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The Last Place

angela morgenstern writes "Buddhist Bhutan was the last place on earth to legalize television. Trading traditional practices for daytime soaps and WWF, many fear that western influence will trample the culture." A whole set of articles about the effect of American television on one of the most remote places on earth - it's official, there is no escape from American "culture".

31 of 469 comments (clear)

  1. No escape? by warmcat · · Score: 5, Funny

    Sure there is, turn off your TV, prise your kids out of the kid-shaped depression in the sofa and do other things that don't require you to be passive and watch ads to give you a value system.

  2. "...all for about $5 a month." by Erik_ · · Score: 3, Interesting

    In the report it says : "Rinzy has hooked up this secluded society to 45 cable television channels, featuring everything from the BBC to Baywatch, all for about $5 a month: the price of a bag of red chillies."
    Is that the cost of a bag of red chillies in the United States ? How much buying power is $5 in Bhutan ? So these people get to watch adverts for cars/food/luxuries that they will not be able to purchase.

    1. Re:"...all for about $5 a month." by laa · · Score: 3, Informative

      ...with the risk of being unbearably dull...

      The GNP per capita 1995 for US seems to be $26 062, ranking at 12th postition. Bhutan, again, is 145th with a GNP per capita of $172. So, I suspect five bucks is a huge portion of a normal monthly salary.

      --
      Why does the kernel go through stable and then unstable forks? Can't it always be a stable build, like with Windows?
    2. Re:"...all for about $5 a month." by Zarf · · Score: 3, Funny

      So these people get to watch adverts for cars/food/luxuries that they will not be able to purchase.

      Sounds like TV in Alaska.

      --
      [signature]
    3. Re:"...all for about $5 a month." by io333 · · Score: 3, Funny

      So these people get to watch adverts for cars/food/luxuries that they will not be able to purchase.

      Exactly. And plenty of folks there are going to want to purchase those things. And they're going to realize that they need to quit hanging out in the monestary so often, or meditating, or whatever other unproductive things they do and GET A JOB.

      And in a few years they're gonna be waking up early every morning and going to a job they hate and busting their butt every friggin' day, just like you & me, to get all that stuff.

      Welcome to the west.

  3. they will be less affected than is thought by Zemran · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I have only just got back from SEasia and could not find much to watch on their TV as they have their own programming that I found terrible. They have a good strong culture of their own and I think it will prevail. I had to resort to MTVasia and the BBC world. Even MTVasia is their own bubble pop rather than the stuff we are used to. As the tube moves into Bhutan I think it will be asian TV that goes with it and they will not get this expected burst of western "culture" when it arrives.

    American "culture" ? is that an oxymoron ?

    --
    I love stacking my barbecues in the shed at the end of summer - you can't beat a bit of grill on grill action.
  4. Avoiding US Cultural Imperialism. by tjensor · · Score: 3, Funny

    it's official, there is no escape from American "culture".
    Sure there is. Here are a set of simple instructions.
    1) Locate point of entry for electricity in to your house.
    2) Disconnect Electricity (some car is advised at this point). 3) Locate all telephones in house.
    4) Smash telephones with Hammer, or other large heavy object (possibly your now useless VCR).
    5) Locate large wads of cotton wool.
    6) Insert cotton wool in to ears (in case of passing boombox).
    7) Never leave house.

    Never mind Pax Americana, fear Pax AOL / Time Warner.

    --
    <fnord>OBEY</fnord>
    1. Re:Avoiding US Cultural Imperialism. by EverDense · · Score: 3, Funny

      ... 6) Insert cotton wool in to ears (in case of passing boombox).
      7) Never leave house.

      8) ???
      9) Profit

      --
      http://jesus.everdense.com/
  5. Waitasec. by vavenger · · Score: 3, Funny

    Bhutan's top 10 cable channels.

    They mean to tell me that they get HBO in friggin' Bhutan? I can't even get it in Canada!

  6. Spread of US "culture" by jamieo · · Score: 5, Informative

    Actually this is a bit more accurate than you may think. Recently I spent a month trekking in Nepal - a nearby country to Bhutan and one that has only recently (30 years) opened itself to foregin influences.

