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The World's Largest Scavenger Hunt
illuminatedwax writes "Every spring, University of Chicago students attempt to cast off their bookish tendencies and hold the world's largest scavenger hunt. Now, the event has been filmed by the student film group, Fire Escape, as a documentary, and is being sold on DVD and VHS from Periphrastic Films. The film follows the various teams and their effort to procure the off-the-wall 300+ items. For those who haven't heard of the University of Chicago Scav Hunt, its biggest claim to fame is from the 1999 hunt, when
students built a working breeder reactor. Items during the 2002 Scav Hunt featured in the film include "Passports stamped by all three axes of evil", building "terrorist base camps" on the University quads, and students competing in a game show-style contest, featuring a DDR contest, and trivia like "Digits of Pi" and "Taylor Series." The Scav Hunt lists can be found here, and the 2002 list here."
221. Slick looking Linux Interface
222. A secure Windows Web Server
223. A geek with a girlfriend
224. A slashdot firstpost
"This isn't a study in computer science, its a study in human behavior"
Hahaha Great stuff "Take a lap around the block in Greektown with your brand new ``Red Wings Suck, Yzerman Swallows'' t-shirt. Lettering should be in clearly legible bold letters at least 4" in height. [78 points]" "Stand on top of the big JEEP with your top down. [23 points]" We should all wait around and see which way the women interperate that :)
Wow, something about my school! Nice :)
In case you don't know, Chicago can get a bit depressing in the Winter. The University does a bit to alleviate that, including giving us a day off in the middle of Winter quarter. Well, if Winter is depressing, then Spring is freedom. It gets warm, you take easy classes...it starts to feel like a real college.
Scav Hunt is basically a four-day long party. You stay up late, skip classes, wine and dine the judges, throw a massive party in the middle of the quad, and go on cross-country trips. I think this film is a great treatment of a really unique experience, something you can only really do at University of Chicago.
... more fun than finals.
You'd think UC students would be too busy to play DDR, or is that hope? It seems no campus is safe from this geeky scourge.
---- El diablo esta en mis pantalones! Mire, mire!
Couldn't they have made A LOT more money by selling the video to one of the networks to for yet another reality tv show? Or is it not about the money, but sharing the fun?
What Would Satan Do?
was an endangered species. How come they are hunting them?
11. Prizes. Prizes are money. And a trophy, apparently.
So I wonder how much money?Sex - Find It
I go to university of chicago but I have no idea how to join this. Is it just for students or what are the rules?
So umm, any one team get the Nuclear Reactor AND passports with stamps from the 3 "Axis of Evil" nations?
yea yeah, two different hunts i know, but still!
That really doesn't sound that tough. How difficult is it to fly to...
- One)
- Two)
- Three)
Oh, wait. They must be referencing the President's State of the Union address. My bad...1330 Connecticut Avenue N.W., Suite 300
Washington, D.C. 20036
15503 Ventura Blvd.
Encino, California 91436
and
One Microsoft Way
Redmond, WA 98052-6399
My legal education, in nifty podcast format
when students built a working breeder reactor.
According to the article, they build a "working nuclear reactor", an fairly easy task if you know how, not a "working breeder reactor", a very complicated task requiring multi-million dollar processing plants and weapons grade plutonium.
"So, Mike, now that you're at the Tribune have you changed anything?"
"Only my socks."
The year they ran this commercial we put his socks on the list, figuring it was a good gag for one year. Royko, however, was really mean to the first group to ask him for his socks and printed a column berating the Scavenger Hunt and the U of C.
That's all it took. Pretty much until he died, Mike Royko's socks were on the list, guaranteeing he'd be bothered by geeks every year.
the major advances in civilization are processes which all but wreck the societies in which they occur - A.N. White
Gee, and people jump on me for putting up bad links.. Nice rotten.com picture.
Chenguin site
:wq
DUde. WHat the hell happend to stealing street signs. Shouldnt this be one of the primary signs that a scavenger hunt needs to be toned down?
150. a rubber duck
151. a watermellon
152. a hommemade nuclear reactor
153. a sample of the china syndrome in progress
154. george bush
All Troll + "offtopic" mods are meta moderated as "Unfair", because you abused the system.
on a TiVO remote?
"Hardly used" will not fetch you a better price for your brain.
