Slashdot Mirror
Slashback: Moonbase, Schools, Entropia
Perhaps in a bit, though. texchanchan writes: "From the BBC: 'China will not be launching a manned mission to the Moon in the foreseeable future, according to Ouyang Ziyuan, chief scientist of China's Moon exploration programme... he said he wanted to clarify news reports in the Chinese media that Beijing would be putting a man on the Moon by 2010..."We will explore the Moon certainly," he said from his office in Beijing, "but with unmanned spacecraft."'"
Can I sign up to be a robot brain surgeon? ascii7 writes "Remember that story a while back about Project Entropia, the free MMRPG? Well, now it's in the commercial trial phase, and free for all to download. Get it at www.project-entropia.com"
Free Software Entrepreneurs, take note. llywrch writes with more information on the Microsoft effort to crack down on licensing in Northwest public school districts, as reported by Oregonian columnist Steve Duin, writing: "Most intriguingly, Microsoft's heavy-handed tactics have already started a backlash, with 16 school districts in central Iowa having 'completely dumped' Microsoft and migrated everything to Linux."
He sends some background details not in the column:
- This column generated the most feedback Duin has seen for any one of his columns to this time. (He has experienced the Slashdot effect first hand.)
- The Beaverton And Hillsboro school districts, two that have been targeted for the audit, apparently will comply quietly. Beaverton will because they have kept close enough tabs on software licenses to make it feasible (as well as officially banning all non Mac & MS Windows machines from their network). Hillsboro will because a certain microprocessor manufacturer based in that city can subsidise the costs of Microsoft software.
- Paul Nelson (one of the forces behind the Linux for public schools movement) has been urging more cooperation between public schools and local Linux user groups. ``My hope is that other LUGs out there would start hosting clinics. If you are from a school, contact your local user group and offer to host a clinic!" He is planning a demonstration of what Linux can do for schools this July 4, calling it Software Independence Day."
Apropos that, JDALaRose writes: "While it was discussed at some length in this Ask Slashdot, the Washington Post is running an article wherein a columnist gives his take on making the switch from Windows/MS Office to Linux/OpenOffice."
Kinda like warez huh? If you lose the race, don't you get nuked?
Impressive, now release yo anger.
Their FTP servers are already own3d. Bummer.
"Upon attaching the waterblock to my penis, I began to notice that I know nothing about computers." -- JRockway
my school district is still on apple ][ machines for word processing in the english department...
needless to say, apple has not tried any heavy handed licensing tactics with them... YET
MARIJUANA, SHROOMS, X: ONLINE?! - E
Windows Only downloads....::sigh::
CDE open sourced! https://sourceforge.net/projects/cdesktopenv/
It's old, it's cliche, it's the fable of the Tortoise and the Hair. In this case it doesn't matter who gets there first, what matters is who gets there and stays there. Remember Leif Ericson? First European in America (that we know of)? Columbus may not have stayed, but the conquistadores, and later the English and French, did.
BlackGriffen
You want to demo software on July 4th??!?!? Instead of drinking beer and bbq'ing? That will definitely show people that Linux users aren't communists!
ostiguy
I wonder, why is it called Entropia? Because it brings chaos (entropy) into the lives of the poor people who download the client?
Also, how long will it take the Entropia world to create Project Reality (the peak of technology, real world emulator!)?
;)
This is part of project Waste Modpoints. It's objective is to waste peoples' modpoints by posting as many offtopic messages about project waste modpoints as possible. You are invited to join by posting this message as often as possible.
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8====D
Why would they go out of their way to do this? Is this a condition Microsoft set? This sounds an aweful lot like one of the points their conviction was based on, their forcing OEMs to use MS products.
Anyone remember the novel "snowcrash"?
Like Entropia some ppl built up a whole cyberworld where you could meet friends and have 3-D access to other applications. And of course one would be able to participate in fancy sword-fights and supersonic motorcycle races. Legalized mafia and dragster-style pizza delivery where you could legally kill the pizzy guy when he failed to deliver your stuff on time.....
