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The Timex Speedpass Watch
RedWolves2 writes "Timex Corporation is developing a watch which incorporates Speedpass technology embedded into it. McDonalds has also partnered with Speedpass with 400 stores in the Chicago area that accept speedpass. Now you can order a value meal like this "You will serve me a Big Mac Meal with a Coke!" (While waving your hand like a Jedi Knight using the Jedi Mind trick)."
"You will serve me a Big Mac Meal with a Coke!" (While waving your hand like a Jedi Knight using the Jedi Mind trick)."
How is this different than what I do already?
I am Jack's HTTP Server
Heh, user puts on speedpass watch and forgets he/she's wearing it and at a visit to a speedpass supported gas station, walks a wee bit too close to the pumps...
FREE GASOLINE! just not for YOU!
Cant imagine the MULTIPLE ways this watch could get abused.. it hooks up to your creditcard so hell, I'd rather have my speedpass on a seperate thing to make SURE nothing gets charged to it by accident!
when your watch gets "declined" at the line at mcdonalds. sad, staring at those fries, quietly asking the 15 year old in the yelow visor if you can just wave it one more time.
yes i run a goth/punk/emo porn site.
Why would anyone use this technology when micropayments and the like can be done using your mobile phone using reverse billing now (you punch in a code to your mobile and an amount gets added to your phone account) and in the future there is bluetooth.
This proprietary, system will shortly float off into oblivion like all the rest.
Reliable, Great Value Hosting: $7.95/mo 2.4G/120G
Well.. I saw a movie the other day (70s movie) where a guy goes to McDonalds and gets served in an instant. Wow. That's never happened to me. The movie was some Time Machine thing with the main characters HG Wells and Jack the Ripper. Can't remember the title.
Does the watch incorporate a timer between the time I pay and the time I get served, and start beeping (indicating I will get my meal free, and automatically reversing the transaction) when the doofus behind the counter still hasn't served me my McChicken and Fries within the time limit I specify?
Conversion Rate Optimisation French / English consultant
Wouldn't these things be pretty prone to EMI?
Also.... I'm not sure if this is an issue, but what if it runs out of batteries?
Or... even better yet... what if someone makes a "speedpass scanner" and walks around a mall for an afternoon, leeching from everyone closeby.
Seems pretty exploitable...anyone have experience with these? I would imagine that having these more widespread would open them up to more problems.
-kwishot
It is a little larger then a normal Swatch and you can load it at umpteen or so ski resorts, where it can be used instead of a normal ski pass.
ich bin der musikant
mit taschenrechner in der hand
kraftwerk
I'm not to sure on the exact specifications of the speedpass system, but it would seem to me that anything that can transmit a signal to another unit (the reader) would also, in theory, be able to transmit the signal to an interceptor. It's only a matter of time before someone thinks up a way in which to pick up the speedpass xfers and reprogram/program 'new' ones with the information from others. These watches would mean that people could snipe the information in other locations (the office... or any other place someone might wear a watch, but normally not have their speedpass button available) and not just at gas stations.
Anyone?
"It's the Law of the Universe, and I'm the sheriff." Slash-cott 2/10-2/17
Wot? I already thought those parental advisories that have been around telling kids to "Not talk to strangers".. those ads have been around for like centuries.. I'm pretty sure it means to NOT shake hands either!
"These are not the fries you are looking for"
----- Whats wrong with this picture? http://www.revoh.org:1234/whatswrong
I cant remember the exact quote but it oges something like this
....
....
because banks wanted to be secure the invented teller machines that first of all asked for a pin then took a sample of blood and scrapped skin from the back of your neck for DNA testing ending with some very personal questions about you and your family
people couldnt take it an longer so they invented the identyChip... to answer all the DNA and biometric tests and be rid of personal questions
in the end people stole the identyChips and commited faud as they had before
nice Idea but should this not be Done with something standard and low power like Bluetooth connect it up to a phone that has your equivlent IdentyChip on it
you could even order ahead through your phone and then when you got to Macky Dees(or any other shop where ques are an issue like Coffe shops and theaters) you have your order ready !
sort it out people
regards
john jones
Ever try to tune in an AM radio in a car at a Mobile Gas station that employs Speedpass.
