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Johansen Trial Underway

Posted by michael on from the wheels-of-justice dept.

Info is trickling in about Jon Johansen's trial In Norway, where he is accused of violating Norwegian law. Aftenposten and VG Nett have stories, and there's at least one amateur account of the trial. The trial is supposed to last a week, and I'm sure Slashdot will keep up with it, so please submit only *new* stories about it, thanks.

39 of 227 comments (clear)

  1. Type of Judicial System by airrage · · Score: 4, Funny

    What type of judicial system do they implore: either the English Common Law (presumed guilty) or the German way (guilty, and must prove innocence)?

    Do they have the death penalty?

    --
    "This isn't a study in computer science, its a study in human behavior"
    1. Re:Type of Judicial System by travail_jgd · · Score: 5, Funny

      I kinda doubt they are going to execute him. I don't even think the MPAA would encourage that.

      Not unless they could get the movie rights for cheap!

      (Yes, I'm joking.)

    2. Re:Type of Judicial System by CrazyDuke · · Score: 5, Funny

      As long as its not American:

      "Guilty by reason of pissed corporation."

      --
      Any sufficiently advanced influence is indistinguishable from control.
    3. Re:Type of Judicial System by Pretor · · Score: 3, Informative

      IANAL but I think that you are considered innocent until proved guilty.
      But you can be kept in prison before your have been sentenced, if it's found necessary to ensure that evidence is not tampered with.

      There is no death penalty in Norway, with the exception of wartime. The last person that received this penalty, was Vidkun Quisling and he received it for his actions during the WWII.

    4. Re:Type of Judicial System by Zapateria · · Score: 3, Informative

      Britain hasn't had the death penalty for murder since 1965 and got rid of the death penalty for military offences in 1998 in accordance with the Human Rights Act of Nov 1998.

    5. Re:Type of Judicial System by Syre · · Score: 4, Informative

      Countries are not allowed into the EU unless they eliminate the death penalty.

      This is why Turkey recently eliminated theirs... to help them qualify for entry.

    6. Re:Type of Judicial System by Lagrange5 · · Score: 5, Informative

      From WORLD FACTBOOK OF CRIMINAL JUSTICE SYSTEMS -- NORWAY:

      excerpt 1:

      PROSECUTORIAL AND JUDICIAL PROCESS

      1. Rights of the accused.

      *Rights of the accused. The rights of the accused are described in the Criminal Procedures Act. The accused must be informed of the nature of the charge(s) brought against him or her upon being arrested and attending court for the first time. The accused must also be given the chance to refute the grounds on which the charge is based. (Criminal Procedures Act, Sect.90,92,171).
      Although the accused has a general right to attend court proceedings and to summon and examine witnesses, the court can order him or her to leave the courtroom while a witness is being examined "if there is special reason to fear that an unreserved statement will not otherwise be made." The accused must be informed subsequently of the proceedings that occurred in his or her absence. In special circumstances, such as if national security interests are at stake, the accused may be entirely excluded from the proceedings. (Criminal Procedures Act, Sect. 135,245).
      The court's verdict must be communicated to the accused as soon as possible, along with information on rights of appeal. Court judgements and orders are to be accompanied by reasons. (Criminal Procedures Act, Sect.39-41,43,52).
      The accused has the right to bring appeals against court verdicts, both on questions of fact and questions of law. There are, however, several limitations on the exercise of this right. For example, appeals to the Supreme Court, which is the highest judicial body, can only take place if permitted by the Court's Appeals Selection Committee (Kjoeremlsutvalget). Moreover, the general rule is that such appeals can only be based on alleged errors of law. In other words, the Supreme Court is unable to try questions of evidence related to the issue of guilt. (Administration of Justice in Norway, 1980: 65-66; Criminal Procedures Act, as amended new Chapt 23, Sect. 323, 1993).
      The accused do not have the right to have their cases tried by jury. As a basic rule, however, appeals from verdicts reached by the court of first instance on cases concerning felonies punishable by more than 6 years' imprisonment are dealt with by the High Court (Lagmannsrett). In these cases, there is a jury (lagrett) present to decide the question of guilt. (Criminal Procedures Act, new Chapt 24, as amended, 1993).

      *Assistance to the accused. As a general rule, the accused is entitled to the assistance of defense counsel of his or her choice during all stages of the judicial process. The accused is also provided with the free assistance of defense counsel, chosen by the court, during the main court hearing. There are several exceptions to the latter rule, such as if the case involves a
      certain minor offense, like driving under the influence of alcohol, or when the accused has made an unreserved confession. However, these exceptions apply only in cases tried by the City or District Court. (Criminal Procedures Act, Sect. 94,96,100,107,262).