Sadly somebody wrote a virus for it that affected the people behind the characters. I hope that won't happen anytime soon.
0 001 11 1
Logo was a language invented by Seymour Papert.
/Styx
Could it be possible that the move towards "Free Software" is a result of its cost effectiveness rather than any particular sin of Microsoft? When you calculate the cost of licenses to cover an entire school district, $50 (if you buy an COTS version of RedHat, for example) beats $75 (guessing) x # of seats.
The kids still will be ill-prepared to work in any normal job, though, as Linux is nowhere near standard in the real life world.
I have been pwned because my
I like it. "Open Source: beating down the forces of tyranny." "Give me OS liberty, or give me ... well, Windows." "I regret that I have only one CPU to run with my OS." "We must all hang together, or certainly our PCs will all hang separately." And so on.
Perhaps we need a Boston Tea party sort of thing where we burn hundreds of Windows licenses.
Or not.
=brian
Is this the beginning of the next hibernation?? FWIW, I play civ3 in much the same way, but while I am not playing the politics game, I'm revving up everything else.
OS/2 - because choice is a terrible thing to waste.
I am not a Goth chick but my ass has brown lip stick. Interested?
I think it was on /. a while back that someone mentioned MS policy on accepting donated computers in schools.
It used to say that it's "a legal requirement for the the original operating system that came with the computer to stay with that computer."
I guess realizing how utterly stupid a claim that was they have since changed the site.
Now they just say its a bad idea to accept computers without the original OS.
I work for a small company that sells educational software. We recently lost a large sale because Microsoft was turning the screws on the district that wanted to buy our software, and they didn't have any money left over for ours.
"Then we can blow up some Windows boxes"
Careful. Just blow up the software.
After trying Linux Mandrake out a couple of months ago, one thing that crossed my mind is how ready Linux is for schools. Linux distros these days contain all the basic tools needed for productivity. You have several different office applications (Abiword, KOffice, StarOffice, OpenOffice) to choose from for word processing and spreadsheets and then you also have scientific tools like Scilab (a clone of Matlab I am told). Though admittedly I am not sure if there are Powerpoint and Access alternatives for Linux, perhaps someone could shed some light on this.
Now consider the Windows alternative, that would entail getting a site license for Windows, Microsoft Office, Matlab and who knows what else. This would not only cost quite a bit of money but I imagine would also create a pile of added paperwork due to the multiple licenses. Then with Windows you have to contend with issues of kids installing software on the school machines such as games, and macro and email viruses which from past experience spread like crazy in schools.
As far as I am concerned Linux is more than ready for schools. Sure it may be different to Windows which most children would be accustomed to using at home but children these days are quite tech savvy and I assume they would pick up Linux interface quite quickly (perhaps faster than adults?). The only major issue to consider is inoperability issues such as opening Word 97/2000 files but this could be resolved by encouraging children to save in RTF format which presents no problem.
aus.music.scrapbook
According to the Netcraft poke, http://www.beavton.k12.or.us, the public webserver for the Beaverton (Oregon) School District, runs Linux/Apache. Interesting. Guess the ban on non-Windows and non-Mac machines doesn't extend to things that actually require stability. :)
-SymphonicMan
Hillsboro will because a certain microprocessor manufacturer based in that city can subsidise the costs of Microsoft software.
Intel is actually not based in Hillsboro, just has a few billion-dollar fabs there. And yes, they subsidize the district's IT budget.
Part 3 of the MS -)
Good thing about a strong, efficent, state like China, the people responsible for the false media leak have probably already been arrested and are awaiting punishment.
I know most slashdoters agree when I say that it sure sucks to live in a totalitarian state like America.
