murk1e writes "The BBC reports that in this article that a smart Pool table has been invented. The full information is here. For more about the Physics of Pool, try this site, or for a game, try here."
that suits me fine. it's your shot, clippy comes along to tell you something utterly inane like "it looks like you're playing a popular western pastime, do you want me to write you a fucking letter?" and you've already got a pool cue in your hands...I can't think of a better user experience...
The technology behind James, who looks like a professional pool player
So he has a mullet, old faded AC/DC t-shirt (hanging out), worn out old blue jeans, home made tattoos that have H A T E on his fingers on one hand and L O V E on the other, a beer in hand and squinting from his cigarette smoke that he lit with his Harley Davidson Zippo lighter (he's never actually owned a Harley though) while he waits for his shot. When he takes his shot, he smashes the sweet baby Jesus out of it where ever possible.
Of course, the physics of pool has and never will enter his head, because pool comes naturally to him, what growing up in pool halls and all.
He's professional because he usually wins the local comp, which just covers his practice expenses.
-- War crimes, torture, lies, illegal spying... Would someone give Bush a blowjob, already, so he can be impeached?
Re:Clippy
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 0
Need a Content Management/Email/SMS Marketing System in the UK?
You're asking the/. community if they are interested in SPAM technology?
Wow, talk about choosing your target market wisely!
I think they are talking about the type of AI employed in clippy and not the microsoft implementation in particular which has one major flaw, MS didn't have the time to spend to teach clippy how to respond to intermediate and advanced users. Clippy is tuned to beginners only and thats why anyone that has half a clue is totally annoyed.
All in all the technology is good, MS's implementation is flawed (though to note it exactly filled MS's needs by reducing the number of beginner tech support calls by like 70%).
Yeah, we need some sort of futuristic technology (and intelligent quantum-computers) to be able to calculate angles on a handheld ANYTHING. Any chimp could calculate the angles in pool with a TI-82.
(And yes, I am aware that the "future" in QL was 1999.)
Re:I've seen this before
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 1, Interesting
Heaven forbit people draw their inspiration from anywhere but the black void of nothingness. There's a lot of science that came from TV shows, mate, and nothing indicates that it is LESS scientific just because the concept came from TV.
Re:I've seen this before
by
suhit
·
· Score: 4, Informative
Well, actually a professor at Columbia University (Dr. Tony Jebara) was just interviewed about his "new device [that] may turn billiards beginners into high-tech pool sharks". The article was at http://www.ny1.com/Living/technology.html. It looks very cool. Also he just bought a pool table for the department to test his stuff on, and given that my office is just a few doors down from his, I will enjoy playing for hours (so much for my PhD).
Re:I've seen this before
by
LMacG
·
· Score: 1, Funny
For those of us of a certain age, we had an even earlier experience -- he might not have had lasers, but Donald Duck taught us all about the angles on a pool table in the classic Donald Duck in Mathmagic Land.
-- Slightly disreputable, albeit gregarious
Re:I've seen this before
by
SamBeckett
·
· Score: 1
Al only helped me!! I used most of my elite pool knoweldge I got from growing up in Indiana to help me beat the hustler!!
I saw the Donald Duck episodes in my HS physics class. It is fascinating how a well thought out lesson in geometry and physics can reduce complex interactive terms into simple concepts.
Every time I go out and play pool I remember the image-flipping scenes to calculate banking angles.
It's too bad there were no episodes of Donald Duck in Good English Land. or Donald Duck Fights the Dangling Participle
Clippy...
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 3, Funny
'The technology behind James, who looks like a professional pool player, is the same Microsoft uses for its paperclip office assistant. '
"It looks like you're trying to pot the black, would you like help?"
"Looks like you are trying to pot the pink. Would you like some help potting the brown?"
Liam.
-- The opinions contained in this document are in no way expressed.
The first rule of bar games...
by
gowen
·
· Score: 5, Funny
"Never play pool with a man named after a state."
-- Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.
Re:The first rule of bar games...
by
MosesJones
·
· Score: 2
Too true, never can trust a man call Georgia. Its the cross-dressing and stetson that are a dead give away.
-- An Eye for an Eye will make the whole world blind - Gandhi
Re:The first rule of bar games...
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 0
I could be wrong, but I'm sure it was more along the lines of Tex, moron.
Re:The first rule of bar games...
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 1, Informative
You are wrong. He was referring to Minnesota Fats. I own you.
Re:The first rule of bar games...
by
gowen
·
· Score: 2, Funny
Correct.
I can also assure you I was definitely not referring to Tennessee Ernie Ford who is easy to beat at pool, because he is
A country singer
Dead
-- Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.
Re:The first rule of bar games...
by
AGMW
·
· Score: 1
Oh. Not Dave Idaho then?
-- Eclectic beats from Leeds, UK
handmadehands.co.uk
Re:The first rule of bar games...
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 0
no, and not U Utah Phillips either.
nor George Washington!
void Maine(ME, ZipCode 0????);
never mind
I'm a big fan of pool
by
PhysicsScholar
·
· Score: 2, Funny
One of the neatest and most practical shots in pool is the stop shot.
