OpenOffice.org For Mac OS X

Chris Coleman writes "Move over Microsoft, OpenOffice.org is starting to take hold on Mac OS X. To facilitate this, we at Daemon News have put together a CD set that makes it really easy to install and use. We are also donating part of our booth space at Mac World Expo to the OpenOffice.org group to help spread awareness."

Comments

Re:Question.

[FyreFiend]

From the article:

Even if the X11 environment isn't running, when you click on the document it soon will be.

Interface

[aufecht]

So the installer has the Aqua interface, but what about the app? Screenshots anyone? I wonder if those memos and Emails of hysteria are flowing through Micorosoft this morning.

I am so excited!

[sharrestom]

The packaging for OpenOffice looks very professional, very attractive, though I hope the box is really large with lots of manuals. People want to buy a box with heft, you know, lots of weight, like it has big manuals in it. Maybe put a ream of inkjetpaper and a script on the back in big letters that creates a manual. People will like that. I'm going down to my CompUSA to ask that they stock this. It looks like it will cost over $500, with all of that weight, so I'll have to save up. This is bad for Microsoft. Now they will have to spend more money designing a heavier package for Office.

Quartz (Native OSX) version not ready yet.

[rf600r]

So says this page.

"The 1.0 sources build for Quartz (Mac OS X native). OpenOffice.org doesn't work there yet, but the program compiles and links, a large first step towards beginning our Quartz and Aqua tracks. If you're a developer, find out how to build and help us get the Quartz version finished and move onto our Aqua redesign effort! Special thanks to Dan B. and Dan W. for helping to push this along!"

No dice, it still requires X11

[analog_line]

I don't care if the interface is "Aquafied", but it's a non-starter with me unless it runs without X11. I have XDarwin installed and use it pretty regularly, and it kills any real multitasking, either by slowing everything else down in rootless mode, or requiring a full desktop shift. It sucks, and I use it as little as humanly possible.

So thanks, but no thanks. I'll certainly try it when the actual port gets working, but until it runs without X11, it might as well not exist.

Re:No dice, it still requires X11

[jbolden]

It sounds like you need a little more ram or a slightly faster CPU. For right now try a lighter window manager. Usually when people complain about X being slow they are using too much window manager for their machine.

Re:No dice, it still requires X11

[analog_line]

Are you going to give me the new computer?

Didn't think so...

Re:No dice, it still requires X11

[analog_line]

And, for the record, the window manager I'm using is the default, ugly fucking window manager. fvwm, I believe. I don't know how much more lightweight you can get.

Re:No dice, it still requires X11

[jbolden]

Its not openoffice that's doing look, feel and services but rather the OroborusOSX project (i.e. a X window manager that runs as a bridge between Aqua and X). My guess is that X apps will work about as well as Classic apps do now in say 2 years. GDK for OSX and QT for OSX will allow X apps to be recompiled and then you'll have something more like Carbon apps. Since at this point most of the "native apps sold today" are Carbon apps that's probably close enough. I wouldn't be suprised if Sun moves OpenOffice over to GTK/Gnome as part of their SunDesktop platform. So by say 2007 or so you'll have what you want.

note : not aqua, only X

[selderrr]

as long as they don't adopt the aqua interface, I doubt that they'll grab any serious marketshare. Mac is all about look & feel. About interface (you know, the lickable one...)

Currently openoffice runs only under X, which is butt-ugly and completely windows oriented. Not exactly what 'switchers' have in mind IMHO.

here is a screenshot that shows the diff between X and aqua (MS Ofifce in background). The price difference not withstanding, MSOffice is hands down the winner here.

My god you're ugly.

[l-ascorbic]

Screenshots comparing OpenOffice.org with Office v.X show quite how far it has to go. It simply looks ghastly.

Re:My god you're ugly.

[Alex Thorpe]

You're right, it looks like a Windows app. Save that there's also some side buttons of unknown use, as well as the usual top ones. I've never been a fan of rampant button bars.

Aqua adoption timeline

[selderrr]

more detailed schedule found here

Still a long way to go, but if they get it aquafied, MS might eventually get hurt. Offcourse, they'll change doc format faster than you can say 'blub'...

clipboard

[Twirlip of the Mists]

I know that the X11 primary selection is somehow bridged to the system clipboard, so you can select in an X11 application and paste in an OS X application and vice versa, but does this interface handle styled text or graphics? I use the clipboard for moving styled text, Unicode text, and images around all the time, and not being able to do that to and from my word processor would kill me.

Anybody know what the deal is here?

Re:clipboard

[goon america]

I don't know, but you can experiment using the pbcopy and pbpaste shell commands. You can pipe and direct in and out of them and everything. They're really cool.

Re:Question.

[ted_nugent]

If you want to run openoffice without X, try the (very) beta NeoOffice.

Re:Question.

[jbolden]

Neooffice is/was a proof of concept project. It isn't and its not going to be a end user product.