Hey, wait a minute
None of these are new stories
Slashdot deja-vu
"The kids still will be ill-prepared to work in any normal job, though, as Linux is nowhere near standard in the real life world"
If you look at it that way, yes. But if we train kids to use Linux, they will grow up preferring Linux. Therefore, as they grow, they will swing the market's preference towards linux.
You just couldn't leave it alone could you? Their FTP server was already screwed, and now they get mentioned on /. again?? I STILL DON'T HAVE THE CLIENT!! (Oh yay, .3 - 1.8kb/s... And I'm on cable...) T_T
Friend: "The NIC is misconfigured..." Me: "No prob, I'll just telnet in and fix it." *Silence*
Doubtful. You'll only teach them that computers are 'hard' and useful only in behind-the-scenes processing.
Windows and Mac environments lead them to explore their creativity (Mac especially) without needing to fuck around with an OS that fights you at every turn.
Teach them Linux and watch the future of computers die.
I have been pwned because my
I don't buy it. First of all, the whole point of commercial products (according to MS and their bannermen) is that the interface is "intuitive" -- which means it can't take all that long to become a power user. Second, anyone who's grown up on a complex and responsive system like Linus will find Windows a breeze -- plus they'll have actual problem-solving abilities. Let's face it: One reason that Unix conceded the desktop world to Microsoft involved the inability of any seasoned Unix user to take Windows seriously. Yeah, that was a mistake, but going from Linux to MS definitely does not tax the brain...
Besides, this isn't about preparing students for the real world. Students are remarkably flexible and adaptable. This is about the inconvenience to the old dinosaurs who can't conceive of a computer as anything more than an intimidating electric typewriter...
The Mongrel Dogs Who Teach
Remember you have to supply and staff the thing, and thats after you construct it.
No nation right now has the capacity to effectively do this. ISS is feasible because shuttles can dock directly with it.
Yes both mysql and postgres are superior. Is there a problem with using a superior substitute? If so, maybe since it's open source, we could dumb it down to the level of Access.
Seriously, they also provide features that let users make tools to use the database. Those tool-making features are called bash and perl. Duh.
anyone who's grown up on a complex and responsive system like Linus
Linux really is too complex to ever be useful to a normal user. The glorified typewriter is exactly what a computer is to the majority of people. Sure it can do other things (and is doing other things behind the scenes for the user like formatting, etc), but all the user needs to know is whether to press button A or button B. In short, I really like the responsiveness of Linus, but I could do without the complexity.
It really irks me to have to stay up half the night listening to him cry about how selfish a lover I am. For chrissakes, I'm putting my dick in his ass! Does he think I don't think it's a little gross?
I have been pwned because my
Leave the machine for one second... *grumble*
The kids will be ill-prepared to work in any normal job if they learn Windows right now because by the time they graduate either 1) Microsoft will have change the interface for Windows enough to force them to completely relearn it or 2) KDE or Gnome will have replace Windows as the GUI of choice. This will also require some relearning, but because Linux desktops have no incentive to completely change between releases, it will be much easier on them.
Now, if you said that a person entering the job market today and looking for a non-admin job (i.e. not working on servers) would be better off learning the Windows desktop than Linux, I might agree with you...
What idiot thought this up? Everyone else will be getting drunk, hitting the beach, and running over swimmers with jetskis (after the drinking). Christ! Just when I have most of the world convinced that being a geek is hip, some Spock-ear wearing moron plans this event.
argle!
Although an open-source presentation program _would_ be nice, there is very little that Powerpoint can do that an HTML editor/HTML server combination can not do. As far as Access, I thank god every day that there isn't a database that poorly implemented available for Linux. There is, however, MySQL, I beleive.
Thats right, Microsoft wants to spend their entire net savings on a moon base.
Beaverton seems to be running a apache/linux server (according to netcraft). and made the switch from ISS in '00.
Right now, your average distro just loads on the options. Eight different text editors, six different shells, five ftp programs, and countless other duplicate items.