When the cue ball is very close to the object ball, this can be accomplished with the center ball. The cue ball slides to the object ball and stops dead as the object ball shoots ahead because of the collision. But most stop shots are done with draw. You use just enough draw that the cue ball stops sliding just as it strikes the object ball.
Of course, all of this may sound difficult to judge, but it is fairly easy with practice. You soon learn to adjust your speed and amount of draw, depending on the shot (distance and other requirements of the pool situation).
(Twelve drinks and 1/2K*M*V^2 later and you may find yourself with some extra $$$ and a few pool sluts to walk you home to your bedroom that night!)
--
Department of Physics and Atmospheric Science, Dalhousie University, Halifax, N.S., Canada, B3H 3J5
Re:I'm a big fan of pool
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 0
"...and a few pool sluts to walk you home to your bedroom that night!"
Pool sluts?? They exist, wow, time to dust-off the old cueing action:)
Re:I'm a big fan of pool
by
superid
·
· Score: 3, Funny
-- Eclectic beats from Leeds, UK
handmadehands.co.uk
Re:It all boils down to:
by
CowboyMeal
·
· Score: 2, Funny
1. So poor, we didn't have a sink to piss in. 2. The kettle calling the sink black. 3. Hey Dudes... wanna buy some sink? 4. Sink-bellied pig. 5. ??? 6. Profit!
My definition about a smart pool table:
1) Knows not to make smart alec comments like "Whoops" just when you're making that crucial shot to win the game.
2) Doesn't "eat" your money and give you no balls
3) Doesn't take your money and give you all the balls except one
4) Actually has chalk you don't have to pay for - say on a piece of string
5) Doesn't charge you ridiculous amounts for a game
6) Is too smart to be in a pub
7) Has recently submitted a phD thesis on game theory
moderators, I am *AMAZED* at you. Not two lines up this SAME guy posted the SAME message (#4577406) and was modded redundant.
I take it he re-posted as a correction when he realised he had his line-breaks missing (see the point he makes in the newer version).
So, if you read "newest posts first" like many of us do, then as a moderator will see his corrected post (where he included the line breaks) and mod it as "funny". They then see the "original" that he was correcting in his re-post and mark it "redundant" (closest there is to a moderation of "obsolete" or "corrected") - not to tell him "you are a bad poster", but to aid you, the reader, reading at +1, so you'll only see the corrected version.
Moderation is about making slashdot easy for the reader, it's NOT about rewarding a poster (although I bet he comes out about +2 on karma from this exercise anyway).
I'll probably get modded at OT for this post of course;^)
-- T
-- I spent a lot of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I just squandered. - George Best
Re:smart pool table
by
Shanep
·
· Score: 4, Informative
All this "laser" business reminds me of an old episode of Quantum Leap.
Lasers are actually not practical for showing pool ball angles after the first bounce (even if the shooter takes imparted cushion spin into account with off centre shooting) due to the fact that the angle reduces after each successive bounce due to spin the cushions impart on the ball.
If you hit a ball hard at a moderate angle, intending to get the ball to bounce back and forth many times between two cushions, you will find that the angle will keep getting closer to 90 degrees to the cushions, until it actually appears that the ball is just bouncing back and forth parallel to the cushions 90 degrees to those being bounced off. Going from a moderate start angle to close to 90 degrees quite quickly.
I don't think photons suffer the imparted effects of cushion spin.
Also, not related to angle, but velocity, is that when a ball is first hit (on centre) it moves across the table surface initially without forward "rolling" spinning. The friction between the ball and table surface actually slows the ball down mostly up to the point where the rolling becomes "in step" with the velocity. When this ball hits a cushion, this rolling speed is slowed dramatically by the sudden braking effect of the ball pushing hard into the cushion and any rolling that remains after the bounce is quickly reversed as the ball now starts rolling in the opposite directing, again due to the friction of the ball against table surface. This in addition to energy being absorbed by the cushion (well, I don't like the term "absorbed" being used to describe energy "loss". The energy is converted to sound and heat) has the overall effect of making a ball travel much less than if it were to be hit with the same force without obstacles.
-- War crimes, torture, lies, illegal spying... Would someone give Bush a blowjob, already, so he can be impeached?
Not to mention that the point of aim is not the same as the point of contact. Most people would see the laser dot, or whatever it is, and aim directly at it. Unless you are shooting perpendicular to the rail, the ball will not contact the rail at the point you are aiming at. Experienced pool players compensate for this automatically due to practice, but most novices don't quite understand.
The lasers are suspended above the table and used to draw out a computed path for the ball. It isn't like there's a laser beam coming out of the cue ball to let you know where you're pointed.
all your explanations of how pool balls move about a pool table are really basic physics.
Rather than accusing the smart table of failing because you think it is too complicated, wouldn't it be safer to assume these guys have a clue!
I mean, the system can do thousands of complex calculations per second - trust me, getting the angles right is trivial. (getting the player to properly execute the shot, however, is another story).
I don't think anyone would invest as much time as they likely did in creating a 'smart table' without realizing the balls have spin. I would guess their understanding of it all goes far deeper than your own.
all your explanations of how pool balls move about a pool table are really basic physics.
Yes I know.