Anyone care to grab the text from the new york times article, I'm feeling too uncreative to lie to them on their form, and too lazy to remember their stupid password.
Peace in the Middle East ... 2 points!
I was on one of the top teams(Pierce) for my first three years, and a cameraman for the documentary this past year. Scav Hunt is one of the most enjoyable things I've ever had the luck to be part of. Four and a half days of caffeine, power tools, lewd behavior, and insanity.
Examples:
The above-mentioned breeder reactor. A bunch of advanced physics students cobbled, jury-rigged, and "borrowed" the necessary components. It was of the type used to make medical radio-isotopes, and therefore didn't receive full points, but it was real and scary as hell. The builders were known for wanting to build their own high-energy weapons for personal use.
"Fisher-Price Baby's First Flamethrower", a device that had to appeal to children and be operable by a three-year old. I'm quite proud of my work on that. Somewhere, we have the photos of that thing shooting out gouts of flame like a scene from a WW2 movie.
Sharlene, our "Chewing Gum Cannon". A device to launch a kilo of chewed gum. Points for distance and shortest time to launch. We used shells and produced a mortar with a range of 75 yards, easy.
A simulated air strike on Slobodan Milosevic. Involved more fireworks going off at one time than I ever want to see again. I have adrenalin-imprinted memories of running very fast in the opposite direction from the initial blast crater, roman candles scorching the air as they passed my head. The cops showed up and laughed until they had tears streaming down their faces.
If you're ever in Chicago on Mother's Day(the Day of Judgment every year), head down to the University to see what's been built/found/destroyed.
Ew, books!
Is Moacir still judging? Hasn't he flew off to be one with David Foster Wallace yet?
...a boy scout built a working breeder from junk he scrounged (for a merit badge no less!); why not two physics majors?
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored. - Aldous Huxley
This really is quite an experience. My fondest memory is running around the Harrah's East Casino in Gary, Indiana looking for "petri from Harrah's". Got a High Roller card out of it. FYI, it was a pet rock, not a dish for fungus-growing. Go Snell-Hitchcock!
Scavenger hunt finds YOU.
(p.s. don't forget lovely Maryland...)
...are they sure that there is only one sniper (and he's not really a lotm a rather annoyed NRA whose members are bored with how little they can use their rifles?)
of {he,she,politically-correct-second-person}'s
fro
Just a thought.
#75 is find an alfred or jeeves at Butler University...didn't think that there were any here but according to the noc list (the webmail addy book that conatins all students and faculty)...there are no jeeves here...but there are 3 alfreds here at this wonderful campus in indiana
[echelon]
On Campus; It's that season at Chicago, and Ph.D.'s have taken a back seat to a degree of silliness.
By Andrew Bluth
''People think of the University of Chicago and they think the students are weird,'' says Tom Howe, a junior from Atlanta. Having taken off his chicken suit, he is wearing a cardboard crown from a Burger King Kid's Meal. ''We want to show that intellectual doesn't necessarily mean stuffy.''
It is this philosophy -- that Chicago students can have fun if they really put their minds to it -- that gave birth to the University of Chicago Scavenger Hunt, a yearly celebration of looniness at a campus far better known for its Nobel laureates.
Putting aside term papers for a long weekend, hundreds of undergraduates in teams representing dormitories and student organizations range around the campus -- and, this year, the North American continent -- in search of items that will never be found in a course catalogue. The grand prize is $500, but the goal, says Mr. Howe, is loftier: ''to make the participants maximize their intellectual creativity.''
These were among the 339 items on the list for this year's scavenger hunt, released at the stroke of midnight on May 6:
No. 123: A computer suffering a year 2000 problem.
No. 262: Five Mensa membership cards.
No. 167: A 15-foot-tall monument to Grimace, the McDonald's Happy Meal character.
No. 40: A tenured professor willing to recite profane lyrics from a gangsta rap song.
Each team works from an identical list; items are assigned points, based on difficulty, and the team with the most points by Sunday afternoon is the winner. The wording of certain clues often suggests a trip to a far-flung destination -- having a team member photographed with an Ontario police officer, for instance.
Teams are often elaborately organized, with ''page masters'' assigned to each page of the list and at least one person operating a computer long after midnight in search of Web sites that will lead the team to cubic zirconia (20 points) or Chicago Bulls season tickets (15 points) or an autographed photograph of the Food Network star Jacqui Malouf (30 points).