Attn X11 foes

[Znonymous Coward]

There is already an OOo port the is 100% Aqua (no need for X11!!!).

www.neooffice.org

www.neooffice.org/flaming_yeti_screenshots.html

Re:Attn X11 foes

[analog_line]

As this is a prototyping project, it is merely a proof of concept intended for software engineers

Mostly non-functional. Printing barely supported according to their comments. Nice, but I don't alpha-test software I'm not working on myself.

NeoOffice Screenshots

[knoxer]

Here are some screenshots for the latest public build of NeoOffice (prototype Aqua version of OpenOffice) http://www.neooffice.org/flaming_yeti_screenshots. html

Re:cool

[Blackstealth]

All Micro$oft products for Mac OS are very poor and crash a lot of times

I've been using Office v.X heavily since it was released and it's never crashed or failed on me yet. Internet Explorer is another kettle of fish tho...

What I hate about open office

[WasterDave]

I've been using OOo on Linux for about a year now. Yeah, it's competent, I guess. But it's not good, and it's office compatibility is not all it's cracked up to be.

Look, for instance at their own screenshots. Here the fonts are completely different, causing line breaks to take place in the wrong place, page breaks to do the same, orphaned half paragraphs and assorted shit that I'll have to go through and fix before I can print the bloody thing. Don't ask what happens when I forward the document to a colleague who uses word.

Sure, it's 99% there, but that's not enough. It's another demonstration of the "saving money by pushing my car around town" effect.

Dave

What a rush... to market

[Slur]

I haven't looked at the source code for OpenOffice but I tend to think this is the wrong approach to get this software onto the Mac. I'm sure the development team is very excited to see their baby can walk, but why not take the longer road and get it right? What's kewl for geeks is not always kewl for end users.

Assuming the program is written using intelligent design the data model and I/O controller should be almost completely isolated from the display code. If this is so then the bulk of work should consist of putting a decent Aqua interface on it, putting the menu bar where it belongs, and using Quartz for the text rendering.

Could it be that there's a limited supply of Mac-savvy open source developers available?

You're doing a disservice

[GlassHeart]

by promoting a product that is nowhere near ready for primetime. OpenOffice for Mac OS is at alpha level, suitable really only for developers and very brave and dedicated testers. Putting in a box raises expectations to unreasonable levels, and saying "move over Microsoft" is just downright crazy.

With lies like "amazing product that will soon give Microsoft a run for its money", free software doesn't even need enemies. Please do not promote free software to the general public until it is ready.

Re:You're doing a disservice

[anarkhos]

I doubt anybody will be fooled by your "Aquified" version. Aqua is not only an appearance, but a behavior. I've been pulling enough hair with Aqua-looking Swing apps as it is.

Re:You're doing a disservice

[GlassHeart]

OOo on Mac (for X11 of course) is stable, has OS X integration in the form of printing and Audio support, opens most anything we throw at it, and simply _works_.

First of all, I appreciate your hard work. I downloaded one of the earliest binaries available, and my impression then was "slow and buggy", which was to be expected.

However, "opens most anything" isn't in a position to tell "opens everything" to "move over". The Aqua interface and slow startup are huge roadblocks, and before that is completed, Office v.X simply has no real challenger. We need to be honest about that, or people will stop believing us, when it is indeed ready.

I went to MacWorld today, and if I'm not terribly mistaken, the office bundle in question is selling for about $50. Since OpenOffice is the core attraction, my concern is that enthusiastic folks will be disappointed. Look, Apple is about to sell iTunes, iMovie, iDVD, and iPhoto as a $50 bundle, and these are polished applications now.

People already think you get what you pay for. I stand by my statement that holding free software to a lower standard is a disservice. Just imagine what Microsoft would face if it shipped OpenOffice in this state.

Re:Question.

[Graff]

does it still require x11 installed?

According to what I have read on the site, yes. However, it also installs and sets up x11 for you. They worked with the person in charge of OroborOSX, an Aqua look-alike window manager. This means that all of the windows and widgets that are running under x11 will look and act like normal Aqua windows and widgets. I use OroborOSX all the time and it is one of the best ways to run x11 apps under MacOS X.

Useless until...

[commodoresloat]

This installer is useless until someone ports a talking paperclip to openoffice.

x runs great, use icewm

[b17bmbr]

go to fink.sf.net, install icewm, and then edit .xintrc to this:

#twm &
/sw/bin/icewm &

for some reason, on my ibook, when i run even oroborosx, it doesn't immedaitely pick up mouse clicks. in gimp, i have to click twice to switch from one window to the next. not so in icewm. it's lite and fast and is actually fairly feature rich. there is nothing wrong with X11. i have only 256MB on my 700mhz ibook. i run X and aqua concurrently and have no problems. the biggest gripe about OO.org is it takes forever to load. they trashed the desktop, but they still kept the apps tied. if i load writer, i don't need the calc and impress libs loaded too. msoffice is "integrated" yet each are distinctly different apps. OO.org needs to do this.

Re:Abiword?

[Arandir]

Does OpenOffice lack confidence in their own word processor?

OpenOffice didn't create this CD, Daemon News did.