Rather than accusing the smart table of failing
I didn't accuse the smart table of anything. I'm just stating for anyone that might think that "angle of incidence = angle of reflection" is too simplistic for pool physics.
(getting the player to properly execute the shot, however, is another story).
Jeeze you think so Einstein? Humans are usually the weakest link in automated systems.
I don't think anyone would invest as much time as they likely did in creating a 'smart table' without realizing the balls have spin. I would guess their understanding of it all goes far deeper than your own.
I suppose you think that you are insulting me? First of all, there's no need to get defensive, I'm not attacking them. Second, I would bloody well hope that someone who sets out to make a "smart pool table" (whether as a non-technical visionary with money or a geek studying the physics) would know more about it than me, who hasn't studied it beyond mere curiosity.
-- War crimes, torture, lies, illegal spying... Would someone give Bush a blowjob, already, so he can be impeached?
Re:smart pool table
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 1, Informative
ah, I believe the lasers are more of a projection onto the table from above.
"People do not speak to pool tables so we came up with this personalised system and people are happy to talk to him," explained Mr Larsen.
Uh, I never needed an AI assistant to speak to a pool table, but the number of curses you can apply to an inanimate object are limited. Kudos to them for offering a target for my rage and frustration.
-- That's not a soda... it's a caffeine delivery device!
1) Knows not to make smart alec comments like "Whoops" just when you're making that crucial shot to win the game.
2) Doesn't "eat" your money and give you no balls
3) Doesn't take your money and give you all the balls except one.
4) Actually has chalk you don't have to pay for - say on a piece of string.
5) Doesn't charge you ridiculous amounts for a game.
6) Is too smart to be in a pub.
7) Has recently submitted a phD thesis on game theory.
8) Reminds you when you've left out linebreaks posting to slashdot.
All this "laser" business reminds me of an old episode of Quantum Leap.
Man, I loved that show. Well... "film". We must have watched it 5 or 6 times in 3rd grade. The person who got the highest score on a test every week got to pick out a film. A few friends and I kept picking that film over and over again until, about halfway through the year, the teacher said the film "mysteriously" disappeared from the storage room, so she made us pick other films. (So we kept going with the film about a claymation kid named Mike who had singing "germ fighters" in his mouth and little diseases with red and green berrets on.)
ok. WAY off-topic, but you sent me into a flashback and I felt I should share.:)
-- Karma: NaN
Technology similar to clippy?
by
GnomeKing
·
· Score: 2, Interesting
What exactly does that mean - and surely they could have come up with a better example...
I'm assuming that they mean that they use bayesian networks to help in their decision making about what type of shot the player is trying to make? heck, thinking about it, I just cant see how that would work
Perhaps they just mean they have a picture of james (as it shows in the slide show and thats what is similar to clippy...
Re:Technology similar to clippy?
by
Pulzar
·
· Score: 2
They didn't say that the technology was similar to clippy, it was based on it.
-- Never underestimate the bandwidth of a 747 filled with CD-ROMs.
Re:Technology similar to clippy?
by
Chromonkey
·
· Score: 1
The MS Office Assistant is actually one smart little monkey.
Check out some more information about it here at Microsoft Research.
And no, I don't work for Microsoft:)
-- There are very few real things in this world...this isn't one of them.
I'd rather something that took the shot I told it!
by
6Yankee
·
· Score: 5, Funny
I can see the angles, dammit! The hard part is getting the damned stick thing to poke the damned round white thing into the other round things at the angle I can see, without going down a damned hole thing, getting airborne, or knocking the damned round black thing down a damned hole thing!!!
M$
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 2, Funny
The agent "James" is based on the Microsoft Agents technology in their thesis
wonder how much the license will be to play pool on this thing?
light on the details....
by
FaRuvius
·
· Score: 3, Insightful
I wonder if it will just calculate angle shots, or if it considers more complex shots like ones involving English or combo-shot situations in 9 ball.
Sounds like a good tutoring system nonetheless, but I also wonder how dependent a person will be on the laser lines. Kind of like a sniper without a scope, probably.
Re:light on the details....
by
mydigitalself
·
· Score: 3, Interesting
my sentiments exactly regarding tutoring. what a fantastic application to have on your basement pool-table so that when you go out "sharking" you really kick some ass.
in terms of the dependance on the laser lines. i would think that maybe a good mechansim for this would be a level of competitance meter. basically, if you are a crap pool player - the lines would stay on the table until you've hit the ball. as you become better, the lines last on the table for a shorter period. this way you can use the lines as a guidance and still use some form of intuition to make the shot.
You surely can't play (and win, natch) a whole game of pool WITHOUT putting some spin on the white to get to the next position you want? e.g. two balls next to each other; you pot the first and use backspin to get position on the next. I know some (OK, US) pool tables have humungous buckets for pockets, but it can't be that easy, can it?
.
-- They will never know the simple pleasure of a monkey knife fight
Re:light on the details....
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 0
it shouldn't make you dependent on the lasers at all. from what i read, the lasers are more of a test than a guide. they describe what you should do.
it's basically a fancy method of doing drills. you could accomplish much of the same thing by drawing on the table with some chalk. the computer piece would ideally figure out what you're doing wrong, coach you on proper technique, and set up shots that will focus on your weaknesses.
