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Friendly Plastic Pop Can Nearly Ready for Market

drfishy writes "BevNET has the story of Toledo, OH based Owens-Illinois and their new pop can. The can is made of a "fancy" new clear plastic with a traditional aluminum top and should be in stores sometime this year. Consumers are supposed to like it because of the "cool" factor, manufacturers will like it because they can use the same equipment to fill and package them, beverage companies like it because consumers and manufacturers will, and advertising agencies love it because they can get rich making all new commercials to convince people it really is cool. Seriously though, I like the idea, enough to submit a story about it anyway..."

51 of 114 comments (clear)

  1. Pop can? by Evro · · Score: 4, Funny

    What the hell is pop? I think you mean soda, or maybe coke, but certainly not pop.

    Obligatory link: http://www.ugcs.caltech.edu/~almccon/pop_soda/

    --
    rooooar
    1. Re:Pop can? by Jahf · · Score: 3, Informative

      You know, the parent poll is as close to a troll as I am willing to reply to :)

      I've lived in enough areas in the US that I've been around most variations. It seems to break down like this:

      West: soda or pop
      Midwest: pop
      East: soda or soda-pop
      NorEast: soda-pop
      South: Coke or "fountain drink"
      Deep South: Coke (even if it's clear or fruit colored)

      I grew up with "pop", moved to where it was "coke", and then back to where it's "soda" or "pop". I generally call it soda or better yet, use a brand name, as soda seems to be understood everywhere. I definitely have had people not understand when I used "pop" before.

      The point? Not much ... except this is how culture develops ... and telling someone they are wrong (worse, that only they are wrong and other variations are ok) is ... well ... a troll :)

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    2. Re:Pop can? by MillionthMonkey · · Score: 2

      He could be from New Jersey. We always called it coke or soda.

      Never heard of "pop" until I met some people from Chicago. They thought "soda" was weird.

    3. Re:Pop can? by !splut · · Score: 2

      Having grown up in New England, and having lived in upstate New York, I can say that where I come from we decidedly do not call carbonated beverages "soda-pop." It's usually "soda," or "soft drink" if one is trying to sound more like a restaurant.

      "Pop" calls to mind images of popsicles, blow pops, and someone's dad.

      -ks

      --
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  2. Red Dye #3 by orthogonal · · Score: 3, Funny

    Great! Another reason to add more and more garish artifical colors to my sugar water.

    Gimme some more o' dat green "Romulan Ale"!

  3. I am from the Toledo area, history on Owens. by heldlikesound · · Score: 3, Interesting

    They declared bankrupcy after a huge loss in a class-action asbestos lawsuit. Then they went on to simply not pay many small design firms they owed money to. Pretty much puta few of them out of business. It was right around Christmas time too.

    Anyone think they'll pay these firms pay after plastic pop cans become all the rage? Yeah, me neither...

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    1. Re:I am from the Toledo area, history on Owens. by EnVisiCrypt · · Score: 3, Informative

      You're thinking of Owens-Corning.

      --


      *everything* is Orwellian to cats.
  4. Define new? by Trak · · Score: 2, Interesting

    This can may be new to the market, but it's not a new design. I held a prototype of this exact can (plastic body, aluminum top) while visiting a friend that worked at a 7UP plant back in the early 1980s, twenty years ago. The can was clear green plastic with the 7UP paint job. It was empty, but sealed.

    1. Re:Define new? by arb · · Score: 2

      And I recall in the mid-80s when "clear cola" was launched, there were several different brands of soft drink available in Australia in similar, clear plastic "cans". They were kinda cool...

  5. but! by DonFinch · · Score: 4, Funny

    how do you crush it on your forhead? A plasticy plunk is nowhere near as manishly satifying as the savory crash and pang of sweet, metallic destruction...

    --
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  6. How recyclable is it? by DaveOnNet · · Score: 4, Insightful

    How do the recycling folks like it? What's the number in the little triangle? I suppose they'll have to separate the top from the body to recycle it at all. Gotta love that!

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    1. Re:How recyclable is it? by Jahf · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I was about to post the same issue ... with my recycler, I have to separate plastics and aluminum before taking them to the drop off.

      Anyone know which is more environmentally sound to recycle: plastic or aluminum? I would have guessed the aluminum requires less energy and releases fewer gasses than plastic, but I'm not sure.

      If it's a matter of making the can cheaper to manufacture but more expensive to recycle, sorry, but I would rather the manufacturer pay for it than my local co-op recycler.