      ***

      excerpt 2:

      PENALTIES AND SENTENCING

      2. Types of penalties.

      *Death penalty. There is no death penalty.

      --
      "Folks just call him Buckethead." -- Les Claypool
  2. New stories only! by Anonvmous+Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    "The trial is supposed to last a week, and I'm sure Slashdot will keep up with it, so please submit only *new* stories about it, thanks."

    The same could be asked of the editors.. ;)

  3. Asinine by cioxx · · Score: 5, Insightful
    To Blockquoth the journal:
    Jon contacting Nomad, who'd written a decryptor but no front-end or keys; Jon blagging a copy of this and promissing not to circulate it; Jon writing a GUI for it [prosecutor asking what a GUI is - pardon ? - yes, really, the counsel didn't appear to know]

    Classy. This is the reason why he won't get a fair trial, regardless of the outcome. The prosecution, judges, etc. don't have a fucking clue about technology and yet they are presiding over it.

    Same thing goes on in the States. I don't buy the whole "technology is in it's infancy" bullshit. There are tons out out of work sysadmins. Give them books, let them take the bar exam and proceed to become a prosecutor. Everyone wins.
    1. Re:Asinine by radicalsubversiv · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Unless the Norweigan legal system is wildly different from the American one, the prosecutor is only doing his case a disservice by demonstrating his technological incompetence before the judge (is there a jury in this case?). Leaves the defense with a great opportunity to paint the prosecution as being grounded in computer illiteracy.

      --
      Red All Over: Rambling Missives from an Aspiring Revolutionary
    2. Re:Asinine by Ezubaric · · Score: 3, Funny

      It could be that the prosecutor is asking what a GUI is to get him defining Jon's role in the development, not out of ignorance.

      For example:
      Witness: So I opened up the cupboard and got a jar of peanut butter.
      Matlock: What do you mean, you got a jar of peanut butter?
      Witness: I took out the jar with my hand and took a knife to butter ... alright, you've got me! I really killed him because he hated me and my toast!

      Well ... maybe not quite like that ...

      --

      ----------
      I am an expert in electricity. My father held the chair of applied electricity at the state prision.
    3. Re:Asinine by poot_rootbeer · · Score: 5, Insightful


      No, the prosecutor is asking what a GUI is because he needs to ensure that everyone present in the courtroom is using the same terminology. It has to go into the transcript, or the first thing that will come up in appeal is "They were using a different definition of GUI than we were."

      If out-of-work sysadmins want to become prosecutors, they can go ahead and enroll at law school. It takes more to become a lawyer than reading a few books and taking an exam, though.

      To paraphrase someone, "the nerds, geeks, etc. don't have a fucking clue about the legal system and yet they are trying offer commentary about it.

    4. Re:Asinine by Dyolf+Knip · · Score: 4, Interesting
      "the nerds, geeks, etc. don't have a fucking clue about the legal system and yet they are trying offer commentary about it."

      Similarly, "the judges, the lawyers, the politicians, etc. don't have a fucking clue about technology and yet they are regularly passing summary judgement on it and destroying people's lives over issues they don't even come close to understanding." Hmmm, I wonder which is more dangerous, abusive, irresponsible, and totally reprehensible behavior?

      I find it unlikely that 'GUI' and 'GNU/Linux' were the only technical terms that arose. If the prosecutor understood but didn't question the others, why these? Declan McCullagh's suggesting that the prosecutor didn't know was likely prompted by more than a simple, "Please explain for the court what a GUI is." On the other hand, 'GUI' is found pretty early on when picking up the jargon, even thumbing through a 'Computers for Absolute Dummies'...

      Ah, screw it. This account is second hand from someone who admittedly doesn't know the language particularly well. Let's wait until we get the actual transcript translated by someone able to read it.

      --
      Dyolf Knip
  4. CNN even picked it up! by quantumparadox · · Score: 5, Informative

    CNN's interpretation of the beginning of the trial is here.

    Amazingly the CNN story isn't actually 100% biased.