At stations sporting three rows of pumps all equipped with these infernal electro-magnetic emmision Fast Pass coils so much noise is broadcast that AM Radio becomes pure noise.
This is true even on good radios with all digital modern tuning.
Its disgusting. This crap should all be made illegal.
I have a RIGHT to receive radio without deliberate interference from abusive technologies that violate my space.
I hope people will band together to petition against these eternally broadcasting 24 hours a day illegal radio emmitters... also known as "Fast Pass sensor equipment"
Arrrrrghhhh!
I love AM talk radio... I can listen to CLEVELAND and NASHVILLE and MONTREAL clearly at night in boston suburbs in my car.
But nothing at all comes in once I drive too close to Fast Pass equipment. I understand radiation should diminish at R^3 (cube root) but geeeez these fast pass things seem more insidious and powerful than you think.
The most insidious and EVIL pulse reader passivly scans the ROM chips in 2001 tires... and does it at the us-canadian borders (soon or already).
The codes exist for product control and are readable from many feet from the tires, but the US gov uses them because Liscense plates are too easy to swap-steal-create.
And wait till they start using passive pulses to read the sub-grain-of-rice bio id rom implated originally in dogs but soon applicable for enemies of the US federal governement on probation.
Its only a few years away... just you wait.
We need to closely control this slippery slope of eroding rights and spying on our lives and destruction of our AM radio air space.
If one of these things ever gets stolen, there is literally no way to trace where it is.
No signatures... nothing.
With a credit card there are a few more layers of security.
First, it needs to be swiped (can't be read from a distance...which can be potentially bad)
Second, you need to sign for it
Third, many credit cards have the option of a picture...
Pretty scary.
-kwishot
Hmm. You shake hands with your right hand. And you wear your watch on your left hand. Thus shaking hands will not bring your watch any closer to the other guy's watch than simply standing behind him in a queue. So where's the problem?
Say no to software patents.
From what I can see from the speedpass website there is no authentification to verify that the possesor of the speedpass is really the owner. A speedpass is the electronic equivalent of a blank cashiers check to my bank account, so if I lose a speedpass I lose the equivalent of my credit card plus my pin code! Am I willing to risk this just so I can wave my wrist/keys without having to type a PIN? NO! I may be lazy, but not stupid.
Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
How about making the speedpass standard available for gas first?
In san diego there's not a single gas station that will accept speedpass.
I'm sick of things being hyped as new revolutionary and totally cool without seeing it become actually popular by public demand.
If you spend all your money funding new instances of your product standard before it becomes a standard you're in for a reality check, not a paycheck.
These people need to get out in the real world and see what it's like, not take the word of the company marketing and selling the products.
) Human Kind Vs Human Creation
) It'd be interesting to see how many humans would survive to serve us.
...you'll not only get a charge report but also a calories/sodium/fat report. Your doctor will be automatically alerted if your visit frequency exceeds 5/day or if you're likely to get RSI (aka tennis elbow or nowadays JWS (jedi wave syndrome). Your undertaker will be informed when he has to rent a crane. You mom will know you already had your share of of caffeine when you show up that sunday for coffe and cookies.
The funny thing is the same people start hyperventilating when something about an ID card is pondered upon...
Use The Source, Luke!
FastPass! Dont make me laugh. Fast food restaurants still have a hard time accepting CASH. Get McDonalds to Accept CASH (2 dollar bills) first.
Yup you heard me... for laughs I carry around 2 dollar bills with me to cause trouble at institutional minded stores and fast food empires that lack places to tuck away Half dollars, susan B coins, 2 dollar bills, and golden dollar coins. I like to force 2 dollar bills on rigid institutions.
But that is not all I do, I act like I am low on coins, hunting my pockets, then finally producing a 2 dollar bill or two to complete a purchase, avertIng my gaze "nervously".
I act as if it is a non-valid note.
Guess what? Innercity dwelling teen females usually have to go get the manager to see if such as thing (a US 2 dollar bill) is legal tender and truly act as if they have a counterfeitter standing before them.
Sometimes it causes quit a stir.
I tried using a 50 dollar bill on a 37 dollar purchase at an Arbys and had to leave my comapanys order because they refused to accept the 50 dollar bill as strict corporate policy.
