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Nethack 3.4.0
Dark_Nova writes "Nethack 3.4.0 - the latest version of the greatest game ever created - has just been released. See the release notes for details about what's new, or go here to download it."
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When i first played Diablo all i could think was, "Hey this is just hack with a nice interface". All the same elements are there except that nethack has a depth and subtle complexity that Diablo lacks.
Lets see you master Starcraft in 100 hours of gaming :)
...)
And by mastering, I don't mean finishing the single-player game, but being a master of multiplayer matches..
In fact, most games aren't really "mastered" in 100 hours.. finishing the single-player game isn't mastering, and most modern games are geared towards the multiplayer version (Quake 3, Unreal Tournament, Starcraft,
Hmmm, I'm downloading it right now and I have 3 kids. All the famous hackers I can think of are married, except RMS...
The deal with NetHack is that is has been in development for ~15 years, and almost all of that work has gone into the gameplay. The interface hasn't changed at all in forever, there aren't really any graphics, so all of the work that is put into the game goes into how it plays, not how it looks.
Once I get really into a game, the graphics don't much matter (excepting maybe a few select games, such as Myst). Once I've been playing for very long, I stop really seeing the details of the graphics, and see more of the abstract concepts involved. If new graphical effects are slowly leaked out over time, I may continue to pay them some attention (in Black and White, for example, I continued to pay some attention to how my creature was growing, getting fatter or thinner, and looking nicer or meaner), but it's mostly at the level of mild amusement. As long as I'm just going to see the abstracted version of what's really going on, why waste a lot of time on the interface? Put the time into game play, because that's what I really care about.
The problem, though, is that people are initially attracted to a game by the graphics, even if the graphics don't ultimately have a big impact on how much they enjoy it. I've been playing NetHack since, uhhh, shit, I dunno when. Given modern standards for graphics, most people look at it and snort in derision. I know this happens all the time when I'm playing and someone wanders by and asks what I'm up to. I can try to explain that the gameplay is _way_ more important than the graphics, but it's hard to get people to sit down and put in the effort to learn it.
I'm still happy playing, but this makes me a little nervous. How many new people are finding NetHack these days? I'm guessing it's not many. If NetHack can't keep attracting new blood, it'll eventuall stagnate and die. _Man_, that would suck.
Arrr, it be the infamous pirate, No Beard Pete!
Unfortunately (fortunately?) for me, I succumbed to searching for cheats on the web after dying the 6th time. Nethack is wonderfully rich, but in it's richness it's also one of the most unforgiving games you can play. There are hundreds and hundreds of things to do...but by the same turn there are just as many ways to die.
For those of you who are not familiar with Nethack, once you're dead...you're dead. This can get especially frustrating if you've invested a lot of time in the character. So after having died so many times within the first hour of gameplay...almost regardless of what I did.(it's very easy to run out of food, die of desease, etc) I decided to check the web:
No sooner than 15 minutes later, I had discovered a 'cheat' for saving character files. This effectively meant that I would never die...provided I kept backup copies of my character which wasn't a problem.
So with this method I happily hummed along, and my wizard gained all kinds of levels and items...and the Nethack world WAS incredibly rich and diverse. But...for whatever reason...I payed another visit to the cheats section on the web. After about 15 minutes of looking I discovered 'Poly-piling'. It involves zapping a 'pile' of your gear with the 'Wand of Polymorphing' transforming it into other random items of the same type. This, coupled with the ability to reload my previous saved games(thanks to my backup copies) effectively gave me the ability to stock my wizard with any item I wanted =(. . I'd just zap and reload until the process prduced the item(s) I was looking for.
So, to make a long story shorter, by the end of about 1 week's time, my wizard had mega gear, and mega levels...but I had lost something...my Nethack innocence if you will..and there was no getting it back.
For the brief time that I played nethack, it was all there was in life. The underlying texture of Nethack was the most wonderful and diverse computer based roleplaying experience I have every had. But, those times are forever passed for me. Sometimes in those fond memories...I try to return to the game, to revel again in that fountain of wonder...but every time I try, the urge to invoke those nasty save/polypiling cheats overpowers me! Alas I cannot...and I end up quiting the game out of shame...rather than doing so.
The Moral of the story...is that the posters here who play for years very likely do not employ these 'cheats'. I chose the dark path...and it forever tainted my Nethack experience...yes, power was quicker, easier to obtain! But ultimately it spoiled me! and I cannot enjoy Nethack for what it was meant to be...trecherous, unrelenting, and vastly rewarding game play!
Comparing apples and oranges. You can "master" starcraft in 20 hours of gaming. You would know all the units, moving them, everything about the game, etc. What you wouldn't have "mastered" is playing against other people.
NetHack on the other litereally takes 100's of hours to master the game.
It is not designed such that the player is ensured to eventually win. Almost every commercial game uses the same psychological feedback formula of "optimal" reward that essentially makes every game blend into each other.
Although Diablo/Diablo2 might perfect that formula such that playing all the way through is very engaging, the replayability is low due to the fact that you know the game is designed for you to win.
Nethack is a universe that is vast enough that winning is exceptionally difficult, even if you read all the spoilers. Yet you still have the impression that it is easy throughout.
Maybe though if there is one hint to take to heart it is to learn how to use and make holy water.
Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.
But you just haven't given it sufficient chance. It only seems clunky at first because people are not used to the game's key ideas:
A. You don't need flashy graphics
B. You only have one life
Perhaps you are frustrated by other things as well, but these two things seem to turn off the most people, as far as I can see. People who get hung up on the game's difficulty and/or interface often fail to notice the hundreds of things that can actually happen in the game that make you stop and say "I can't believe they thought of that!" My wife was playing one time; she read a scroll of Punishment and was outfitted with a ball and chain. Later, she fell in a pit trap, and while attempting to climb out, the ball rolled in and hit her character in the head, ending the game. I find that completely funny and cool. Or the fact that you can get rings from kitchen sinks. Makes sense, right? Discovery is everything in Nethack...
Try dipping a potion bottle into itself. :)
Even though your pet can get a free meal like that, it pays for you to get in first and buy all the tripe rations. Then, when your pet picks up something *really* valuable, drop one outside the store and watch your pet speed outside, with whatever loot it has pilfered! :D
I think the point is that people would rather hear a symphony where the musicians were ugly and dressed in rags than go see a group of beautiful people bang pots and pans together. If you get both the good view and the good content, that's great. But when you have to choose, more people would rather have the good content.
If my choices were playing chess with scraps of cardboard against a knowledgable player, and playing tic-tac-toe with a 3 year old using diamonds and rubies, I'm taking the chess.
Empire, www.empire.cx, rec.games.empire, has been around forever.
It is great multiplayer game focusing on strategy and not appearance. It is said that it's easier to develop a program that will be the best chess player in the world (it's been done actually) than to create a bot that will win in Empire.
The depth of the game and military genius of the famous players are amazing. Modert online RTS's are way more primitive.