  5. Making a case out of him using Linux by MoonFog · · Score: 5, Informative

    I watched the news on norwegian televison just 30 minutes ago. They said the prosecution actually made a huge case out of the fact that Johansen was a Linux users, saying Linux is popular among hackers
    Here's another article.
    Also, here's a statement from Electronic Frontier Norway (EFN) on the matter

    1. Re:Making a case out of him using Linux by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The more you know (on anything), the more you realize how terrible the news media is. It's disturbing when you see how things are wrong/misreported/overblown on something you know, and then consider that the same thing is going on with the things you don't know as much about.

  6. Is Johansen a saint by nutshell42 · · Score: 5, Interesting
    An interesting link which was posted in the heise-forum:

    http://www.debian.org/~kju/decsstruth.txt

    in short:

    He stole the source, violated the GPL and didn't even have a linux-box.

    I don't know whether it's true but it sounds convincing

    --
    Don't think of it as a flame---it's more like an argument that does 3d6 fire damage
    1. Re:Is Johansen a saint by KjetilK · · Score: 3
      According to the police investigation, he had a box which booted into FreeBSD, Windows and Linux, so it is definately not all true.

      I think it is quite correct what he said, that he only wanted to watch the movies on whatever equipment he chose. But he has definately grown up to see the bigger picture now.

      --
      Employee of Inrupt, Project Release Manager and Community Manager for Solid
  7. That is NOT the American system. by DAldredge · · Score: 5, Funny

    The American system is "Guilty by reason of lesser bank account balance"

  8. False dichotomy by Robin+Hood · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Huh. From an earlier Aftenposten article entitled "'DVD Jon' declares his innocence" (http://www.aftenposten.no/english/local/article.j html?articleID=452751), I found this quote:

    Some view Johansen as a hero, while others view him as the entertainment industry's worst nightmare.

    Um... What about both? Do they have a problem with that concept? :-)

    --
    The real meaning of the GNU GPL:
    "The Source will be with you... Always."
  9. So what... by Pedrito · · Score: 4, Insightful

    So he goes to jail for a couple of years. It'll probably teach him to be a better member of society and not to do such criminal things as try to view copyrighted material on open source operating systems.

    It occurs to me that having trials where the judge, prosecution, or defense are so technologically behind, how is one to get a fair trial?

    Is this something new to computers? Are there cases in the past (like 20+ years ago) where technology or something else causing a major lack of understanding, has caused difficulties in providing fair trials?

    1. Re:So what... by Pedrito · · Score: 3, Interesting

      How about Galileo's trial?

      Not really. I mean, in Galileo's trial, everyone understood the issues involved. They simply refused to believe them. Maybe I'm wrong, but it's not like Johansen is tried to prove something that people didn't believe. He may be convicted because the courts don't understand the issues. That's a different animal, I believe.

    2. Re:So what... by kilogram · · Score: 3, Interesting

      It occurs to me that having trials where the judge, prosecution, or defense are so technologically behind, how is one to get a fair trial?

      Well, there are two literates/commoners that will be deciding his penalty. These are actually mentioned in a few of the articles, and they have first been screened on experience and skills, then the prosecution and defense have settled on the two now chosen.

      I read a quote from one of Norway's most prominent geeks, Jon Bing, earlier today; "Johansen is actually charged for breaking into his own property", which could describe the entire case. He has never actually distributed the movies, which is the only thing that Norwegian laws actually forbid. (You *can* copy whatever you want for your own personal use, but you *can't* distribute them)

      Further, whatever the judgement will be, this will not set legal precendence in Norway, as the DMCA (or something very similar) probably will be enforced shortly, thus overriding the older laws.

    3. Re:So what... by cyril3 · · Score: 3, Insightful
      You confuse fair outcome with fair trial.

      A fair trial is a process where each party has the opportunity to present their case to an appropriate tribunal which decides whether the accused has done the deed alleged and whether that means they have broken the law in question. This determination is based on a reasoned consideration of all the facts and circumstances as presented in the trial. I suspect that this occurs in the vast majority of cases.

      nowhere in that is there any mention of the fairness of the law itself or the outcome.

      In any case your statement that laws are not inherently fair seems to be based on an idea that it is not fair to be held accountable for your actions in any way. On that basis please tell us what is unfair about the laws against murder (as an extreme example)

  10. Kevin Mitnick's First Chapter by hazzzard · · Score: 3, Informative

    Well, I've been trying to submit this as a story before but the slashdot editors rejected it. It's not about the same person, not the same "crimes", but somewhat related (feel free to mod me down!). Promise: An interesting and revealing read.

  11. Submit only new stories.... by Arcturax · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I guess they don't even trust themselves not to post duplicate articles anymore...

