Slashdot Mirror
Microsoft Drags Feet with Settlement Claims
An anonymous reader writes "Microsoft is holding up compensation claims from a quarter of million Californians in order to punish Lindows.com, and to coerce the class action plaintiffs 'into siding with Microsoft against its Lindows competitor,' according to a court filing seen by The Register. The document, filed on 21st November by Townsend and Townsend and Crew, lead counsel for the Californian class action consumers, points out that none of the claims being held up was actually filed via Lindows.com, yet Microsoft has held them 'hostage' for over two months."
gathers GAY NIGGERS from all over America and abroad for one common goal - being GAY NIGGERS.
Are you GAY ?
Are you a NIGGER ?
Are you a GAY NIGGER ?
If you answered "Yes" to any of the above questions, then GNAA (GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA) might be exactly what you've been looking for!
Join GNAA (GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA) today, and enjoy all the benefits of being a full-time GNAA member.
GNAA (GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA) is the fastest-growing GAY NIGGER community with THOUSANDS of members all over United States of America. You, too, can be a part of GNAA if you join today!
Why not? It's quick and easy - only 3 simple steps!
First, you have to obtain a copy of GAY NIGGERS FROM OUTER SPACE THE MOVIE and watch it. (click here to download the 280MB MPEG from BitTorrent)
Second, you need to succeed in posting a GNAA "first post" on slashdot.org, a popular "news for trolls" website
Third, you need to join the official GNAA irc channel #GNAA on EFNet, and apply for membership.
Talk to one of the ops or any of the other members in the channel to sign up today!
If you are having trouble locating #GNAA, the official GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA irc channel, you might be on a wrong irc network. The correct network is EFNet, and you can connect to irc.secsup.org or irc.easynews.com as one of the EFNet servers.
If you do not have an IRC client handy, you are free to use the GNAA Java IRC client by clicking here.
If you have mod points and would like to support GNAA, please moderate this post up.
This post brought to you by Penisbird , a proud member of the GNAA
G_____________________________________naann_______ ________G
N_____________________________nnnaa__nanaaa_______ ________A
A____________________aanana__nannaa_nna_an________ ________Y
A_____________annna_nnnnnan_aan_aa__na__aa________ ________*
G____________nnaana_nnn__nn_aa__nn__na_anaann_MERI CA______N
N___________ana__nn_an___an_aa_anaaannnanaa_______ ________I
A___________aa__ana_nn___nn_nnnnaa___ana__________ ________G
A__________nna__an__na___nn__nnn___SSOCIATION_of__ ________G
G__________ana_naa__an___nnn______________________ ________E
N__________ananan___nn___aan_IGGER________________ ________R
A__________nnna____naa____________________________ ________S
A________nnaa_____anan____________________________ ________*
G________anaannana________________________________ ________A
N________ananaannn_AY_____________________________ ________S
A________ana____nn_________IRC-EFNET-#GNAA________ ________S
A_______nn_____na_________________________________ ________O
*_______aaaan_____________________________________ ________C
um, dolor. Nunc nec nisl. Phasellus blandit tempor augue. Donec arcu orci, adipiscing ac, interdum a, tempus nec, enim. Phasellus placerat iaculis orci. Crasa sit amet quam. Sed enim quam, porta quis, aliquet quis, hendrerit ut, sem. Etiam fe
FIRST POST
Glen Dawson 1309 (1:23:01 AM): Hey biznatchhomie69!
Glen Dawson 1309 (1:23:12 AM): Last year, CowboyNeal's boobs grew. A lot. He's so proud of them, he shows them to EVERYBODY
PLANT BUSH BACK IN TEXAS!
Does this mean that all of us who filed via the Lindows method are going to be stiffed? I did receive a claim form direct from the court...I wonder If I should file it. It says I have until March 15, 2004.
They need to hurry up and process all the legitimate claims filed with proper proof-of-purchase, so they can get down to what really matters... processing all those phony ones from MSFreePC.com!
*eagerly awaiting his ill-gotten gains*
fifth post
I'm not a professional accountant, but could this be a move for the stock? According to the article, they won't have to pay out all 1.1 billion but there will still be a good chunk of money paid out. If they can keep delaying this until after the end of the year, they wouldn't have to report it on this quarters accounting forms. It would seen to me, even for MS, a big cash payment like that will look serious on paper. I could be wrong in my facts though.
Microsoft is evil!
It's not like Lindows is free, they charge $59.95 for the crap.