This is in general a good thing (tm) but when it comes to putting it in a school or giving it to a home user, it's overwhelming. I know because I am not an average user and all those options in the toolbar menu drive me up the wall.
Advice to distros. You want to put your product in schools and on home desktops? Make a distro that let's you pick (and set up for automation) one text editor, one word processor, one shell, etc... and then display the installed options prominently on the desktop and in the toolbar menu.
And on that note: call the text editor "TEXT EDITOR" and the word process "Word Processor". Don't call it Emacs unless you call it "Emacs - Text Editor" or better "Text Editor - Emacs".
If you look at a MS PC (even one that's been used for years) it's usually got one program for each task. Why? Because everything costs money, so the user picks one, pays for it, and sticks with it. It's not economical to buy multiple products with overlapping usages.
To make an analogy that's close to my heart, imagine you're driving a long way into an unfamiliar territory. The highway you're travelling on lists every possible route to any destination at each exit. Even if that route involves driving around back roads or dirt trails. Even if you knew what you wanted to do, there'd be so much signage and so many options that they'd be at best worthless and more than likely damn confusing. That's what Linux looks like to the new user.
Meanwhile, Linux is perfect for the classroom. It's a native programming environment. It's a lab in a box. A place for experimentation and exploration.
Kids don't want to make powerpoint presentations. Challenge them, do CS 101 in elementary school. Do Algorithms in high school. Then you'll be graduating problem solvers, not flow-chart-dependent middle-managers.
While I'm telling them what to teach in grade school. Teach English! Well! Enforce mastery and require that all your graduates can write a two page essay that could, say, get them a job or a raise or an A in college.
Those two things, if you taught kids computer programming and english and that's all, they'd be ten times as prepared as I was. They wouldn't need to go to college to get a good job, because that's all employers are looking for right now. And college can go back to being a place for future scientists and researchers (and rich kids who have nothing to do after high school).
Argh! I'm all riled up now!
Sweat
It breaks my pluginses, my precious!
My Matrox G400 Max is going to be SOOO fucked.
:)
LOL.
2D forever!
Need help treating your acne? Come here!
> The kids still will be ill-prepared to work in any normal job...
Is that because anyone that took the time to understand a unix system could NEVER catch up to the someone who only ever point-and-clicked?
-- Don't Tase me, bro!
Windows and Mac environments lead them to explore their creativity (Mac especially) without needing to fuck around with an OS that fights you at every turn.
Fuck that, as a young child stuck with DOS I found my creativity in manipulating config files and making BAT files to do repetative tasks for me.
Windows just teachs kids how to click the blue e to get on the internet and check out the scores of their favorite sports team.
Hell even on the old AppleIIs I have more fun playing around with the various system disks then I did with the various traditional 'artsy fartsy' disks that were availble.
Developing innovative methods of solving problems involves creativity to you know.
Those students who are good at art already have control over EVERY OTHER DAMN SUBJECT, let us mathmatical / logical people keep something damnit.
Need help treating your acne? Come here!
Sorry if I implied you should be teaching sql databases...
I don't think I'd mind taking your latin classes, but I can't imagine that the computer classes are anything but absolute drivel. No offense.
And the system is now too big for it to ever fix itself successfully. Shame.
There will always be a group of people that think the above. These sort of folk really don't care about how the world works around them, just as long as it does, and they know who to contact when it doesn't.
Windows and Mac environments lead them to explore their creativity (Mac especially) without needing to fuck around with an OS that fights you at every turn.