    The popularity of WWF, even high in the remote mountain villages, was not something I expected. Then again, this is usually the only "culture" the US exports.

    I also visited the country about 10 years earlier after a few months backpacking through India. For around 3 months I travelled and didn't once see a bottle/can of Coca Cola (or derivative) - it was all local soft drinks that were available. At the time it was a refreshing change, and gave you a much more local flavour.

    On my more recent trip you could *only* get Coca Cola soft drinks (Coke, Sprite, Fanta, etc.), even high in the mountains a week's travel from the nearest road. OK, they were locally manufactured (under license) and tasted different (the Fanta was nice!), but it was something that got in the way of emersing yourself in a completely different culture. As for the locals themselves, there seemed to be no benefit whatsoever for them having "Coke" soft drinks compared to the local ones before them.

    Ho hum, roll on the Disneyfication of the planet.

  7. Re:Hmm by jamieo · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Are you happy with US "culture" as it is today? By that term I do not mean real US culture (there is some), but the jokingly termed "culture" many non-US people label for things like Disney, Coke, WWF, etc.

    Travelling around the US you see that such companies have had, what I believe, to be a very negative effect. Everywhere you go it all looks the same, tastes the same, hears the same (same music industry manufactured "pop"), etc. Local and regional flavour is lost. This is great if you like Taco Bell, only drinking Coke and listening to Britney. But there is a lot more to life than that!

    Why is it popular in other countries? Well, 2 reasons:

    1) The *good* thing about the US - **freedom**. You live a very privelidged life compared to many people of the world. Many people of the world see the US and freedom as being very related things. So when they are given a bit of freedom they have previously lacked, they gravitate towards such things. Think as a teenager and how you behaved once given freedom from parents.

    2) This is a not so good thing about the US - **money**. Consider the situation in Bhutan as an example. At the moment there are local (very small) companies that make soft drinks - these won't be copies of Coke, etc., but will be genuine different soft drinks you've never experienced. As Bhutan opens itself up, Coca Cola will move in and either set up a new company to manufacture their drinks, or buy existing ones. People will buy their drinks first of all because of #1 above - it's new, it's cool, etc. Within a very short time, there will be no local soft drinks made. The reason for this will *not* be because Coke is better and people only want it. It will be because the Coca Cola company have the financial muscle to completely control the soft drinks industry of that country. This is not good.

    #2 applies to things much more than soft drinks, TV, etc. When you're talking about 3rd world countries and things like agricultural seed supplies and strictly controlled genetically engineered crops, this can have a very bad effect. It's very realistic for companies akin to Monsanto to completely control who areas of agricultural production in these kinds of countries.

    So if you believe "raionalism" is #2 above, and this is a good thing, you can surely extrapolate this to meaning there will eventually be only 1 of anything in the world - a single soft drink we all only buy, a single type of car, etc. I don't think this will be a nice place to live.

    Left uncontrolled, #2 will eventually remove much of the choice and freedom in the world, thereby harming the greatest thing about the US, #1.

  8. American Culture by YeeHaW_Jelte · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I guess there should be a distinction made between american culture and american "culture" as used by michael. Yes, you americans have a great culture; excellent writers, great artists and original musicians. Too bad that the stuff that actually gets exported the most is "culture": coke, disney and the worst of hollywood.
    I've been reading some of the comments and all I have to say is this: don't short change yourself or your culture, be aware of the things that have real value and give these to the world.

    --

    ---
    "The chances of a demonic possession spreading are remote -- relax."
    1. Re:American Culture by asreal · · Score: 4, Insightful
      This reminds me of a question that came up while I was studying in the UK. My Pop Culture in Britain 1800-Present class was discussing what the term culture means. Many people were certain culture meant what was played on BBC4 and "the classics." I took another point of view. Culture is everything produced by a civilization... there is no real yardstick.