Microsoft is dragging its feet on settlement claims?
In other news...
Water is wet!
The Sky is blue!
Ice is cold!
and so on ad nauseum.
Now in news just to hand:
Sun rises in the east.
Sheesh
Non-Microsoft-based VPS Hosting
Is anyone surprised?
It doesn't matter whether we're talking about SCO, Microsoft, the DMCA, RIAA, or Michael Jackson. The new get-rich-quick or save-your-ass business model is now based on seeing who can legally travel the farthest on the gas they have in their tank.
I know someone from IRC who openly brags about making up information to get a free download of Staroffice 7, because he says his claim will end up being thrown out. The fact is, it does encourage people to make up phony claims, and unfortunately, people like the one I mention above will probably never be caught. This is exactly one of Microsoft's objections, and they couldn't be more right in what they've said. By requiring people to file claims through the court, as would normally happen, people are much less able to make phony claims. As much as I don't like Microsoft, and even though they're guilty, it doesn't make it right to steal from them, or from Lindows.
It's a nice idea to encourage people to claim their piece of the settlement, and as much as I like seeing it happen to Microsoft, it really can't be done in a fair and legal way.
From what I read, they don't require the proof that the settlement requires, so how are they going to get the money? And what's stopping you from filing claims with both MS and Lindows? I doubt MS is going to share it's data with Lindows.
"It is not how things are in the world that is mystical, but that it exists." -Ludwig Wittgenstein
...to pay your $1499 licensing fee you cock-smoking teabaggers.
Remember, the price went up November 1st.
How many other companies can afford to pay 1.1 billion and barely feel it....?????
ONE
I'm not sure what intentions Lindows had beyond marketing their software using a court decision, and I'm equally unsure of how they can say that any of the claims filed by Lindows on behalf of the claimant have any merit whatsoever.
/., I rushed to MSFreePC and completed all but the last couple steps to file a claim. Of course, I've never even been to any states that BORDER California, let alone purchased a PC there. What's to stop anybody from doing that, and how could they ever verify the legitmacy of the claims?
When I first read about this program on
As bad as it may be, I think Microsoft is well within its' right to not accept MSFreePC claims, or at least to challenge their validity in a court of law. That shouldn't stop them from processing claims submitted under THEIR terms, however.
why should they benefit from it? I don't see anything wrong with Microsoft being "exploited" any more than I did when I heard that Dahmer got offed in prison...
In both cases, my reaction is: "couldn't happen to a nicer fuck". And I dont' see any reason to feel bad about that.
Uhh.. first of all, Microsoft does have to follow the law. Why else would they have to abide by this 1.1 billion dollar settlement? Also, the DoJ had them backed in a corner for awhile, and they might be in some trouble again, because the previous settlement in that antitrust lawsuit hasn't worked. They've had other antitrust lawsuits brought against them, too, and have lost in many cases. Also, Eolas has them backed in a corner on a patent claim. Clearly the law does apply to MS. Grow up. Your anti-MS bullshit has no place in a reasonable discussion on this issue.
now THAT's why the money isnt coming. and i filed one of those claims that came in the mail! man.... i wanted to buy a new wireless router...
Investing forum
Just desserts. Microsoft has made a habit of making phony claims against people for years. What do you think happens if their hired goons, the BSA, pull an audit on your company and your sysadmin can't produce all the requisite documentation to "prove" they had a "right" to use the software on every single machine found? Will Microsoft's henchmen say, "oh well, I'm sure you bought them all properly; we understand it's a pain to keep all this paperwork for things that cost just a hundred dollars"? Yeah, right.
The only bad thing about false claims is that if the total claims exceed the settlement limit, then the people with real claims will get smaller amounts, if I understand the settlement correctly.
But how many small businesses are going to be that efficient? Especially when the guy who runs the systems is probably someone doing it part time along with his other duties, who may have been handed the job by the last guy who left, without a significant training period (after all, Windows is so easy to run, right?). A lot of small research labs (e.g., under one professor at a university) are run like this, usually by student volunteers.
And the point is, Microsoft accuses you of theft without any proof whatsoever. They have no way of tracking where that version came from, to know, for instance, if it was copied from some other disk). They have no witnesses to testify that they saw you make the copy illegally (unless they can find the guy you laid off last week and he has a grudge). But "innocent until proven guilty" means nothing. It's more like, "we have more lawyers than you and can grind you into the dust whenever we choose, so wouldn't you rather have a site license and end all these worries?"