Id somewhat agree with you on this. Im a fairly young person, 23 years old, I work in a large building doing support for windows machines. I used to sit on the frontline phones and take incoming calls on certain products on windows machines, and I got to the point where if the person had win98, I could sit there and navigate to any screen that you could get to in the os, without even looking at my compter at work. Anyway, we have a few products that work on macs, and today I sat in front of one and tried to figure it out a bit (mind you it was only like 10min or so). To tell you the truth the thing puzzles me. I can open up apps, use them, save, etc.. but trying to figure out where things go at times, its pretty bizarre. When it comes to sitting in front of a computer and becoming creative, im not too sure what your talking about. Here are the things that I think a fairly new user could use and be 'creative':
a - Paint type of program. You can run these types of programs on Linux, Windows or Mac and be equally creative I would say. Just as long as you can figure out what the buttons do, you can start drawing and such.
b - Word processing types of programs.. Same deal, you can type on any of these operating systems with equal ability.
To make this short, these kinds of programs do not differ that much when going across operating systems. None of them really make you have to go into the os much, the only time I can think of is to save and retrieve files. You tell someone where to save something and that clears up a lot of stuff.
Teach them Linux and watch the future of computers die.
So, you really think the future of computers lies in the hands of 2 companies, Microsoft (windows) and Apple. Apple has been in schools for a long time and they do fine there, they also seem very school / education friendly, in fact they are selling maine a bunch of ibooks for their 7th graders, and providing training to the teachers and such.. Of course they are getting paid but its the thought that counts.. Microsoft is a company that is more interested in money then customer satisfaction (this is in no way saying that microsoft does not have interest in the customer, as anyone that has worked in any of the support areas for them knows that it lies pretty high on the chart), but they do make descisions with money in mind over what the customer gets. Does microsoft really think that its in the best interests of the customer to hide information about how the OS works? Or do they do this because it is more profitable this way? Do they think that the customer will be harmed if IE isn't there at all times, or do they do this because it makes them larger in the market? It kinda makes me feel better about using something like Linux because I know there isn't a company there that is controlling how I operate my machine based on how much money that they can squeeze from me. I may not know how to interpret source code that well, but I am glad its available so I can ask someone that does.
Good points, all.
The thing about the Mac is that it hides all the complexity pretty deep down. The trouble with that is if you have a serious problem, you really can't troubleshoot the thing yourself. The good thing is that the OS is designed to make it easy for the user to get in and do stuff right away.
I don't think the problem is with Linux itself, and I probably shouldn't have phrased it that way. Rather, the problem lies in the cryptic and difficult to use Unix system. Students shouldn't be allowed to delve into the OS like most others here are suggesting. Instead, they should be encouraged to do their task and get off the machine as soon as possible. The rough edges evident in every Unix-workalike makes it virtually impossible to do this. The Mac OSX shell is a vast improvement laid upon the Unix kernel which is the reason I'd not call it a Unix-workalike.
In short, Unix is fine for those tasks that programmers need a stable system, but it is wholly unsuited for teaching kids.
I have been pwned because my
Either is anything MS puts on there computers, since it will all be changed by the time the get out of school.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Am i the only one who, when reading "Project Reality" immediately thought about the nintendo 64's original "code-name"?
i sure wouldn't doubt it.
simply enter your credit card information to complete installation... hrmmmmmm
[o_o]
When I was an ISP support tech, I found that people from these professions were hardest to work with: journalists, teachers, lawyers, psychologists. Preachers and writers were up there too. I took to calling these "the word-oriented professions." The most dreaded customers to deal with, other than the habitually furious, were schoolteachers. Public school or private made no difference.
In general, they had great difficulty comprehending even the most basic concepts such as the difference between the Windows desktop and the interior of a web browser window. (There was one exception, a coach at some local country school who had an excellent computer lab going from the sound of it.)
Teaching teachers about computers is already hard. Introducing the idea of a different kind of operating system would, I think, confuse most of them very much.
I don't see what's so hard about this on a newer distro.
Pop in your PCMCIA card, run your distros network configuration utility, set up your interface and boom it works about 75 pct of the time.
Rest of the time you have to go into some serious configuration file editing, but just because it's not plug and pray doesn't mean it's difficult.
Who uses modems anymore anyway?
Editors have infinite mod points, so you better hope that non-editors waste their mod points before the editors get to your posts.
