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AIM And ICQ to be Integrated

Posted by ryuzaki0 on from the annoying-desktop-sounds-increased dept.

sam writes "According to this InfoWorld article the next version of America Online's Instant Messenger will allow users to communicate with ICQ users in a move that will bridge the gap between the company's two popular chat services. Maybe AOL finally woke up and realized people were using IM clients that have both in them." I still use only IRC for messaging, but this is gonna make things easier for a lot of users.

24 of 369 comments (clear)

  1. Doesn't this already work? by jimmcq · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I thought this already worked... You can load up the AIM client and add the Number (not nickname) of an ICQ user as buddy.

    1. Re:Doesn't this already work? by ActiveSX · · Score: 5, Informative

      This isn't about the client protocol, this is interaction between users on the server.

    2. Re:Doesn't this already work? by infiniti99 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Yes, which is a huge deal. Lots of people in the comments are posting about client-side workarounds, which don't even solve the problem. If you are logged into AIM and ICQ from one client, the networks are not bridged whatsoever. You've just got two logins, that's all. It's a nice trick, but there is a lot more to solving IM interoperability.

      Now that the IETF working group for Jabber is on its way, I sincerely hope that AOL will consider using it for their server-to-server communication. They can still use OSCAR for client communication (just as they use a proprietary client mail protocol and not POP), but they need to use Jabber on the outside (as they use SMTP on the outside) to fully solve the "IM Interoperability Dilemma" (tm).

      Of course, considering how long it is taking for them to link their own damn networks, I'd say we've got about 5 years to go :(

      AOL holds most of the cards for IM interoperability. I still encourage everyone out there to start using Jabber and run Jabber servers, but AOL's users totally outnumber us. Even in this Slashdot forum today, most of you using some form of IM are using an AOL-controlled service. Please, guys, the faster we move to Jabber, the faster this war will be over. Stop using AIM, ICQ, MSN, or Yahoo, especially if you are on Linux (doesn't anyone think using MSN on Linux is just too ironic?). Or if you can't quit cold-turkey, use GAIM so that you can use Jabber alongside these other proprietary protocols. I still think it will take a move by AOL to fully solve this (as I said, they have most of the cards), but I think if the entire tech community embraced Jabber we would have a lot more influence. This move to link AIM and ICQ is a good first step, but there is more to be done.

      So go forth and use Jabber. Find a friend to do it also. Even if you just have each other in your contact list and no one else, you are securing yourself a place in the future of open IM. I'm already AOL-free, as I quit AIM and ICQ earlier this year. Now my Jabber roster has over 100 contacts, after successful conversion of all of my friends and family. Who needs AOL? Not any of us!!

    3. Re:Doesn't this already work? by __aaahtg7394 · · Score: 5, Informative

      AIM and ICQ have been the same network since icq2k. It's just that they've been limiting the ability to speak between the two.

      You could log in to AIM servers with an ICQ UID and join ChatNav (AIM chat rooms) before. dunno if you still can, don't care to test. You simply couldn't IM AIM users (you could still message ICQ users).

      ICQ2K's protocol is just OSCAR with the ICQ bits stuffed in via new TLVs.

      -josh, who helped with OSCAR RE and did the first (afaik) partial icq2k implementation (See libfaim or the aimster/madster client-side proxy)

    4. Re:Doesn't this already work? by tzanger · · Score: 5, Informative

      After your inspiring speach about Jabber. You never really tell us exactly what it is, or provide a link for more info. A link wold be nice. We like links.

      I'll try to help. Here is Jabber's main page. The first thing you need to do is Grab a client My personal favourite is Psi, a crossplatform slim and slick client that I feel is better because I can opt to have incoming events as messages or chats (or just leave them as they came), opt to pop up the window, automatically show the message, or just flash in the tray (especially important when you type over 100WPM and someone messages you out of the blue), it's open source, I've created a few patches to help make the client better (IMO), and it's under active development. Psi also has a message/chat history (searchable) and supports multiple identities (online at the same time, in the same client) and Jabber itself features multiple instances of a particular Jabber User (home/work, etc.). Features coming up in Psi are groupchat (in 0.8.7, due out Very Soon Now), File Transfer (that works behind NAT, coming in 0.9), pluggable storage for history and prefs (SQL, etc.) and other leading-edge stuff for Jabber. Justin (the lead developer of Psi) seems to have a real knack for making a solid, stable client and pushing the envelope with the new Jabber feature drafts.