''One of the items on the list was the 'street value of Mount Everest,' '' said Sam Hunt, a freshman competing for his dorm, Shoreland Hall. ''So we posted it on Ebay, and made it look pretty, with a nice picture of the mountain and everything. The bidding got up to $180 before we got kicked off the site.''
The Shoreland team is run out of sixth-floor dormitory room of its captain, Ryan Miller. By the end of the weekend, Thai food containers litter the floor and at least three trash cans are overflowing with empty soda cans. The members have slept little if at all, and the room is a nest of cables that wire no fewer than six personal computers.
When the phone rings, it is answered with a curt ''Command central'' and calls are kept short so that the line can be free for a check-in from the road-trip group, probably somewhere in Canada.
''From what we can gather, the road-trip team is doing really well,'' Mr. Miller says. ''Except last time they checked in, they sounded drunk.''
Other items on this year's list included building a nuclear reactor from scratch (one team was actually successful -- this is the University of Chicago, after all), an edible iMac computer and a ticket to a local theater for a certain movie opening May 19. (To these students, the date needs no further explanation.)
No one is really sure how or when the scavenger hunt began, but they do know it is a welcome break from economics exams and Shakespeare papers -- a way to demonstrate, in Mr. Howe's words, that ''we actually can have fun on this campus.''
And how do you say fun on a college campus better than a keg toss? As part of the Scavolympics, a string of a dozen events before the final judging that teams compete for points in, all 13 teams came together to recreate a battle of the Civil War, to demonstrate a fight between Aunt Jemima and Mrs. Butterworth, and, yes, to toss a keg.
Competing for his dorm, Hitchcock-Snell, 23-year-old Niyi Omojola, after minutes earlier winning the competition that called for contestants to eat an entire bottle of squeeze cheese, won the keg toss. While others had grabbed the kegs with two hands, taken a few steps and heaved, he held it with one hand, arm extended, and spun around like a discus thrower, propelling the keg beyond the other teams' markers.
''I was trying to get some torque,'' said Mr. Omojola, a junior. ''If you can direct that torque in a straight line, you can throw it pretty far. People were trying to muscle it, and that's not going to work.''
And if you can't say fun at the U. of C., with a little torque and a keg toss, certainly you can with a nuclear reactor.
Two physics majors, Justin Kasper and Fred Niell, gathered up some spare junk from their physics labs and dorm rooms and built a plutonium-producing reactor.
''It's kind of scary how easy it was to do,'' said Mr. Niell, assuring onlookers that there was only a trace of plutonium -- nothing harmful. ''It only took us about a day to build it. We've been thinking about it for a few days and we gathered the parts, and last night we assembled it. In Justin's room -- he lost the coin toss.''
The makes me all the more sure in my belief that my children had better get a damned fine scholarship, because there is no way in hell I'm paying 20k a year for my kid to do this, and drink beer through a funnel. I did all this at my local community college for 13 bucks a unit, thanks.
"Inattention makes clowns of us all" -Bean
I have a wife, dose that count?
I'm a grad student at Caltech. Am I eligible? And can I wear a "Kobe sucks Shaq's pencildi*k" T-shirt through Compton instead of the Yzerman t-shirt?
-Looking for a job as a materials chemist or multivariat
The part about Greektown is referring to the traditionally Greek neighborhood in Chicago (think of it as the Greek equivalent of Chinatown). Sure you may have gone to the U of C but I guess you didn't get around Chicago if you didn't know that. FYI, it's a few blocks on the West Loop in Chicago.
"When you sit with a nice girl for two hours, it seems like two minutes. When you sit on a hot stove for two minutes, it
I wish I could see this
Theonlyuse of monkeys is to testthings onthem.Some peoplemay say"Hey That'scruel!"and myresponse is"I don't like monkeys
271. Have a member of the US Congress wish your team best of luck in the ``antient and honorable Scavenger Hunt at the University of Chicago'' on the floor of the House. [435 points. 100 bonus points for a Senator. 50 bonus points for getting both a Republican and Democrat. 100 bonus points for getting Tom Daschle and Trent Lott, or Hillary and Strom to do it]
Unfortunately, no senators, but...