StarOffice Impress. Applixware. HancomOffice. KOffice. There are plenty of replacements for Powerpoint's functionality, on Linux and other platforms as well. See MSBC's The Alternative for a longer list.
== Paul Rickard, Editor of The Microsoft Boycott Campaign ====
Did you pull those figures out of your butt, or are you quoting any particular study? The International Space Station is only going to cost a fraction of that, and that's largely due to it being a huge orbiting pork barrel. Returning to the Moon is obviously a bit beyond John Carmack just yet, but well within China's reach if they set it as a national priority.
The world has moved on since Apollo, but everybody seems stuck with the concept that spaceflight is only ever going to be a national project on a pyramid-building scale. It's still going to be expensive for quite some time, but the fact that we don't have to reinvent the wheel, compact computers, carbon fibre or Tang helps keep it a bit more affordable than the '60s NASA program.
There are several groups looking at private Moon exploration, Artemis being perhaps the most well known. I think that they are kidding themselves, but good luck to 'em.
No, seriously. Did you pull the figures out of your butt?
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Honestly I'm not sure I like this concept. The real economy is not a zero-sum equation. New wealth can always be created in a myriad of ways (mining gold as one example, you put in labor and get out a *hard* commodity) without anyone neccesarily losing out.
It would seem to me that Project Entropia *is* going to be zero-sum. The only way for new weath to come into the economy is from real world money. It certainly wouldn't be plausible for the developer to add new wealth to the virtual world as this would cost them real resouces. Thus for anyone to actually make money playing this game, they would do so at the expense of other players.
P.T. Barnum aside, the idea of getting rich at others expense doesn't particularly sit well with me. The only way I can see to make this viable is for players to make money by selling services of some sort in game. Thus the person you are selling too at least recieved the experience for their buck.
Still, I am glad that casinos are legal most places even though I don't frequent them. If you enjoy this sort of thing, more power to you. I just hope that most people realize what they are getting into.
"42"
Santa Cruz, Ca. reporting. Ready for orders. I think we need a good old fashoned barn raising blow out. Burn your EULA. Boycott Microsoft. See you on July 4 th at a school near you.
I may be bad with names, but I'll never forget your IP address
anyone who's grown up on a complex and responsive system like Linus will find Windows a breeze
Similarly, anyone who's grown up living in a house will find a cardboard box much simpler... if a bit restrictive and uncomfortable.
The more I learn about *nix, the more I find myself contemplating violent action against my Windows box.
Under capitalism man exploits man. Under communism it's the other way around.
How the hell is that funny? A pic of the penis bird? -1, offtopic, -1, moderators on crack
Yeah, but they'll be seriously underprepared for the colleges, where UNIX and Linux are still widely used.
The thing about the Mac is not only is the complexity hidden very deep, but it's also hidden successfully. At least with the old MacOS.
I've used Macs for over 10 years now, and I can't think of a problem that couldn't be solved by dragging icons around or clicking on buttons. Worst case, maybe the RegEdit GUI a couple times.
Classic example is driver installation. Install: Drag icon to folder. Uninstall: Remove icon from folder. Every other OS on the planet (including OS X) has some fragile shitnest of hardcoded paths and voodoo commands essential this process. Linux wins by getting a bunch of compile-time problems on top of that.
I'm not the hugest fan of Macs, but I certainly recommend them because I know that I won't be getting any calls for free tech support.
When you donate your computer, put on a fresh linux distro and tape a copy of the GPL to the lid. Or do the corresponding thing for BSD. Either way, the school then has a computer and a license to go with it.
Beta is broken and the link to classic doesn't work. Stop wasting our time or there won't be anybody left here.
So, if the US and China stopped paying their military for 1 year, we could have 2 moonbases. And by working together we probably become friend, and wouldn't need those militaries as big anymore.