Under US law all these things are valid for public and private debt so long as no more than 25 of the same coin denomination is used without mutual acceptance.
Only one business has a US federal government exception : Federal Express.
Federal Express in Los Angeles and in autonomous cities in california such as Pasadena are premitted at the FBI's insistence to deny accepting any US currency at their stores and insist on debit and credit cards only.
Other Than Federal Express, everyone else has to accept Federal Reserve notes.... but just try to get them to take a 2 dollar bill.
I think we should start with basics before getting them to use fraud prone SpeedPass.
Actually, that system was very advanced for its time. If you passed the toll station on the Køfri area without a chip in your window, two cameras digitally photograhped your license plate in normal and infrared light. Pictures were stored on MO media for evidence, and the system could react on cars passing as fast as 490 km/h.
A lot of people posting here seem to be worried about interception of credit card/debit info -- as though Speedpass watches would simply beam out your account number into the open, where anyone with a scanner could pick up your info. Problems like this are easily solved with cryptography -- choose your favorite authentication protocol. Instead of sensitive account data, the watches more likely beam out a unique identification number linked to a public key directory (for authentication) and credit/debit card numbers.
Of course, none of this matters if your entire watch gets stolen, which is a far more serious security matter.
Cheers,
IT
Power corrupts. PowerPoint corrupts absolutely.
...this is just an intermediate step; why not cut out the middlestep and just implant the damn thing in your wrist now? And then have the McDonald's logo tattoted on.
As they say, marketing is all about perception; if you commit a crime, you wear one of these and they call it a monitoring bracelet; I can't wate to hear what they call it ("McTracker") to get McCustomers to line of for them.
Actually, I'm not totaly opposed to the idea of an implanted chip, as long as it isn't the counter crew at McD's who have to insert it!
Why yes, Mr. Beast, I'd be glad to accept your mark! What? You say you want me to bow down before your graven image? Oh, 'tis not a problem at all!
N4st0r, trixx0r h0bb1tz0rz! Th3y st0l3 0ur pr3c10uzz!
'This is not the Happy Meal I ordered'
'This is not the Happy Meal you ordered!'
'You will make me a Cheeseburger Happy Meal'
'We will make you a Cheeseburger Happy Meal!'
'You will not forget the toy'
'We will not forget the toy!'
The Jedi Mind Trick surely could work wonders at McDonalds...unfortunately, at Wendy's they employ mainly Hutts.
They do not have batteries. I'm not exactly sure HOW they work but I haven't seen anyone else explain it either and, you know, this is the net. The answer can't be that difficult.
A web google search didn't turn up much besides this. The Mobil Speedpass is based on Texas Instruments' Registration and Identification System (TIRIS), the first radio-frequency identification (RFID) device used for retail transactions. The system is similar to a remote control but different in that RFIDs transmit a user-specific signal, almost like a wireless PIN number.
But a usenet search turned up a lot, like this post. Ok, a typical device of this type is quite simple in concept. The coil with rod, acts to recieve 100Khz or so RF, which is then rectified to charge a capacitor, to power the rest. There is a small chip in there, which talks to the reader, usually by shorting out the coil for short periods of time, this causes the RF field to change, which can be read by the reader. Another way is for the chip to connect a diode to the coil, this causes the transmitter/reciever to generate a harmonic, at 2* the frequency of the exciting field, this can also be picked up.
Until they implement speedpass into the sole of my shoe and make purchases with it consists of 20 mph kung-fu kicks, I won't think any of this technology is practical or an improvement.
I rather agree with some other posters that this system will most likely be supplanted by cell phone-based systems -- mostly because phones will probably soon include location/GPS systems. Not only will each purchase be tracked, but the location as well (E911 services) -- beyond the flip side of the privacy implications, that would make theft a bit more complicated, since the police would know the exact location of the thief. Note that since the anonyminity of cash is not existant in the system, the thief has a very small window of opportunity -- if he goes anywhere with video surveilance to use the system, between the ID of the electronic wallet, and the time stamp of the transaction, he will be recorded. If he transfers money to his own account, well... not quite the Darwin Awards but...
... what happens if anonymous cash and purchases are no longer common?
Pan-handling could become a thing of the past if no one has any cash to hand out and the homeless cannot get a device to have money transferred into. Drug dealers, porn stores, bookstores, charities, political groups, gun dealers, money laundring, etc.
