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Mandrake Appealing to Community, Again

Posted by michael on from the maxing-out-the-credit-cards dept.

An anonymous reader writes "It seems that MandrakeSoft's short-term financial problem is worse than was thought. A new page on the Mandrake web site says: 'Everyone who is concerned with the company's future is encouraged to read and distribute the following message. In order to reach the next release, MandrakeSoft currently needs to raise cash, and quickly complete the Increase of Capital.' Darn, and I thought they were almost over this hump. Looks like a good time to help recruit Mandrake supporters for the Club."

26 of 569 comments (clear)

  1. My appeal by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny
    This is my appeal to the Slashdot community:

    I am a 31 year old male virgin and I really, really need to lose my virginity this year. At this point I don't care if you're a guy or the world's skankiest geekette. If you are willing to finally make me a man, please reply to this post with your address. I'll fly over next week.

  2. Thinning the herd by Skyshadow · · Score: 5, Redundant
    Even if I were to give money to Mandrake, what sort of information do I have that would lead me to believe that they wouldn't just be in this hole again six months from now? Throwing good money after bad is a real pet peeve of mine.

    IMO, Mandrake is about to get thinned from the herd. And it'll be too bad, since they've provided a lot of leadership in terms of desktop Linux, but I think we're all a lot more realistic about business realities than we were a few years ago.

    --
    Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
    1. Re:Thinning the herd by Reality+Master+101 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You've failed to make the argument about why saving Mandrake is "the right thing".

      Not everything is worth saving, and particularly not everything with good intentions. Why does Mandrake offer that is so great that it's worth dumping $4M into? And note that that $4M is not going into new development -- it's to resolve outstanding debts from all the wasted money of the past.

      --
      Sometimes it's best to just let stupid people be stupid.
    2. Re:Thinning the herd by Skyshadow · · Score: 4, Insightful
      I'm sorry, I don't see how this applies.

      In the interests of promoting diversity in Linux choices, I can see giving a few dollars to help an otherwise viable company get over a particular rough patch.

      But this doesn't seem to be the case here -- rather, it's beginning to look more and more like Mandrake will never turn a profit. This brings up the spectre of the community supporting a supposedly for-profit company via donations, which just isn't realistic. So it's not a question of the "right thing", but one of eceonomic reality.

      --
      Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
    3. Re:Thinning the herd by Skyshadow · · Score: 4, Insightful
      It sounds to me like you gained without buying. How about supporting the company that made that gain possible? What more to you gain from RedHat?

      The real difference here is that RedHat isn't counting on sales of CDs or, worse, the altruism of the community to make money.

      Instead, they have displayed good business sense and are creating sell-able services surrounding Linux, such as training and subscriptions to time-saving services (using up2date anytime is worth $60 a server, IMO). This is working out really well for them -- they're suddenly in the black.

      If Mandrake can't do the same, well, that's life. They need to either develop a viable for-profit business plan (if they want to remain a for-profit business) or work out another way to survive (go non-profit or get aquired).

      That's just reality.

      --
      Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
  3. Boxed Sets by xombo · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I remember my first Linux Distro... It was Mandrake 6.0. It is the best one I've ever used, for it's bare-bones Red Hat compatability and ease of use. They are missing the boat by trying to compete with people like Red Hat because they know they can't steal Red Hat users. RH users are dedicated to RH and usually revere Mandrake as child's play. Mandrake needs to re-evaluate their position and make themselves a Linux for the working man who doesn't have the time to sit around for hours making it work.

  4. Re:Pardon? by British · · Score: 5, Funny



    "Please help these needy software developers. Your donation can get a Linux developer a brand new system, a 100 gig SCSI drive, or maybe a clean t-shirt. For the cost of a Mountain Dew you can give a developer some Mountain Dew to develop trivial new Linux applications you might not ever use or understand. Is that too much to ask for a command-line driven utility?"

    For each Linux developer you sponsor, you will recieve a 45K JPEG portrait, and a monthly email detailing his progress."

  5. Yeah its sad and all.. by antis0c · · Score: 5, Interesting

    But why continue to throw money into toilet? It's already started flushing man, get out while you can. When a company begins a downward spiral like this, the first instinct it to start throwing some money into it, putting out fires here and there. However the damage is too much and without a huge investment, and I'm talking more than the Slashdot community could ever raise, its going to continue all the way down.

    A second point to be made in this is Mandrake is a company. When they start begging for money like this to save the company, I want to see a plan. I want to know how my money is going to help. What they have is way to vague.

    Our current cash needs are approximately 4ME ($4M USD). This level of cash infusion would resolve outstanding debts, cover the expenses needed to become profitable, plus secure an extra amount to satisfy the needs of future growth.