Microsoft does have a point in that there probably are a large number of fraudulent claims from msfreepc.com. Perhaps they could just do some sanity checking of the Lindows clains (no, 123 Fake St. doesn't exist). On the other hand, if Microsoft did agree to allow for this, then I suppose they deserve to suffer.
By Joseph Nicolosi, Ph.D., and Linda Ames Nicolosi
At the very heart of the homosexual condition is conflict about gender. In the boy, we usually see a gender wound tracing back to childhood. He comes to see himself as different from other boys.
Gender woundedness usually exists as a silent, secret fear -- one that the boy's parents and loved ones only vaguely suspect. The boy has felt this way for as long as he is able to remember. That differentness creates a feeling of inferiority and isolates him from other males.
For some little boys, the gender confusion is obvious. Let me begin with one little boy whose case is unusually dramatic.
Stevie's Story
As a clinical psychologist who has treated hundreds of dissatisfied adult homosexual men, I get phone calls from all over the world. But with increasing frequency, the request concerns a child. Most of the people who call me are dedicated parents who want the best for their child, and I strive to guide, educate and support them.
The particular caller one day, my secretary informed me, was from nearby Pasadena, California. I picked up the receiver and heard a woman's voice on the other end of the line.
"Doctor, my name is Margaret Johnson," she began. Her voice quavered.
For one long moment, I thought we might have been disconnected.
"Are you there? Can I help you?"
"Well, I ... I think I saw you a couple of weeks ago on
television. That was you, wasn't it? You were debating a
psychiatrist?"
"It's possible," I said. I had been on a national TV show two weeks before, jousting with a gay activist who had become a familiar figure on the talk show circuit. "You probably mean the debate with Dr. Isay."
"Yes," she said. "You were on a show that talked about little boys who want to be little girls."
"That's right," I said. "We were doing a show about gender confusion."
This time Mrs. Johnson spoke up with determination and urgency.
"Doctor, you were describing my son Stevie. He's a beautiful little boy, a special child. But..." She hesitated. "Stevie's fascinated with little-girl things. Even more so than my daughters. In fact, he just loves the colors pink and red. He even, well, plays with Barbie dolls and dances around the house on tiptoes like a ballerina."
As I listened, Mrs. Johnson gave me a few more specifics. Her son was five. "I've been noticing this kind of behavior for almost two years," she explained.
To me, that length of time was significant. It is okay if a little boy wonders what he would look like wearing long blonde curls and so he tries wearing a wig, simply to be silly. There is nothing particularly alarming about that. But if he keeps on doing it and has little interest in "boy" things, there likely is a problem.
"This has been going on for two years?" I asked.
I think Mrs. Johnson misinterpreted my question as a rebuke. She sounded a little defensive. "But his teacher said not to worry, it was just a passing phase. So did my mother-in-law. She even gives Stevie her scarves and jewelry to try on. 'Grandma,' she tells him, 'adores her little baby doll.' "
"And you've been hoping they were right, that this is just a childhood phase."
"Yes. But I really do think there's something wrong." By now, Mrs.Johnson's voice sounded sharp and determined.
"Last week," she said, "Stevie insisted on getting him a Pocahontas doll. And then I saw you on TV. You were describing my son, Dr. Nicolosi. And if you're right, then Stevie will grow up?"
She hesitated, as if afraid to say the word. "He'll be gay. That's what you said. And to be honest, that's why I cal
This is about Microsoft wanting its way and screwing over innocents to try and get it. They're just being whiney crybabies here about MyFreePC. Sure, they may have some legit complaints about MyFreePC, but that shouldn't stop them from processing legitimate claims that have nothing at all to do with MyFreePC! This is truly just pathetic behaivor on MS's part.
It's a nice idea to encourage people to claim their piece of the settlement, and as much as I like seeing it happen to Microsoft, it really can't be done in a fair and legal way.
The settlement is whatever the parties agree on. They could have agreed to give the money to chain smokers, or to donate to endangered ducks, or to burn a billion dollars to heat orphanages. It doesn't matter matter whether you consider the distribution fair, what matters is what they agreed to.
And what they agreed to is that they owe a billion dollars, a light penalty anyway compared to the harm they have caused. But now they are trying to delay and wriggle out of that, too. That is definitely not fair.
Yes of course you are absolutly right. The post and articles point out clearly that the claims being held back have nothing to do with the lindows. These claims have been made by ordinary citizens of California and should have been handled.