Would it make people spend money more easily as they have to think about it less? Just wave device/push a button?
Hrmn. You two are taking this "living of two lives as one thing" very seriously it appears:
CmdrTaco (editor) (kathleenfent@yahoo.com)
Speedpass is a good idea, but all the consumer protections associated with a normal credit card DO NOT APPLY.
According to consumer advocates (one among them being Clark Howard in Atlanta GA) SpeedPass is bad news. If your speedpass device is lost or stolen or in any way abused you are LIABLE for ALL charges. Not so with a real credit card. According to Clark on his syndicated radio show part of the SpeedPass agreement states this (I have not seen it.) A consumer called into Clarks show and relayed that they had to pay over $4000 in bogus charges for a fleet vehicle because one of his employees had lost the SpeedPass. Clark explained to him that there was nothing he could do to help, SpeedPass is built that way. It was clearly fraud but SpeedPass, again, does not offer the protections a credit card does. BE ADVISED, NOT A GOOD IDEA.
Until these clowns step up to the plate and make SpeedPass work identically to a credit card, then forget it.
Funny? Insightful? Paranoid? Probably all of the above.
Credit cards also seemed pretty exploitable when they were invented. Hey, I bet personal cheques seemed so too. And to be fair, these things are exploited, but, people will always find a way to thieve regardless of the technology. Perhaps there is some aspect in which this technology is actually safer than plastic cards... Read the other comments for info about its security features... Hmm...
Great! Now I'll be able to buy speed faster than ever! I may not even have to stop the car - just lower the window and my man can toss it in as I roll by.
I can't wait until weedpass comes out next year!
This sounds great, just so long as they use it to track my every movement. I'm getting sick and tired of friends, family, and government agents not knowing where I am every second of my life.
Thank you Speedpass!
Anything you can do, I can do meta.
(That is, unless the ladies take SpeedPass too!)
For your security, this post has been encrypted with ROT-13, twice.
At my local drug store, they don't bother to ask for a signature for purchases under $10. I was told it was for convience. Whatever. Of course, they never checked the signature with my driver's license or even the back of the credit card so I could sign pretty much any way I wanted to.
Point of that rambling, is there isn't anything more secure about using a credit card at the gas pump (or this particular store) than a speed pass. In my case, showing up at the gas station means wearing full motorcycle gear and the speed pass I attaced to my jacket sleeve saves me about a minute of fussing with zippers and gloves and other saftey gear.
in Hong Kong, they have been using the "Octopus Card" for the past 6 or 7 years. It's actually really cool because you can go to the subway station and get one. It is a standard magnetic card that you could use for subway, City buses, vending machines and I believe they had a couple of stores that had them. They started to market the Octopus watches for kids so they won't lose it (as public transportation in HK is a huge business). It would really be nice if we had a system like that here. From the way things look, we may be up to speed in a few more years!
but more a sign of how convenience.has won over modern society. More people will eat at McD's because it's now faster than anything else, choke up on their fries and Big Mac, and the country as a whole gets five pounds heavier and less healthy overall.
Neat idea, but I'll pass, thank you.
LV
Woot w00t w007.
Of course everyone knows that to indicate which code is in use, they will all start with 6 hundred 3 score and 6.
for those who don't get it, in Christianity 666 is the number of the beast, a throughly evil creature who forced everyone to get his tatoo at one time. (accually this is some time in the future, not past)
That's great -- I can't wait for them to put those speedpasses in the Ironman triathlon watches, so that the fat slob wearing it can get his greasy Mcdonalds big mac and fries 10 seconds faster than his previous record... :)
...
Ha ha
Its the mark of the beast!!!!!!!! :-p
I am the Alpha and the Omega-3
The utility vs. security of the Speedpass has baffled me right from the start. Speedpass was a technology developed by Esso (Exxon) to be used at its gas stations. Soon after, another gas station company here in Canada, PetroCan, developed its own proprietary version of the technology. At the outset, it appeared that the two technologies wouldn't interoperate, and I haven't seen anything to suggest otherwise.
/or/ a Petrocan station). So the trade is a (little) extra speed (since you can swipe a card at the pump, too) for the ability to only use it in one or two places.