    To the topic at hand, from what I've read, the case against him is weak and hopefully he will prevail and deliver a much needed blow to the MPAA and DVDCCA.

    If he is convicted, I hope the Norwegian people cry out the way we did when Dimitry was jailed. In this case it would be a Norwegian jailed for breaking a US law in his own country, I expect the outcry would be phenominal. If so, hopefully whoever their president/primeminister/etc is has pardon powers and uses them before things get out of hand.

    It will be interesting to see... in any case, I'm going to light a candle for Jon this holiday season and hope that he comes out on top, not because its right for fair use, but because its unjust to take a man's freedom for something like this.

    --

    --Won't that be grand? Computers and the programs will start thinking and the people will stop. - Dr. Walter Gibbs
  12. Short review of todays norwegian news by skurk · · Score: 3, Informative

    According to Verdens Gang (VG) (in norwegian), the Norwegian Economic Crime Unit claims that the creators of DeCSS are organized criminals, because "DeCSS written for, and can only be used to copy DVD movies."

    From what I've read, it seems that they are currently discussing wether or not CSS is a copy protection or not, and the fact that Johansen didn't break any laws when he wrote the GUI for DeCSS. As you know, some german guys did the hard work, and Johansen is taking the kicks.

    I'll keep you posted

    -skurk

    --
    www.6502asm.com - Code 6502 assembly or.. DIE!!
  13. Prosecutor got the charge wrong by tomhudson · · Score: 5, Interesting

    State prosecutor Inger Marie Sunde claimed in an Oslo city court Monday that Jon Lech Johansen is guilty of breaching protection mechanisms in DVDs, ...

    </quote>

    The DVD itself is not altered. The protection mechanism that is being bypassed is in the DVD player.

  14. Historical intrest only by lkstrand · · Score: 4, Interesting

    According to the norwegian law professor Jon Bing, the outcome of this court is of historical intrest only:

    http://www.vg.no/pub/vgart.hbs?artid=995988

    The reason for this is that after DVD-Jon was accused, the EU has got the EUCD/Infosoc directive wich is the european equvialence to DMCA.

  15. Funny reason for a trial by Old+Wolf · · Score: 4, Funny
    The story says:


    Info is trickling in about Jon Johansen's trial In Norway, where he is accused of violating Norwegian law.


    Unusual accusation for a court to make..

  16. A Norwegians two cents. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    First of all the law thats used to prosecute Jon was written to prevent people reading other peoples mail, it has a small bit about obtaining illeagal access to other peoples data, but the courts in Norway have earlier ruled that that dvds goes under the laws of music and film, not data. The laws that have to do with music and film in Norway gives the user very wide rights. You can even copy music and film from "close friends and family" legaly.

    As long as the crime isn't done in the purpose of gaining money, the law thats used to prosecute him has a highest possible punisment of 6 months.

    To sum up, the prosecution has a paper-thin case, and it is my view that they only prosecute because of all the attention, and if the judge isn't incompetent Jon will surley win. But judges sometimes are :(.

    (pardon my english)

    1. Re:A Norwegians two cents. by HiThere · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I used to believe that judges were frequently incompetent. Then I finally decided that there couldn't be that many incompetent judges. This leaves a few choices:
      1) many judges have a known track record, and the da is able to manipulate which judge will hear which case.
      2) many judges have been corrupted.
      3) most defense lawyers are incompetent relative to most district attorneys.
      4) some combination of the above
      5) ??? (somthing I haven't thought of)

      E.g., consider the case which declared that corporations were people. This is a totally absurd assertion, but it has been a "fact" for over a century. It is the source of much that is wrong with the US, and it traces back to one court decision involving a railway company in California during the latter half of the 1800's. If I decide that this is because of corruption, then either every supreme court since then has been corrupt, of the legal system has no means of correcting errors. If I decide that it's because of incompetence, then...

      And I'm *SURE* not going to decide that it's a sensible decision.

      --

      I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
    2. Re:A Norwegians two cents. by Malcontent · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Did you ever write code? Did you test that code? Did you test the code by throwing in unexpected parameters and seeing how the system behaved?

      Maybe we ought to the same with the legal system. Take a thousand white people and a thousand black people of varying economic levels and throw them into the system. Knowing full well that every single one of them are innocent I wonder how many will come out of the system and how many will end up in jail or on death row?