      If there is no downside to the recycling (and separation is still an issue) then it's a neat concept, but I just feel like aluminum is the more ecologically sound method right now. I would love to be proved wrong.

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    2. Re:How recyclable is it? by Strange+Ranger · · Score: 4, Interesting

      AFAIK, "Multi-layer injection molded" plastic is not really recyclable at all. Maybe they can melt it down and use it for plastic packing bubbles or something where the properties of the plastic don't matter much. But when you take a piece of "Multi-layer injection molded" plastic and melt it down the layers all melt together like a soup, their different properties mingling together into a plastic "grunge" that isn't usable for much. There is no way to seperate the layers and end up with anything like what you started with, i.e, make another can out of them.

      That is, this product is FAR less recyclable than aluminum cans.

      As far as I know that is, I'm no expert.

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    3. Re:How recyclable is it? by Anonymous+Codger · · Score: 2

      In my area, aluminum cans are recyclable. Plastic containers are only accepted if they have necks (don't ask me why). So these cottles or bans (to coin two words) are not recyclable here.

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    4. Re:How recyclable is it? by gaj · · Score: 2
      Yeah, I was all set to ask the "how will it recycle" question as well. Where I live, we seperate plastics, paper, glass and cans, with cans further devided between aluminum and non-aluminum. Until we moved out here, we could co-mingle (they used that word, I'm just parroting.)

      My guess would be that you are correct that currently aluminium is cheaper and easier to recycle. However, your comment "I would rather the manufacturer pay for it than my local co-op recycler" is a bit naieve. If the aluminum can is more expesive, they'll simply charge you more. That's not to say that, if the composite can is cheaper, they won't just scarf up the extra profit, mind you. If it is cheaper, it will allow them room to move the price down as necessary to encourage use of the new format, though. Once in a while that results in the price staying lower.

    5. Re:How recyclable is it? by ivan256 · · Score: 2

      with cans further devided between aluminum and non-aluminum

      That's probably a waste. They'll still have to pass them under a magnet because of stupid people who don't know the difference, or lazy people who just don't seperate. It's not very hard to automatically seperate steel cans from aluminum cans.

    6. Re:How recyclable is it? by gl4ss · · Score: 2

      well, that's exactly why i think it won't make it here(in finland).

      here all beverage/soda/juice cans have a pawn on them(15cents), the pawn-o-mats used to return the cans just crush the cans, so these plastic 'cool' cans wouldnt fit in. and they sure ain't going to replace all those automats for pointless one can.

      actually most people dislike cans around here anyways, except when trolling tax-free beer from foreign countries/cruises(note that these cans don't fit into the pawn-o-mats, theres a code on the cans that gets read).

      one major thing to include: NOBODY WILL BUY BEER IN PLASTIC CONTAINER!!! (even if the plastic wouldnt hurt taste)

      iirc the can return system makes them as environmentally friendly as return bottles that get used ~5-10(did a school project on the issue and this is iirc from few years back) times before crashing and making new(both plastic thick soda bottles and glass 0.3-1l bottles, they're not like the usual thin soda bottles i've seen elsewhere).

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    7. Re:How recyclable is it? by YaRness · · Score: 2

      >>NOBODY WILL BUY BEER IN PLASTIC CONTAINER!!!

      they already do if you haven't noticed, there's been plastic bottles of shitty beer out for years.

      and if you drink beer out of a can*, you clearly don't have enough taste to care about what kind of container it comes in.

      * - a notable exception to this is draught cans.

    8. Re:How recyclable is it? by www.whitehouse.org · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Anyone know which is more environmentally sound to recycle: plastic or aluminum? I would have guessed the aluminum requires less energy and releases fewer gasses than plastic, but I'm not sure.

      Aluminum. Virgin aluminum is a bitch on the environment (in terms of pollutants and land use), recycled is a hell of a lot better. Of course, recycled plastic is even better than that.

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    9. Re:How recyclable is it? by gl4ss · · Score: 2

      cultural differences then..

      you don't want to troll few 24packs(4 per person isn't that uncommon) of glass bottles out from a cruiseboat and then from a bus to your home, 4 24packs of cans is much more convenient. and cans aren't considered bad for beer here.

      nobody would settle to drink beer from plastic container around here, maybe one could buy IF IT WAS cheaper(it doesn't really matter when drinking to get drunk, and got seperate glass), but the cost of beer doesn't really depend around here on how cheap it is to manufacture or bottle. 0.33l glass bottles is the number one way to drink beer, and there's (also pawned) good plastic packs that hold 24 glass bottles for them(handy as festival chairs&etc, also handy for getting the bottles back to shop plus they make a moody sound when shaked when loaded full, kilikilikili), beer also comes in 1l glass bottles but rarely anyone drinks from them except when drinking with lunch/dinner/or so.

      fyi, beer costs here rougly 1$ per 0.33l bottle(or can).