      After all, in his day, Shakespeare's plays were considered to be for the common people. I don't mean to equate The Fast and the Furious with Hamlet, but I think we are too fast to dismiss anything other than 'high culture'.

  9. American Culture Not That Bad by Kirby-meister · · Score: 4, Insightful
    I think American culture is much better than some of the less-tolerant cultures there are in this world.

    Come on, what's so bad about our culture? Not all of us are the stereotyped fat slobs who stare at the TV all day. Our music is diverse, our people tend to work, and our culture is mostly tolerant on issues. And I like the fact that we are free to discuss issues concerning the government.

    1. Re:American Culture Not That Bad by Per+Wigren · · Score: 3, Interesting

      and our culture is mostly tolerant on issues.

      Yes, I've seen that on Ricky Lake and Jenny Jones. ;)

      "Oh no, you're not normal! We have to change/brainwash you so you can fit in with the rest!"

      --
      My other account has a 3-digit UID.
    2. Re:American Culture Not That Bad by jafuser · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Our music is diverse

      Only if you know where to look. Remember, before the internet, the same crap you hear on all of the current Clear Channel radio stations was the majority1 of what would make it to other countries.

      our people tend to work

      True, but we seem to be prejudiced against rest and relaxation of any sort. What ever happened to enjoying life? What's the big deal if you die a "successful" millionaire if you Can't Take it With You"TM?

      My roommate from England tells me about how many Europeans get a month of vacation per year; they get even more (6 weeks?) if they've got some seniority. The average full-time American employee gets two weeks of vacation time per year, and those with seniority may even be lucky enough to get three! And even when we do finally get to take some down time, we still can't get some rest and relaxation without overworking ourselves.

      and our culture is mostly tolerant on issues

      More like Apathy. Passivity. Sheep-like behavior.

      There are many issues which are worth some time to consider:

      • Human rights
      • Civil rights
      • Racism
      • Affirmative Action
      • Funding education
      • Arms control
      • Campaign finance
      • Missile defense
      • Immigration
      • The USA PATRIOT ACT, UCITA, DMCA, etc
      • The corruption of mainstream media
      • Medicare/Medicaid
      • AIDS
      • Drug patents
      • Disabled rights
      • Juvenile justice
      • Conflicts in Africa
      • The cause of poverty
      • Third World Debt
      • Free trade and globalization
      • Creeping corporate power
      • Consumerism
      • International criminal court
      • The Middle East
      • The War on TerrorTM
      • Foreign Policy
      • Israel and Palestine
      • Kosovo
      • Chechnya
      • East Timor
      • China
      • Genetically modified food
      • Global Warming
      • Animal/Nature conservation
      • Human cloning
      • Prayer in school
      • Gun control
      • Patient rights
      • Euthanasia
      • Privacy
      • Terrorism
      • Tobacco
      • Health Care
      • United Nations
      • Veterans
      • Tort Reform
      • Separation of church and state
      • Bill of Rights
      (just to name a few)

      At least some of these issues should be things people talk about and think about every day, instead of going home to be brainwashed by MTV or the latest episode of Friends (aka "culture"). I know there *are* people in the USA who do stay on top of the issues, but for the most part, people prefer to stick their heads in the ground and be apathetic (aka "tolerant") of how everything is going now. Honestly, do you think our leaders are going to make the right decisions?

      --
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    3. Re:American Culture Not That Bad by jafuser · · Score: 4, Interesting
      If i want an abortion, i can march my ass down town and get one.

      Yeah, right past the "tolerant" americans holding their picket signs, their list from the Nuremberg Files, and their tote bag full of weapons which has "choose life" printed on the outside.

      if i want to have a gay marraige, I can go to vermont or new mexico.

      We're so "tolerant" that 4% of our state governments allow gay marriage. And then there's always the issue of dealing with our "tolerant" neo-nazis, Aaron McKinneys, and "tolerant" churches and conservative groups?

      if i want to claim glaucoma and smoke a fat tasty spliff, I go to Cali (id rather fly to amsterdam, but whatev).