    What kind of outstanding debt? Is my money going to pay for those 1,500 dollar Aeron chairs the executes who are already being paid 6 digit salary are sitting in? Is it to cover "corporate meetings" held at the Sheraton or some other overly expensive restraunt? Those are the things that bother me the most. I'd be more than glad to help a company that is going under due to the pressure of the market, but I want to know why they got to where they are now. Is it because of a sincere inability to raise profit and lower required expenses? Or is it because the executives demanded fresh squeezed juices while they sit back in an Aeron chair.

    I'm not saying Mandrake is like that, but I know plenty of companies that are to be overly cautious about investing any money into a company about to go bankrupt.

    --

    ..There's a-dooin's a-transpirin'
    1. Re:Yeah its sad and all.. by cgleba · · Score: 4, Informative

      Mandrake 8.1 beta (I think) showed pictures of the developers and office during the install process.

      From what the pictures showed they looked like a small outfit with nothing really fancy -- it looked like an older office, the chairs looked comfy but reasonable and the computers also looked average.

      It would be a big shame to loose Mandrake. They have several developers that work full-time on open source projects and nothing else -- in other words they contribute solely to the projects and nothing value-added for Mandrake.

      For instance, looking through the kernel ChangeLogs Mandrake recently added a lot to the network drivers' mii interfaces so that mii-tool would work properly with more network cards. Little things like this make a big difference but no one ever notices. . ..

  6. Sigh. by Emmettfish · · Score: 5, Insightful
    You know what? I've had enough. These people have burned through how many millions of dollars already? Meanwhile, we work our asses off, and I'm still concerned about how to pay my rent next month. If we had the kind of money that Mandrake has likely paid in taxes alone, we would be producing ungodly amounts of software.

    By my watch, with the amount of money that Mandrake has already spent, they should have the absolute best commercial distribution of Linux available. There should be no question as to the performance of Mandrake compared to any other commercial version. They should be kicking ass and taking names. Unfortunately, the only ass they're kicking is the collective behind of the Linux community, and the only names they're taking are followed by credit card numbers.

    Meanwhile, we're a non-profit company that produces the absolute best-of-class general-purpose audio compression codec in the world, proprietary or otherwise. We've been through recessions and poor economic times before; Hopefully we'll live through this one, too. Everybody and their brother has a Linux distribution; Why don't you support the smaller projects that actually make a difference?

    Emmett Plant
    CEO, Xiph.org Foundation

  7. hey by Slashdotess · · Score: 5, Informative

    509 Pepperidge Ln
    San Antonio, TX 78213

    rawr!

    1. Re:hey by clem · · Score: 5, Funny

      The fact that this was modded +1 Informative has nearly cost me my bladder control and dignity.

      --
      Your courageous and selfless spelling corrections have made me a better person.
    2. Re:hey by ASMprogrammer · · Score: 5, Funny

      Wow, the first literal karma whore.

  8. Re:well... by EvilAlien · · Score: 5, Insightful
    They aren't just asking for cash, they are appealing for people to purchase their products and services because they are trying to stay afloat. Read the history of the company. It is no secret that they dug a hole branching into the ill-fated e-learning initiative during the tech boom at the behest of Vulture Capitalists.

    If you like Mandrake and believe in Linux then the only way to show it is by actually supporting the products to believe are valuable. Free software, unless you mean free-beer, doesn't alleviate the producers of a product or service from the realities of economics. If you do not believe Mandrake is viable, despite liking their products, then don't purchase a MandrakeClub membership or box. If you do believe in the products, then support them.

    I've got a shiny new Mandrake 9 PowerPack, and I'm happy with it. I've replaced MS Office with StarOffice. Those who value the products should do the same, and those who don't value the products should not. I think Mandrake has a chance to get back into the black, and I've voted with my $.

    --
    perl -e 'print $i=pack(c5, (41*2), sqrt(7056), (unpack(c,H)-2), oct(115), 10)'
  9. How I help Mandrake by kbielefe · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Since I regularly use Mandrake, I try to buy the distribution CDs for major upgrades. The price is well worth it, especially if you get the DVD. When I download the ISOs instead, I answer 50 or so support questions on mandrakeexpert.com for free. Since other people pay to ask the questions, this is a way I can indirectly support the product. My point is don't be a leech. If you use the product, find some way to contribute, monetarily or otherwise.

    --
    This space intentionally left blank.
  10. You people are incredible by WankersRevenge · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I got the karma to burn and after dealing with a very crashy server, I got the angst to burn as well.