What we have then, is something that is effectively a (faster) credit card, except that the credit card only works in one place (namely, an Esso
Moreover, the security of the Speedpass is minimal -- less so than even our credit card system. And who knows how good/fast Esso will be at deleting your account when you tell them your Speedpass has been stolen.
To me, it seems like they're trying to get (gas) brand loyalty. Here in Canada (different than in the US), gas quality at different stations is essentially the same (due to regulatory bodies); thus, brand loyalty is a myth when it comes to gas -- I just see who gives me the cheapest gas on the day that I need it.
Reader expense is a small part of the expense of a total solution. If you look at this page you will see that the buttons themselves are more expensive than the readers. Also the buttons are much more expensive than comparable smart cards. I can buy Java Card Open Platform cards for $2.86 and there are 16 kbyte (not kbits as the iButton measures things) MFC cards for less than $1. If you are doing a deployment the cost of the cards will dwarf the cost of readers.
(I prefer my ring)
What do you use it for? Do you wear it all the time?
Disclaimer: I work for IBM so I might be biased.
Lasers Controlled Games!
Browsing on Speedpass' own website, it appears that there is NO security other than needing physical possession of the "speedpass" device. (Their "Question and Answer" section specifically states that you don't even need to type in a PIN number)
So...who's going to be the first to build a directional "Pringles(tm) Can" antenna to record SpeedPass exchanges, and publish schematics for programmable speedpass "emulators"?
The only way I'd consider bothering with this is if I could get a "buffer" account to tie it to, and dump, say, $50 in it at a time from my real account (so that if my "Speedpass" gets stolen and is used before I have a chance to transfer the money back out of the "buffer" account, I wouldn't be able to lose more that $50 or so...) Tying it to a Credit Card just seems completely insane to me, especially since other posts say that YOU are liable for unauthorized charges on the thing...
Hacker Public Radio is our Friend
It would make more sense for McD's to start taking debit/credit cards first.
I never have cash on hand, and it's wasteful to pull out $20, along with the usual ATM fee just to buy a couple of cheeseburgers.
This is probably why they sent out quick release keychain clips a while ago and recommended removing your Speedpass from your keychain before giving your keys to a valet. Of course, I wouldn't trust a valet to park anything more valuable than an old pair of running shoes...
Can someone explain this for the non-Americans? I'm curious... Are $2 and $50 notes/bills rare or discontinued or something? Or is it that cashiers dislike giving change from a $50?
I will now run it through the dishwasher to get the grit off and I will report back here!
Lasers Controlled Games!
So many problems here... I didn't think there were people out there who actually handed over the entire keyring when taking a car in to be serviced. No reputable dealership or garage should accept anything more than the key, which should be fairly easy to remove. Also, I don't know about their Speedpass, but mine came with its own little ring to make it easy to remove, and a couple months ago I was sent a couple of little clips to make it even easier to remove (the clips were accompanied by a suggestion to never give someone your Speedpass with your keys).
As for toll-paying devices, it's a bit tough to rack up huge charges with those things unless you live near some really expensive bridges or something (McDonalds doesn't accept them yet, but I'm sure they're working on it). It's still a good idea to remove them, but unless it takes you a long time to notice that there are two empty velcro strips on the inside of your windshield, a thief isn't going to get much (as in less than $5) in exchange for risking the loss of a job and criminal charges (especially considering that to use them you have to go through a tollbooth that probably has a camera that can take a picture of the license plate of someone trying to use a stolen tag).
Just ran it through with the dishes with detergent. Card continues to function. I am thinking that if I hit it with a hammer several times I will destroy it. I think that an iButton would also be destroyed by a hammer. My point is that I can't think of anything that would happen to the card in the course of normal use that would destroy it.
Lasers Controlled Games!
"Timex. It takes a licking, and keeps on tracking your every movement, faithfully letting The Man and Doubleclick know your spending habits."
Hey, it has a nice ring to it, doncha think?
Can you think of some sort of physical abuse that would destroy your iButton?
Lasers Controlled Games!
you right handed facist!
most left handed people(who are also smarter and better looking the right handed people)wear our watches on are right wrist.
:)
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Yeah, it's really useful when you find someone dead on your landing.
General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.