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The Ethics of Desktop Chips Stuffed Into Laptop PCs
squareBIT writes "I recently found this article on THG about my SmartStep 250N having a desktop CPU stuffed into it. That's all fine and dandy. but when I paid for this thing, nobody told me it would run at HALF SPEED in battery mode. I don't recall there being any mention of this before I handed them thousands of dollars. Shouldn't there be some sort ethical ramifications put into action here? I feel so dirty ..." The least-satisfactory computer I've ever owned (won't even boot now) is a Toshiba with just such a chip -- wish I'd asked about that in the store.
If the manufacturer and/or retailer is not going to take the responsibility and state things like this up front, then it's up to the consumers (us) to spread the word to each other in whatever way we can. Forums like Slashdot should go a long way towards educating the general public, and enlightening potential buyers. If "they're" not going to do it, we will...
Palaces, barricades, threats, meet promises
If I spend $50 on something I want to know exactly what I'm getting. If you spend $2000, and are this unimformed than you deserve what you get. You must not have read the specs very closely, or compared it with other models, or read many reviews. I guess you won't make the same mistake twice.
1. It is called SmartStep. That should have been a major clue.
2. Common sense would tell you that a desktop processor running at full speed would drain a battery far too quickly.
Slashdotter are stupid and biased.
I don't see why you would need it to run at the full speed on battery anyway. If you're doing something CPU-intensive enough to need the full speed of the chip, then you can almost certainly plug it in; for most other things, half speed is more than enough and doesn't even get noticed. It's not like you're only running with half the RAM active or something like that.
In fact, you mentioned that you saw it on THG. Did you notice it at all yourself when using the laptop? Or did it run just as well, and you just like getting offended at these sort of things (which seems like exactly what you're doing here).
This has been a test. Had this been a real emergency, we would have fled in terror and you would not have been informed.
This is a clear explanation of SpeedStep, it says as clear as day "You 500 mhz chip will operate at 300 mhz speeds"
I don't mean to give anyone a hard time but if you are going to spend more than $100 (or 0x64 dollars for that stupid hex guy) you would save a lot of aggrevation by doing some research.
In the future, I would want to not be isolated from my friends in the Space Station.
Laptops are "portable" computers, but not really "mobile". The distinction, as I see it, lies in the fact that even with a fully charged batteries, many laptops don't give very useful operating times unless you're plugged in to an AC outlet.
Assuming you can find an outlet wherever you're likely to want to use your PC, laptops can be a decent choice. But without access to an AC outlet, you're not going to find a laptop to be useful for more than 30-40 minutes or so.
I can't tell you how many times I've had my laptop just shut down with no warning because the AC cable was loose and I didn't notice, and I'd only been using the computer for maybe 20-30 minutes.
So that's why I say a laptop is portable, but not mobile. You can't really go that far with one while it's umbilical is plugged in, so it's not really fair to call a laptop mobile.
And, if you're going to be plugged in 90% + of the time you're using it, then you're not going to have to deal with the reduced performance issue anyway.
You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
What if the Car had a sticker on it that said V8.
Most end users aren't going to do research on the internet before they purchase a computer, they are going to go into the local computer store and buy one. If that laptop that they buy says it runs at one speed, but then doesn't, they're getting screwed, and it's not their fault because they didn't do research, it's false advertising.
I dunno, it seems that the parent poster didn't read the article. From THG:
Even more annoying is the fact that Dell documents this energy-saving feature neither on its German- language homepage nor anywhere in the handbook. The English homepage, in the meantime, features a footnote: "Power management features limit processor speed when running on battery." This is pretty well hidden, however.
So right off the top, if you're German, then Dell isn't even going to tell you that they're selling you a desktop processor that's automatically crippled when running on battery. If you're English-speaking, then you still have to have very good eyes. The "power management features" quote is buried in a fine-print footnote at the bottom of the technical specs page. Further, nowhere on the pages for the Speedstep 250N is the actual slower clock speed noted. At what point is the footnote no longer sufficient? On battery power, the processor drops to 0.7 volts and 300 MHz. Can I complain yet? I'm getting great battery life, after all...
