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Windows on an iMac (says the invoice); Red Hat's Alternative
A user writes "According to a story at The Register, schools who want to take advantage of educational bulk licensing agreements with Microsoft have to count all PCs (and Macs!), even those not running Windows." One package of software applies to all installed PCs and Macs, including those running Linux or BSD, so schools end up paying for stations that Windows (and other programs) cannot or do not run on. Microsoft's justification is that the agreement requires an "institution-wide commitment." Coincidentally,
bc90021 points out that "RedHat announced its Linux Pilot Program for schools today. Designed to improve the overall learning experience for children, seven North Carolina school districts have already joined. One county director is quoted as saying: 'With the money we saved from not buying proprietary licenses, the school district purchased additional resources that directly [a]ffected the learning experience of our students and brought us into the 21st century.'"
by eliminating the accounting necessary for Microsoft licencing?
** The opinions expressed here are my own, and do not reflect those of my employers - past, present, or future**
With all this MS licensing crap, why do schools even consider going with it? Even if they don't go to Linux/BSD, iMacs are perfectly good replacements for windows, and they can do anything a Windows station can (that a school would need, anyways)
This is not the greatest sig in the world, no. This is just a tribute.
One version of the agreement it suggests that they sount all the staff (even the ones not using computers at all) working over 200 hours a year to get a license purchased. So when do we have to include a license for buildings and cars?
ASCII tastes bad dude.
Binary it is then.
What about graphing calculators? I mean, how far do you go? Slide rule? Abacus? They are all computing devices.
I don't think it's going to be long before people/organizations actually start READING those agreements they sign, once word about this kind of stuff gets out (school board meetings, company newsletters, etc). THAT'S when the shit will hit the fan for MS.
To ensure perfect aim, shoot first and call whatever you hit the target
But really, what educational software is available for Linux? What good is a free OS if the software they require runs exclusively on Windows or MacOS?
Satanosphere.com / The dot does not count as a / syllable, d
Doesn't that just mean giving up?
"Well, they can force us to buy licenses of Windows we don't need... we might as well make the best of it and figure out uses for all the extras."
I guess they should also just install Windows on any *nix machines too?
Would be a shame if they got to choose, huh?
mark
If you want to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe. -- Carl Sagan
On the other, I don't know if I should direct the statement at Microsoft or its customers.
Institutions should just refuse these licenses on principle.
pr0n - keeping monitor glass spotless since 1981.
...about computers or about Windows? Linux and Windows and MacOS will all do the same business functions (spreadsheets and whatnot), but if you want to delve any deeper into how computers work and what the OS really does the 3 OS are certainly not equal. Windows will only work to a certain level of advancement in computer know-how, since it focuses entirely on apps. So if we really want the kids to learn something about COMPUTERS, shouldn't we go open source and teach what makes them tick?
Murphy was an optimist.
As if the consumer wasn't enough those scumbags are now trying to extort money from out education system. I personally am going to go about getting every school in my area to at least aknowledge the existence of sowtware suppliers that don't screw their customers over. As a high school student myself, this senseless waste of taxpayers money on Proprietry sowtware sickens me. My School has every M$ Application it's possible to have and the result: I'm the only person in a 1500 pupil school that knows how to use an OS other than Windows. For M$, this kills two birds with one stone; they can extort money from schools in the short term and then cash in on the fact that the've raised a whole generation of people that know nothing but their crappy software in the long term because they've discouraged their school from even providing an alternative to Windows. Sorry if this is too much of a rant but this really bugs me.
This is obviously an illegal use of Microsoft's monopoly. Stopping these types of practices should be the Justice Department's primary goal.
IIRC there was some kind of law suit against Microsoft years ago for forcing OEMs to pay for Windows licenses on machines that did not include Windows. I believe Microsoft lost that suite. Wouldn't this fall under that ruling?
A lot of people seem to agree that putting Linux on computers in schools is a good idea. There's one thing that's always bothered me about the idea, though - there doesn't seem to be much of a selection of good educational titles that run on Linux. I know that more generic applications (such as word processors) are very useful in the classroom, and those are most certainly present on Linux. But what about education games? Or tools for the teacher's own use (such as gradebook software)?
Admittedly, I haven't done a lot of searching for these things, so maybe they exist. If so, then that's great! But if not, and no one does anything about it, it seems to me these Linux-in-the-classroom programs are going to eventually fail - and Microsoft will have the opportunity for a big "I told you so!"
Perhaps come up with a one-CD, bootable Linux distro specific for high school. It doesn't have to have 6 word processord and apache and 4 window managers and etc, etc, just a very few workable apps. Bare bones, simple, clean, works on "typical" school hardware.
Sounds like we might see more schools systems (with Mac + Linux and no Windows at all) bragging about the money they saved and the purchases they made with these savings. It would be nice if they could network and share expertise. Might also be nice if Macs and Linix interfaced a little more seamlessly.
=brian
PS: This might be another occasion where Microsoft's aggressive policies work for us and against them. If they really are hard-assed about this "all or nothing" licensing, several schools systems will choose to opt out, especially those that are Mac-heavy.
They certainly teach all these kids to never sign up a contract with Microsoft. So, the kids are actually learning something usefull here.
When Queensland's Education Department signed up for the Microsoft School Agreement, they tried the same thing. Schools using Macs were expected to count their computers as well. After alot of blowup, either the Education Department or Microsoft backed down. It was never made clear which.
Also the asking price that the schools were expected to pay was far too high, especially considering most schools wouldn't get much advantage right off the bat. In this case the Education Department subsidised the cost.
Schools can't afford that - what $400 equated to in a school of 600 with 100 computers, was literally the entire IT budget. The school I'm involved with rejected the "offer", only to be told that doing so meant they were no longer licensed to use Windows or any other Microsoft product - even those supplied OEM. That is, "since you broke the contract here, we're nullifying every EULA you've ever seen!"
My school has since switched to 100% non-Microsoft products (Sun, Linux, some macs) and haven't regretted it since. They're able to use older machines as thin-clients of sorts, and with a couple of bright students and a lot of learning, they haven't needed to look back.
The Department of Education are not amused, and neither I imagine are Microsoft. Education Queensland have used the carrot ("but this is so much easier to account for than Linux, and here, we'll give you 10% more IT budget than last year...") and the stick (need I say more?) approach, but it so far hasn't worked.
I couldn't care what the prices currently listed are. It's what they'll be when they've got you hooked that count. If you have 500 Macs and 20 PCs and you're charged for all 520, you might purchase PCs at the next computer purchase round. Thinking it's "cheaper" to "standardize". Then what will they be charging?
It's never better to set yourself up to be bled dry.
I think that the CALs are required for Macs. At least if they are accessing Windows file shares, Inter/intra-net servers, etc.
You don't need a CAL to access a Windows Networking share from a computer running Mac OS X. All you need is SAMBA. Most of Microsoft's other server software runs on standard protocols such as HTTP, FTP, etc.
Will I retire or break 10K?
Computers are, as Steve Jobs puts it, bicycles for the mind. Google, for example, is a tremendous educational resources.
Microsoft, however, adds no value to the educational mix over what is available for free. Possibly it subtracts. It's a scandal that school districts are putting themselves at mercy of Microsoft's predatory licensing practices.
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