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Microsoft Drags Feet with Settlement Claims

An anonymous reader writes "Microsoft is holding up compensation claims from a quarter of million Californians in order to punish Lindows.com, and to coerce the class action plaintiffs 'into siding with Microsoft against its Lindows competitor,' according to a court filing seen by The Register. The document, filed on 21st November by Townsend and Townsend and Crew, lead counsel for the Californian class action consumers, points out that none of the claims being held up was actually filed via Lindows.com, yet Microsoft has held them 'hostage' for over two months."

22 of 133 comments (clear)

  1. Argh by SpiffyMarc · · Score: 4, Funny

    They need to hurry up and process all the legitimate claims filed with proper proof-of-purchase, so they can get down to what really matters... processing all those phony ones from MSFreePC.com!

    *eagerly awaiting his ill-gotten gains*

  2. A move for the books? by NightWulf · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I'm not a professional accountant, but could this be a move for the stock? According to the article, they won't have to pay out all 1.1 billion but there will still be a good chunk of money paid out. If they can keep delaying this until after the end of the year, they wouldn't have to report it on this quarters accounting forms. It would seen to me, even for MS, a big cash payment like that will look serious on paper. I could be wrong in my facts though.

    1. Re:A move for the books? by Prof.+Pi · · Score: 4, Insightful
      If they can keep delaying this until after the end of the year, they wouldn't have to report it on this quarters accounting forms.

      Only to have it as a charge on next quarter's earnings report? What would they gain from that? I know modern execs have an extreme short-term outlook, but that would really be extreme. Unless some guy is getting ready to retire and his retirement bonus is based on this year's stock performance.

    2. Re:A move for the books? by Registered+Coward+v2 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I'm not a CPA either, but IAR once you have a reasonable expectation of paying out the cash you take a charge for the full amouunt, which you can reduce if you discover you overestimated the actual payout.

      Side note - this allows companies to control earnings by overestimating, for allowances for unpaid debts. Say you overestimate by 1 billion dollars (in a period where earnings are great) - you can discover your error in a period where earnings are poor, magically adding back earnings removed earlier.

      --
      I'm a consultant - I convert gibberish into cash-flow.
  3. Gee, what a suprise! by crass751 · · Score: 5, Funny

    Microsoft is dragging its feet on settlement claims?

    In other news...
    Water is wet!
    The Sky is blue!
    Ice is cold!
    and so on ad nauseum.

  4. Battle of resources, not facts by mabu · · Score: 5, Informative

    Is anyone surprised?

    It doesn't matter whether we're talking about SCO, Microsoft, the DMCA, RIAA, or Michael Jackson. The new get-rich-quick or save-your-ass business model is now based on seeing who can legally travel the farthest on the gas they have in their tank.

    1. Re:Battle of resources, not facts by mattjb0010 · · Score: 5, Funny

      It doesn't matter whether we're talking about SCO, Microsoft, the DMCA, RIAA, or Michael Jackson.

      Well the RIAA and Michael Jackson have been going after little kids, but Microsoft?

    2. Re:Battle of resources, not facts by Maestro4k · · Score: 5, Interesting
      • Is anyone surprised?

        It doesn't matter whether we're talking about SCO, Microsoft, the DMCA, RIAA, or Michael Jackson. The new get-rich-quick or save-your-ass business model is now based on seeing who can legally travel the farthest on the gas they have in their tank.

      Well, yes and no. I'm not surprised because I know Microsoft tends to behave this way, but at the same time, I'm a tad surprised at how flagrantly they're thumbing their nose at all the governments (states and federal) that these settlements effect. As for federal, things aren't looking perfectly hunky-dory for MS on that front, as thre seems to be a fair chance the holdout state may manage to get tougher sanctions placed on MS.

