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CRF Reveals Draft of New DRM Technology
scubacuda writes "PC Advisor and others report that the CRF (Content Reference Forum), a new, cross-industry standards organisation that boasts Universal Music Group, Microsoft, Nippon Telegraph and Telephone (NTT) and VeriSign among its members, has unveiled a new specification for a DRM technology.
A draft of CRF Baseline Profile 1.0 is available for public review and comment." According to a report on CNET News, the "the [CRF-created] file would set up a process that automatically delivers files in the right format and potentially triggers an automatic payment system that could be changed moment to moment by the content distributor."
Really make one of the meanings of "member" appropriate.
Wow, people are going to download executable code from kazaa and execute it. It ain't hard to guess what the follow-up news stories are going to be like. (Dammit, why haven't I bought stock in the anti-virus companies yet?!)
"Believe me!" -- Donald Trump
I wonder what key we'll have to hold down to disable this new brainstorm.
Xenon, where's my money? -Borno
Blah. you mean more like 'automatic theft system'( once your machine is cracked ), or 'automatic consumer screw system', or 'automatic removal system' ( for those documents of 'restricted information' )...
If we ever get to that point, i for one wont be using a PC device of any kind...
---- Booth was a patriot ----
...file would set up a process that automatically ... triggers an automatic payment system that could be changed moment to moment by the content distributor.
Hey, I'll sell you a music file for only 1 cent.
On second thought, make that $100
Don't waste your vote! Vote for whoever you want, unless you live in a swing state it won't matter anyways
Last time I checked, a file that tries to automatically charge you for opening it was a...
virus?
Ok, let me also say this. The whole thought process around the word automatically is really starting to scare the hell out me. We live in a society where folk have a hard time keeping track of written checks. How the hell do we expect them to keep track of all the automatic deductions being taken from them?
Oh wait, we don't. Just another way to enslave the masses I guess.
No thanks. I will stick files that might sound like crap, but I don't get charged for until I buy the cd (let the flames begin).
is it just me or does this "potentially triggers an automatic payment system that could be changed moment to moment by the content distributor" sound a bit dangerous and easily abusable by the 'content distributor'?
Is it just me, or does this require the participation of ALL digital content providers to work? For example, how will the downloaded file get a working file from iTunes if Apple doesn't want any part of it?
If I'm right, this seems dead before it starts, since the only real shot it has (IMHO) is being able to provide all songs, where some online sales places can't.
Am I wrong?
If you think this couldn't happen, consider that more Americans use p2p filesharing applications than voted for George Bush.
Change the Law, from my article Links to Tens of Thousands of Legal Music Downloads, discusses the background of copyright law in the United States, and suggests steps you can take to reform copyright law. Among the steps I discuss are to Speak Out, Vote, Write to Your Elected Representatives, Donate Money to Political Campaigns, Support Campaign Finance Reform, Join the Electronic Frontier Foundation and Practice Civil Disobedience
Thank you for your attention.
Request your free CD of my piano music.
...that Microsoft wants to have a hand in the "standard DRM", you know, in light of their upcoming digital music service
why do people keep reinventing the wheel and then say they're not trying to reinvent the wheel?
:-)
So they can patent it under different discriptions
Don't waste your vote! Vote for whoever you want, unless you live in a swing state it won't matter anyways
3 names that evoke freedom, innovation and the interest of the consummer. ah, we feel so much better now.
there's no place like ~
Its really scary reading all this online. Large monopolies growing larger set to put the law back 200 hundred and more years.
A lot of people who don't read places like slashdot would be equally concerned if they knew what was going on. They need to be educated, its why democracy works, and why it fails when it doesn't occur.
It's called "bait n' switch, internet style"
Take the cheese to sickbay, the doctor should see it as soon as possible - B'Elanna Torres, "Learning Curve"
"potentially triggers an automatic payment system that could be changed moment to moment by the content distributor" So basically, a file could cost 10 cents one minute, and 20 the next? What if you happened to download the file as it was being repriced, and you end up paying more than you expected?
Suddenly I am less happy. #1. M$ is part and parcel of it. #2. I don't like DRM Glancing at a document on the site, it would appear that it is a lawyer tool. Observe from their document: The primary goal for developing CEL is to meet requirements for building operational systems for content reference as given in [15], and to provide an extensible architectural framework for specifying contracts in other potential applications (outside of those for content reference) The primary function of a contract in CEL is to serve the following purposes: Evidence: communicate information conveyed within a contract that can be easily and unambiguously understood. Execution: facilitate permissive, obligatory or prohibitory performance within a contract in appropriate context, integrated with the contracting parties' business processes. This includes determination of whether or not one is allowed to exercise some right, or is required to fulfill some obligation or obey some prohibition. Evaluation: check permissive, obligatory or prohibitory performance by contracting parties. This appears to be another tool to control what I do. So I dislike it.
