seemed like an obvious development. There isn't much need to create custom arcade hardware when you've got something like the X-Box that you can develop arcade games on and later port to the home PC (and X-Box game console).
Quite a good strategy, for Microsoft and Sega.
I recommend remaining with your choice of the gamecube. Go to the Nintendo GameCube website and check out the CubeClubs. Basically these are events in select cities where you can go play the GameCube with a lot of different games. I went to the one in Atlanta, GA a few weeks ago and I have to say that Star Wars is absolutely breathtaking. I felt like I was actually in the movie controlling the X-wing. You can do many different missions though, and use a lot of different vehicles. Another one I really liked was Madden 2002. I've been a fan of Madden ever since it was Madden 64. I have played Madden 2002 for PS2 at a friend's house and I thought the graphics were really great but the play was unresponsive. Well, for GameCube, as expected, that is fixed. The players respond immediately to what you press on the controller. Oh, and that reminds me, the controller for GameCube is really cool. I was skeptical at first sight on cube.ign.com but when I held it in my hand it just felt right. They've really outdone themselves with this system, trust me... or go to a Cube Club.
~ now you know
I wonder if it would be possible to build/hack a JAMMA adapter for Sega's new board...??
This is a legitimate business move. One of the main reasons people go to arcades is to play other people. A good friend of mine bought a copy of Marvel vs. Capcom 2 for his Dreamcast and hardly plays it anymore. He's had it maybe three weeks. However, he still goes to arcades and spends hour after hour playing Marvel vs. Capcom 2. The Dreamcast version he can play at home on his big screen TV is arcade perfect (arguably better than the arcade version), but playing a computer-controlled opponent just can't compare to playing another person. Computer-controlled opponents have routines and tendencies that become familiar to players after a while. On the other hand, if console networking continues to improve that incantive decreases. There is a lure to having a physical opponent to scream insults at, but is it strong enough?
My Karma is so good, I'm the Dalai Lama...or something.
I can't believe how many people are rushing to post speculations without reading the articles. Posting without reading the articles is like a first post, useless to the discussion.
This is more than just a power play to be the arcade hardward source (despite the speculations of some people here, Sega has been doing pretty good in the arcades) this is also a good oportunity for Sega franchises to continue on a new platform. Think about the first time you saw Sonic? Everyone instantly fell in love with him. For those of you that play imports, Sakura Taisen probably holds a special place in your heart. Phantasy Star, admitadly a knock-off on Final Fantasy, is hugely popular. While some people are questioning this move, I think this is Sega playing to it's strenghts.
Heck, there's a couple games at the laundry I often use and only once in over a year have I seen anyone play them.
Putting the xbox guts into these machines might be a cost effective solution, but I dunno. If the whole thing is supposed to sell for $499, even at cost I think they could do better. I wonder if there'll be any marketing through stenographic or subliminal messages...
Insert 1 coin for one player
Insert 2 coins for two players
Insert 5 coins for customer support
Insert 20 coins to recover from blue screen
Insert 100 coins if you don't want captured video of you getting your worst score ever published on the web
WINners DOn't use drugs!
WinnerS eXPerience the
GOOD LIfe! Never Underestimate
the power of the Xbox, Boys AnD
girls!
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Phantasy Star does, indeed, hold a special place in my heart. It was the first console RPG that rivalled my beloved text-based adventure games for play value.
I take exception with the notion that Phantasy Star was a rip-off of Final Fantasy, however, as it was released in 1987. A full 3 years before Final Fantasy made its way onto the NES platform.
It was actually released slightly before Dragon Warrior, a far inferior RPG that received a great deal more attention.
And while Final Fantasy I and Phantasy Star are quite different (FFI being more traditionally RPG and PS incorporating futuristic themes), I would note that I was struck by how the later Final Fantasy themes would begin to rip off the original Phantasy Star (from 1987!!!), with the incorporation of a great deal of science fiction and the adopting of a standard scenario whereby the world was a combination of technical and magical components.
Sega has often set the bar by which other console games are judged, only to regretfully be forgotten about themselves. They just couldn't sell enough console units to generate buzz, and eventually their game quality decreased even as their engineering grew more apt.
Still, their existing Arcade games are head-and-shoulders above most, in my opinion. When I go to the Arcade (twice a year?), it's not to play Tekken Tag or any of the more mindless games, it's to play the queer looking machines that have strange controllers, odd viewpoints, fascinating takes.... by and large, these machines proudly sport the "Sega" insignia.
-l
Sega is using
System 246 boards too.
Sony was there first.
++ Say to Elrond "Hello.".
Elrond says "No.". Elrond gives you some lunch.
At the very least, the arcade version will use different storage formats. Loading from DVD or a custom disc-based format is completely inappropriate for an arcade box.
Of course, then there's things coin-slot detection, to know when to start the game (yes, this could be somewhat standardized, but you'd want some integration into your attract screen), etc.
Not to mention that the arcade box might have more features (more standard memory, slightly faster CPU, etc).
All of this is pretty standard for arcade boxes based on consoles...Similar situations exist for the PS2-based arcade board as well as Naomi (the Sega Dreamcast based arcade board).
tags, friend, so don't blame me...blame slashcode.