      Yes, I know we all think Microsoft is the Evil Empire (tm), but even evil empires/villians generally know when it's time to shut the hell up and at least pretend to play by the rules for a while. Hasn't MS learned by now that further antagonization very well may cause them to end up in bigger trouble? If they start ticking off enough business and individuals, they may find not only public sentiment totally against them, but some seriously powerful lobbying interests pulling out the big guns to launch attacks on them. That could hurt a lot more than any of the current judicial cases/settlements would, and definitely would be far worse than the miniscule amount of money they'll be out by playing by the rules of the game in this case.

    3. Re:Battle of resources, not facts by Trurl's+Machine · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Yes, I know we all think Microsoft is the Evil Empire (tm), but even evil empires/villians generally know when it's time to shut the hell up and at least pretend to play by the rules for a while.

      Sorry for straying offtopic, but this is generally not true. Actually most empires in history fall just because they went for yet another "easy prey" and bitterly discovered that it wasn't that easy after all. Would the Soviets keep away from Afghanistan, they could pretty well still be in Kremlin. Would Napoleon keep away from Kremlin, he could pretty well keep Paris, Vienna, Berlin, Rome and Madrid till the end of his days. And still this lesson didn't keep Hitler from repeating exatcly the same mistake. The same goes with the villains - Al Capone could live his days in luxury if he wouldn't be too greedy.

      DISCLAIMER - no, I am not saying that Bill Gates is like Hitler or Capone; I'm just saying that history proves, that saying "Okay, I have gained enough, now is the time for peaceful consumption of what I've got" is actually the MORE difficult part than saying "Let's build an empire from scratch".

    4. Re:Battle of resources, not facts by sultanoslack · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Yes, I know we all think Microsoft is the Evil Empire (tm), but even evil empires/villians generally know when it's time to shut the hell up and at least pretend to play by the rules for a while. Hasn't MS learned by now that further antagonization very well may cause them to end up in bigger trouble?

      No, because it hasn't landed them in bigger trouble. They continue to ignore the legal system and it continues to be very profitable for them. And they'll keep thwarting the legal system as for them it's been a working strategy.

      Microsoft has learned that they can win most of their court cases and get slap-on-the-hand settlements for the rest and then see to it that the slap doesn't even actually happen.

    5. Re:Battle of resources, not facts by Daniel+Dvorkin · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Response to disclaimer: I'll probably get lynched for saying this, but Gates is actually not a bad guy. Really. He's already given away somewhere in the neighborhood of $20 billion, roughly half his fortune, and is actively working on giving the rest of it away.

      If you rob a bank, and give half your ill-gotten gains to charity, and on your deathbed give away what's left ...

      ... you're still a bank robber.
      --
      The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
  5. MS has a point on this by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I know someone from IRC who openly brags about making up information to get a free download of Staroffice 7, because he says his claim will end up being thrown out. The fact is, it does encourage people to make up phony claims, and unfortunately, people like the one I mention above will probably never be caught. This is exactly one of Microsoft's objections, and they couldn't be more right in what they've said. By requiring people to file claims through the court, as would normally happen, people are much less able to make phony claims. As much as I don't like Microsoft, and even though they're guilty, it doesn't make it right to steal from them, or from Lindows.

    It's a nice idea to encourage people to claim their piece of the settlement, and as much as I like seeing it happen to Microsoft, it really can't be done in a fair and legal way.

  6. How was this going to work in the first place? by benna · · Score: 4, Insightful

    From what I read, they don't require the proof that the settlement requires, so how are they going to get the money? And what's stopping you from filing claims with both MS and Lindows? I doubt MS is going to share it's data with Lindows.

    --
    "It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
    1. Re:How was this going to work in the first place? by evilviper · · Score: 4, Interesting
      Yikes... Where to start tearing apart your post?

      From what I read, they don't require the proof that the settlement requires

      I don't know what the hell you read, but the Microsoft standard claim form requires practically NOTHING. Name of product, where you got it, your own address, and signature... That's it. I have the form right in front of me as a matter of fact.

      And what's stopping you from filing claims with both MS and Lindows?