      (draught can=keg with valve?)

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    10. Re:How recyclable is it? by Jahf · · Score: 3, Insightful
      However, your comment "I would rather the manufacturer pay for it than my local co-op recycler" is a bit naieve.

      Not in the least. I know I am going to be the one paying in the end no matter who bears the costs.

      The issue here is that my co-op recycler operates as a non-profit. They cover recycling costs with garbage [non-recyclable] fees ($2/can). I would rather the for-profit manufacturer deal with extra costs of bottling/canning than trickling it down to the local level.

      In fact, I'm purposefully paying -more- this way than if my recycler bore the brunt of the additional recycling cost (at least in the short term) since I pay nothing to drop off the recyclables.

      I'm willing to pay the little bit extra in the way of an aluminum fee to make sure I contribute that little bit less to the cost of recycling, thereby making recycling a more economical alternative and thereby making it more common.

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    11. Re:How recyclable is it? by disappear · · Score: 2

      If you think that Guinness is the gold standard for narrow-minded beer snobs, you don't know any real beer snobs.

      Most REAL snobs don't like Guinness --- they may say, "It's the definitive dry Irish stout," but that's meant to damn it with faint praise.

      Real beer snobs will say, "Guinness isn't bad, but Dogfish Head's World Wide Stout is REALLY something," or "Young's double chocolate stout is really much tastier," or "Pyramid's Obsidian Stout is much hoppier, and much tastier."

      Moreover (replying to the parent comment, not this one) I'll note that Guinness in cans is worse than Guinness in bottles or on draft: in order for the draught widget to work right, the beer has to be waaaay too cold to properly enjoy.

    12. Re:How recyclable is it? by disappear · · Score: 2
      I suppose it lets one feel superior to belittle standard beer when obviously any small brew (which is probably brewed at a large brewery anyway) with an obscure/odd name is far superior.

      It's not the size of the brewery, it's the quality of the beer. There are some very large English and German breweries that make some excellent beer.

      Out one side of their mouth they'll talk about the sancity of the German purity law, then turn around and rant and rave about how good the chocolate malts and cranberry winter wheat brews are.

      Actually, chocolate malts (the kind used in brewing, not the kind from the soda shop) are in fact just malted barley, roasted in a particular way. So many (though not all) chocolate stouts are Rhineheitsgebot compatible. Though of course the Germans don't brew stouts.

      The Germans do brew wheat beers, though. Even though they're not rhgbt-compatible, technically. But the Germans don't put cranberries in. ;-)

      And the Rhgbt is BS anyway: the Belgians totally ignore it, and even their big breweries put out some of the world's most incredible beers.

  7. More garbage, less recycling by MrEfficient · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Right now aluminum cans are recycled by many people because they bring a decent price and there are many places they can be sold. But plastic? As far as I know, there's no money to be made by an individual in recycling plastic and if there is, I doubt it's as much as aluminum.

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  8. Not at all new... by darkov · · Score: 2

    I was drinking out of these cans years ago (like 5 years). Yes, they looked somewhat "cool" becuase of the clear body, but they seemed to have disappeared. Was it becuase the contents tasted like crap? Packaging by itself isn't enough to make a successful product.

    1. Re:Not at all new... by DonFinch · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Packaging by itself isn't enough to make a successful product.

      Two words: Brittney Spears

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      -- Insert wisdom here:
    2. Re:Not at all new... by Hard_Code · · Score: 2

      "Packaging by itself isn't enough to make a successful product."

      Of course not. You also need a prize scam!

      Now you can get a FREE tricycle, or vacation in the bahamas if you just drink 5e99 cans of Mr. Blech!

      --

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  9. "It doesn't taste the same" by tswinzig · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Before the soda connoisseurs get on here and try to tell us they're not gonna like these because the soda from the metal cans tastes better than the soda from the plastic bottles, keep in mind the aluminum cans' interiors are coated with some sort of plastic material.

    Otherwise the carbonic acid would react with the aluminum, and leave you with a nasty taste (I believe due to Aluminum Oxide? but its been a while since high school Chemistry).

    --

    "And like that ... he's gone."
    1. Re:"It doesn't taste the same" by linuxbert · · Score: 2

      i am by no means a conousour, but i can taste a diffence between caned, and plastic bottled coke, and i like the caned one better.

      i dont know anything about the manufactureing process of either, but i think the contents of the can, taste better then the bottle, and avoid plastic for soda containers as a result.

