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Microsoft/HP to Market Crippled Entertainment PCs
gustywinds writes "CNet is reporting that Microsoft and HP recently announced the details on their Media Center PCs that will be coming out this Christmas season (this used to be called 'Freestyle'). The big story is that these PCs will have anti-copying mechanisms built-in to them -- ie can't burn recorded TV shows to DVD, or even copy and play them back on other PCs. And they are going to be expensive... $1500 for the starter box. Sounds like this thing is going to be DOA. Lots of other PC-based TV recording products that aren't restrictive when it comes to copying stuff goes... Snapstream, WinDVR... And, of course, Hauppauge, nVidia and ATi have products too but their software is pretty lacking..."
Sure, it's running linux, but isn't it just a crippled entertainment PC?
Doesn't HP already do this with their hardware?
This could be fun!
Finding God in a Dog
The article states a price of $1,500-$2,000. Then it talks about marketing them to COLLEGE STUDENTS. Think about that... the college students are the ones most opposed to DRM technologies! For less than $1,000 I can put together a machine with an ATI All in Wonder Pro DVR and a massive disk without the DRM inhibitions. Funny thing is, college students are the ones to figure this out first.
There is no reasonable defense against an idiot with an agenda
:wq
Of course, by moving to a subscription model for the OS, which ties your media to your subscription fee, they can make sure that Joe Consumer forks over however much they want to ask for in subscription fees. Maybe I'm being paranoid, but I think this is where MS is headed with this.
You can only drink 30 or 40 glasses of beer a day, no matter how rich you are.
-- Colonel Adolphus Busch
That strategy might make sense as Microsoft attempts to attract Hollywood movie studios with its digital rights management and anti-copying technologies.
This is NOT DOA, because it is not about PCs or PVRs or multimedia control. It is a Proof of Concept to sell the Digital Rights Management of MS to the MPAA and RIAA. Then the MPAA and RIAA will then use their money to ensure that ALL PCs have a DRM built into them.
While we can whine and cry that "no machine we buy will!!!", It is a non-issue. Dell, Gateway, Compac/HP, etc. will continue to sell their millions of boxes to the various businesses, and Mom & Dad like always. Legislation will pass that requires DRM and those that do not have it will be marginalized as criminals.
This is not the war, this is just the start of the battle. MPAA/RIAA make be seeing they will never get another DMCA, so they need to control "just content". MS sees the opportunity to manage every piece of electronic data on the web. 95% of the OS market is child's play by comparison.
The way these things fail is if someone manages to circumvent it in the first few months in a way that every 12 year with a 56k connection can bypass it.
I would guess that this product is intended to fail.
That was the impression I got from reading the article, too. Consider this snipit:
This makes it sound very much like the primary motivation for creating this system is to make friends with the RIAA & MPAA. I think customer satisfaction is secondary to them. And remember, this is Microsoft we're talking about here. They have a monopoly on OSs. They can pretty much do what they want and the customers will be stuck with it. And Apple-heads and Linux-fans, please don't start screaming at me. I hear you. The problem is mainstream America doesn't.
GMD
watch this
So we have a bunch of people who are willing to shell out a lot of money to make sure that no one could really make a living building and selling weak-DRM hardware. Any would-be competitors will find themselves completely underpriced, as content owners subsidize the hardware that protects their "property." I think strong-DRM hardware is pretty much inevitable, considering the cash clout of its backers - they can pretty much control the market.
I dunno...buying an overpriced, shackled, computer to watch and record music and (God help us) TV programs makes about as much sense as buying an overpriced TV to run your spreadsheets. Did the people running MS, HP, AOL, and all the rest have childhood fantasies about being movie moguls? This all smacks of a hangover from the late and unlamented flash-in-the-pan known as "convergence".
-- Slashdot: When Public Access TV Says "No"
Of reasons HP investors will sue the board of directors. Carly Fiorina, that idiotic Compaq merger, and now releasing these systems... morons.
Doh! You beat me to the punch on pointing out that it has the same restrictions as a TiVo.