      Oh yes, Psi also supports SSL (client--server) and there is a Jabber draft for SSL between servers, so your inane chatter is kept private with strong encryption. *cough*ICQ*cough*

      Psi is a Qt app, but there are CLI clients, Perl module clients, GTK clients, Win32-only clients, Java clients, JScript clients... Hell there's even a Flash client. The protocol is completely open.

      Perhaps one of the biggest assets to Jabber is that it is decentralized. There are many public servers, and you can set your own up (hell even Debian has packages for it!). [warning - the public servers link has a session-id, I don't know if it'll work for anyone else]

      The biggest problem with Jabber is that it is still a little tricky for newbies to get in to -- there is no "download this, it registers you with one of the common servers" links (not that I'm aware of anyway), so you need someone to either set it up for you or point you off to a public server. A lot of the clients are crap (a common problem with OSS, I'm afraid). Sometimes the transports (gateways to other IM systems, like ICQ, AIM, Y!, etc.) don't work because the other systems find a common server and shut down access to their network from it, but if you run your own server or you are on a small server, you won't even blip on their radar.

      I really like it. I used to be an ICQ-head (my UIN is just over 1-mil) but when they started throwing up ads and adding more and more crap to the client I bailed) and I couldn't find a decent Jabber client (one that didn't pop up messages and take focus, how F#%#^T#$'ing irritating!) for a while, but now I am a very happy Jabber user. Hell even my wife, mom and grandmother use it (seriously) -- it works great for computer-cautious people because of the simplicity.

    5. Re:Doesn't this already work? by infiniti99 · · Score: 5, Informative

      I guess I made the false assumption that everyone already knows what Jabber is, yet aren't using it. That was actually very stupid of me, considering what I was arguing :)

      Jabber is an open IM system, which uses an XML-based protocol for interconnecting servers and clients. Your Jabber ID (or JID) is in the form "user@host", obviously following in the footsteps of other common internet protocols (most notably email, but also ftp, http, etc). Jabber also supports SSL in the core protocol.

      Because the protocol is open, there are numerous server and client implementations, all designed to interoperate. Anyone can run a server, and there is no such thing as an "official client" (that would be as absurd as an official email client). The world of Jabber is much more friendly than that of closed IM, as the Jabber Software Foundation encourages developer participation.

      Let the linking commence!

      Jabber Software Foundation - The "JSF" handles all of the core protocol decision-making. There are members, council, and an enhancement proposal system. The website is also a nice hub for information, as there are links to guides, programming info, client software, server software, public server lists, etc. Start here.

      Some nice clients:
      Psi* - powerful and minimal cross-platform Jabber client (Windows/Mac/Unix), looking like Licq.
      Gabber - a full featured GNOME Jabber client.
      Exodus - a very featureful Windows client. Has a strange UI in my opinion, but lots of people like it.
      Gaim - mentioned 100 times already in the comments area. This program is nice because it natively supports AIM (and other protocols), which can make your transition to Jabber easier.

      Other areas of interest:
      User guide - a good read for newbies.
      jabberd - home of the popular open source jabber server.
      Jabberd Admin guide - Read this if you want to run your own server.
      Jogger - a Jabber-based blog.

      *Note - I am the author of Psi. Please forgive the plug :)

  2. About Time by codemachine · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Considering they use the exact same protocol, I'm not sure what the holdup was. ICQ2000 onward was really just AIM protocol anyhow. I guess they need to make integration look hard so they have an excuse to not allow MSN and Yahoo! interoperability.