    2. Re:"It doesn't taste the same" by arb · · Score: 2

      i am by no means a conousour, but i can taste a diffence between caned, and plastic bottled coke, and i like the caned one better.

      But Coke in glass bottles tastes even better still! ;-) Thank God they have started selling Coke in glass again!

    3. Re:"It doesn't taste the same" by Christopher+Thomas · · Score: 4, Informative

      Otherwise the carbonic acid would react with the aluminum, and leave you with a nasty taste (I believe due to Aluminum Oxide? but its been a while since high school Chemistry).

      Aluminum oxide is not soluble and almost certainly doesn't have any taste (it's even more stable than silica).

      What you get after dissolving aluminum with an acid is hydrogen and an aluminum-based salt. This would be aluminum carbonate for carbonic acid, and aluminum phosphate for the phosphoric acid many drinks use as a flavouring agent.

      I left a case of coke unused for about 6 months once. Tasted very odd after the lining broke down.

    4. Re:"It doesn't taste the same" by tswinzig · · Score: 2

      I left a case of coke unused for about 6 months once. Tasted very odd after the lining broke down.

      Did you die from drinking it?

      --

      "And like that ... he's gone."
    5. Re:"It doesn't taste the same" by Christopher+Thomas · · Score: 2

      I left a case of coke unused for about 6 months once. Tasted very odd after the lining broke down.

      Did you die from drinking it?

      Not yet, though I suppose the jury's still out.

      Strangely, it gave one heck of a caffeine/sugar rush. Not that I'm about to repeat the experiment.

  10. How is this different from... by Gid1 · · Score: 2

    this?

    I remember these transparent plastic cans with standard aluminium top at least ten years ago, selling here in the UK.

    AFAICR, the drink itself was foul.

    1. Re:How is this different from... by Cy+Guy · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Yeah the technology is definately not new, this has been the standard format for tennis ball cans for well over a decade. The question is market acceptance and given the recycling concerns, I can't see that being too great.

      You can already get beer in plastic bottles in the US but most people think the beer will not taste as good (for the Miller, Lite, and MGD brands that use the technology, taste isn't really a concern anyway - but somehow these consumers consider themselves beer conoisseurs if you change the bottling material). So given the limited acceptance of plastic bottles I've only seen them at sporting events where it is prefereable not to arm potentially drunken disgruntled fans with glass missiles just in case the home team loses.

  11. A New Revenue Source by Euphonious+Coward · · Score: 2
    It looks like Slashdot has discovered a new source of income: turning press releases into headlines. It's far from original, but it works -- for a while, anyway.

    At least I hope Slashdot collected some money for the headline. If not, they're bigger suckers than those of us who read the article.

    1. Re:A New Revenue Source by Blkdeath · · Score: 3, Insightful
      It looks like Slashdot has discovered a new source of income: turning press releases into headlines. It's far from original, but it works -- for a while, anyway.

      Newsflash for you, and for every other maroon who parrots the "Slashdot is selling out" / "Slashdot should charge advertising fees" lines; This is a site dedicated to news for nerds. Nerds like gadgets. They like cool toys, fast processors, high speed RAM, water cooling to make the best out of their new high speed toys, mods to make their toys look good, caffeinated products, sugary foods - how else is a news site supposed to tell people about these products without, oh, mentioning them by name? Are you going to clamour that they should charge AMD for announcing the Athlon 64 release to the market? Or they they should invoice Intel for announcing the Pentium 4 4.0GHz?

      It's news. Get over it. If you don't like it, go somewhere else and be uninformed. Stick to your Celeron 400MHz and thinnet LAN and quit bitching. It's old, and nobody cares.

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    2. Re:A New Revenue Source by Euphonious+Coward · · Score: 2
      I don't mind if Slashdot sells out. They're a business, after all.

      But promoting plastic sugar-water cans is pretty far afield from "News for Nerds". I don't see any way to turn these things into a microwave antenna. What's next, pearlescent eye-shadow colors? Britney's new album? (I'd better be careful, maybe Katz has already done those!)

  12. Cool factor? by Kj0n · · Score: 2

    Does this mean this can will keep my drink cool at all times?

    Or am I just expecting too much?

  13. Re:this one is unrecyclable by Bastian · · Score: 2

    Well, technically you can separate the aluminum from the plastic, but no consumer is going to take the time to do that - most people are still too lazy to take the screw caps off their plastic pop bottles before throwing them in the bin - and there is no way that it will be financially feasible for recycling companies to separate the aluminum from plastic themselves.