How do you impress the babes ...
by
hal9000(jr)
·
· Score: 3, Funny
with your solid knowlege of geometry if the pool table knows more about angles and proper shot alignment than you do.
If your opponent has a lot of balls left on the table, and you have sunk all of yours and then the 8-ball, then you have a high score. Simple as that.:)
If your opponent has a lot of balls left on the table, and you have sunk all of yours and then the 8-ball, then you have a high score. Simple as that.:)
Maybe you and I should play some 9-ball for money:).
-- Never underestimate the bandwidth of a 747 filled with CD-ROMs.
uhhh... there are alot more games than 9 ball, dude. of the "real" competition worthy ones the one that is probably most prevelant is "straight pool". all balls are colorless, 1 pt/ ball sunk, when 1 ball is left on teh table you rerack the other 14. (the idea being that you shoot the last ball and break up the rack at the same time so you have another shot)
Truly good players can easily run (shoot in sequence w/o a miss) 100 balls. 250 will win you some but not all competitions.
If going on the pool table in your local bar is a humiliating experience then help is at hand.
Yes, I hate it when I urinate on the pool table...::blush::.
This reminds me of a Howie Mandell joke. (You know, that guy with the blown-up glove on his head.)
He likes to party, so one night he's at a club, dancing the night away. He literally does not stop dancing all night long, except to drink copious amounts of alcohol. Eventually, many hours later, his friends are amazed at his stamina, drinking skills, and RETENTION skills. They ask him, "Dude, you are amazing! Do you EVER go to the bathroom?"
"Depends."
--
"And like that... he's gone."
Re:Depends?
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 0
When Bob Dole was running for President, he went on MTV and they asked him the old question:
... I actually came up with the idea that this could be done but did not have the drive/money/time to do it. Kudos to these folks! I would love to see their table in action!
As an aside, just as with any other skill, becoming a better pool player takes a little learning from someone who knows and lots of practice. If you want to learn to play pool better join a pool league. In the USA there is a great organization called the American Poolplayers Association (APA) that runs leagues with handicapping systems so that no matter how good or bad you are you have a good chance of winning your match.
Once you have played pool once a week for a year you should notice a huge difference in your game.
I can see where this technology can be adapted to other sports and activities
Golf James : "I've noticed that you've landed in the rough again, would you like some help?"
Baseball James : "I've noticed that you've kicked dirt all over the umpire, would you like some help?"
Football James : "I've noticed that you're the Cincinatti Bengals, would you like some help?"
NASCAR James : "I've noticed that Todd Bodine has once again wrecked half the field, including yourself, and you're about to throw your helmet at his car on national TV, would you like some help?"
Extreme Skier James : "I've noticed that you're tumbling down a snow-covered icy slope with your legs and arms flailing at angles not normally associated with normal movement of the human anatomy, would you like some help?"
When I was a kid a friend of my father's had a pool table in his livingroom. I used to screw around on it. One day the guy showed me something really neat.
He put two balls right next to each other against the far bumper and balanced the 8-ball on top of them. He waleked around to the other end of the table and said "I'll bet you twenty bucks I can sink the eight-ball without touching the other two at all."
(Remember, I was 5:) It looked impossible, so I took the bet. He smiled at me, made his hand into a fist and brought it down on the far end of the pool table as hard as he could. The two support balls slid sideways from the jolt and the eight-ball came gliding down towards the center of the table. He put down his cigarette, picked up his cue and sunk the eight in the corner pocket.
Cheap trick, but very clever. (I still owe him the 20):)
1) Buy pool table. 2) Line up cue to laser guided tutorial system. 3) ??? 4) Pocket!
This is so sad...
by
al701
·
· Score: 4, Interesting
I love pool, comes right up there with computers, sex and food. I love it because it gives me a non-technical escape from my every day. It doesn't involve anything except technology from centurys ago, and a lot of math and physics.
They should just let the game stay as a classic, and not try to always improve on things with lasers and computers and such.
Re:This is so sad...
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 0
You are missing your dream, fool!
You can have sex on a computerized pool table, while eating your favorite meal! Nirvana!
Re:I'd rather something that took the shot I told
by
jbrownc1
·
· Score: 1
Or tell me if the guy I'm playing is a pool shark so forget the "friendly wager just to make things interesting"...
When I was a teenager, my best friend had a really nice table in his basement. By the time I left high school I was actually quite good at the game. But even when I was bad, I wouldn't have wanted a "smart" table. Part of the fun is really bolluxing up what should have been an easy shot, laughing at yourself, and learning how to do it right. The only "smart" table I want is one that knows more games than I do and will always be tabulating the score.
Off topic story now. When I was 16 there was a Danish exchange student in my circle of friends. I wanted her like mad, but hadn't found a way to get past that "good friends" stage. She was hot as all get out, and had an adorable way of mistaking what we were saying and/or not knowing the words, especially the slang. So we're all at my friend's place playing pool, and I just about won a game with an incredible shot on the 8-ball. But instead, the 8 hit the cue a second time, knocking in the cue. I lost, and exclaimed something about how I "double kissed"** it. Danish exchange student says "what's a 'devil kiss'?" Full deadpan, I said "step in that closet over there and I'll show you." She grins and accepts! All our friends' jaws drop, we head in the closet and come out 20 minutes later, breathless. Turns out all the guys knew I wanted her, and all the girls knew she wanted me, so they never said a word. Started a short-lived but highly passionate relationship that was broken up by her exchange parents. And that's my best pool story ever.