      I'll agree a lot of people are tolerant to light drug use, but my problem with it is that as long as it's widespread and illegal, it makes a lot of people arrestable for something the majority of the public accepts.

      Funny that you dont realize how much of a role intolerance plays in the two international issues you addressed. If im living in Israel and Im Palestinian, you bet your ass I'll be seeing some intolerance. If im a Catholic living in the wrong Neghborhood in Belfast, you bet your ass I'll be seeing some intolerance. But if I'm any of these living in any neighborhood in the U.S. I'll bet your ass that no one will give a flying fuck.

      You're mostly correct as far as extent, but your colorfully metaphored assertion that there is complete racial apathy here in the USA is a little bit inaccurate. For example, what about a black family living in an all-white community in a southern state, or a young married couple moving into a community of mostly retirees? While in most cases, we've reached the point where physical violence is rare between these groups, there is certianly at least a small degree of intolerance.

      --
      Please consider making an automatic monthly recurring donation to the EFF
    4. Re:American Culture Not That Bad by Brian_Ellenberger · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yeah, right past the "tolerant" americans holding their picket signs, their list from the Nuremberg Files, and their tote bag full of weapons which has "choose life" printed on the outside. We're so "tolerant" that 4% of our state governments allow gay marriage. And then there's always the issue of dealing with our "tolerant" neo-nazis, Aaron McKinneys, and "tolerant" churches and conservative groups? For example, what about a black family living in an all-white community in a southern state

      And then there are those ignorant people who stereotype all pro-lifers as violent abortion clinic-bombers, evangelical churches as neo-nazi gay bashers, and white southerns as racists.

      Brian Ellenberger
  10. Bhutanese Culture will cease to exist. by Zarf · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Just like I've seen the culture of a small Alaskan village cease due to the introduction of T.V. So will the culture of Bhutan. This letter to the editor is very convincing on that point.

    When I was young, we were Alaskans. We had our own culture and music both the old (native alaskans) and the new Russians and Americans had forged a unique identity that was Alaskan. Then TV came. By the time I left High School you could see the changes.

    My point is well illustrated by this story:
    I graduated high school in 1992, the kids from our class did the Christmas dance theme on some cute "Stairway to Heaven" or other schmaltzy thing. The kids that were class of 1994 did "Christmas in da 'Hood". The '94 kids had gang violence in their classrooms. Kids bringing guns to school (with the intent of shooting other kids and not to show off their new hunting rifle), weapons, and grafiti became problems.

    The ironic thing was that the younger classes were smaller ours was the largest graduating class.

    I remember all the Rappers and the oppressed gansta' types sulking about the remote and wild wilderness of one of the remotest places on earth. Some people run away to the untouched beauty of Alaska to escape inner-city grime. How ironic that an aspiring young rap-star would be cursed with living in a place where there was hardly any crime and the government paid you to live there.

    If religion is the opiate of the masses, then television is the crystal-meth of the glue huffing, crack-smoking, I-got-the-munchies masses.

    --
    [signature]
    1. Re:Bhutanese Culture will cease to exist. by Zarf · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Not that it's a bad thing ofcourse. A single world-culture and a single world language would be good for trade. I still own a TV and I watch it BTW and I think that a strong mind can use TV rather than be used by it.

      I just don't hold any illusions that you can preserve a local culture under the constant wash of TV. It just is as it is. TV's unblinking eye serves us well in many ways. As it connects it also provides a common experience to all who are watching, the common experience causes common culture. Just how GNU/Linux has a culture formed about it, and TV shows tend to spawn sub-cultures too (ie: Star Trek, Star Wars, et al.).

      So maybe I'm being a bit harsh with my last post. Still, it is sad to see the end of a culture. Just like it was sad to see the end of Amiga, OS2, or Novell.

      --
      [signature]
  11. Nothing on TV, and you still pay for it?? by Flounder · · Score: 5, Insightful

    After realizing that I never watched TV anyway, and the kids were watching too much, I disconnected the cable.

    Got internet for news, info, and entertainment. The kids now spend more time playing outside and reading. The only thing I really miss is sports (no big deal, as I hate all the local teams here in Maryland) and 24hr news (at least have the net).