This item can be found in the Congressional Record (available at http://thomas.loc.gov). Search for "scavenger hunt" and "University of Chicago"
For me to poop on!
FYI - read the link before you click it.
Elf with ears and sword not last long in gulag!
323. ... [150 points]
324. Profit! [25 points, B.A.s in Marketing for the team with both this and item 323]
There's no wrong way, to eat a Rhesus...
I'm sorry, but with the obscurity of these items, it's turned a scavenger hunt from a fun afternoon activity with some purpose into a monumental waste of time, energy, and resources.
...after building a 'breeder' reactor, you are no longer able to breed.
In Soviet Russia, breeder reactor builds YOU!
"And like that
In case anyone wants more info about that reactor everyone's talking about, Slashdot actually covered it back in '99. Here's the link: http://slashdot.org/articles/99/05/20/1320256.shtm l
Mea Culpa. I am aware of UofC's fine standing as an academic institution. I would be pleased to have my children go to a school so accomplished. I was merely trying to elicit a chuckle I thought it would be fairly obvious I was not serious, in comparing UofC dis-favorably with a Community College, but aparantly UofC grads are touchy. I was not trolling, though it appears to have had that effect.
"Inattention makes clowns of us all" -Bean
here's a respons from the creator of the reactor to some web board back in '99 when they did it:
Alright, I just want to set a couple things straight, so here are some
responses to oft heard comments the last few days:
1. "I assume they used U-238 to get to Pu-239..." we did not start
with any uranium or plutonium, that would have ruined the fun, and the
point was to make fissionable materials. Our starting material was
thorium, which can be found at any hardware store. we happened to have
some in our dorm room... The final products were Uranium 233 and
Plutonium 238. I'm not going to spoon feed the decay chains to anyone,
you can figure it out yourself if you really need to.
2. "You endangered the life of my son!" We created a neutron source
using some shit we pulled out of a trash can. This source was safer and
less radioactive than the radioisotope Americium 241 found in the smoke
detector in each of your rooms.
3. "Someone said your roommate lost his job because he built a nuclear
reactor" Neither I nor my rommmate have lost our jobs since doing this.
4. "I hear you paid another group to steal Plutonium for you" We did
not steal Uranium or Plutonium from anywhere. Nor did we have anyone
else steal some for us.
5. "but to qualify as a true breeder, doesn't the reaction have to be
self-sustaining?" No. A breeder reactor just means taking advantage of
all those tasty neutrons flying off from whatever source you have, be it
a sustained fission reaction or a naturally radioactive source. The
best neutron source on campus would be the Physics Dept's neutron
howitzer. But since the howitzer produces neutrons from the decay of
Plutonium, you have to agree it would be silly to use it to try and make
plutonium.
6. "(I'll be really impressed if the two come up with a micro-fusion
reactor.)" We'd fly back next year just for that one...
- Juniper Tasks
Just some clarification for the readers who've forgotten their nuclear
physics:
U-235 is the fissionable used in the Hiroshima bomb and Pu-239
in the Nagasaki bomb. U-238 is used in fast breeder reactors
to make weapons grade Pu-239. (U-238 is also used in fission-fusion-fission
bombs, so technically it is fissionable with a net gain of energy
but you need really fast neutrons).
Thorium was to have been used in slow breeder reactor technology which
turns out U-233 as its fissionable. (Is Pu-238 fissionable at low neutron
energies with a net gain? The even Z makes me think not...)
I thought you had started with depleted uranium to make a fast breeder;
didn't know the thorium isotope available from hardware stores was the
one used in slow breeders.
Well, with a small sample of thorium and a neutron source, you can make
the U-233. But with a fully functioning breeder don't you need some of the
U-233 created to fission and transform the rest of the thorium without
running away and slagging the reactor or damping out so you never
end up with more thorium than whatever's directly exposed to your
neutron source? I suppose the nuclear engineering definition of a
breeder has to be more pragmatic.
Fred and Justin didn't begin with any uranium.
(Uranium, after all, ain't a commonly available thing.) They began with some
thorium and an alpha source, which they just happened to have lying
around. They used the alpha source to make a neutron source, and bombarded
the thorium. This induced a chain of reactions, the final products of
which were fissionable uranium and plutonium.
and you prove my point my modding that piece of flamebait down to offtopic. what a waster of a modpoint. AC's already post at 0, so most people never see them. why would you bother wasting your mod points on such trivial crap? i know why. cuz you're all R E T A R D E D ! ! !
