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Suggestions for POST Diagnostic Cards?
antis0c asks: "I have a number of PC's of mine, and family that have stopped working, or caused other odd unknown failures such as 4 different harddrives, different brands, all becoming physically damaged in the same computer. General fixing is as easy as removing some hardware until the problem goes away, then putting it back until it comes back, thus narrowing down to the single problem hardware. However more tricky problems require a POST Card. I've never purchased one before and I think I could get more use out of older hardware if I did, and I was wondering if the Slashdot community had any suggestions and comments on the various brands out there such as POSTmortem, MSD PostCodeMaster, and PC Engines. Thanks."
Just go out and buy the 'first POST' card you see.
Damn, it's just too easy.
Unfortunately, no one can be told what my sig is...
but that was too easy.
Ahh yes, POST cards. Points Out Stuffed Technology. Before they came in card form, it used to be a little midget in your computer (mind you, back then computers filled entire nations, so they were actually giants) and they'd run around saying "Oooh, look at that! It's stuffed!", for which we'd be forever grateful.
If you can pick up one of these, you'll save yourself tonnes, because POST midgets are cheap, reliable and they feed and clothe themselves. Mind you, when they get bored they start to play with your hardware, so remember to keep a cattle prod close by.
So which brand to get? Choose one that's polite, friendly, doesn't smell to bad (it can get hot in there, people, and they don't like having cooling fans strapped to their heads) and knows his shit. There's nothing worse than a POST midget who insists that "Houston, we have a problem. The red light is flashing" whenever you read data from the hard disk.
This sig intentionally left bla... dammit!
Who's got the whiteout?
The single biggest cause of problems in a computer system that was once stable is bad connections. Just open up the case, pull out all connectors and adapter cards a few millimeters, and push them back. That cleans the contacts.
That said, I have no idea how well it works, or what the delay is now that he's moved. But I'd vouch for his good guy status, and he's shipped other high quality parts to me.
The actual part is so deathly simple, it should just read I/O port 80 and put it on an LED, so I can't imagine there is a bunch of difference in quality, but that's just me. Last time I needed one, the hardware engineer in the cubie next to me just hooked up his logic analyzer and 2 minutes later I had the post code.
Kirby
I have had good experience with the POST Code Master.
A nice touch is that the card will monitor voltage rails and test its own LED segments.
I also had the opportunity to meet the developer of the card - a nice guy.
What are you doing with this machine? You're not putting DRM-enabled drives into your Kazaa server are you?
"Accept that some days you are the pigeon, and some days you are the statue." - David Brent, Wernham Hogg
And, how are we related?
http://www.google.com/search?num=50&hl=en&ie=ISO-8 859-1&q=diagnostic+POST+cards+
Grab a spare video card. Then use it just with the MB and CPU. If it doesn't work you know either the CPU or MB are fucked and it's not worth fixing either, go to the second hand store and grab another set.
The famous german c't Magazine has instructions how to build a very simple ISA-based POST card, using only two GALs, a two-digit seven segment LED display, and 15 resistors. You can buy the programmed GALs at eMedia (order code 9503314PAL, 9,50 EUR, roughly the same in US$). The full article is available online for 0,40 EUR. (If you create a new account, you will get 1,00 EUR to play with. So basically, it is free.)
I built one POST card myself, and I never leave home without it. ;-)
Denken hilft.
I've got this card, and it's great -- monitors bus voltages, and also has latching LEDs for each IRQ and DMA channel. Has a BIOS extension on it that includes a bunch of diagnostics (including par/ser loopback, drive and RAM exercising, etc.) so you can do quite a bit of testing without (or despite :-) an OS.
Of course, just a few months after I bought the card the manufacturer dried up and blew away. Now I need a PCI equivalent and haven't seen one out there.
4 drives in the same machine? damnit man, put a fan on them. Heat causes the early demise of most harddrives. You'd think after the first couple you'd have figured that out...
Let me get this straight, you want a good POST diagnostic card packed with all the latest features?
So, what your really looking for are POST cards from the edge?
No thanks required. No, really.