Anyway, while a TiVo is cheaper, you're leaving out the PC functionality. If we go with the price of a comparable TiVo as being $300 (leaving out the subscription fees, though it's possible that Microsoft might include TV listings in their purchase price), that leaves an extra $1200. For a consumer PC sans monitor, that just doesn't seem that bad. Allocate some of the money toward the "integration/convenience factor", and you'll got a deal that I think some people will go for.
I think the major deciding factor will be whether or not people actually like having a PC near their TV. The price and the television capture restrictions are secondary.
I can only hope that there are enough clueful computer users who violate intellectual property to create a large market for non-DRM hardware.
The thing is, I can't imagine that there will be a time when you can't compile and run your own programs because there are just too many developers out there. And if you can compile and run programs you can compile and run xvid codecs. If MS decide to have processors check for xvid etc headers then you can change the xvid headers to something else- put the info fields in a different order etc.
If people can't transfer their home videos to their pc, or their photos or home-made music, they're going to get pissed-off.
In fact, thinking about it, if Palladium is everything we fear, AND it becomes so that you can't even buy loose components that aren't palladium-based, then I don't see how you wouldn't get a huge mega-meltdown-apocolypse as people refuse to upgrade their computers.
It's certainly going to be interesting.
graspee
While browsing around, I found what appears to be a standalone unit that you can use to browse and record broadcast television, includes no DRM controls, includes a 19inch screen, a remote control unit, speakers, and is contained in ONE unit. It does not record the broadcast digitally but the medium it uses appears to be compatible with 1000's of other units and is cheaper then any memory stick or other removeable device I've ever seen. I imagine a device like this sitting next to your computer would be a more logical choice for only $169.
Bad boys rape our young girls but Violet gives willingly.
I recently put together a box to do the same thing, ut $1500 it was not.
Shuttle S50 - $300
Celeron 1.8 - $100
256MB DDR - $75
80 GB HDD - $85
DVD (w/WinDVD) $50
Hauppage FM-TV tuner w/ remote - $100
SnapSteam SW - $40
--------------------
$750
It outputs to my TV, records what I want, and I can watch DVD, DIVX, VCD, MP3, CD, etc. PLUS I can watch any recorded show on any moachine on my network. What do I get for the other $750
I'm very sad to totally agree with your analysis.
... so that congress can bless the "proven Microsoft Way" and force the Microsoft "technology" onto the rest of us.
This isn't an attempt for Microsoft to sell PCs or Windows.
Instead, this is an attempt to gain lobby support from MPAA/RIAA
It all comes back to the Microsoft strategy - once you're locked in, you can complain... but you're still a paying customer...
Soon Microsoft's operating system will be free, not just from Linux competition, but because of media management revinue. Thier digital restrictions management (DRM) will collect viewing fees from which Microsoft will keep a cut. Can you say, "Blockbuster Video on steroids"?
It is a fairly simple business plan. They become a regular utility bill.
Hp and Microsoft announced today that they're updating an old idea for the 21st century.
...... "The PC Jr. - Media Center Edition"....
Following the IBM lead of many years ago they've created:
- You can make something they want, so that they choose to buy it
- You can make it legally mandatory, either by direct requirement, or by outlawing the alternatives.
Which approach do you think best describes the marketing plan for this product?Turing machines in the hands of private citizens are as dangerous to our current ruling class as were weapons in the hands of the peasants in feudal times. Next thing you know, we'll start having laws ignoring the constitution and restricting our right as individuals to keep and bear arms.
OK... where's the details/facts?!
Is this really a version of Windows that won't allow you to run Winamp/Audiocatalyst etc? (XBox style - only runs digitally signed code)
Or just more restrictions on the bundled Windows Media Player?
Can't imagine it being 'only run signed code' - How can they stop you running Winamp/AudioCatalyst/Gnutella/CloneCD without stopping you running all other Win32 software?
Maybe it's a driver-level attempt to stop CD ripping/digital audio recording. But how the fuck do they expect to stop you playing an downloaded MP3? Only allow signed apps to play audio? What about games etc?....
If filename contains *.mp3, refuse to open/copy?
What do I get for the other $750
;)
ehh looking at the description of the HP version, the answer appears to be:
DVD +R/RW drive, twice the RAM, a better processor, a 200 watt Klipsch sound system, a Ge Force4... and a whole bunch of annoying DRM crap
I am not pleased with the way the future of digital media is unfolding...