    I swear . . . you people amaze me. You cry a river over Palladium and litter these message boards with cheers when some country decides to go Linux. You hate Microsoft - yet - when the most user friendly desktop distro is in financial trouble - you scorn them. I mean - wtf? If you believe in the cause and a major leader is having problems - you help them out. You help them out not because you want something in return, you help them out to keep the movement alive. And don't give me this market philosphy bullshit either. If you really believe that shit, stick with MS.

    I swear you people are incredible. You cry so much about the DRM thing yet you make it invetiable by turning your back on Mandrake. You're just proving to everybody (including the RIAA, MPAA) that you just want a free lunch. Nothing else. Nothing more.

    Go ahead - flame me to death and knock me down to the -1 country. I don't give a shit.

    1. Re:You people are incredible by cheezedawg · · Score: 5, Insightful

      when the most user friendly desktop distro is in financial trouble - you scorn them.

      No, its a company that has a crappy business plan and is not making any money. A company asking for cash donations so it can survive a little longer is one of the dummest things I have ever heard. Maybe they should rethink their business plan instead(what a strange idea- a business that actually makes money without donations?). You are not helping out the "movement" at all- Linux does not rely on Mandrake for survival. If you want to donate your money, that is fine, but you should realize that by donating you are just throwing your cash down the toilet to enable a crappy business to survive another week.

      And you should leave Microsoft, DRM, and all of the other /. buzzwords out of this -- they are not relevant at all to the topic.

      --
      "The defense of freedom requires the advance of freedom" - George W Bush
  11. Re:Mandrake: Embarrassment by aoteoroa · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Speaking of emabarrassment - I'm feeling a little sheepish myself because it is people like me who have helped get Mandrake in this awkward position.

    I have downloaded and used isos for:
    Mandrake 8.0
    Mandrake Single Network Firewall
    Mandrake 8.1
    Mandrake Corporate Server
    Mandrake 9.0

    At work everytime I have a server problem there is usually an easy Mandrake solution.

    At home I have used the most recent version of Mandrake for the last 3 or 4 releases. Yet to date I have not paid a dime.

    Well today is the day I will pony up and stop being a complete leach. Sadly I can't afford much 'cause this is an expensive time of year.

  12. I couldn't agree more by Sycraft-fu · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Your project is unique, as far as I know, and genuinley useful to lots of people. I fail to see how another Linux distribution, that when I tried it (version 7.0) was more or less a RedHat knockoff, is any sort of huge benefit.

    So people, if you are feeling the urge to donate to free software, give it to the Xiph guys. No matter what OS you use, OGG is available to you, and it's GOOD at what it does. If Mandrake dies, well, then they die and we are limited to only the other million and a half Linux distros. If Xiph dies, we don't get updates to Vorbis, and none of the rest of their projects come to be.

  13. Why Mandrake is worth saving. by stonedown · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If you don't use Mandrake, it's not worth saving, plain and simple. If you use Mandrake, and you like it, then getting Mandrake through this rough patch ensures that they'll be around for you to use their next release.

    Numerous polls show that Mandrake is the favorite desktop distribution by a wide margin, so there are clearly a lot of people who use Mandrake and like it, and if Mandrake goes out of business, they're all going to be moving to SuSE or Red Hat. Clearly, there are reasons that so many people opted to use Mandrake in the first place, so SuSE and Red Hat are going to be a step down for many.

    I am a standard member of the club, and I purchased the DVD set of Mandrake 9.0, because it was worth paying for.

  14. It couldn't be the business model could it? by fmaxwell · · Score: 5, Interesting
    Let's see if I understand this:
    1. Mandrake gives away their primary product to anyone who has a fast enough connection to download it.
    2. Every year, more and more people get a fast enough connection to download it.
    3. The number of copies that they sell in retail packages is already too low to cover their expenses.

    Yeah. Sounds like a real solid business model.
    Reality:
    • Most people will find a way to rationalize why they should keep their money whenever possible. (Just look at all of the people that think it's okay to cheat on their taxes.)
    • People like to get bargains. Very few people would want to pay money for an OS when their friends downloaded it for free.
    • The majority of people who claim to be part of the "open source community" are just leeches who want free software. They don't contribute code, money, testing, documentation, or anything else.

    Mandrade could make money selling distros by following the OpenBSD model, copyrighting the ISO images and not making them available for download. Alternatively, they could write proprietary installers and configuration tools that are not open source, witholding those from people that download the OS components. What they have now is a losing business model that will only get worse as more and more people have access to broadband.
  15. Re:Pardon? by Bruce+Perens · · Score: 5, Informative
    FSF? What software have they released lately?

    Are you trying to be a troll? If this is a serious question, go look at fsf.org . It should suffice to say that there would probably be no Mandrake distribution without their work.