      As it is now. If you are 100% absolutely innocent the best thing that can happen to you if you are arrested is that you will go broke, lose your job, and lose your family and friends. The worst thing that can happen to you is that you will die. The US legal system is horrible that way. Once you are in it you are fucked royally.

      --

      War is necrophilia.

  17. Oh boy by mao+che+minh · · Score: 3, Insightful
    So, corporate money does all of the legal talking in Norway, too. Seeing as I have no idea what the technology laws are like in Norway, my interpretation of the trial means nothing and is ultimately pointless.

    However, my opinion as a technology using citizen of the world that routinely watches DVDs that I purchased and own in Linux is this: Any judge that possesses an ounce of common sense would wrap this case up in favor of the defendant in a day. The kid/man owns the DVDs, the CSS encryption is not in place to protect anything other then access. He did not gain unlawful access to anything, and furthermore did not harm or effect the DVD (which he owns) in any way. I would imagine that the judge has heard of reverse engineering, and understands that it is legal.

    Bah, this all pointless. They should just bring in a group of Korean protestors and make it interesting.

  18. There's been too much work put into it... by Kjella · · Score: 5, Informative

    They can't admit to having spent three years basicly finding out "Doh! He didn't do anything illegal", certainly not in such an international case with lots of media attention. Økokrim (the department handeling serious economic crimes) is on crack anyway. They're the ones that among other things wanted to ban anonymous email because it made people so hard to track. Not to mention no form of anonymous surfing, so webcafes would be forced to record IDs and more.

    Kinda reminds me of the latest "doping-scandal" in Norway. Our biggest commercial TV station had been working for over a year trying to dig up sensational news about doping among norwegian top athletes. They didn't really have anything to go on but aired it anyway, and the program was picked apart as a bunch of loose rumors and false information, plus some very bad journalism. The executives ended up holding a press conference disavow the whole program, and cashed out 700,000$+ "voluntarily" to try to undo the damage.

    Kjella

    --
    Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
  19. Re:It seems that neither sides understands by villoks · · Score: 5, Informative
    Oh well.

    Unfortunately most of lawyers don't read Slasdot or any other tech-education site (it really is a problem, for example the Law School in Helsinki University had 2-3 voluntary short courses on these topics and most of students didn't take them.)

    About reverge engineering, yes, it is allowed under quite strict circumstances, the EU-directive (Council Directive 91/250/EEC, it's the same in Norway and Germany) sets a 6 step test for decompilation:

    Article 6
    Decompilation

    1. The authorization of the rightholder shall not be required where reproduction of the code and translation of its form within the meaning of Article 4 (a) and (b) are indispensable to obtain the information necessary to achieve the interoperability of an independently created computer program with other programs, provided that the following conditions are met:

    (a) these acts are performed by the licensee or by another person having a right to use a copy of a program, or on their behalf by a person authorized to to so;

    (b) the information necessary to achieve interoperability has not previously been readily available to the persons referred to in subparagraph (a); and (c) these acts are confined to the parts of the original program which are necessary to achieve interoperability.

    2. The provisions of paragraph 1 shall not permit the information obtained through its application:

    (a) to be used for goals other than to achieve the interoperability of the independently created computer program;

    (b) to be given to others, except when necessary for the interoperability of the independently created computer program; or (c) to be used for the development, production or marketing of a computer program substantially similar in its expression, or for any other act which infringes copyright.


    In this case the it's not clear if the information was readily available (from DVDCCA,NDA + price could make it possible to at least argue otherwise) and also it's unclear whether the reverge engineered software was legally bought or not..

    Ville
    Electronic Frontier Finland
  20. Re:You have no right to a free software DVD player by echo · · Score: 4, Informative

    the CSS encryption system is NOT under a patent, it is a TRADE SECRET.

    Once a trade secret is discovered, you have no legal recourse, oh, except of course for the DMCA in the US.

  21. Re:Obligation by Phosphor3k · · Score: 3, Funny

    Copy Protection Jumped the Shark!

  22. stories have it wrong by Warpedcow · · Score: 4, Informative

    I read articles about this on CNN and newsweek (just look at google news for links right now). They all have it wrong. They claim he created software that can be used to illegally _duplicate_ a DVD. WRONG! DeCSS just lets you _PLAY_ a DVD not copy it. They should be prosecuting for allowing people to illegally play DVDs (that sounds rather silly, doesn't it?... maybe thats why they keep saying copy copy copy everywhere)

    DeCSS has nothing to do with copying.

    -Dave

    --
    moo