**"double-kiss" is when the cue hits the intended ball (in this case the 8) more than one time in a shot.
It was Christianson. Or Kristansen. Or something like that. I wasn't too worried about spelling at that particular moment. Woulda been fun to have inspired it, but I think all I inspired was a lot of legends about me among my friends. Oh, and an obsession with accents that I still can't get over 10 years later. I think I dated every exchange student I met that was even close to attractive for the next 3 years.
Actually, I mean "therefor". Either way is actually correct usage, though the version I used is the more antiquated. I liked the juxtaposition. Check it out if you don't believe me.
http://www.dictionary.com/search?q=therefor
Yea, the machine I grabbed that ping time from was having network troubles. Turned out to be the NIC.:-)
-- been out for 5 years, time to comment again...
magic pool shot?
by
true_majik
·
· Score: 1, Interesting
I'm not some pool expert, but did anybody see the picture on that article giving an explanation on how all that works?
The laser is supposedly showing the path of white ball which seems to me as if it is being hit straight on, then the white ball colides with the yellow ball (ball 1) which takes off at a completely different angle. Should we call this the "magic pool shot?"
Newton's First Law: An object at rest tends to stay at rest and an object in motion tends to stay in motion with the same speed and in the same direction unless acted upon by an unbalanced force.
The acceleration of an object as produced by a net force is directly proportional to the magnitude of the net force, in the same direction as the net force, and inversely proportional to the mass of the object.
Re:magic pool shot?
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 0
er yeah, that's why the lines are straight. Straight as in 'in the same direction'.
its not hit quite straight on. the laser looks to be depicting the path of the cue ball, which is reasonable for this shot. of course it doesnt tell the user that they have to hit a stop shot in order for the cue ball to come off in a perfectly straight line.
The technology behind James, who looks like a professional pool player, is the same Microsoft uses for its paperclip office assistant.>
It looks like you want to hit a ball. Do you want me to...*Ahem* I really don't spend that much time with clippy so anyone want to continue on from there?
If the geniuses at Microsoft had written it, it would have looked more like this:
'This keeps causing an error. Fix it in a patch. If intScore > intHighScore Then
Say("You got a good score buddy!") Else
Say("You suck loser! Go do something productive!") End If
free book on the physics of pool
by
bcrowell
·
· Score: 5, Informative
There's a free book on the physics of pool. Reviews here would be appreciated.
why this wont make you a pool shark
by
PissedOffGuy
·
· Score: 3, Insightful
it may help a beginner who doesnt know the angles yet, but any decent player can tell you that you also have to know exactly where to hit the cue ball.
in the technical description it says this is designed for two-ball practice scenarios where you sink a ball and leave the cue ball in a particular spot. however in a real game, putting the cue ball where you want it will often require follow (topspin), draw (bottomspin), or left/right spin as well. the one picture of the laser path of the cue ball going off in a straight line doesnt quite match the reality where the cue ball's path is parabolic until it stops sliding on the table and begins rolling.
anyway, what separates the good players from the average is cue ball control and strategy, and strategy isn't covered by this machine so it'll still take practice, practice, practice to get better.
This smart table calculates the angles, but the game of pool is about a LOT more than the angles. Or maybe I should say that there is a lot more to the angles than just straight geometry. For example, most people don't realize that if you spin the cue ball (whether on accident or on purpose) then the ball the cue ball strikes will pop off the cue ball at a different angle than if there was no spin on the cue ball. It is extremely difficult to put NO spin on the ball, and most players purposely spin the cue. It's just that the good players know how to re-calculate the angles needed based on what spin they are using. anyway, this table seems like a big waste, but i guess in the end it's just a pool table.
Correct, there are also a lot of other factors involved. You could be an "expert" player on your table at home and be an "average" player at the "pub". I play every Tuesday in a local 8-ball league and I can tell you what bars have better tables, etc... As the "felt" wears out it becomes "slippery", as the cushions get old they become either dry/hard or "mushy". This all affects ball dynamics and is something that takes time to adapt to. Better players can adapt within a game, others take too long to adapt (or aren't good enough to notice the difference) and lose matches because of it. "Mastering" pool techniques on a particular table won't help you "in the real world". It should, however, teach you enough to become a decent player. The rest comes with experience, as does everything else in life...
Getting hustled by the table...
by
billstewart
·
· Score: 2, Funny
Great, just what we need. The pool table automated assistant James suggests you try the shot and draws little laser pictures about how easy it will be for you to make it. It's worked the last 10 times, but this time you've gotten overconfident on your betting abilities, and the table has just hustled your wallet.
In poker, they say the first thing you should do is look around the table and find the sucker, and if you can't find them, then it's you. Now you've got the *table* playing against you....
--
Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
And never lie down with a woman who's got more troubles than you...