    Bruce

    --
    Bruce Perens.
  16. MandrakeClub is not a charity by deno · · Score: 5, Informative

    In spite of the very unfortunate way MandrakeClub is "advertised" (ahem), MandrakeClub is not a charity, but a service.

    I am in charge of MandrakeClub, and i have worked very hard for last 12 months to build that place into something really special.It isn't finished yet, but it is indeed on a good way to become by far the best "service" for private users and small companies.

    I wan't bother you with the details (as if someone would care to read anyway), but there is a whole bunch of people there who are really happy to be Club members today, so I must have done something right after all.

    I know that everyone on Slashdot is telling you that Club is no-good, but maybe you should just go there once, and try to build your own meaning.

    OK, it wan't be a very excitiong trip (site is not made for anonymous users, and it is in fact even quite unfriendly towards them), but maybe you could still get a feeling that it isn't "just charity" by browsing trough FAQs, and looking at the discussion in the "future" forum on MandrakeClub.

  17. Re:Pardon? by sevensharpnine · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I love Linux as much as anyone, but let's be realistic. If Dell had an option on their order page to pick Microsoft XP or RedHat 8.0, %99.9+ of users would pick XP. Furthermore, Dell probably doesn't want the added tech support of a Linux machine. You can't just shove someone through a three-week training course and have them fix Linux boxes, you need people with some degree of skill. I know Microsoft has used illegal tactics to award OEM contracts, which I'm sure we all hate, but in the end *most* OEM's wouldn't want the extra hassle of dealing with Linux.

    And if you think the reason Microsoft dominates the desktop is marketing, you need to slow down and take an honest look at the situation. Marketing never hurts, but having an OS that can be run (and maintained) by a slobbering idiot doesn't hurt either. See also: Apple.

    --
    "God is a comedian playing to an audience too afraid to laugh." -Voltaire
  18. Re:This means redhat would be the only Linux Deskt by TheWanderingHermit · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The other distros, lets see, how many newbies can install slackware or debian?

    Knowing how dedicated Debianites are, I'm sure this will get modded to troll immediately, but...

    I'm not a newbie. I was taking classes in assembler back in the early 80's. I've been working with computers since the late 70's, in high school, and I've had a computer on my desk ever since the Apple //e came out (which I knew inside and out -- knew ROM entry points from memory and did a LOT of machine code programming).

    I had to set up a new system last week. I spent 2 days trying to get Debian to install. If it asked for Disk 1 and I mistakenly put in Disk 2, and hit return, then put in the correct disk at the error message, it wouldn't even acknowledge the correct disk. I checked all my CDs to make sure they were readable in the drive I was using, but not once, in 2 days of trying to install Debian did I have a successful install. Every single time, whether I installed from the network, or from a CD, it kept telling me it couldn't get all the packages (and this was a basic install with the basic X-Windows and KDE, not something with a lot of extra programs). I tried the floppy install, following directions, and it still asked for the CDs (not when it was asking for debs sources -- at the beginning). If it installed, X wouldn't run. It did not talk well with my ATI Radeon A-I-W. And forget it even realizing I had a firewire card! I had really wanted to set up a video system under Linux and all my Debian loving friends have been swearing on how good Debian is.

    2 days and not once did I get a working install that could recognize my hardware and give me X w/ KDE. So after all that, I decided to try Mandrake 9.0. It worked perfectly the first time. I went to the Penguin Liberation front and got the commands to add RPM sources and all the extra programs I needed (like Cinelerra) installed perfectly. My firewire card worked and for the first time I could capture video in Linux, as well as getting MPlayer to play DVDs.

    Mandrake got skunked by venture capitalists who "knew better." Right now I'm still in the startup stage of a business. Money's coming in, but it's paying off startup costs. Mandrake has won my loyalty and I can tell you that within the next month I'll be buying the most complete version of Mandrake 9.0 and will continue to do so with each upgrade they offer. Why? Because it just works! I use the computer as a tool to do work, not as a tool to create tools to make more programs to do more techie stuff with Linux. I use it as a tool, and Mandrake works as a tool. Plain and simple.

    Newbie or not, Mandrake is a solid distro and a great tool if you want to actually use your computer to get work done. Such a company deserves our support if we ever want to see Linux prosper on the desktop.

    Debian sure isn't anywhere close to the "just install it and it works" stage yet.

  19. Re:Pardon? by Afrosheen · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Nice troll, but in your ignorance, you're overlooking the good Mandrake has done for the Open Source community at large. To date, they have:

    1. Donated heaps of cash to KDE developers to encourage development and keep people fed.

    2. Open sourced all their software they've created in-house in order to benefit the community.

    3. Provided free downloads of their distro from day one.

    I'm sure there are dozens more, but first and foremost, they work for the community.