I was wondering if Microsoft would get away with putting a crappy OS in a consumer box.
Now, arcades are not exactly the place where you tolerate crashes or BSODs. The mobo has to be glitch-free, and the software shouldn't crash ever.
Point 1 (mobo never crashing) is hard enough with server PCs. Considering the speed of the XBox graphics subsystem and the corner-cutting (a.k.a. price-reduction engineering) required in a high-volume chipset, this will be no mean feat.
Obviously, Sega will develop specific motherboards for this application, but they'll need to use the same chip set, which already suffered from the usual bane of highly complex chips (bugs founds in production). Sega can't allow these chips to glitch their arcade machines. The arcade manager would pull the plug at the first crash and call service. How are they going to solve this problem? Sorting and cooling? Anyone knows?
Point 2 is interesting. If the XBox's OS and DirectX layer can really withstand the day-long, intensive use of a high-perf game machine without crashing, then Microsoft should be commended for a great QA job.
And if it cannot stand the intensive load, then a lot of gamers will see these "XBox Inside" Sega machines with the plug pulled and an out-of-use sign. This will not look too good for the sales of the XBox.
If MS can survive this, they'll have an impressive product on their hands. Hyperactive teens pounding on your mobo are no substitute for good design, but they are a good substitude for a high-speed test vector generator! :-)
--
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The real reason Sega is doing this is that they are strapped for cash, and see a way to slash arcade machine costs. Its a desperation move. It has nothing to do with innovation.
We won't see any PC games in the arcade for the simple reason that it won't work. Incidentally, this is also why Xbox will fail as a console-- porting games works one way:
Arcade --> Console --> PC.
It DOES NOT and NEVER WILL work the other way:
PC --> Console --> Arcade. PC games are just too complex for a console, and require too much time to play for arcade operators to make any money.
The golden rule of an arcade game is reasonable excitement in 30 seconds to two minutes. PC games are made to be played for hours straight. The two don't mix.
Successful arcade games all make use of new and innovative input devices, which is where most of the production cost goes, anyway. There won't be any addtional saving on production, games are already made using PCs and have been for years.
So in the end, Sega gets to shave some dollars from machine cost, maybe, and the slow death of arcades is prolonged a bit longer.
I go to arcades all the time and all I see are DDR clones, bad fighting games, bad driving games, goofy games like Namco's horsie ride, and variations on Time Crisis. I see no renaissance of the arcade, not for gamers at least.
Here in Los Angeles, arcades are not doing well. The last arcade opened years ago. Speedzone out in City of Industry used to have maybe 100 games. Now they have 25 and a lot of prize machines.
Its a tragedy, but arcades are dead, and Microsoft can't save them.
Ever flown a commercial flight simulator, like CAE produces? These things are the bomb - picture a 30 foot high room that can spin like a top. There are lots of companies working on much less expensive versions of exotic simulators - namely flight and automotive/racing - that make use of cheaper projection technology to immerse the player in an environment that you're just not going to get at home.
The conventional model is dead, yeah. Nobody is going to make money with games like Centipede or even Tekken anymore, and the arcades are dying quick. But - I could definately see people getting bored with playing GT4 on their TV and want to get into a mockup of an Acura NSX and try the same thing, though, especially if they're networked and competitive against other people. Or the same thing with flight sims. Set up national tournaments in immersive environments. Racing for example has a huge following, but most people will never race a indy car. Technology will advance to the point where you could do a life-like simualtion of the indy car circuit virtually, for example.
There's lots of companies working on this, and before you shirk it too much, I've flown a flight sim based on three projectors and a real cockpit, and it's definately real enough to amaze - even if you never actually move.
Something to think about, anyhow.
..don't panic
...even for Sega. Sega's cartridge-based NAOMI arcade system is the same hardware as the Dreamcast. (At least, when released, it was the same hardware, with an extensible architecture, meaning it could be extended to improve rendering speed above that over the DC, for future "arcade-improved" releases).
This is why their recent ports of the arcade games have been so quick (simultaneous arcade and home releases), and so "arcade-perfect". No time was spent porting the game engines, just on the interface changes.
I believe they also have a software porting layer for the ps2, now, so that they can do essentially simultaneous releases of Arcade, DC, and PS2 (see Capcom vs. SNK 2).
So they've done this before, and it seems to have had the desired effects for the most part. Why not do this, if it doesn't cost too much to adapt the hardware, when you can do the same home development and get an arcade version of the game "for free", to make whatever money you can off that. Now they're just doing it for someone else's system instead of their own, much like making their games for others' systems, instead of their own.
-Puk
Apologies - I meant previous to their current solution (Naomi 2) rather than the XBox/PS2-based solutions they're working with as well.
As for Naomi 2 vs home systems, it looks like accurate home conversions of Naomi 2 titles should be possible - the PS2 version of VF4 appears to be *better* than arcade perfect in some respects, and that's the weakest (oldest) of the home consoles this generation now that DC is bowing out.
++ Say to Elrond "Hello.".
Elrond says "No.". Elrond gives you some lunch.