A better usage of lasers
by
goodchef
·
· Score: 2, Insightful
Anyone who's played pool even a little knows what the best shots are, the tricky part is being able to cause that to happen. So I think a better usage would be to have the pool table use rangefinding to determine how you're holding the cue stick, and display where that will make the balls end up. Then you'd be able to adjust your stance & position and see the new results in real time. This would be much more beneficial for learning. After all, any idiot can say "You should hit that ball there." I doubt there's a bar or pool hall anywhere that doesn't already have several of these helpful "experts".
--
"Inflammable means flammable? What a strange country!" -Dr. Nick, The Simpsons
taking aim after my fifth guiness, why is my laser three feet wide?
/haiku
-- This space for rent.
improving your game - personal experience
by
tqft
·
· Score: 2, Insightful
I was an OK player but did not waster as much of my youth as my brothers.
So to improve:
1) take money
2) play for money - $5/game or drinks
Funny how fat you improve real fast when real cash is at stake
Aw, I was expecting a pool table with an aim proxy.
That would be neat. A bit of metal in each ball, and small electromagnets under the table. Subtle control, so that no trajectory changes by more than 2% or so.
Using the overhead TV camera, the control system could make accurate course corrections.
Re:Nice work, assholes
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 0
To the mod that moderated this offtopic: I have meta-modded you unfair.. This means that you have less of a chance to moderate in the future. Please learn to read either the article, the context, or the moderator guidelines.
Feel free to contact me (flames about my english and the useless of this driver will be redirected to/dev/null, oh no, it's full...).
-- Michael Beck, describing the PC-speaker sound device
- this post brought to you by the Automated Last Post Generator...
Slashdot Mirror
The technology behind James, who looks like a professional pool player, is the same Microsoft uses for its paperclip office assistant.
Uh oh, Clippy has invaded pool tables
...sadly, I think it was in an episode of Quantum Leap, where Dean Stockwell used his handheld computer to calculate the angles.
Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.
'The technology behind James, who looks like a professional pool player, is the same Microsoft uses for its paperclip office assistant. '
"It looks like you're trying to pot the black, would you like help?"
Great.
"Never play pool with a man named after a state."
Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.
One of the neatest and most practical shots in pool is the stop shot.
When the cue ball is very close to the object ball, this can be accomplished with the center ball. The cue ball slides to the object ball and stops dead as the object ball shoots ahead because of the collision. But most stop shots are done with draw. You use just enough draw that the cue ball stops sliding just as it strikes the object ball.
Of course, all of this may sound difficult to judge, but it is fairly easy with practice. You soon learn to adjust your speed and amount of draw, depending on the shot (distance and other requirements of the pool situation).
(Twelve drinks and 1/2K*M*V^2 later and you may find yourself with some extra $$$ and a few pool sluts to walk you home to your bedroom that night!)
Department of Physics and Atmospheric Science, Dalhousie University, Halifax, N.S., Canada, B3H 3J5
I sometimes wonder how news travels nowadays... a slashdot article quotes a BBC article quoting a newscientist article...
Boring Old Fart (40, married, 3 kids...er no...make that 49, married, 3 grown up kids...it's been a long time)
It looks like you're trying to pot the '8' ball. Would you like me to:
( ) Show you the angle
( ) Pot it for you
( o ) Shut the hell up
My definition about a smart pool table: 1) Knows not to make smart alec comments like "Whoops" just when you're making that crucial shot to win the game. 2) Doesn't "eat" your money and give you no balls 3) Doesn't take your money and give you all the balls except one 4) Actually has chalk you don't have to pay for - say on a piece of string 5) Doesn't charge you ridiculous amounts for a game 6) Is too smart to be in a pub 7) Has recently submitted a phD thesis on game theory
Video Game cheats, hints a
"People do not speak to pool tables so we came up with this personalised system and people are happy to talk to him," explained Mr Larsen.
Uh, I never needed an AI assistant to speak to a pool table, but the number of curses you can apply to an inanimate object are limited. Kudos to them for offering a target for my rage and frustration.
That's not a soda... it's a caffeine delivery device!
My definition about a smart pool table:
1) Knows not to make smart alec comments like "Whoops" just when you're making that crucial shot to win the game.
2) Doesn't "eat" your money and give you no balls
3) Doesn't take your money and give you all the balls except one.
4) Actually has chalk you don't have to pay for - say on a piece of string.
5) Doesn't charge you ridiculous amounts for a game.
6) Is too smart to be in a pub.
7) Has recently submitted a phD thesis on game theory.
8) Reminds you when you've left out linebreaks posting to slashdot.
All this "laser" business reminds me of an old episode of Quantum Leap.
Video Game cheats, hints a
I hope the people who have the slanted pool tables at the carnival don't find out about this! Think of the implications!!
Well, it looks like I watched Donald in Mathmagic Land for nothing.
Bort.
Free, Anonymous surfing: Pagewash.com.
What exactly does that mean - and surely they could have come up with a better example...
I'm assuming that they mean that they use bayesian networks to help in their decision making about what type of shot the player is trying to make?
heck, thinking about it, I just cant see how that would work
Perhaps they just mean they have a picture of james (as it shows in the slide show and thats what is similar to clippy...