As for why MS is doing this. Bill Gates is a little kid. For the last 20 years he has been head of an empire growing ever bigger. Everyone around him told him he was a hero. Now slowly he is finding out that outside his little empire people really don't share his vision of the world. Law makers are after him, geeks are building software for FREE, major companies he thought he had beaten multiple times are still there ready to see him fail.
I am willing to bet that nobody on this earth will be able to get Bill Gates to admit that this is a just punishment, that he Bill Gates was guilty and that this settlement is exactly what MS deserved. To all the MS apologists. Proof me wrong.
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
That reminds me how sexy Bugs Bunny looks in drag, heh...
But seriously, Bugs Bunny is hot when he dresses up like a girl.
I think I just registered a domain, but I can't tell (too drunk).
The bulk of this money will return to Microsoft in the form of new income. So logically, they have no reason to block the settlement. I deduce therefore that it's a subtle way of pumping profits into 2004.
Or maybe Microsoft just hate Michael Robertson so much they would rather find themselves in breach of the settlement than pay one red cent... Nah, can't be.
Ceci n'est pas une signature
News like this make me sick.
Hello, wake up - we live in a capitalist society!
It's very simple, but obviously the average IQ guarantees handsome attention to this stupidity.
All right, lets see:
1. You can buy a desktop with Lindows, Mac, GNU/Linux and even HP-UX and Solaris. You can also buy a desktop without OS or assemble your own. You can choose not to buy anything.
Some folks chose to buy a PC with Windows preinstalled. Now they want the OS-part money back. WTF?
It reminds me of that chick who sued McDonald's for spilling hot coffee in her lap.
2. Microsoft - of course they're doing everything they can to delay and screw up Lindoze. Are they supposed to give them all the money they want on a silver platter? Nonsense.
I wouldn't give anyone any money until I have no other choice.
3. Lindows - those idiots are just trying to stir up news on account of others' trouble. Sun is licensing StarOffice cheaply because they hope to make money off their servers later; as that won't work, ultimately StarOffice will cost the same as Microsoft Office.
I really hope Microsoft will squash those Lindowz deadbeats...
BEEEEAAAATCHH!!!!!
Is dat all der shit am gon git, muddaphukka??
I've seen a few posts speculating that MS may be trying to put off paying out untill next quarter in order to make profits look better, but is it possible that they are just keeping that cash in a high interest account or some other high growth thing for as long as possible to recoup some of the lost mony by collecting interest?
I'm in now way an accountant, but it seems to me that this might be a way to gain back some of those losses.
On a side note, there have been a few posts about how $1billion is not much to MS, but really I think that although it might be a much smaller percent of their overal value than any other company, that $1billion is still a fair loss in the sence that it could have been used to generate some ammount >$1billion which is not chump change even to MS
Famous Last Words: "hmm...wikipedia says it's edible"
The agreement says they pay out a maximal of 1.1 billion. That means they've done at least 1.1 billion damage. So, any phony claim is only depriving real claims of their share of the settlement. MS has no reason to complain because they owe 1.1 billion. People who aren't getting their share of the claim should be out trying to get their fair share.
Sounds like a bunch of pirates to me...
Use ISO 8601 dates [YYYY-MM-DD]
A delightfully refreshing commentary!
What? A benevolent, law-abiding company like Microsoft, whose only goal is to make people's lives better and more productive, trying to chisel people out of money it owes them? This can't be true. It's those anti-Microsoft zealots at it again. Don't believe everything you read on Slashdot.
Townsend and Townsend says:
"Although plaintiffs expressed some initial concerns with the Lindows web site, we are now satisfied with Lindows' explanation of its procedures and believe that it fully comports with the express terms of the Settlement Agreement."
Microsoft is known for slowly backing out of punishments, or does pay people....such a politicians to look the other way.
and seriously, has microsoft ever done things the legal way? no, but they have done some legal things.. but based off illegal actions.
they dont like following federal law, but they sure like using federal law against its own consumers.
when I first heard M$ was supposed to send out money.. I laughed, because I knew they wouldnt do it. Also, if they did pay the settlement, they'd lose a massive chunk of cash,.. which they wish not to do.
so really, they are like "hmmm, no, dont wanna do it. we dont wanna lose money. and federal law doesnt apply to us"
also, they'd prolly jack up a licensing fee in the next windows release... and require you to pay like 700 bucks for the next windows release.. preinstalled or not.
Give 'em a break, they're still running the mail merge for the form letter response...