The best part of this is always the road trip, and that has not been mentioned really. You have about four days to get someplace far, far away and back with a ton of stuff. One year we went to New Orleans and NYC the next (in a rented Neon) in a whirlwind tour of taking photos and items, all in a rush to decipher where to go along the route. (If they told you outright where you were going and where you had to stop, it wouldn't be fun.) Definitely the best part.
Al-qaeda bought it... =)
soviet russian WHORE!
The Univerisy of Waterloo also had a bomb ass scavenger hunt every year, until some guy died trying to climb the exhaust pipe of the uni's envrionmental control building. (Anyone remember the Onion article, "Thre stupid kids spoil toy for everyone else"?)
So the University banned Scavenger Hunts.
Now we have Havenger Scunts (take that, laywers!), and every year has a new theme. The year I remember best was the 70s blaxpliotation theme. My shirt "Funky Scunt, 99'" gets a lot of double-takes if you read it quickly.
"Old man yells at systemd"
Second: Completely impossible, unless you are me! Frankenchrist originally came with a painting called 'Penis Landscape' by H.R. Giger (you all know Him) that was one of the first PMRC cases that was pulled from production (Which I purchased when I was 12, so I could have won 53 points!). Nice Punk Rock Pop Quiz (please say point number one out loud for me). Thank you.
If you see a 'shorl.com' URL containing id=futetanerifi, then mod it down because it's a link to a disgusting picture of a woman pooping on herself.
The link in the parent comment redirects to "Futetanerifi", better known as "Fecal Japan". Mod parent down if you don't like poop porn.
Will I retire or break 10K?
I'm feeling too uncreative to lie to them on their form
First name: Pinocchio; last name: Nixon. That should give you some ideas.
But doesn't lying on an application for access to a news database constitute fraud?
Will I retire or break 10K?
In these cultures, there's a word for someone who is even lower than the murderers and rapists ... oathbreaker.
Actually, perjury is typically a felony punishable by up to 5 years in prison and/or a $5K fine. A first-degree murder conviction, on the other hand, puts the perp away for 20 years to life in most jurisdictions.
No, the reactor was built *in* Mathews House, under the bed of one of the builders (Justin, because he lost the coin toss). I lived right on the other side of that wall for a year.
Furthermore, the reactor was *not* dismantled at the orders of the judges. Fred found it in the back of his truck, still running, a few months later. I don't know what happened to it after that.
The physics majors in question did not use the nuclear material to which they had access, because, as Fred said, it would be pretty silly to use plutonium (the Physics Dept's neutron howitzer) to make plutonium. Their original material was thorium, from the inside of some old vacuum tubes (although their first plan involved americium from ordinary hardware-store smoke detectors).
The one thing they had to borrow from the Dept was the equipment needed to prove plutonium production. *THAT* took a lot of begging, and was the hardest part of the whole thing.
The list item was inspired by a Reader's Digest article about the "Nuclear Boy Scout", who built a breeder reactor in a shed in hopes of making Eagle Scout (he made a Superfund site instead), so, really, any whacko with enough nerve and enough physics books could probably do the same.
horrible link, DO NOT FOLLOW IT!
Lameness filter encountered. Post aborted!
Reason: Don't use so many caps. It's like YELLING.
Try this http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?r107:1:./tem p/~r107esuPkD:e413:
funniest part about it is he put in the bit right in the middle of a morbid debate on abortion
He's the genius behind it all.
The CD, released in 1999
Glancing over, I thought that you were referring to the Democratic Republic of Congo, formerly Zaire.
This 'Democratic' is not from Communism, just some wicked sense of humor.
Yes, I'm on topic.
__
Men with no respect for life must never be allowed to control the ultimate instruments of death.
GW Bu
You'd hope that after 4 years at $20k+ they'd teach you how to write.
paintball
But this is driving me nuts. Your sig: Unless you want to show posession (i.e. Jump the Shark owned by The Simpson) then it should read The Simpsons Jump The Shark. Sorry for the grammar nazism.