I can see the angles, dammit! The hard part is getting the damned stick thing to poke the damned round white thing into the other round things at the angle I can see, without going down a damned hole thing, getting airborne, or knocking the damned round black thing down a damned hole thing!!!
The agent "James" is based on the Microsoft Agents technology in their thesis
wonder how much the license will be to play pool on this thing?
I wonder if it will just calculate angle shots, or if it considers more complex shots like ones involving English or combo-shot situations in 9 ball.
Sounds like a good tutoring system nonetheless, but I also wonder how dependent a person will be on the laser lines. Kind of like a sniper without a scope, probably.
Need to get away?
Adirondack Vacations
with your solid knowlege of geometry if the pool table knows more about angles and proper shot alignment than you do.
I hate Slashdot. less than 50 replies and someone already beat me to the punchline!
All I could think when I read the article was "Clippy + Pool Cue = Long Time Coming"
I've got a bad attitude and karma to burn. Go ahead. Mod me down.
The first correction the pool table should make to your form is to berate you relentlessly if you even ask or attempt to use a Bridge for any shots.
A putter for Rodney Dangerfield.
is one that will go get me a beer right before I want one.
"There's no such thing as a fluke shot in pool. It's just an oversight in the calculations."
Despite the hypocrisy, made glaringly obvious by his proficiency at the game, my dad loved to quote Mark Twain whenever the subject of pool came up:
"Proficiency at billiards is sign of a mis-spent youth."
So, does this project mean that I can possibly cite all of my college evenings as research?
It can call us Betty!
(mangled Quantam Leap/Paul Simon reference)
Face it, people are stupid, and the internet is the place where they all meet.
How many people didn't read any of the links and went straight for the java pool game???
sweet. me too.
Eeeasssssyyy buddy.... Put doowwwnnn the pool cue...
my religion lies somewhere between buddhism and super monkey ball - pamphlet?
"He congratulates you if you get a high score," said Mr Larsen.
Since when is there a "high score" in 9-ball?
If going on the pool table in your local bar is a humiliating experience then help is at hand.
::blush::.
Yes, I hate it when I urinate on the pool table...
This reminds me of a Howie Mandell joke. (You know, that guy with the blown-up glove on his head.)
He likes to party, so one night he's at a club, dancing the night away. He literally does not stop dancing all night long, except to drink copious amounts of alcohol. Eventually, many hours later, his friends are amazed at his stamina, drinking skills, and RETENTION skills. They ask him, "Dude, you are amazing! Do you EVER go to the bathroom?"
"Depends."
"And like that
... I actually came up with the idea that this could be done but did not have the drive/money/time to do it. Kudos to these folks! I would love to see their table in action!
As an aside, just as with any other skill, becoming a better pool player takes a little learning from someone who knows and lots of practice. If you want to learn to play pool better join a pool league. In the USA there is a great organization called the American Poolplayers Association (APA) that runs leagues with handicapping systems so that no matter how good or bad you are you have a good chance of winning your match.
Once you have played pool once a week for a year you should notice a huge difference in your game.
42 - So long and thanks for all the fish.
I can see where this technology can be adapted to other sports and activities
Golf James : "I've noticed that you've landed in the rough again, would you like some help?"
Baseball James : "I've noticed that you've kicked dirt all over the umpire, would you like some help?"
Football James : "I've noticed that you're the Cincinatti Bengals, would you like some help?"
NASCAR James : "I've noticed that Todd Bodine has once again wrecked half the field, including yourself, and you're about to throw your helmet at his car on national TV, would you like some help?"
Extreme Skier James : "I've noticed that you're tumbling down a snow-covered icy slope with your legs and arms flailing at angles not normally associated with normal movement of the human anatomy, would you like some help?"
Create your own, share and trade with friends!
When I was a kid a friend of my father's had a pool table in his livingroom. I used to screw around on it. One day the guy showed me something really neat.
:) It looked impossible, so I took the bet. He smiled at me, made his hand into a fist and brought it down on the far end of the pool table as hard as he could. The two support balls slid sideways from the jolt and the eight-ball came gliding down towards the center of the table. He put down his cigarette, picked up his cue and sunk the eight in the corner pocket.
:)
He put two balls right next to each other against the far bumper and balanced the 8-ball on top of them. He waleked around to the other end of the table and said "I'll bet you twenty bucks I can sink the eight-ball without touching the other two at all."
(Remember, I was 5
Cheap trick, but very clever. (I still owe him the 20)
Triv
1) Buy pool table.
2) Line up cue to laser guided tutorial system.
3) ???
4) Pocket!
I love pool, comes right up there with computers, sex and food. I love it because it gives me a non-technical escape from my every day. It doesn't involve anything except technology from centurys ago, and a lot of math and physics. They should just let the game stay as a classic, and not try to always improve on things with lasers and computers and such.
Or tell me if the guy I'm playing is a pool shark so forget the "friendly wager just to make things interesting"...