Remember the pie incident? Remember....? Think about it... think bigger... yes... that's right... it would be sooooo easy... where are all the crazed loners when we NEED em?
It's time to stop letting these things get turned into PR circuses benefiting the the defendant who chooses to settle out of court (and apparently giving no benefit to the plaintiffs, so far).
Standard disclaimer: IANAL, use this advice at your own peril, yada-yada-yada.
Logic is a wonderful thing but doesn't always beat actual thought. -Terry Pratchett
MS evil big corporation
must destroy ever true socialist city on a hill linux os
bill gates bad..must be punished for not donating money to clinton/gore 1996 reelection campaign.
Note the date on that article, February 17, 2000. It was based on Microsoft's most recent annual report (at the time), 1999.
"A significant portion of the wages Microsoft pays to its employees comes in the form of stock options rather than in cash. Compared to the rest of the industry, the amount of cash Microsoft pays its programmers is at best mediocre. It attracts and retains employees via stock options..."
"So there you have it. $3.1 billion from a tax loophole [the "Stock option income tax benefits."], $1.3 billion from its employees [payroll deductions to exercise those options], and $0.7 billion from put warrants combine to give Microsoft over $5 billion from its own stock in fiscal 1999. And it avoided paying $9 billion in wages. All that from a company that only had $7.8 billion in net income. And as long as the stock keeps going up, they can keep doing that ad infinitum."
Options to buy MSFT at $120, anyone? The MS class of 1999 ought to be vesting any time now.
Obligatory Simpsons reference: Disco Stu's "Can't Stop the Learnin' Disco Academies"...
Disco Stu: Did you know that disco record sales were up 400/ for the year ending 1976? If these trends continue... A-y-y-y!
Carthago delenda est!
But neither Bill nor Steve have anything to cut off.
So you're saying it's too onerous a burden for Microsoft to have to verify all those claims themself, so a court should do it? I dunno, when the SBA audits you, you have to somehow prove to them that all the software that's installed on all your computers is properly licensed. You don't get the benefit of a court absorbing the cost of the audit for you. I don't see why Microsoft (SBA member) should get that benefit.
Nope, it means they haven't done any real damage (please keep in mind that distributions of Linux cost as much as retail copies of windows (and way more than mass licences) - and for these, the vendors do not have to shell out money for imoplementation and test). It means that Microsoft realized that they'd be tied in litigation to the point where that process would cost them more than grudgingly accepting an unjust 'punishment'.
Not to be a Microsoft apologist, but this is a claim made by one party in the case, and one who's heavily biased. This is an assertion, not a proven fact.
I live and work in California and filed a claim through Lindows.com. I have purchased a great deal of MS products over the last 7-8 years for myself, my children and my employer.
The items I claimed on the Lindows form represented only a fraction of the $$ MS has gotten from me over the years.
Because MS is paying with vouchers, and those vouchers will not cover the cost of any new software, they are betting most of it will come back to MS along with some cash.
I filed that claim through Lindows because it gave me a chance to use my share of the settlement money to help a MS competitor and I felt assured the money would not wind up back in MS's pockets. This seems to be the intention of the portion of the settlement which states the settlement"cannot be used by Microsoft to complicate or discourage claims, and they must not discourage legitimate Microsoft competitors from promoting the settlement, distributing claim forms or otherwise participating in the settlement process as expressly contemplated by the Settlement Agreement."
I have no idea whether I will ever see my new free PC but I certainly don't consider myself a thief, nor do I blame Lindows for "promoting and participating in the settlement" as is their right.
There is nothing so powerful as an idea whose time has come.
YOU FAIL IT!
- MS is refusing to pay ANY claims in an attempt to extort the attorneys for the class members to object to MSfreePC
- MSfreePC requires the IDENTICAL information that the manual process does. In fact, it's the same form. They are just doing it electronically. To the extent that someone could defraud MSfreePC, the IDENTICAL opportunity exists with the paper process.
- Microsoft objecting to ONLINE settlement claims is dripping with irony given their "innovation" advertising campaigns.
- While 1.1B is the announced number, if you read The Register article you will see that currently they are ONLY going to be paying $50MM!! That's less than 5% of the trumpeted settlement amount. Yes, I know they give a bunch of other money in the form of free software - CDs are cheap. That costs them nothing.
This whole process seems like a scam, not MSfreePC, but the whole settlement process. I bet the attorneys will get more than MS ends up paying out.
the "So what did you expect?" department.
The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
or something like that.
A reasonable comment gets modded down into oblivion. Sad.