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FCC Proposes Fining AT&T Over DNC Violation
Iphtashu Fitz writes "The FCC has just announced a proposed $780,000 fine against AT&T for violating the recently enacted Do Not Call telemarketing rules. The FCC charges that AT&T marketers called 29 consumers on 78 different occasions after those consumers had signed up on the Do Not Call list. The FCC has posted a press release (pdf) to this effect on their web site."
Personally, I support the DNC list - I hate being interrupted at all hours of day or night for solicitations. My motto? - If I want your product/service - I'll come to you to find out what you have to offer.
I say this is great because if AT&T gets fined, it shows that nobody's above the rules and will send a message to all the smaller telemarketers who might be tempted to ignore the DNC. It's nice to know that nobody, no matter how big or small, is above the rules.
On the other hand, as we all know, the DNC is hotly contested in court as possible free speech violations, among other things. I don't think the courts really care about the small telemarketer and their rights, but someone with the size, lobbying ability, and lawyer teams that AT&T has really could put up a good fight to the law.
It's a nice precedent to see AT&T fined for this, but I hope it doesn't backfire.
SEARCHING FOR SIG
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READY.
This is based on the rules that have long been in place that you can request that a company put you on their internal do not call list.
Si vis pacem, para bellum
The only thing more annoying than a Libertarian is an (un|mis)informed Libertarian
It must all be a mistake.
Surely the consumers had opted-in with a business partner.
Caution: Do not look into laser beam with remaining eye.
Figure that 1 out of 100 consumers who receive calls in violation of the DNC submit compaints.
Out of 300 who complained (probably slightly less, since some may have complained multiple times), 29 of them were accepted, or about 1 in 10.
So one could assume that for every violation that was reported, investigated, and verified, about 1000 went unpunished.
So the actual penalty comes out to about $10 per actual violation, reported or not.
According to this article the fine is not for violating the recently enacted DNC list, but rather for violating separate FCC rules. Specifically if someone asks you to remove their name from your list you are required to do so.
What is also interesting is AT&T's reaction in the above article, as I have had telemarketers call me offerring me things like identity theft protection on my AT&T Universal card, yet they aren't at all affiliated with AT&T.
I am impressed. The DNC registry has worked for me. I used to get calls all the time. The only people who call now are the bill collectors. I did get one charity, which quickly added me to their DNC list after I queried why they were calling me and I got one real pollster doing a real poll, which I don't actually mind.
The only thing left is for the year to end so that the Must Transmit Caller ID information is in force. I thought it took effect the same time as the DNC, but it doesn't actually take effect to the new year. Anyone automated calling to your house must transmit caller ID information and they have to take proactive steps to actually transmit the information. No excuses.
D.O.U.O.S.V.A.V.V.M.
AT&T Called me about a week after the list was turned on.. of course I got the name and number of the person calling me and then explained that I'm on the DNC list. Would believe she freaked out and asked to not be identified or report her company.
I was like "I've been bombarded by spam from all directions for the last 15 years.. it's on my truck, my answering machine, my email and the d**n phone. You bed your telemarketing arse I'm reporting you."
I did however leave her last name out of the complaint but ya know what.. at work if I screw up the FAA can fine me 10k.. they should be just as careful.
They were calling to sell me broadband access... but they made sure to preface their call with "you recently purchased a laptop from us". As this Do Not Call thing swings into use I forsee the value of knowing who companies sell their products to significantly more valuable than it's ever been. It used to be that only Radio Shack asked who you were ... get used to EVERYONE doing it ... because they'll be able to partner with other retailers and cross-sell products using that loophole in the Do-Not-Call law.
And actually, this being a civil rather than a criminal matter makes proving the case that much easier - instead of "Beyond a reasonable doubt", it has to be proven "By a preponderance of evidence".
To put that into perspective - OJ was found "Not Guilty" in a criminal court, because it wasn't proven beyond a reasonable doubt that he did it. The civil court proceedings, however, found him guilty "By a preponderance of evidence". So, by one standard he's not guilty, by another he is guilty. At the end of the day, he killed 'em, but the case wasn't good enough to prosecute criminally.