      The same thing that stops you from filing two claims with Microsoft... When Microsoft recieves the information, they see that they've already paid one, and refuse the other.

      I doubt MS is going to share it's data with Lindows.

      That's how Lindows gets their money. If Microsoft doesn't pay Lindows for your claim, then Lindows doesn't pay you. Simple.
      --
      Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
  7. Interesting Thought..... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    How many other companies can afford to pay 1.1 billion and barely feel it....?????
    ONE

  8. Re:Hmmm... by loknor · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "The document, filed on 21st November by Townsend and Townsend and Crew, lead counsel for the Californian class action consumers, points out that none of the claims being held up was actually filed via Lindows.com"

    'nuff said

    --

    me karma am bad
  9. Inventory control by Prof.+Pi · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Probably a company like IBM has a thorough system in place. But then again, MS wouldn't be crazy enough to sue someone that big over a few licenses (especially when they can pay SCO to make trouble for them).

    But how many small businesses are going to be that efficient? Especially when the guy who runs the systems is probably someone doing it part time along with his other duties, who may have been handed the job by the last guy who left, without a significant training period (after all, Windows is so easy to run, right?). A lot of small research labs (e.g., under one professor at a university) are run like this, usually by student volunteers.

    And the point is, Microsoft accuses you of theft without any proof whatsoever. They have no way of tracking where that version came from, to know, for instance, if it was copied from some other disk). They have no witnesses to testify that they saw you make the copy illegally (unless they can find the guy you laid off last week and he has a grudge). But "innocent until proven guilty" means nothing. It's more like, "we have more lawyers than you and can grind you into the dust whenever we choose, so wouldn't you rather have a site license and end all these worries?"

  10. This isn't about MyFreePc folks!!! by Maestro4k · · Score: 5, Interesting
    Ack, so many posts already, all saying that they agree that the MyFreePC site is probably plagued by cheats. Come on guys, that's not the main point in this article!!! It plainly says the following: "The document, filed on 21st November by Townsend and Townsend and Crew, lead counsel for the Californian class action consumers, points out that none of the claims being held up was actually filed via Lindows.com, yet Microsoft has held them 'hostage' for over two months."

    This is about Microsoft wanting its way and screwing over innocents to try and get it. They're just being whiney crybabies here about MyFreePC. Sure, they may have some legit complaints about MyFreePC, but that shouldn't stop them from processing legitimate claims that have nothing at all to do with MyFreePC! This is truly just pathetic behaivor on MS's part.

  11. It's just an accounting maneuver by heironymouscoward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The bulk of this money will return to Microsoft in the form of new income. So logically, they have no reason to block the settlement. I deduce therefore that it's a subtle way of pumping profits into 2004.

    Or maybe Microsoft just hate Michael Robertson so much they would rather find themselves in breach of the settlement than pay one red cent... Nah, can't be.

    --
    Ceci n'est pas une signature
  12. This can't be true! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    What? A benevolent, law-abiding company like Microsoft, whose only goal is to make people's lives better and more productive, trying to chisel people out of money it owes them? This can't be true. It's those anti-Microsoft zealots at it again. Don't believe everything you read on Slashdot.

  13. Mail Merge by drdestructo · · Score: 5, Funny

    Give 'em a break, they're still running the mail merge for the form letter response...

  14. How future MS settlements should be handled by shadow255 · · Score: 5, Interesting
    Let this be a warning to any other states which have not yet completed class actions against Microsoft for anticompetitive pricing. Any settlement reached should require that Microsoft place the settlement amount, in cash, into an escrow account managed by an impartial third party with disbursements to be managed by said third party with strict guidelines and regular court oversight.

    It's time to stop letting these things get turned into PR circuses benefiting the the defendant who chooses to settle out of court (and apparently giving no benefit to the plaintiffs, so far).

    Standard disclaimer: IANAL, use this advice at your own peril, yada-yada-yada.

    --

    Logic is a wonderful thing but doesn't always beat actual thought. -Terry Pratchett