/b
|f(x)dx = F(b) - F(a)
Oh gee I can't wait to see what kind of quality products these great protectors of individual rights come out with next. It sure is great to see such companies as Microsoft & Macrovision working together, but it sure does make you wonder where the RIAA and the Taliban were during these meetings? Their invitations must have gotten lost in the mail.
I know it's 2003, but why does it feel like 1984?
Is that painting on the top of their website copyrighted?
Well, the painting was finished in 1512 and copyrights didn't exist until 1710, so I doubt it.
Have you tried Linux yet?
Can the money they make and/or "save" on this stuff ever possibly justify the expenses that must be going into research/development and other costs (including pissed off consumers) for this stuff?
It's just an XML file that says where you can download the content, what software/hardware you need to view it, and how much it costs.
Folks I hate to break it to ya but this type of stuff is the beginning of the end for privacy in the U.S. and abroad. Any lingering "wall" of privacy afforded to citizens trying to maintain personal discretion and private matters..well private is being torn down bit by bit. First it's the Patriot Act with it's slick naming scheme police state features and now it's the computer industry complying with it's handlers to figure out a way to make your data their data (remember that possession of 'property' is 9/10th's of the law...if any of us actually "owned" anything anymore anyway) What is this mess leading too? World Police Government....Sorry to spills the beans.
Fun for the whole family, have little billy click it twice for twice the fun!
Seriously, I was eating in "Dennies" (rellay, my fault, I know) and the eight of us each had the all-you-can-eat breakfast bar. When the bill arrived we had been charged for ten. When we said, "hey, there are eight of us, but you charged us for ten" the servers response was, "oh, so do you want to go back and eat some more?"
If you don't understand what is so wrong with the server in this example, then "automatically" and "changed at any time" are happy fun words for you and yours.
Someone please save us all from the popular culture that would make people think anything like this CRF could be given a "popular and positive" spin...
Innocent people shouldn't be forced to pay for inferior software development.
--"Code Complete" Microsoft Press
As far as I can imagine, "automatic payment" won't survive in a court. Unless you authorize payment, it's theft - setting up the account isn't authorization enough. The second they charge you, you can bring up a suit saying that you didn't download that song, your 7-year-old did, who isn't old enough to participate in the contract, etc.. I don't see how they expect to prove you payed if the transfer is completely automatic (no digital signiture, no entry of credit card info at time of purchase, no "Click Here to Order," etc.).
Imagine a virus that downloads tens of thousands of songs to your computer. Then imagine the automatic money transfer. Then imagine the lawsuit you'll have if they won't give back the money.
G
"the [CRF-created] file would set up a process that automatically delivers files in the right format and potentially triggers an automatic payment system that could be changed moment to moment by the content distributor."
Oh yeah, that sounds like a great idea.
Remember, these are the people you keep reading about that leave their servers open and have lists of credit cards stolen from them. Regularly.
Just imagine DRM and auto billing mixed into that. This will be a nightmare of epic proportions. You heard it here first.
Weaselmancer
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
There is currently a lack of interoperability between digital content technologies that makes it challenging for consumers to easily get the content they want, in the format, platform and other preferences they choose.
"While the internet and its protcols e.g www/http, filesharing etc are well suited to almost eveyrone in the world, we the suits find it challenging to make more money from less work."
Additionally, there is currently no technology framework in place that allows all market participants to ensure that the business agreements they make are respected.
"We have come to the conclusion that the business model that has been in use since the dawn of mankind (you give me this i give you that) does not work. We want to sell you a book, but we dont trust you to burn it after 24 hours so you can return and buy another one."
Today, there does not exist a technical and business framework to achieve interoperability across multiple technology platforms and enable new business models. The Content Reference Forum plans to change that.
"We had an old business model working before, but unfortunately there has been a change in technology and instead of moving on we want it our way."
The Content Reference Forum (CRF) is a recently formed standards group of leading technology and content-related companies established to develop a universal way to distribute digital content across various media and geographies.
"We have decided to join forces with our other corporate friends and make what is known in the business world as 'A big fucking unstoppable snow-ball monopoly bull-doser'"
The organization's goal is to create a dynamic marketplace where participants can promote, sell and legitimately share content; consumers can get the right content for their location, platform and preferences; and the underlying commercial agreements and rights surrounding the content are respected.
"We realised that eventualy everyone would figure out our plans so we sugar coated a potentially useless idea with the solution to a totally random problem: people get pissed off when they have to select their country and media format from a drop-down list."
CRF's work will benefit many different audiences including content and technology companies as well as services companies (e.g. cable, telecommunications, cellular) and related businesses (e.g. Internet portals/media companies, wireless companies, computer manufacturers, consumer electronics makers, entertainment companies).
"This will benefit us... and a few choice friends"
Consumers will also eventually benefit as it becomes easier for them to find and share the content they want in the way they want it.
"Consumers will eventually realise that if they do what we say we wont sue them. They will also be able to use our complicated, badly designed content search system and have the ability to select their country and media format from a drop-down list."