For our purposes of the DNC list, I would think that this will make nailing the slime who try to weasel through the loopholes easier...we don't have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that they're a weasel, we just have to show through a preponderance of evidence that they are a small, furry mammal of the Mustelid family, behaving in a weasel-like way.
The preceeding is noted as being gratuitously insulting to weasels, for which I apologize.
If we have to have a Big Brother (which apparently we do), at least it's nice to have one that will beat up people who keep bothering you.
Jeezus, I'd love to have a "proposed" fine the next time I get a speeding ticket.
It is a proposed fine. Go to court and offer a counter proposal by following the instructions printed on the back of the ticket. Chances are it will be substantially less. The only way it becomes the actual fine is if you don't challenge the proposal.
Dacels Jewelers can't be trusted.
Your right of free speech stops at my mailbox. The constitution does not give you the right to electronically barge your way (uninvited) into my home, demand the use of my equipment and ink and paper supplies to present your message, shifting all your selling costs to me without my permission or request.
0 3/022705P.p df
Can you imagine a whole new class of "door-to-door" salesmen who knocked on your door, entered your house uninvited, demanded the use of your possessions, showed their product and then claimed that you had no right to stop them because it would violate their right of free speech?
The TCPA has been around for over 10 years now and has been upheld to be constitutional, but that doesn't prevent lawyers from trying the same old arguments again and again. They include: Destination Ventures, Ltd. v. FCC, 46 F.3d 54, (9th Cir. 1995), and Moser v. FCC, 46 F.3d 970 (9th Cir. 1995), cert. denied, 515 U.S. 1161. See also Kenro, Inc. v. Fax Daily, Inc., 962 F. Supp. 1162 (S.D. Indiana 1997). Linder v. Thrifty Oil negates the popular "minimal harm" argument.
Because cert to the US Supreme Court was denied in the 9th Circuit, it means that the operating law is the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals ruling which unanimously upheld the TCPA as constitutional. The 9th Circuit is the largest of the 13 federal circuits so this ruling holds a lot of weight. It covers California, Oregon, Washington, Arizona, Montana, Idaho, Nevada, Alaska, Hawaii, Guam or the Northern Mariana Islands. In addition, federal district courts in three circuits have also upheld the constitutionality of the TCPA.
An 8th Circuit District Court (Eastern District of Missouri) judge ruled (March 13, 2002) that the TCPA is unconstitutional. The judge was none other than Rush Limbaugh's uncle, Steven Limbaugh, Sr. Limbaugh's bogus ruling was reversed, as we predicted, by the 8th Circuit Court of Appeals on March 21, 2003. (it is important for you all to understand the differences between a ruling being reversed, remanded, or otherwise directed. Reversed pretty much means that something was in such gross error, it should have never existed.)
http://www.ca8.uscourts.gov/opndir/03/
More infor can be found at junkfax.org
Cave, wreck, and deep diver.
They aren't that well researched in the demographics department. Here's a typical sample with the cast of AT&T Rep and myself:
AR: We're offering a special long distance package for you. May I ask who provides you with your long distance service?
Me: Yes. I don't have a long distance service.
AR: You don't have one?
Me: Yes.
AR: Sir, do you make any long distance phone calls?
Me: No. (pause to enhance clueless consumer effect)
AR: Sir, we'd like to-
Me: (interrupts) Actually, yes, I make local long distance phone calls.
AR: You don't have a long distance service provider but you make local long distance calls?
Me: Yes.
AR: How is that sir? Do you use pre-paid phone cards?
Me: No.
AR: Uh... How do you place local long distance calls sir?
Me: I use my mobile phone.
AR: And, sir, who is you wireless phone service provider?
Me: AT&T.
AR: Oh... (long pause)... Thank you for your time sir, you have a good night.
I've had this conversation with AT&T three times now. The novelty has not yet worn off. I wonder when they'll compile a list of existing customers, so they can save money on long distance calls.
=D
Fred
"A fool and his freedom are soon parted"
-RMS
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