    Personally, this idea pisses me off enough to keep me from purchasing ever again from companies that bottle their beverages in these cans.

  14. what's next? by js7a · · Score: 2

    I have to disagree, the topic is, as they say, on.

  15. Japan has the opposite! by mcgroarty · · Score: 3, Interesting

    In Japan, you can buy bottles made completely out of aluminum. It's an aluminum can narrowing into a neck at the top with a traditional metal twist-off cap, and it's got a sticker around it which looks much like the decoration on a standard Coke can.

  16. Should be Using Transparent Aluminum by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 2
    or, more accurately, transparent alumina.

    here's the prior-art non-patent application:
    Method for making recycleable transparent beverage containers
    • heat up some alumina really hot
    • form it into a tube
    • seal the bottom
    • fill the can
    • crimp on the top
    • sell it for a huge premium
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  17. Re:To be or not to be stupid... by ivan256 · · Score: 3, Informative

    If the stupidity or laziness of a few makes the efforts of everyone else useless (they still have to pass them under a magnet), then the industrious and smart people should rebel and pretend they're stupid to send a message that thier time and efforts are being wasted.

    I'm sure technology has advanced sufficiently from when the following happened to prevent it, since it was over 10 years ago, but this is why I bet they still have to pass all the cans under a magnet:

    When I was in high school I worked in the kitchen periodically (we all had to rotate through cleanup duty). We had a recycling program run by our trash collection service. They provided statistics for us comparing what percentage (by weight and volume) of the things we threw away went to the landfill or were recycled. They were printed on greenbar and hung weekly on the board in the office. The recycling bins for cans were the extra large barrels with the hook and bar on them to be auto-loaded in the truck. After removing both ends of the can and stomping it flat, you could fit about 700 pounds of steel in the barrel. One week the recycling percentage dropped dramatically. The reason, they explained to us, was that someone had put an aerosol can in with the metal recyclables, and it made the whole load useless when they processed it. It's a great example of the stupidity of the few making everyone else's efforts useless when it comes to recycling.

  18. Re:Insulation? by 3waygeek · · Score: 2

    True, but it'll take longer to get cold, meaning increased refrigeration costs, which you'll end up paying for one way or another.

  19. This just in... by docbrown42 · · Score: 2

    ...Coke and Pepsi sale drop drasticly as consumers finally see what kinds of crap they've been drinking all these years!

    --
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  20. Nearly Ready? by John+Sullivan · · Score: 2

    A clear plastic 'can' and that's it? We've had these for several years in the UK - it was indeed just a 'cool' market attempt. They also had small carefully-density-controlled jelly balls floating throughout the drink. Seems to have pretty much died by now.

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  21. You left off one... by Valdrax · · Score: 2

    "Soft drink" -- a holdover from Prohibition times that's still used today. I've lived in the South, and I don't think I've ever heard "fountain drink" used except maybe to specifically refer to whether or not a drink comes from a can or a fountain. "Soft drink" is definitely more popular where I've lived, with "Coke" being the most often.

    (However, even living in Georgia, I've never actually heard anyone call any non-cola drink a "Coke." Ever.)

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    1. Re:You left off one... by Jahf · · Score: 2

      I was in Nashville for a few years and there it was mostly Coke or fountain drink (but you're right, only when in an establishment with a fountain).

      In Huntsville, AL it was hard to tell because so many people were not from there, but many of the natives used Coke or, yep, soft drink ... knew I'd forget something. Though one of my best friends would always refer to it as "getting a Dew" even on the rare occasions when he meant something other than Mountain Dew.

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  22. Re:and how? by Valdrax · · Score: 3, Interesting

    By the way, where i live its not "coke" and not pop (doesn't matter if its sprite, dr pepper, or coca cola)

    Where exactly is this? I've always wondered. You see, I've lived in Atlanta, the home of Coca-Cola, for six years, and I've never seen anyone call any non-cola beverage a Coke. I've seen Pepsi, RC, and hundreds of knock-off store brand colas called Coke, but I've never heard a Sprite, a Dr. Pepper, or anything else called a Coke.

    Personally, I think the whole "everything's a Coke" bit is an urban legend.

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  23. Sounds pretty cool... by dagg · · Score: 2
    Being a 23 year old woman, these things sound pretty cool. I can't wait to try them out. I bet they had people like me in mind when they made them (my demographic).

    But I wonder how dirty they get? Plastic seems to attract dirt worse than aluminum.

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