  3. obligitory trillian link by anotherone · · Score: 5, Informative
    I feel that I should mention Trillian, which everyone should know about:


    Trillian.cc


    It lets you connect to and message users on both ICQ and AIM, as well as MSN and Yahoo. And you can connect to IRC with it, although I prefer to use mIRC for that.

    --
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    1. Re:obligitory trillian link by Dog+and+Pony · · Score: 5, Informative

      Personally, I found CenterICQ to be one of the best multi-IM applications. :)

    2. Re:obligitory trillian link by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      Well if you get to post your favorite, I get to post mine.

      I think everyone should know about Gaim, a UNIX instant messenging client supporting a wide variety of protocols.

      All of the protocols Trillian supports:
      ICQ, AIM, MSN, Yahoo, and IRC
      plus:
      Jabber, Zephyr, and (not that it's much use) Napster.

    3. Re:obligitory trillian link by ejaw5 · · Score: 5, Informative

      I find Gaim to my liking. Haven't tried the $25USD Trillian, but Gaim works like a charm. It even alerts me when mail comes into my Y! account. ..and it's free. The linux version is great...well the Win32 could use a little more work.

      --

      $cat /dev/random > Sig
    4. Re:obligitory trillian link by Jace+of+Fuse! · · Score: 5, Informative

      Haven't tried the $25USD Trillian.

      No, Trillian is $Free. Trillian Pro costs $25.

      There is a difference.

      There are no restrictions to the regular Trillian, and only a few tiny bells and whistles in Trillian Pro. The reasons to buy Trillian Pro are almost totally about donating to the developement, and little else.

      --

      "Everything you know is wrong. (And stupid.)"

      Moderation Totals: Wrong=2, Stupid=3, Total=5.
    5. Re:obligitory trillian link by brain159 · · Score: 5, Informative
      Also, when they introduced Trillian Pro, they gave everyone who had previously donated >= $1 a free license to Pro for a year (I think it's a year's worth of updates, not necessarily a year of using it). Cunning ploy to get us to want to pay for it after a year, certainly, and I'm convinced already :-)

      Pro adds the ability to read RSS feeds for you and pop up stuff when there's new news to be read (it alerted me to this /. entry). It also checks for emails and a few other similar nice things. Pro doesn't have IRC, but I prefer mIRC for that anyway.

    6. Re:obligitory trillian link by lewp · · Score: 5, Informative

      The AIM file transfer capabilities of Trillian seal the deal for me. I realize that for more technical users that this isn't a big deal (everyone has a server, right?), but my less technical friends are always trying to send me files via AIM and it gets old really quickly explaining why you are using a client that isn't capable of accepting their transfers. I use Gaim on my non-Microsoft boxen and this appears to be the only major feature it's missing.

      I shelled out the $25 for Trillian Pro when I saw the first screenshot. The default interface is arguably better than AIM's and is much tighter than the ugly rounded default of the free version. The "Send to" context menus for initiating IM transfers out of Explorer, Open... dialog boxes, and just about everywhere else are a nice time saver. The weather, mail and Winamp plugins make it useful enough to consider "docking" to one side of your screen if you have the real estate (I don't do this because I have already discovered the "one true way" for my Windows desktop). Finally, with the Minibrowser plugin you even get the full HTML profiles you see in the regular AIM client.

      Oh, and Trillian Pro will notify you of mail in your Yahoo! account too (and MSN, and even AOL it looks like), but unlike the other clients it gives you quick and easy checkboxes to turn this feature off if you, like me, don't waste your time with Hotmail or Yahoo! Mail.

      --
      Game... blouses.
  4. Next week in the news... by MontyP · · Score: 5, Funny

    AOL files a lawsuit against itself as it tries to integrate ICQ into their Instant Messenger System.