The technology is context sensitive. It's the antithesis to one-size-fits-all mass market distribution models. This makes it quite powerful and consumer friendly. The user's situation is relevant and respected including the rendering environment, location, existing relationship with content provider(s), and language preferences.
"We're going to write this little java app that lets you set the background colour of your online shop, and you can select your country from a drop-down list!"
This comment does not represent the views or opinions of the user.
TH15 5UX0RZ?
Come on, you were all thinking it...
You can't take the sky from me...
Last night, I got a worried IM from a younger cousin of mine. His mom had "cleaned up" their computer, and he was having trouble sending some wmv/rm files to friends of his. Windows Media Player kept giving him and his friends errors along the line of "I'm sorry, but you don't have a license to play that file." Of course, I immediately knew what was going on, and explained to him that Windows was just trying to prevent him from making illegal copies of music. The problem is, the files he was trying to share were of his band, off of their own demo CD. At that point, I pointed him to xiph and enlightened him about ogg vorbis.
Do you really need reason for beer? Wingman Brewers
Still smells the same....it stinks...
Copyright eventually expires, DRM doesn't.
Shakespeare didn't have copyright protection, neither did Bach, Mozart, Beethoven.
Interesting that no one since has been deemed better in those particular categories.
Infuriate left and right
I agree with all the previous posts saying how this is just another control mechanism. How in the hell can any human being accept a standard that automatically charges your bank account or credit card? I can see it now...you accidentally click on something and you end up buying it even thought you never agreed to or wanted said product.
So what is your response to this Mega-Corporation virtual theft? You call up their 1-800 number based in some 3rd world country and sit on hold for a day or so. When you finally get someone online they know nothing plus you can't understand a word they say.
God this sounds fucking great!
I can't wait! Where do I sign up?
Seriously these mega-corps can institute this standard or whatever they want to call it and sell it to the masses but we DO have a say so. I hope it goes the way of the 1st incarnation of DivX from Circuit City and burns out oh so quickly.
We as consumers can reject this outright and not buy into it. Money talks and bullshit walks. Money is the only thing these companies understand and that's the genesis of the entire drm/dmca argument although they would like to convince us it's just the ability to innovate.
With groups wanting to tie a drm to hardware and now this I really think the day is coming where we will actually want to stick with yesterday's hardware (today's) and forgo the next gen with all of the mega-media money protections built in.
I will stick with the hardware that I can control and not let it control me.
You aren't free to do anything, until you've lost everything.
What kind of fantasy world are they living in. The problem is that almost everything is encoded in well known formats that can be handled by most machines. The powers that be wish that content on P2P networks were in proprietary protected formats, but except for a bit of windows media crap, it isn't.
"She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
The problem is, the files he was trying to share were of his band
Actually, he might not have the right to distribute those files. He needs the songwriter's OK to distribute a recording of a song. And if he is the songwriter, he needs a professional musicologist's OK, or else what happened to George Harrison might happen to him.
And they plan to correct that by providing files to download that are specifically designed not to be readable by people who lack the appropriate software or hardware
These people don't actually use the English language. Or at best its a version of English that has been taken out the back, given a good thrashing and been convinced to do what its told or there'll be more of the same.
Both the RIAA, Microsoft and Verisign have a dominant role in their respective markets. This forum is about providing a infrastructure for digital content.
There is inherently nothing wrong with that. That is, as long as they define infrastructure that will be universally applicable. So if it only runs on an Microsoft platform it has failed. If it only protects data by companies associated with the RIAA it has failed. If the only security it allows for is the security as provided by Verisign it has failed.
When content, of a type protected by the mechanisms to be worked out by this committee, become available, the content is the copyright of the issuer of the data and as such it is entitled to the protection offered by the infrastructure. This means that music is secured at the time of publication within the infrastructure. This allows for people to create their own content and do with it as they like and, if at all it is secured, it is secured within the same infrastructure as is the commercial content as published by the organisations associated with the RIAA.
* Linus Torvalds has said before that the inclusion of DRM is not a problem as far as he is concerned.
* Music Midi and computers have a long history. It cannot be that the use of computers connencted with music or photo's or video will cease.
* There is nothing inherently wrong with DRM but it has to be open and it must secure my data as much as the data from a commercial entity.
* Given the pedegree of the people in this committee THEY have to prove their bona fides. Microsoft is a convicted monopolist and the RIAA wants the law to grant them the right to be a monopolist. They have one good thing going for them; Microsoft is one of the greatest marketing companies ever.
Thanks,
Gerard
"Punishments too light. Expect life jail sentences, extension of liability to family, friends, and unlimited fines, all to be determined by the copyright holders."
One thing that I found quite interesting when watching it again, in the movie Aliens, the whole thing is a corporate wonderland! 40-odd years ago you forgot to do your maintenance on that one motor-spinny-thing? We'll have to fine you $3,000! The whole military / corporate trial was really scary, and I don't know why I didn't pick up on it the first time I saw it. So this is a little OT, but the arbitrariness of the sentences (and resulting bargaining) may be something we'll see more in the open soon...
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