"Accept that some days you are the pigeon, and some days you are the statue." - David Brent, Wernham Hogg
I bought an Ultra-X P.H.D. board after a trade show and I've been very happy with it. I got it packaged with their Quick Tech diagnostic software and some various plugs and control BIOS chips and they've helped out on a number of very dead systems. The board can find bad RAM (providing there is a working memory controller) and any number of other problems. I picked up the whole kit for under $1000 (show pricing) and I'd say I've got my money's worth out of it. My only regret is that I got the ISA version because at the time I was pretty much guaranteed to have ISA in any machine I was working on, but now with the legacy free machines, I kinda wish I'd gone with the PCI version. You can find them at http://www.uxd.com.
Power ON Self Tests are what the BIOS conduct automatically to check the buss traffic and see if there are any tie ups. Also known as BEEP Codes, they cause the computer to beep the first time it is started up. If the computer has a working speaker you can use this function of the BIOS. It requires that you know who made the BIOS and what their BEEP Codes are. SEEN HERE: http://www.computerhope.com/beep.htm
I've done tech work at just about every level, and I've used several POST cards. I honestly haven't found them to be THAT reliable. Sure, it's nice to have confirmation that something is broken, instead of the result of a loose cable or an installation "oops", but I'd far rather have a memory-test card than a post card.
RAM problems can be a lot more annoying to diagnose IMO, while the times I've used POST cards, I either haven't learned anything from them, or I've gotten conflicting results from repeated uses.
-- I wanna decide who lives and who dies - Crow T. Robot, MST3K
You can buy an HP logic analyzer on EBay and program them to do PCI decodes and record POSTs. The deep throats and the new wizbang color models are still very expensive but you can get one that will work for well under a thousand.
I debugged the Linux kernel boot process on an embedded box with POSTs and an HP logic analzyer. One you get some hardware geek to set it up for you it's a slick way to work on that kind of stuff.
I understand that Stabilant is a good product; I 've never used it. However, it has the world's worst web site.
I built my own ISA card years ago, all it has to do is decode port 80. It took 2 IC's to decode the address bus, and 2 to drive the LEDs. I haven't been able to find any info on PCI post codes (or much of anything on the PCI bus).
My latest MB (MSI KT3 Ultra) has a built in post display feature. I like that because it's my first board with no ISA slots.
Jason
ProfQuotes
So, does Stabilant work? You paint the connector contacts and then you have no more trouble with bad contacts? Is there anything I should know about how it is used?
$1000 or so for a good POST card would easily buy you a few new machines. Why bother wasting your time for parts that are so cheap to replace these days. Why do you think nobody does board level work anymore? It costs more money due to time spent than to just replace the thing. Well.. aside from everythign being surface mounted...
I like the diagnostic tools from Micro2000 at www.micro2000.com - I have had a copy of their diagnostic software and POST-probe card for years. I have usually upgraded to a new version of the diagnostic every three years or so, on general purposes.
I have used the POST probe card to figure out that a machine had a goobered BIOS which needed to be reset. Wouldn't boot at all. The POST probe card gave me the answer that put the PC back in use in 5 minutes.
I've used the diagnostic software to track down a "blue screen of death" problem. Turned out to be a single flakey memory bit. Ran the diagnstics in a continuous loop over a long weekend and came back to a report that showed a bad bit once every 15 or 20 writes. Micron sent me new memory with no flack whatsoever.
All I can say is I've used it and it has worked for me. I'm not a super geek or anything, just a regular guy who likes to mess about with computers and who owns his own business. Goobered computers = lost money. There may be better tools and probably advice from someone who actually knows what he is talking about.
Pretty good documentation, and the last time I called their tech support line in short order I was able to talk to a real person who convinvced me they had a clue about diagnosing goobered PCs.
They also offer a USB diagnostic thingy - don't have one so can't comment.
I don't have experience with any other brand of card, so I can't tell how the Micro2000 POST probe card stacks up against others.
not when whole systems cost less than a game console.
Now I'm curious. What make and model of PC with TV output costs less than $150, the US price of a GameCube console at Wal-Mart or Toys "Ya" Us? And unless Wal-Mart or Best Buy brick-and-mortar stores sell them, include shipping.
Will I retire or break 10K?
You can usually find them on ebay for around 50 bucks or less. Don't bother buying one of those 200 dollar ones because you will never use it enough to justify the cost and why spend 200 when you can get one that does the same thing for 40.