    Still have the TV (gotta watch DVDs and the kids still have the kiddie movies). But it mostly stays off now. It's nice.

    Granted, instead of spending $40 a month on cable, I'm spending $100+ a month on DVDs.

    --

    No boom today. Boom tomorrow. There's always a boom tomorrow. - Cmdr. Susan Ivanova

  12. Re:Hmm by SerpentMage · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I think the problem with American culture is that it tends suck you in and forget about the others.

    Let me give you an example. In the US there is a wine company that sells itself as Cabris, which is actually a region in France that is know to sell a good white wine. Well the American company took advantage of this to "con" people. The French region on the other hand has problems now because people get confused by the marketing message.

    The problem of American culture is not the American's themselves, but the companies that take advantage of situations. Corporations in their quest for profits and bigger market share do not care a rat's butt about culture. Just more money. And in the past that has not been a problem. But now in a global economy that is a problem. Since it means some things will be lost, even though they should not be.

    The American corporations are just too damm efficient at taking over the world. Result is hatred. Whenever you see people hating America, do you see people hating individual American's? Nope just icons, flag, McDonalds, jeans, etc.

    I think that the challenge of this century will not be tech, or political, but social. This century will be the century when humanity is tested to see if we can truly live together! Or if we are doomed to be fighting each other. We have the technology to destroy each other and we have the means to live together.

    --

    "You can't make a race horse of a pig"
    "No," said Samuel, "but you can make very fast pig"
  13. Read Kuensel by rpjs · · Score: 4, Informative

    If you want a glimpse of Bhutan, read their national newspaper Kuensel on the web. It's in English and it gives a fascinating insight into a country that's still trying to take on the modern world on its own terms.

    And it uses Slash.

  14. Television is like Alcohol by jafuser · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Lately, I like to consider watching television and/or movies, the same as most people think of the consumption of alcoholic beverages. It's fine to do it socially, while in the company of friends or family, but taking in too much (especially while you're only by yourself), is not good for you.

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    Please consider making an automatic monthly recurring donation to the EFF
  15. Re:Bhorgtan by sql*kitten · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "THIMPHU, Bhutan -- Microsoft's latest venture is a localized version of its dominant Windows operating system for the tiny Himalayan kingdom of Bhutan. "

    Is there a Bhutan-localized version of Red Hat?

    That's a rhetorical question.

    Which brings me nicely to my point: it is literally impossible for a capitalist culture to force itself on another culture. Capitalists can advertise products and services for sale but cannot force anyone to buy; the only people that eat at McDonalds, drink Starbucks, watch Disney and so forth are people who want to and are willing to pay with their own money.

    If people don't want to buy, corporations will collapse and leave. The only people who complain aren't the ones freely spending their own money on what they enjoy. Rather, they are the self-proclaimed elite, those who don't offer anything that their people actually want, and can only survive where there is no competition. An example of this is the way the French taxpayer has to subsidise the production of French films, but with the money they are allowed to keep, they queue up to watch films from Hollywood.

    Imperialism is something different. Imperialism is when one country conquers another with military force, forming an empire, and imposes its culture on the conquered. Imperial means "to do with an empire". Examples of imperialism are, for example, the conquests of eastern European countries and the imposition of Communism by the Soviets.

    So I applaud the government and people of Bhutan - and the global corporations - for bringing freedom and choice to the most remote parts of the world.

  16. Will Thee Move Thy Horseless Carriage? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I don't know, the Amish have been doing a pretty good job of preventing their culture from becoming "Americanized" as far as I can tell, and they live in America.

  17. Homogonized Culture by Ezubaric · · Score: 3, Insightful


    These fears aren't just about Bhutan. If anything, America faces as great a threat from the death of local culture as anywhere else. The only difference is that we delude ourselves into thinking that raking in money makes it all "okay."