Off topic story now. When I was 16 there was a Danish exchange student in my circle of friends. I wanted her like mad, but hadn't found a way to get past that "good friends" stage. She was hot as all get out, and had an adorable way of mistaking what we were saying and/or not knowing the words, especially the slang. So we're all at my friend's place playing pool, and I just about won a game with an incredible shot on the 8-ball. But instead, the 8 hit the cue a second time, knocking in the cue. I lost, and exclaimed something about how I "double kissed"** it. Danish exchange student says "what's a 'devil kiss'?" Full deadpan, I said "step in that closet over there and I'll show you." She grins and accepts! All our friends' jaws drop, we head in the closet and come out 20 minutes later, breathless. Turns out all the guys knew I wanted her, and all the girls knew she wanted me, so they never said a word. Started a short-lived but highly passionate relationship that was broken up by her exchange parents. And that's my best pool story ever.
**"double-kiss" is when the cue hits the intended ball (in this case the 8) more than one time in a shot.
been out for 5 years, time to comment again...
The laser is supposedly showing the path of white ball which seems to me as if it is being hit straight on, then the white ball colides with the yellow ball (ball 1) which takes off at a completely different angle. Should we call this the "magic pool shot?"
Newton's First Law: An object at rest tends to stay at rest and an object in motion tends to stay in motion with the same speed and in the same direction unless acted upon by an unbalanced force.
The real physics[PDF] behind pool. This is much more stimulating than the "physics link" posted in the story.
The technology behind James, who looks like a professional pool player, is the same Microsoft uses for its paperclip office assistant.>
It looks like you want to hit a ball. Do you want me to...*Ahem* I really don't spend that much time with clippy so anyone want to continue on from there?
He is also more encouraging than your mates down the pub.
"He congratulates you if you get a high score," said Mr Larsen.
Wow, that is some *sweet* technology. It will congratulates you if you get a high score.I wonder how long it took the geniuses at Microsoft to write that code.
Mad Software: Rantings on Developing So
There's a free book on the physics of pool. Reviews here would be appreciated.
Find free books.
it may help a beginner who doesnt know the angles yet, but any decent player can tell you that you also have to know exactly where to hit the cue ball.
in the technical description it says this is designed for two-ball practice scenarios where you sink a ball and leave the cue ball in a particular spot. however in a real game, putting the cue ball where you want it will often require follow (topspin), draw (bottomspin), or left/right spin as well. the one picture of the laser path of the cue ball going off in a straight line doesnt quite match the reality where the cue ball's path is parabolic until it stops sliding on the table and begins rolling.
anyway, what separates the good players from the average is cue ball control and strategy, and strategy isn't covered by this machine so it'll still take practice, practice, practice to get better.
This smart table calculates the angles, but the game of pool is about a LOT more than the angles. Or maybe I should say that there is a lot more to the angles than just straight geometry. For example, most people don't realize that if you spin the cue ball (whether on accident or on purpose) then the ball the cue ball strikes will pop off the cue ball at a different angle than if there was no spin on the cue ball. It is extremely difficult to put NO spin on the ball, and most players purposely spin the cue. It's just that the good players know how to re-calculate the angles needed based on what spin they are using.
anyway, this table seems like a big waste, but i guess in the end it's just a pool table.
In poker, they say the first thing you should do is look around the table and find the sucker, and if you can't find them, then it's you. Now you've got the *table* playing against you....
Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
Never eat at a place called Mom's.
Never play cards with a man called Doc.
And never lie down with a woman who's got more troubles than you...
Anyone who's played pool even a little knows what the best shots are, the tricky part is being able to cause that to happen. So I think a better usage would be to have the pool table use rangefinding to determine how you're holding the cue stick, and display where that will make the balls end up. Then you'd be able to adjust your stance & position and see the new results in real time. This would be much more beneficial for learning. After all, any idiot can say "You should hit that ball there." I doubt there's a bar or pool hall anywhere that doesn't already have several of these helpful "experts".
"Inflammable means flammable? What a strange country!" -Dr. Nick, The Simpsons
Get your Fats straight! Heh.
"Computer, please give me laser coordinates for the single women at this bar . . . "
hi, I like pancakes -.-- -.-- --..
haiku
/haiku
taking aim after
my fifth guiness, why is my
laser three feet wide?
This space for rent.
I was an OK player but did not waster as much of my youth as my brothers. So to improve: 1) take money 2) play for money - $5/game or drinks Funny how fat you improve real fast when real cash is at stake
The Singularity is closer than you think
Quant
...the Smart Pool Table is 11% better than the utterly stupid, useless, feltless Pool Table.
Eh?
"It's a tarp!" -- Dyslexic Admiral Ackbar
Tony Jebara of Columbia University devised a wearable computer to assist in planning shots: http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~jebara/stochasticks.ht ml
That would be neat. A bit of metal in each ball, and small electromagnets under the table. Subtle control, so that no trajectory changes by more than 2% or so. Using the overhead TV camera, the control system could make accurate course corrections.
To the mod that moderated this offtopic: I have meta-modded you unfair.. This means that you have less of a chance to moderate in the future. Please learn to read either the article, the context, or the moderator guidelines.
Anonymous MetaMod
Feel free to contact me (flames about my english and the useless of this /dev/null, oh no, it's full...).
driver will be redirected to
-- Michael Beck, describing the PC-speaker sound device
- this post brought to you by the Automated Last Post Generator...