Let's start by being honest... I'm anti-MS. I work for some schools doing their IT stuff including advising on future directions. I would LOVE to get them onto Linux etc. but I've actually recommended using Microsoft products. Why?
:-) We're moving to plain Windows and MS Office suites so that the kids/teachers can use the same software at home and learn something directly useful in later life (because MS isn't going to disappear anytime soon).
They are currently using RM (Research Machines) who I believe hold some sort of officiality with the UK government on educational computers/software. They are worse than MS. They take stuff like Office 97, add kiddie-crap to it and totally destroy it and sell it at extortionate prices (incidentally making it next to impossible for the kids to use identical software at home).
They do the same for computers (you don't want to know how much an RM machine costs, especially not if it comes with the WindowBox software (a login panel and "security" thing for Windows) and their educational software. And the prices of a simple network... WOOOOOO! I bet their accountants are happy.
The kids get confused because they have to use different software at home (radically different in some cases) and their parents could never afford the RM software. The school pays through the nose for computers/software/support.[incidentally, I have a job doing IT for schools because the support from RM is too expensive and the support centre at the local council is overworked (4 people for 17 schools for every problem like broken mice, "I can't find the icon" and building/wiring networks)]
Compared to RM, Microsoft are co-operative and fair.
The Beaverton School District is very anti-Linux (I've been a student of the BSD for my whole life up 'till last year). I've tried emailing them about using Linux but my single voice isn't enough to rock their boat. I'm going to try to give some reasons why you should email them too. ;)
.d0t. com
At Merlo, the students recently were told they could build their own server, but when they wanted to install Linux on it, the IT guy at the school said no since the District wouldn't provide support.
Installing Linux workstations is something that the students want, but the District IT folks and the school (Merlo at least) IT folks won't support it. So we'd have to get non school computers to put Linux on, but even then, the current policy regarding computers on the school network is that they have to look like a windows box (from a port-scan point of view). This is a stupid requirement that means we can't run servers like NIS/NFS which would be helpful for a network of workstations. Its also a stupid requirement since we have Apple OS X machines, which probably don't look like Windows (I'm not sure about that though).
So Linux clients and servers are just about impossible... well, you say, can't people just telnet to their linux computers at home to do work (programming, or whatever)? No. The BSD has blocked the telnet port. They blocked the ssh port. They even blocked the RTSP port, which some clever students were using to run ssh on at home. The only open outgoing ports are FTP and HTTP. Yes, I know its possible to tunnel ssh through HTTP, but some people want to run web servers at home (and ftp servers).
If you are upset about this, as I am, you can email the district and tell them what you think. Maybe if enough people complain they will realize they cannot continue wasting peoples' tax money on inferior technology when Free software is ready and people are willing to installl it for them!
Thanks!
shark28 _ 6 at yahoo
(to lazy to log in).
1) Am I the only one finding it strange that one is presented with a click-thru NDA? Not a license-agreement, but an NDA with a running period of 2 years..? Bells and whistles are going off left and right here.
2) What amateurish installation is this? First a normal setup runs via Windows Installer. Fine, no prob. That means I'm going to be able to uninstall this app. Wait a minute.. Extracting file xxxx of 16003 ?! Hmmm.. Well, after having decided that the account-server is probably /.'ed from here to eternity and back I decided to uninstall Project Eternity. Guess what.. 16000+ files totalling 445 MB was left on my disk following uninstallation. That definitely could use some serious work..
Remember, there are no stupid questions. But there are a lot of inquisitive idiots.
You mean there is a difference? I've certainly seen plenty of Windows PCs displaying web pages on the desktop before now... and the users then wonder why it takes so long for the PC to start up.
In other words, they may get the same amount of money or more from a few schools with strict licensing control than from many schools with lax licensing control.
Anyway, any medium or larger organization that uses commercial software should probably have some sort of auditing software that helps them manage software licenses. It is part of the implied cost of running commercial software.