Communists (Soviets and their fellow travellers worldwide, especially Comintern) used "Fascist" as a broad brush with which to stain any rightist opponents, from actual Fascists (Nazis, Falangists, etc.) to moderates.
Much as members of the western left wing do, even today.
It's particularly ludicrous given that the real NAZIs were self-proclaimed "national socialists". (But it's normal, since the worst fights are typically between different sects of the same ideology.)
Note that "national socialism" wasn't a propaganda distortion like "democratic republic" (which itself would be redundant). Look into the origins of NAZIism and you'll find something eerily similar to the new-age left, right down to natural foods/health fads/vegitarianism, consensus decision-making, green-style environmentalism, animal rights, mysticism (including "crystals"), and so on.
These weren't just extraneous factors, either, but led, by easy steps, to some of the well-known pathologies of the NAZIs. For instance:
Consensus politics (decision-making by near-unanimous consent of the group) led to dictatorship:
The group doesn't do anything as a group except when everybody is onboard. This leads to paralysis if anybody disagrees. So social pressure mechanisms are developed to encourage individuals to consent to, or even support, group activities perceived as popular despite personal reservations.
Once mechanisms to force consensus are in place, a well-perceived and glib "leader" can get his whole group to actively engage in (or avoid) anything he wants, by describing it as good, right, and popular, (or bad/wrong/unpopular) and refusing to consent to any other choice.
(Note that, unlike the strident demagogue of WW II Allied propaganda films, Hitler was perceived, in pre-war Germany, as quite the popular cuddly-bear. As a result, as with Clinton, his followers were willing to ignore, or disbelieve claims of, even blatant misbehavior in either his public actions and policies or persoanl life.)
Add control of the media or support from its decision-makers: Now contrasting views aren't heard (or are smeared when they can't be completely suppressed). This strengthens the perception of consensus - especially among the lawmakers (who are largely cut off from their actual constituents and tend to give excessive weight toe news stories).
Thus the popular, glib, "leader" ends up completely running the show. Once in charge he consolidates by changing the institutions so they answer directly to him and actively suppress his opposition.
Animal rights lead to medical experiments on humans in death camps:
First: Animal research is suppressed.
Second: Medical research is done on retarded humans. The taboo is broken and a precedent established that "subhuman" people are less important that animals and fair game for medical research.
Third: Various outgroups - typically those with a cohesive culture of their own that insulates them from consensus-forcing - are defined as "subhuman". Examples: Homosexuals, Pagans, Labor-unionists, Gypsies, Jews, Communists (and other socialists with a different agenda).
Fourth: The "subhuman" "problems" are excluded from society and their opinions suppressed. Progressively more draconian measures are applied to "solve" the "problem" of their presence.
Fifth: Medical research is done on these allegedly "subhuman" out-group members.
And so on.
For a month of sleepless nights try reading _The Occult Roots of NAZIism_ and _The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich_ in rapid succession. B-(
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
... the reactor was built *in* Mathews House, under the bed of one of the builders ... ... the reactor was *not* dismantled ... Fred found it in the back of his truck, still running, a few months later.
Their original material was thorium, from the inside of some old vacuum tubes (although their first plan involved americium from ordinary hardware-store smoke detectors).
I take it the "breeder reactor" was a "reactor" in terms of producing a slow-but-nontrivial nuclear reaction, perhaps a series of decaying chains when excited by ambient neutrons, rather than the usual meaning of "producing a long-term self-sustaining chain reaction"
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
MS makes horrible operating systems. They are insecure. MS wants to destroy freedom. Bill Gates is a Borg. They wouldn't go to UofC if they didn't like challenges. Just doing my part.
This is not my sandwich.
When I went to U. of C. the ratio of men to women was 65% men to 35% women. To make it even worse, many of the women were so focused on their studies that they did not want to be distracted by dating (it's a pretty serious school!), so the real ratio was even worse.
I wonder what the ratio is today. But then, after looking at this list, it seems *really* likely that it hasn't changed much:-). I wouldn't say this list is particularily female friendly.
I can still remember doing the scavenger hunt, it was the most fun I had there. Looks like there has been a bit of escalation since then.
Brahma said: Well, after hearing ten thousand explanations, a fool is no
wiser. But an intelligent man needs only two thousand five hundred.
-- The Mahabharata
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