The parent poster is correct--when making a major purchase, it is a good idea to read product reviews. What we have here, however, is a case of deliberately deceptive (and possibly fraudulent) marketing. It's like advertising an automobile as a V8--but four of the cylinders stop firing whenever you're not in your driveway. If Dell is going to advertise a 2.2 GHz notebook, then it should be able to function as a 2.2 GHz notebook even when it's not on my desk at home. Dell should reasonably be expected to realize that their notebook computers are going to frequently be used on battery power--the clock speeds cited should be 2.4/1.2 GHz at the top of the page, not 2.2 GHz with a tiny footnote. Anything less--even if barely legal--is still slimy.
As an aside, many Toshiba and Compaq laptops allow you to change a control panel setting to say, "Damn the batteries, full speed ahead!" or words to that effect. Consumers familiar with this friendlier incarnation of SpeedStep may be in for a rude surprise.
~Idarubicin
While I can not generally say I know better than all owners, I can generally say that I know better than any person who: 1) Did not research his purchase enough to discover this feature before hand. 2) Does not see that in 99% of the cases, it is a HUGE benefit instead of the rather minor problem. 3) Considering how unusual and rare their computational needs are, did not go out of his way to make sure they got what they needed, instead of what was standard.
excitingthingstodo.blogspot.com
So by your logic you wouldn't mind if I sold you aa computer that was advertised at 2.2 gHz but that was permanently and unalterably (at least w/o doing warranty-voiding and probably difficult alterations) underclocked to 2 mHz? After all, I didn't lie to you; it has a 2.2 gHz processor in it. I mean, I kind of doubt you ask "yes, it has a 2.2 gHz processor, but does it RUN at 2.2 gHz?" when you're ordering.
Our local Fry's is selling these things under the brand QuickNote. We bought two of them for customer visits to our co. and we may get a few more. It has an AMD desktop 1Ghz cpu in it with a massive heatpipe -> a copper radiator like structure. Amazing looking. It has NO battery. Don't let the A/C cord fall out! It has WindowsXP home prebundled. Uses DDR PC2100 memory (128Meg of which windows only see's 96, must be the AGP screen buffer eats the other 32Mb). Think about that price for a moment... XP alone is like $100 to an OEM (or is it?...)
Also the unit has a warning on it that the feet must be in the down position, tilting the case off the flat so that airflow can move to the radiator.
I had heard when the P4 came out, Taiwan Inc figured out how to duct the heat out of a desktop cpu based notebook so they could be the first to offer a P4 notebook.
Hedley
Comment removed based on user account deletion
>>Second, this *isn't* "unalterably" modified. Not by any means. All you have to do is plug it into a wall outlet and its how it was advertised.
OK, I'll buy it. Oh wait, planes don't have outlets...
I don't know about you, but if I buy a laptop it's so I can use it places where you can't have a desktop. In a car, in a plane, out on the campus quad, constantly walking around, etc. So let me admend my statement: It will run at full speed, but only when connected to an uninterruptable power supply that is the computer's sole source of power. That is roughly analogous to my use of a plugged-in laptop.
I'd also like to say that your HDD manufacturer analogy is false. There is a well-known and accepted standard for what kilo-, mega-, giga-, etc. means. Only in computers will you find that kilo- isn't 1000 and giga- isn't 1 billion. Here, in my mind, it's the places where kilo- is used as 1024 that's wrong (in a factual, not a moral, sense).
On the other hand, if I say "here's a computer with a 2.2 GHz processor", there should be no reason to believe it runs otherwise unless it is *explicitly* stated. Dell's site does have the info, but it's not even on the main ordering page; you have to click "Learn more", then on the "Details" tab, then read a footnote before there's any mention that it runs slower. That doesn't classify as reasonable notice in my book. There's no mention on the main page that the chip will act any differently than normal.
It's as if you're buying a car that will only exceed 25 mph every other day (so you're less likely to be hurt in a crash), but this information isn't even hinted at unless you explicitly request detailed information on the engine. Now, there are some people who would request specific information on the engine, and if this was my first car buy, I would too. But let's say you've bought very similar cars from the same company (or even similar cars from different companies, but those cars are made form the same parts) on multiple occasions. Eventually you stop looking at the detailed specs, especially because they are not much more informative than what you can get from the main page. (The detailed view regularily only provides three useful pieces of information no present on the main page: the BUS speed, the L2 cache, and if it has SIMD extensions.) Your prior experience is that the detailed specs are almost worthless. I would argue that the dealer was negligant in informing you of an aspect of the car that would otherwise be completely unexpected.