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    There is no .sig
  5. iChat just got cooler...I think... by toupsie · · Score: 5, Interesting
    I am assuming that the integration will be rolled into Apple's AIM client, iChat. Now it just needs MSN Messenger, Yahoo Messenger and Jabber support. The built-in Rendevous support in iChat is one feature that the Open Source community should jump on. Not only for chat but all forms of connectivity without the tedious cfg editing. I would love to message my Linux and BSD servers securely for system info.

    Me: Hey web server, what's your load?
    Linux-2 Web Server: Heavy dude! Slashdot just linked to a page and I am r0X0red to max! Talk2UL8r

    --
    Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government.
  6. So... by Evil+Adrian · · Score: 5, Funny

    Bloated AIM client + Bloated ICQ client = 20 MB executable. Greeeat.

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    evil adrian
  7. Functionality? by intermodal · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Does this mean they'll be adding ICQ functionality to AIM, such as being able to message/recieve messages while i'm not online or the person i'm sending to isn't online?

    --
    In SOVIET RUSSIA... erm...NSA AMERICA, the Internet logs onto YOU!
  8. Does this mean... by jesser · · Score: 5, Interesting

    the AIM client will finally include a feature that lets you change how someone appears in your buddy list (e.g., "Jesse Ruderman" instead of "JesseRud")? I can't imagine AIM forcing users to deal with a buddy list full of 9-digit ICQ numbers. Other than automatic logging, this is the feature I'm hoping for the most in the official AIM client.

    --
    The shareholder is always right.
  9. Re:Trillian for windows Gaim for linux by reverse+flow+reactor · · Score: 5, Informative

    don't forget that GAIM has an alpha version that does run on windows.

    And it has plugins for all the following protocols:
    * TOC
    * Oscar
    * Yahoo!
    * ICQ
    * MSN
    * IRC
    * Jabber
    * Napster
    * Zephyr

    --

    The significant problems we face cannot be solved by the same level of thinking that created them. -Einstein

  10. WHAT A TROLL by Roadmaster · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This HAS to be meant to be either a hge troll or a humorous comment, but since it hasn't been modded as such, here are the inaccuracies in this comment:

    1- UNIX talk predates ICQ by at least 10 years, and it appears as "vastly inferior" because it's meant for a completely different purpose. A car appears "vastly inferior" to an airplane because it can't fly, but that's not what it was meant to do.

    2- Trillian's author (and those of all the "compatible" IM utilities) aren't "stealing intellectual property"; they're doing reverse engineering of the protocols, then implementing those protocols in their own applications. It's actually so legal, it's even explicitly permitted by law. It's actually a good idea since that way I can use all those IM networks without having to use Windows, or Yahoo's, AOL's and Microsoft's client software. Um, maybe they would prefer I didn't use their IM networks?

    Trading files is not "illegal" per se. That's all I'm going to say about this one.

    This is AOL realizing "hey, we bought ICQ a while ago, let's start actually doing something with it", because they were getting stomped in the IM arena by competitors.

  11. friend of mine worked at AOL by RelliK · · Score: 5, Interesting

    He says that the servers for ICQ and AIM are _identical_. The only thing that separates the two networks is _one flag_ (in the message header, I think), that AOL can switch at will. The reason AOL kept AIM and ICQ separate is purely political: they didn't want the competition to connect to AIM. (IIRC, this has something to do with fulfilling the AOL/TW merger requirements). Microsoft has been quite vocal on this issue, even going so far as to propose "open standards" for instant messaging. Funny how they cry foul when they have to fight an uphill battle for a change.

    --
    ___
    If you think big enough, you'll never have to do it.
    1. Re:friend of mine worked at AOL by homer_ca · · Score: 5, Informative

      The conditions imposed by the FTC on the AOL/TW merger were that AOL must open it's IM network to competitors when it starts offering "advanced" services like video. Ever since then, they've dragged their feet on putting video features in AIM (pretty obvious when you see the "everything but the kitchen sink" feature list in AIM 5.0). Yahoo and MSN have had video for at least a year now. article here

  12. Re:There goes IRQ! by L0rdJedi · · Score: 5, Funny

    I doubt that this will do anything to the interrupts within your computer :)