    Sure, we feel more comfortable when we travel when we can order the same extra value meal in in every time zone, but I can only echo the sentiments of Lisa on the variety of Americana:

    Lisa: Wow, Dad and Bart have been everywhere! They've eaten submarine sandwiches, grinders, *and* hoagies.

    Damn. I guess I've been taken in by the tentacles too. I guess it's okay as long as I can super-size.

    --

    ----------
    I am an expert in electricity. My father held the chair of applied electricity at the state prision.
  18. Re:A sudden revelation by Tyrell+Hawthorne · · Score: 3, Interesting
    If you only knew how right you are... Everybody, think about this question for a while:

    In which society is propaganda most important, in a dictatorship or a democracy?

    For more on this subject, read Edward S. Herman and Noam Chomsky's Manufacturing Consent, which explains how the seven media filters make sure nothing nasty (like, for instance, the truth) reaches the public. It's a quite heavy book to read, but very interesting.

    Also, for brilliant US political satire comics, something I discovered yesterday: This Modern World, by Tom Tomorrow. (I don't think the penguin is related to Linux though.)

  19. Europe got culture? by marlowe · · Score: 4, Funny

    Oh, boy. I am such a redneck. I need to put on a Kraftwerk CD and read some gibberish by Derrida. And then maybe go out and pogrom a few Jews. Then I'll be suave and sophisticated.

    And now is the time on Sprockets where we go on about how much more culture we have than the Americans.

    Okay, I'll grant Europe had a fine culture, once. Operas and architecture and symphonies and everything. But that was a gosh-darn long time ago. Let's just face it. Europe has been in decline, culturally and politically, for about a century now.

    I can get Beethoven, Mozart and Sibelius on CD. I can get the Dutch masters in high quality reproduction. I can even get the worthless crap the French are passing off as philosophy these days, though there's not much point. Who needs Europe anymore? It's all used up.

    Nowadays, someone mentions European culture, and what comes to mind is the topless aerobics in that Chevy Chase movie. Just think, honey. They've been doing this for eons!

    --
    http://www.angelfire.com/ca3/marlowe Better a smartass than a dumbass.
  20. Re:Americans who travel abroad by Afrosheen · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I had to explain this to my wife one time.

    She's from Thailand (Bangkok), and they get their share of American tourists. Her stereotypical idea of an American, based on her experiences, is that of a loud-mouthed, demanding person that's always smacking gum and throwing money around. Once she moved here to the US she saw things alot differently.

    The problem with foreign perception of Americans is that about the only Americans that travel and make it overseas are rich jackasses. They treat people like shit here and going overseas doesn't magically change that. So other countries get the worst upper-crust nimrods and the rest of us nice folks take the rap for them. I think if most foreigners that hate Americans actually come visit Texas or some other state for a year, they'll learn what Americans are really like.

  21. Re:Hmm by SerpentMage · · Score: 3, Insightful

    First that is a very narrow minded attitude. This is the reason why people get annoyed at American attitudes. Yes people want some parts of the American dream. But there is nothing wrong with that. Just like how Americans want part of the European dream, by driving European vehicles or using Swiss Showers (which btw I have no idea ever existed and I live in Switzerland).

    The problem is that many American corps have an in your face attitude, whereas other global companies are not quite that bad. Consider Nestle, which is the biggest producer of food globally and they produce an almost majority of the processed food consumed by Americans. Does the average American know that? Not likely because Nestle is very deversified and adjusts their food to local cultures. Then consider Walmart, which tries to do everything their way. It works in the US, partially Canada and partially Mexico, but they are getting their butt kicked in Europe. Consider the opposite case of Carrefour which is kicking Walmarts butt globally by respecting local cultures. Not all American corps do this. A prime example are the music labels and MTV. They adjust their content respective to each country. In India MTV is VERY different than MTV in America or MTV in Europe. MTV adjusts to local tastes and languages. Or even CNN. CNN Europe (CNN Spain, CNN Italy, CNN Germany) is not CNN America.

    That is my point. There are ways to become a dominate company globally...

    --

    "You can't make a race horse of a pig"
    "No," said Samuel, "but you can make very fast pig"