Finally, I really don't think it's unreasonable for a software company to ensure that its copyright is not being violated. I doubt there's a 'nice' way to do an audit.
Jack Valenti and the MPAA are to technology as the Boston strangler is to the woman home alone
Um, Microsoft's cost prohibitiveness, and tendency to put the screws to their customers, is one of their particular sins. So no, I guess that isn't possible.
My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
My wife is a programmer for the Portland, OR school district. For quite a while she's been trying to gather the information and courage to push for Linux in her office. Steve Duinn's column and the links and comments on Slashdot have given her the ammunition she needs.
Well, that and the terrible state of school finances in Oregon. The licensing fees she will save by making the switch will pay for a new machine. It's a powerful argument in Oregon where school financing is in dire straits.
Our hats are off to you guys.
The man who never alters his opinion is like the stagnant water and breeds Reptiles of the Mind -- William Blake
It was the graphics language LOGO.
And that was no trianlge. It was affectionately called the turtle.
It was a pretty neat graphics scripting language.
The kids still will be ill-prepared to work in any normal job, though, as Linux is nowhere near standard in the real life world.
Like we get training on school computers in the first place? At my high school, the computers can be used for one of two things: word processing and research. That's all you're supposed to be doing on the computers and that's all you're even able to do (everything else is blocked off.)
The sole exception I could see is in the computer department, where you can actually take classes on stuff like "Practical Computing" or programming in Visual Basic, C, etc. But there's no reason why there couldn't be 50 copies of Windows licenses for those computers while the rest of the school used a free OS.
Why? I'm reminded of the old saying "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic". There's an assumption in there: "sufficiently advanced technology" means "sufficiently advanced beyond the current state of knowledge". You're encouraging students to consider the OS 'magic' by keeping their current state of knowledge low. Some people are fine with this, but some would rather advance their state of knowledge so they can have a better explanation than 'magic' and superstition.
Actually, i feel all students should be encouraged to learn enough about the OS so it's not 'magic', even if they don't go on to become full computer geeks.
--
perl -e'$_=shift;die eval' '"$^X $0\047\$_=shift;die eval\047 \047$_\047"' at -e line 1.
Interesting. You feel that charging customers is wrong. Do you think Microsoft (or any manufacturer) should be required to furnish educational institutions their wares at no cost?
I have been pwned because my
I used to be a subject of the BSD [Beaverton School District]
So why don't they run... um... BSD?
Will I retire or break 10K?
Quit complaining about slow downloads and goto FilePlanet.com or some other fast game download site. Right now ZERO people have downloaded it from FilePlanet.com!! Heres the address for FilePlanet.com, http://www.fileplanet.com/index.asp?section=0&file =88231&download=1
HAVE FUN!!
*sigh*
I do huh? Please, by all means, show me where I said that. But since you obviously have troubles with reading comprehension, allow me...
Original post I was responding to:
Could it be possible that the move towards "Free Software" is a result of its cost effectiveness rather than any particular sin of Microsoft?
To which I replied:
Um, Microsoft's cost prohibitiveness, and tendency to put the screws to their customers, is one of their particular sins. So no, I guess that isn't possible.
Let's break this down, for those simpletons out there. From dictionary.com:
prohibitive Pronunciation Key (pr-hb-tv) also prohibitory (-tôr, -tr) adj.
So high or burdensome as to discourage purchase or use: prohibitive prices.
Now that would mean that they price their software such that the cost is too much for the schools (in this case) to afford. I am not talking about just the purchase price, you have to consider what it means to "afford" using Microsoft software. You have to be face their wrath if you don't behave the way they want you to. You have to sign on the dotted line for their licensing agreements, and bow to their will or they will audit you. That is putting the screws to their customers. Schools don't need that kind of pressure, they have enough trying to teach our future generations.
Now please, show me where I said that they should be required to furnish software at no cost to educational instutitions. Please read, then comprehend, then THINK before you post.
My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.